1998 Silverado-start/battery not usual problem

Beginning about a year ago, I started having a VERY intermittent starting problem with this 1998 K1500 5.7L V8 - 120,000 miles.

Symptom: Turn the key, hear just the "click", no starter crank.

Before you read on, I will preface this by saying this is NOT any of the "usual" suspects (starter, corrosion, oddball "security wire")....

What I did:

Unhooked battery cables, thoroughly wire-brushed and sanded them. This fixed it. Then it happened again a few weeks later. So I pulled the stacked rubber-booted cables apart at the positive end. There was more corrosion inside. So I permanently pulled them apart, cut away the entire rubber boot, which leaves two clearly visible plates at the end of the two cables, so there can be no mistake about whether they are clean or not. Then I got one of those heavy brass accessory studs you use if you want to attach an extra "+" wire to your battery (I don't).
That way, I could screw one "+" cable right against the battery side terminal with the brass stud, and on the other end of the stud, I put the second battery "+" cable, and tightened it down with a nut.

Everything worked fine after doing that.

Well, guess what? 4 weeks or so go by, and it does it AGAIN. Click click click, will not start.

So, now I check parameters:
this battery is only about a year old
it measures 14.1 volts when running, about 13.something when just sitting there
I removed the positive cable, inserted an ammeter inline, got less than 10 ma draw when the truck is just sitting there (as long as I unplug the hood dome light). If I put the hood dome bulb back in, I see about a 1 amp draw.
I can close the hood gently, and the lamp clearly goes out. And besides,
I don't have to jump the truck to make it start! Just tightening/messing with the cable fixes it, so it isn't a dead battery.

There have been no odd security lights coming on. No SES codes, no unpleasant behavior from the truck of any kind other than this. In fact, this truck has been a joy to own since I bought it in 2001 --- except for this!

I got a friend who is a mechanic to look at it right outside of work where this happened. He was able to slightly move the cables if he pulled fairly hard from side to side on them with his hand. I'm a little more timid then he - I'm worried about tearing the soft metal battery sockets right out of the battery. So I let HIM tighten the cable.

Fired right up. And by the way, the cable ends, which are now clearly visible,
don't have the slightest bit of corrosion on them this time.

In between, I had to have the fuel pump replaced. It just flat-out quit one morning. That means that the repair shop probably unhooked and then reattached the battery cables to do the repair. That was about a month ago.

Well... here we are about 6 weeks since the last failure (4 since the fuel pump replacment)... and it just did it again. Click, click, click START.
Go to lunch. Go out to the truck , click, START.

No doubt, it will do a click-click-click NO START soon if not tonight.

I think it is quite clear that the battery isn't bad. There is no way it would start and run the truck for a month at a time. Ditto for the starter and the starter solenoid. If they were bad, or even marginal, I don't see how it would start hundreds of times in a row, then spontaneously fail, and then suddenly work again after loosening and retightening the battery cable.

I have had battery terminals get corroded up and keep a car from starting. And I've cleaned them off to fix the problem. I have NEVER seen anything this outrageously finicky in my life.

I can retighten the stupid cable again. But WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON HERE? Even when we do it, it really doesn't seem very loose. I've had cars with cables much looser that started right up regardless.

I think you might be in the right place around the battery cables, peel some insulation off the cables themselves and check them for corrosion inside the insulation. This was a problem for a while on some side mount batteries. I have seen them corroded inside all the way to the starter before. (battery would leak acid out the side mount and run INSIDE the cable)

You've fixed it too many times by messing with the battery cables. Replace both of them and hopefully be done with it.

I had a very simular problem on the Mrs.Caddy SLS,& if I had had a battery with only one set of terminals (top or side),we would have been stranded.The problem was inside the side screw in positive terminal.It would read thirteen volts and light the testlight,but it couldn't handle any amperage.I brought it home with a set of jumper cables spread out under the hood.

helllo and welcome to the site.

I am surprised that you can't imagine electrical components having intermittent problems. Your problem is not that unusual either. To not suspect any internal wire corrosion is not very realistice either. Stop wasting time on cleaning them and monkeing with them and just buy new ones like 777 said. If that does not do it, take the battery back for exchange and if they won't take it back, buy a new one. Batteries do have failures as well and most parts stores will gladly exchange them.

My truck did the same thing fore about 3 months and it was the started or noid..but I didn't waste time bench testing them..just bought a new starter and no issue..that was 6 years ago. You could even have an electrical issue in your key switch or column.

Trouble shot backwards with the simply things..new wires, new battery, then go to the starter and back from thier.

We all know how these things can be. Damn, I couldn't turn my truck off for a week..it was the tumber inside the column.

let us know how it goes. good luck.

sounds like a bad starter solenoid to me. that 'click' is the starter solenoid trying to engage. there are 2 reasons for it to not engage; 1. there is not enough power to engage solenoid ( usually an old/ bad battery is the problem/ or bad connection), or 2. the solenoid is bad ( the internal contacts are worn). In some starter solenoids, you can replace the contacts for cheap (about $10). you say the battery is 1 yr old and it works fine until it acts up. This tells me that the battery is fine, batteries are not finicky, they either hold a charge or they dont (if a battery starts to go bad, it doesnt magically work perfectly fine for the next 6 weeks). Your conections are without corrosion (did you check the connection to the starter solenoid from the battery?) so this leads me to believe your starter solenoid may be causing this. With 120k miles on original starter solenoid, it should be pretty worn by now. Many people make the mistake and replace their whole starter, spending a ton of money for a starter that usually isnt as good as the one they took off.

well hope this gets you started (pun intended:lol: ) in the right direction,
Jason

I'm back.
I have disconnected and cleaned the other ends of the battery cables (ground, on stud into the block, and hot on the starter). They were both just a little gray and dirty. Nothing out of the usual. Not a whiff of corrosion.

I have cut a bit more and pulled back on the insulation on the
positive cable. Definitely not corroded in the slightest inside the insulation.
I think changing the battery cables would be a waste of time and money.

Since I posted, it did the click-then-start thing once.

In answer to the other comment, yes, of course I am not surprised to see intermittent electrical problems. It's the nature of the intermittency that is so perplexing. When starters or solenoids start to go, at least in my experience, they don't act up once every 6 weeks. They act up every couple of days, or even more often, and then just quit.

Since the click-start thing has now happened twice in one week, it does indeed now look like the solenoid or starter is starting to go.

butch h: Curious about your experience with side-mount vs top-mount terminals. I've been waiting for a chance when the thing absolutely will not start at all, to try jumping the hot from the top to the side post, to see if it fires up. But of course, it hasn't done that. These last two times, it's been a click or two and then it starts right up.

After 9 years and 120,000 miles, it makes the most sense to me now to pitch the starter. They don't last forever.

Since the cables appear to be good, I think now I would suspect the starter solenoid, like JSTMoto thought it might be. Have you checked the voltage at the starter?

Good luck, let us know if you find the problem.

Well, since it has continued its intermittent click-no-start stuff, but has now been doing it every couple of days, I've decided to bite the bullet and replace the starter and solenoid. It might turn out to be a waste of money, but certainly seems like the most likely thing now, and isn't worth fooling around with anymore. Curiously, when I look this engine up, it can take one of two starters - one with a gear reduction and one without. The gear-reduction one is smaller in diameter, but how can I tell for sure what I have just by looking up at it from under the truck? Was it common for a '98 to have a gear-reduction starter? It has a 5.7L V8 and a 4 speed automatic.

If the starter sounds like a Dodge when the engine is cranked, it is a
gear reduction starter. If it sounds like a real GM product starting up,
it is a direct drive. The direct drive is way less expensive, and works
fine. I replaced the gear reduction starter on my 95 with the direct
drive.

HEEEE LAR IOUS! I know what you mean "sounds like a Dodge".
Those 1972 Darts always had that high-pitched sound "kew-kew-kew-kew..."

Anyhoo, I looked at both types in the store. The gear reduction is 2.7" in diameter. The straight drive type is 3.5". It's a pretty easy-to-spot difference.

A quick look under my truck showed that it's NOT a gear reduction type.

The reduction type is also about 3/4" longer, in the gear area between the nose cone and the round body (the square-bodied part of the housing is longer).

It's freezing here right now, or I'd do this myself. My local dealership said they would charge me $43 in labor (reasonable) and $230 (not reasonable) for the part. Absurd. I know them well, and they have been a spectacularly reliable service place (yes, yes, I know, even though they are a dealership!). In fact, they are so good, we take our non-GM car there for all its service.
You don't find THAT at many dealerships nowadays.

Anyway, I digress. I said, "Look, I don't know how it could cost that much for a rebuilt starter (yes, $230 for a rebuilt one). I can buy that part retail at Napa, etc, for $120". He agreed it was a high price, but that's the price they charge. I asked him if I could buy myself a starter, bring it to him, and have him put it in. He said, "Absolutely. I understand completely."

So... tomorrow this'll get done. Of course, it hasn't acted up once since I bought the starter earlier this week....

Okay, the rebuilt starter and solenoid have been in for about 1 week. It has started perfectly every time. I won't really believe it 100% until several months have gone by, but since it was starting to do it every few days just before this, I'd say that was it after all.

So... probably 2 problems. When it started out, it was cruddy battery cable ends. That solved the problem for a while, but the solenoid must have been going south.

i have had the same problem in my 98 from day one and i blew the mortor up back in july so it now has a gm creat motorand new every thing but the intake on it water pump starter altanator all that crab new really good battery and still the same problem but mine sound to me like the starter turning but not ingaugeing the fly wheel i stop turning it over and try again and starts right up never had to bosst or fiddle with the cables and no crossion on them sorry to jack your thread