What Happened

ok, so i changed my water pump on my 2.5 v6 96 sebing an when i changed the water pump i changed the timing belt as well but when i disconnected the battery the wrench tapped the ECU case holder :banghead: witch is metal also the main question i have is would that few sparks that hit the ECU fry it?? but on form that after i changed the timing belt an water pump the car would not start it worked fine before other than the water pump leak. are there any thoughts about why it may not be starting? i know for a fact that the timing is dead on. would the car make a putter noisde a little bit if the ecu (or ecm) was fried? any insight would be great i need this car back working asap. thank you

Here are a few links to some pictures of it
http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=131129817&imageID=1542960818
http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=131129817&imageID=1542963516

Details are your friend :)

The ECU will be isolated from the case its in, I doubt sparks hitting it, or even the case being shorted to the battery would damage it.

Have you checked all the fuses? Both under the dash, and in the engine bay?

Then its a matter of examining everything in turn.
Have you checked for Spark?
Have you checked for Fuel?
Have you double, tripple, and quadturple checked the timing? Are you sure its not 180deg out?

i have checked for fuses but dont know how to check the relays or for fuel. im in the process of checking the timing again.

I just replaced the timing belt, water pump, and ckp sensor on a 2002 Acura 3.5RL and I can tell you that todays cars have a lot of electrical connectors that have to be disconnected in order to do that. Make sure you didn't leave something hanging. Also buy a spark tester to check for spark. They are cheap. Also I might worry about creating a dead short to ground anywhere near the ecu. Its not the fact that you created a few sparks, but the fact that you probably sent 400 amps very near circuits that operate on milliamps. Flowing current creates a magnetic field that will induce itself into other conductors.

ok, so i cheked for spark and im getting it. i checked the timing again and its dead on. i looked for lose hanging wires or areas that i may have unscrewed a connection im not sure how to check the fule thing but i know i have 1/4 tank of gas and the car dose may a putter noise when i try to start it but it only dose it for a second then stops how would i check to make sure the computer is ok without having to go to a dealer and pay out the butt for them to check it?

I don't work on many chryslers but if there is some sort of a valve on the fuel rail near the injectors that would be where to check pressure. It probably looks like a tire valve stem and should have a cap on the end. An easy fast way to check for pressure would be to take a small screwdriver and push in on the valve core. Use a rag to catch fuel that may spray out if there is pressure. Do this after you have cycled the key on.

Can you hear the fuel pump run? When the key is turned on the pump should run about 2 seconds to prime the system. have someone turn the key on and hold your ear up to the fuel fill neck with the cap off.

I don't know if you have a stethescope or not but thay can be a handy cheap diagnostic tool. Have someone crank engine while you hold the end on an injector to see if it is opening. You should hear a distinct clicking sound. Also pull a spark plug to see if they are wet. If pump is runnig and you have pressure but injectors aren't firing I would lean toward a smoked ECU. Just a few more quick tests to help rule out a few things. I'll do some asking around tomorrow and post back.

One more thing, timing can be very tricky. The guy in the bay next to me the other day was having a tough time timing a toyota. The two different sources of service literature he looked at gave him two different sets of marks to use. He had to pull the valve cover to see when #1 was at top dead center to make sure.

just as a note: you dont need any fancy stethescope. A long handled screwdriver will do the same thing.

not to sound negative, but you are playing with a non-interference motor. Timing is utterly crucial on these and the concequences for failure is a completely destroyed motor. I will take your word that the timing is correct....I sure hope you're right

If it sputters at all, that means you have at least some spark and some fuel. Its possible that you ruined your computer, but I highly doubt it. The outer case of the ECU (which one? The sebring has 3 computers all piled on top of each other near the battery) is grounded externally and internally. I would think the odds of it causing an internal problem to be very low.

I would suspect you forgot to reconnect the cam sensor or some other minor issue. I could go into details of how to narrow down the problem, but I'm quite sure you don't have any of the equipment it would require, and you definitely don't want to buy the stuff. Would cost more than the motor.

At this point: I'd take it to a shop

i found a friend of a friend who knows about cars and he has a OBD2 reader an the car is throwing no codes so everything is good on that side. he said the car sounds 180 degrees out but all the marks are lined up. this motor is non-interferance fit. so i tried to retard the crank 2-3 degrees an it sounded like it was close to starting but no cigar. should i retard it more? :screwy:

this motor is non-interferance fit.

I'll bet you $100 on that

I just did a motor on one not even a week ago because the timing belt broke. Snapped off all the valves.

you are playing with a non-interference motor
i think you meant that it was not a non-interference motor.

in a noninterference motor, the valves can be depressed all they want and it wont hurt a thing internally.
in an interference type motot, the valves must be timed precisely, or you got big problems.

Yes, my car is noninterferance

I think...what we have here.....is failure....to communicate :D

well once and for all, which is it?
i vote non-interference...
we should start a new thread with a poll... :lol: :lol:

well once and for all, which is it?
i vote non-interference...
we should start a new thread with a poll... :lol: :lol:

I know for a fact they are interference motors. But I'll take someones money if they want to bet me

ok just so everyone understands this motor is a NON-INTERFERANCE motor.

ok just so everyone understands this motor is a NON-INTERFERANCE motor.

using capitol letters doesn't reconfigure your engine.

Just humor me, the next time you have the timing belt off. Put the crank at TDC and try to turn a cam 360* revolution. It'll come off a valve spring and go *THUNK* and stop dead.

That is the sound of valves hitting a piston....hard.

Its a very aggressive way of finding out, but its accurate 100% of the time.

I don't really care if you believe me, but whatever source you're using, that you are basing your assumptions off of, is flat up wrong. You seem to have trouble believing its possible. But thats ok. Its not my car, so I'm not too worried about convincing you about it.

But I would like the $100, if you do want to bet me on it :2cents:

ok so interferance motors are harder to get the timing done... right? because it has to be perfect, so if im at TDC now and its not starting and i have turned the crank 360 back to the other TDC an no start should i retard the timing or advance or what should i do?

If you have a digital camera, take pictures of the cam and crank marks as they are lined up now. Randomly changing timing alignment to solve an unknown problem is definitely not advisable.

Interference motors are no harder to do a timing belt on. Its the consequences of getting the timing wrong that is the major difference. To reiterate what I said earlier, you get it too far off, you have a junk motor afterwords. IE, several thousands of dollars worth of a silly mistake.

You're playing with fire, randomly moving timing marks around