Car won't start... ;o(*

Okay guys, my car wouldn't start this morning when I was trying to go to work. When I turn the key, it would start turning but it seemed to not have enough "juice" to actually start. Not sure if it's a battery or starter issue. Anyways, it smelled really bad also. Kinda like a mixture between gas and oil burning.

For those who have been here awhile, it sounded similar to last year when I thought my timing belt broke and all the rattling started occuring afterwards. I still haven't figured out what the rattling noise is but maybe it's related!?! I did take the car to a shop and when they first initially looked at it, they said it was my water pump going bad and I had to change it. I bought the whole timing belt kit from Rockville but when I brought it back to the shop to have the service done, they pulled off the belt cover and was like "wow, your belt and water pump looks brand new." So then they say it's probably some pulley down there but said I should wait before I changed the belt and everything else since everything looked new.

So yeah, any thoughts from the experts here? I'll see what else I could find out once I get home tonight but I won't have a lot of because I have class tonight. This sucks...school starts and my car screws up on me....my typical luck... :(

Thanks in advance.

-Oh yeah, I also didn't start my car the whole day Monday and it was super cold this morning too.

I would say its prob. just the battery dude, did you try to jump it? how old is the battery?

hmm, it seems like the rattling would be easy to figure out just by looking for something that is vibrating, especially if they say its a pulley. but im no mech.:rolleyes:

Yeah try to jump it with something larger than a 4banger. I generally always try and find a truck for a jump. Or AAA has those jumper boxes. Anyway, take hte battery to Autozone and have them check it out. If that checks out we can eliminate it from the list.

The smell of gas isn't good. Did you pop the hood when htis happened and check for any visible gas leaks? Also take off the oil cap, and smell inside. Smell gas? If hte engine flooded, the gas can leak past teh rings and contaminate the oil. If it did, you wanna dump your oil and filter and replace. New oil is cheaper than a spun bearing.

as Liquid suggested, test the battery first. if you can jump start it, drive to AutoZone or a local chain store and have them test the battery (most chains should offer this service for free). while you're at that auto parts store, pick their brains about what else it might be.

as for the rattling, i ran across something that might be related. a local guy's 3S here in Dallas had an awful rattling sound. turns out it was his AC pulley. there are 6 bolts that hold the pulley on, and for some reason, a handful of 3S are plagued with the problem of the pulley vibrating so much that some or all of these 6 bolts come loose or even shear off! for the 3S cars that have this problem, replacing the pulley, putting in newer stronger bolts with threadlocker, none of these remedies fixes the problem for good; it always vibrates again and brakes the bolts.

so what i did for this guy's car was to get a shorter belt (NAPA part #406-0408) that bypassed the AC compressor and install it. instead of wrapping around the 5 pulleys on that side of the engine, it just wraps around 3: crank, alternator, and upper idler pulley. it may seem trick to get on, but the way to do it is to put it around the alternator and upper idler, then put it on the top part of the crank. as you rotate the crank clockwise, it will pull the belt on. here is the thread i found this stuff in http://www.3si.org/forum/showthread.php?t=241127&highlight=delete+belt.

so that's just an idea what the rattling could be. but definitely get your car started, then try to figure out what the rattling could be. a way to trouble shoot is to remove the ac/alternator belt, then start the car (don't worry, it will run fine for a minute or so), and if the rattling stops, then you know its a pulley on that belt that was rattling.

Well, the rattling is still the start-up rattling that I've been complaining about the past year or so. It only rattles when I start my car up when the engine is cool. If I drive it for about 20 minutes or so, the car won't rattle when I start-up the car until it cools down again. Yeah, I still need to try and get an audio of that again... But I'll try taking off the AC belt during startup.

As far as the battery goes, I did check it before when my IAC went bad and everything checked out. During that time though, the car was still rattling of course. But yeah, if I can't get it started when I get home I'll try jumping it with my dad's 4Runner.

Thanks for all the replies guys.

[quote=Igovert500]Yeah try to jump it with something larger than a 4banger. quote]

:grinyes: You have no idea how many people try to do that! LMAO, and they only let it sit for five sec. on top of that, then its "OMG the starter!" lol:banghead:

Okay, so here's what I got. Car won't start even with a jump. I don't have time tonight to take the battery to AutoZone but I don't think it's the battery.

My dad kinda thinks fuel isn't getting through or something. Reason being is that it seems to be turning but just isn't "catching" to start up. Do you guys think it could possibly be the fuel pump?

I have a video so I'll post it before I leave for class tonight if I can. I tried sticking the camera as close to the engine as possible so hopefully the sounds quality is a bit better.

Thanks again guys.

Okay, so here's what I got. Car won't start even with a jump. I don't have time tonight to take the battery to AutoZone but I don't think it's the battery.

My dad kinda thinks fuel isn't getting through or something. Reason being is that it seems to be turning but just isn't "catching" to start up. Do you guys think it could possibly be the fuel pump?

could be fuel or spark. too early to tell. take the battery from ur dad's car and put it in ur car. then try to start it.

^^What's the difference between that and jumping? Just more voltage since it's not being transferred through cables?

You could check to see if the fuel is getting to the fuel rail at least with about 5 minutes of your time. Just disconnect the "w" shaped connector on the right side of the motor (when you are looking at it) by simpily taking off the two bolts and throwing a good sized paper towel under it and then turn the ignition for just a sec and see if any gas comes out. If everything is working properly (minus the injectors) it should shoot out like water out of a garder hose. Like I said do not turn it over for too long though unless you want to clean up gas all over the motor.

Videos:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f350/sLADe781/th_StartupFailure2.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f350/sLADe781/?action=view&current=StartupFailure2.flv)

and

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f350/sLADe781/th_StartupFailure1.jpg (http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f350/sLADe781/?action=view&current=StartupFailure1.flv)

The sound's still super crappy but hopefully it'll give you guys the general idea of what's going on. Also uh...ignore the animals...my dad recorded over his hunting video. LMAO I swear, no animals were injured while making these videos. LOL :p

SL, you got a picture of what you're talking about? Because I can't seem to locate the "w" shaped connector and it's getting dark real fast.

Thanks.

In this pic it is an aftermarket piece so it is not really "w" shaped but here it is.

Just take off the two bolts on each side where it mounts to the fuel rail.

http://www.3sxperformance.com/images/fuel-rail-adapter-kit-silver-09-500l.jpg

Yeah check for fuel and spark. You aren't getting one.

^^What's the difference between that and jumping? Just more voltage since it's not being transferred through cables?


uhhhhhhhhh, that would tell you whether or not ur battery is bad. cmon now, use ur head.:banghead: :grinyes:

oh, and from your videos, it definitely sounds like fuel or spark. it sounded like it was gonna catch for a second. probably one of your cylinders is flooded. get some starting fluid and spray it into the combustion chambers (either via lower intake plenum or spark plug holes).

Well if it was flooded and I wait about 8 hours or so, it should start up again, right? Once all the fluids go down!?!

If it's fuel or spark related, what do I do/change to fix it? New plugs/plug wires? Would it be really time consuming? Because I probably might have to take this one to a shop because I really don't have any time on my hands because of school. Hopefully it's not a super complicated job...

Well the first step is figuring out if it's spark or fuel. It could be a $6 half hour fix, or it could be a bit more time consuming, at the bare minimum, the more you troubleshoot the less you have to pay somebody else to. But we really can't estimate until we know which is the problem.

If it's spark related and the engine floods, then yes the gas would eventually leak through your rings and go away (into your oil which would then need to be dumped) but that wouldn't solve the weak or complete lack of spark...and the engine would just flood again next time you tried.

So check 3 things.

1) Is it getting fuel, check as SL3000gt described
2) Is it getting spark, try starter fluid, or pull a plug or two and check.
3) remove oil cap...can you smell gas in there?

If you have spark and fuel, I'd check the timing. Let us know if you don't have fuel or spark.

Well the first step is figuring out if it's spark or fuel. It could be a $6 half hour fix, or it could be a bit more time consuming, at the bare minimum, the more you troubleshoot the less you have to pay somebody else to. But we really can't estimate until we know which is the problem.

If it's spark related and the engine floods, then yes the gas would eventually leak through your rings and go away (into your oil which would then need to be dumped) but that wouldn't solve the weak or complete lack of spark...and the engine would just flood again next time you tried.

So check 3 things.

1) Is it getting fuel, check as SL3000gt described
2) Is it getting spark, try starter fluid, or pull a plug or two and check.
3) remove oil cap...can you smell gas in there?

If you have spark and fuel, I'd check the timing. Let us know if you don't have fuel or spark.

1-So I took off the W shape connector and started the car. Gas came out like what SL said but it didn't gush out super hard nor did it shoot out. Not sure if it was supposed to but gas did come out--trickled at first and then came out harder/faster.

2-Not sure what I'm supposed to do with the plugs once I pull them out...are the front 3 fine or do I have to pull the other ones too? What do with them to check for spark?

3-Took off the oil cap and sniffed it but no smell of gas inside. Had a friend do the same and all he smelled was oil too. When I get my car started, I'll just do an oil change to be safe...but no oil smell at this point.

4-I pulled off the front belt cover and counted the teeth and everything seems to be okay at this point. Not sure about the timing on the bottom or the upper cover but the lower one seems fine.

Any other ideas would be greatly appreciated. Thanks again guys!!!

First off take out a plug or two like Geoff said and then have someone get in the car and turn the ignition over. It may be a good idea to hold where the plug and wire meet with a wrench of some type and hold it tight so you know it is getting a good connection. When they turn the ignition there should be visible spark. If you are not getting spark you may want to get your PTU and/or coils tested. It could possibly be your plug wires as well.

Okay, so pull out the plug but have the plug still be connected to the plug wire and start the car, right? Will try that tomorrow if I can before class. Thanks. :)

That is correct.

You guys freakin' ROCK!!!!! Seriously!!!!

So I pulled the front 3 plugs out and they were soaking wet with gas and some black stuff so I just cleaned it off. Stuck everything back in and after a bit of hesitation she fired right up. YAY!!! :biggrin: So now, the aftermath....

1-I don't really have time right now because of school but do I really need to pull the ones under the plenum and clean those too? If I do then would it hurt that I wait a couple months before (spring break) before doing it or is it a necessity that I do it soon?

2-When I pull everything out to clean it, should I just go ahead and change my plug and wires again or can I reuse them? I've had these for about 2 years now (Accel wires and OEM plugs). How about the gaskets? The last time I changed it I changed all the gaskets...do I really need to change them again?

3-Should I still change my oil? :)

Thanks a bunch guys. You guys always save me money from having to go to the shop!!!

Cool glad you got it started. The plugs dripping with gas sounds like the engine was flooding. But if it works it works...you maybe just running rich or flooded the engine the first time...who knows.

I'd replace the plugs. Wires should be fine. Also I'd replace the plenum gasket when you change out hte rear plugs. And changing the oil and filter would be a good idea too, just in case.

For checking for spark in teh future just pull the wire off the plug, remove the plug, reattach it to the wire, and hold them so the plug is near a bolt in your engine bay that can act as a ground. Then make sure you are only holding the rubber part of hte wire and not touching hte car anywhere, and have somebody crank the car a couple of revolutions. You should see a spark between the plug tip and bolt/nut you are using for a ground.

http://techauto.tripod.com/s.htm <- has instructions and pictures a bit down the page.