Lost to Acura CL types S

Did anyone raced that car. It is damn fast. Wow.

It depends on how well tuned your car is and how many mods you have done. So far I'm 3 wins 1 loss. Beat the 3 by at least a car length. It's a pretty close matchup. It all depends on the driver of course.:D

Maximadave

those ARE honduhs right ?

I beat one on the road and freeway. There was on section around 90-105 MPH where it pulled on me, the rest I pulled hard especially after 120

You cant beat this car it has 260 HP and I drove this car. It don't matter how you moded your maxima. Anyone who has 5 speed, this car has SS with 5 speed. So please dont say that you beat this car, it is much faster, got better handeling, better torque etc.

Thanks.

I can beat this car with an automagic.... Pleeeezzzzz say I can't... Pleeezzzz! It's not that fast, too heavy and 5 speed auto, I've beaten two already. Its not hard with the right mods... I haven't been on the dyno yet, but I guarentee Ive got the HP and TQ numbers beat , so pleaz don't say it can't be done :D

Originally posted by MAXZIMA
You cant beat this car it has 260 HP and I drove this car. It don't matter how you moded your maxima. Anyone who has 5 speed, this car has SS with 5 speed. So please dont say that you beat this car, it is much faster, got better handeling, better torque etc.

Thanks.

Fuck that I got moded maxima, and I been driving for long time. 1990-2000 Stock and moded maxima, will never, I repead never beet 3.2 CL-S. Remember that. And lets all belive that. Get over it.

Don't let your slow car drag down everyone else! Come on over to So Cali or even better, WA, and I'll show ya what a Maxima can do. I guarantee an Acuara CL is not in the 13's, so what kinda smack ya talkin I'm making more power than a CL, so why can't I beat it? . BTW, I'm not taking this serious, so don't get offended----> :D

Originally posted by MAXZIMA
Fuck that I got moded maxima, and I been driving for long time. 1990-2000 Stock and moded maxima, will never, I repead never beet 3.2 CL-S. Remember that. And lets all belive that. Get over it.

Not sure of exact numbers to each Honduh, but a Civic friend of mine claims that most Honduhs lose over 25% of HP from the crank to the wheels, due to the inefficient drive-train. So, based on that info, the CL is only making 195 FWHP (This is probably wrong, but it's a starting point to calculate CL-S performance). Curb weight of the type S is 3525 lb. Compensate the original 232 ft lb's off the crank with the drive train loss, and their only putting down 174 ft lb's to the wheels.

Now, take the curb weight of the Maxima 3010 lbs and the drive train loss numbers (I could be wrong but I remember Maxima's FWHP and FWTQ numbers to be like 165/175)

And estimate power to weight ratio.

CL-S: .0553

Maxima: .0548

With these numbers, the Max has the advantage off of the launch. His tourque is equal to that of the CL-S yet with significantly less wieght to move. The CL-S will kick in at higher RPM's and accelerate quicker than the Max.

Ultimately, the close numbers dictate that the race goes to the better driver.

Conclusion: A MODDED MAX CAN AND WILL BEAT A CL-S

BS.

How can I argue with that? :bloated:

What do you drive anyway, an acura? Why do you seem to care so much? Bring your acura up to WA and I'll show ya, anytime anywhere, the acura will NOT win. Please frequent the acura board if that's your car of choice, but save the flames for real BS, not a fact like a Maxima can beat a CL. 4 post and this is all you have to say? Get real. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by MAXZIMA
BS. :(

a CL and my Max (99auto SE). My GF's has the CL. Granted, it's not a CL-S, but before 5500 RPMs, they're the same car, except the S is heavier. Off the line, I take her everytime. To prove that it's not driver, we switched cars, and she beat me with the Max every time off the line. In the higher RPM range, I can feel her CL wanting to be an S and probably taking my stock (4spd) max with the Vtec acceleration, but it's still a race that goes to the better driver and better launch.

Hello? What the fuck are you talking about man? The Type S has a huge diference with CL-P it is 2 different cars. The 3.2CL Type S engine was tuned and modified until an extra 35 horsepower emerged from its aluminum block. The compression ratio was raised to 10.5:1. The redline was raised to a stratospheric 6,900 rpm. The fuel-cutoff point was raised to a breath shortening 7,000 rpm. And the threshold for VTEC™ activation was raised to 4,800 rpm. I raced my GF, I raced my GF.

All I am saying that I drove one of the CL-S. I had maxima for 5 years already. I had 1994, 1996, and now 2000. I know what maxima is all about. I was selling these cars, 2-3 every day. My Brother was putting mods on this maximas for 5 fuckin years. He did NOS, Headers, Intakes. ETC. HE is putting modes for CL-S now, and he said there is huge difference in performance compare to Maxima. There are huge numbers of cars that was coming back to the shop, because Maxima's transmission couldn't hadle the power that this guys asked for. Huge adwantage of the CL_S is VTEC that you can play with. He had Acuras that was pulling out of the shop with 330-340 HP. And he was able to give them warranty, because he has trast for this transmission.

So please I don't mean no disrespect to all of you, I am just trying to make you guy's understand that this cars are different.

Never argued that the CL-S wasn't a powerful car, or just how different the S from the standard coupe are (the differences you mentioned aren't that more than what a tuner could do to the max, just you get the Type-S from the factory that way) It's some good marketing on their part.

You're arguing that a stock CL-S can't be beaten by a modded max. I'm saying that it's a close enough race with a NA max to warrent that a modded Max can win. If your brother has honestly been putting mods on Max's for 5 years, he should know that too, or maybe he hasn't put much on them.

As for the trannies... the I30's tranny holds up better than the standard Max tranny. Everything has it's treshold. Maybe the CL-S, with 260HP was made to take a level more abuse than the Max's, after all, the crank does put out 70 more HP.

Huge difference in performance is right. The CL was designed as a sporty coupe, the Max is a sporty sedan. The CL has an extra .2 liters to work with and Vtec. It is a higher output engine.

I'm sure he can tune a CL-S to put out 300+ HP, but that's not the discussion. If you wanna talk about who's car is ultimately faster than who's due to mods... it'll be a long conversation about nothing. There's always someone faster. There are 4 cylinder's out there that would woop on your beloved CL-S. But then again, it all comes down to how much money you've got. :).

Ultimately, it's all about taste in cars to begin with. I like the CL. It's a nice car, with great power.

But I preffer my Max.

Don't forget to ask your buddy about the drive-train loss. ;) After all, it doesn't matter what your crank churns out, it's what the pavement gets.

Not trying to flame you, nor start a flame war, but I believe that you're overstating the stock performance of the CL-S. :peace:

Frezny I am not going to lie but I must admit I like your opinion. You are the only peson that understood me. I don't own Acura, it is lots of money, but I must say I am in love with this car.

Peace.

The CL (not sure about the S since it has been "beefed" up) is much more quiet and sure on the road than my Max. It just seems to hug the turns tighter without so much roll. I can realy relax when driving it.

But, like I said before, I perfer to feel the road. That's what I get from my Max that I can't get from the CL. In the CL, I feel a little too distant from the asphalt. Then again, that's why it's a luxary car and most people buy them.

the only nissan i can see beating this car would be the new infinti g35 aka the skyline in sheeps cloathing

Love your statemens guys.

Thanks.

The CL-S is a REALLY nice car. When my GF was shopping for a new car we went by the Acura dealership and I was drooling all over a dark blue one. It is something the max does not have, a sport version. Sure we have the SE, but it's engine is the same as the rest of the lineup. The closest thing we will have is the 2002 SE when it comes with the 6 speed manual, but it will still have the same engine as the rest of the 2002 model year. To compare the two cars is not really fair, both are what they are meant to be, however, a Max can be MADE to beat a stock CL-S, just about any car can, with enough money and time. The max is a 4 door family car, with loads of potential. I prefer to cherish and enjoy what I have, this is my second maxima and I'm only 23, both paid for by me. I used to own an Integra too, Acura's are really nice cars, I would not mind owning another one someday, but I really love my Nissan, and wouldn't trade it for anything (expect maybe an M3!) I'll just hang out till I can afford the new Max with a 6 speed, now that things gonna be fast! :D

Good openion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:D

true those M3 are phat cars

Originally posted by MAXZIMA
Hello? What the fuck are you talking about man? The Type S has a huge diference with CL-P it is 2 different cars. The 3.2CL Type S engine was tuned and modified until an extra 35 horsepower emerged from its aluminum block. The compression ratio was raised to 10.5:1. The redline was raised to a stratospheric 6,900 rpm. The fuel-cutoff point was raised to a breath shortening 7,000 rpm. And the threshold for VTEC™ activation was raised to 4,800 rpm. I raced my GF, I raced my GF.

All I am saying that I drove one of the CL-S. I had maxima for 5 years already. I had 1994, 1996, and now 2000. I know what maxima is all about. I was selling these cars, 2-3 every day. My Brother was putting mods on this maximas for 5 fuckin years. He did NOS, Headers, Intakes. ETC. HE is putting modes for CL-S now, and he said there is huge difference in performance compare to Maxima. There are huge numbers of cars that was coming back to the shop, because Maxima's transmission couldn't hadle the power that this guys asked for. Huge adwantage of the CL_S is VTEC that you can play with. He had Acuras that was pulling out of the shop with 330-340 HP. And he was able to give them warranty, because he has trast for this transmission.

So please I don't mean no disrespect to all of you, I am just trying to make you guy's understand that this cars are different.


Headers? I don't want to start anything here. I just want to know where he got the headers because I've yet to find any, and if there are some out there, then I'm there. :eek:

Check on COMPTECHUSA.COM in products section.

Thanks.

how can you guys say its impossible to beat the acura when last week my cousin and i were in my maxima when the 40 year old jerk wanted a lil race so i gave it to him. my cars an auto and during shifts he did gain on me but it was pretty neck to neck. finally at around 100 i took him no sweat cuz man you can have a ferrari and theres still a chance i'll beat ya cuz it wasn't drag it was on the street and that takes skill and knowledge of the road your on. but yea this is not an impossible car to beat with an auto stock maxima. perhaps on the 1/4 your fucked but not on the road.

The Cl-s runs a 15.3 1/4 as tested by Road and Track, which means any 5 speed driver worth a s hit can beat them, and an auto max with VB should have no problem. Ive run 15.2 NA...

I am not taking sides here as I like max's and the CL/TL models. First of all, Honda/Acura
autoboxes are not that rugged!!!!! I know, I am a tech at an acura dealership. Honda/acura
manual trannys are very strong and can take high abuse.
My father-in-law has a 97 Max SE that he bought on my recommendation. It is a very quick car when running on premium juice.
Yes, a TL/CL type S is a very quick car, but the 97-99 Max SE would be my first choice. A buddy of mine is a Nissan tech and his 97 SE has 175k on it and running fine.
It is just a matter of personal tastes. Most races are one or lost by skill. I used to work with a former European rally car driver. He took me for a blast one day in an NSX to "demonstrate" what a fine chassis it had. I wasn't nervous even though he had that car dancing around the curves.

when my friend bought his 2001 CL-Type S...i raced him and although i didn't beat him by much, i was still ahead of him..and this was before alot of things that i put in my car(GReddy exhaust, pulley, fuel pressure regulators....)
i'm not saying the CL-Type S is a slow car by no means!!! it's a fast car with nice styling..BUT!!! to say it is 'impossible' to beat the car, is not right. many people(although i can only be a witness to myself) have already raced and beat the Type-S...and it's been done...and whoever posted this thread(sorry i forgot the name), you can do it too!!! :D

Did anyone raced that car. It is damn fast. Wow.i went head to head with 2003 acura tl type s and stayed even up to 60 mph all i have is a stillen intake on my 1998 nissan maxima se

I raced a CL S once from like 20mph-80mph. I have to admit It gave me a lot of comp. I ended up beating it by like a car length. I expected it to kick my ass, but I guess it's just a heavy luxury car.

My friend has a 03 TL-S, almost the same as the CL-S? Very nice car. I did a few runs with him, hes stock and my 98 Max 5spd just has a hacked airbox. He uses gate shifting...not SS because its slower for him, he beat by almost a car. With a few mods and better shifting (learned stick 2 months ago) I think I would be able to keep up with him. A max "NOS, Headers, Intakes. ETC." should be able to take take a CL-S and the tranny should hold it. Btw headers doesnt do much for an NA Max.

Welp, I can't definitively speak for a cl s-type, but I can say (hopefully without getting berated) that my 2003 Accord V-6 (with no Mods) is faster by quite a bit than my almost new 4th generation Maxima SE (29k Miles on it-no mods)-I have tested it several times. My Accord V-6 has a 5 sp auto trans with 240 HP and it really puts the Max to shame in a straight quarter mile, so I don't know what some of you are talking about the CL S-type not beating a 4th gen Max, because the CL will beat my Accord, which will beat a 4th gen Max. So use logic, and be realistic, and swallow some of your Nissan pride, because it is FACT.

I have owned Hondas for years, and everything and I mean EVERYTHING, is better built than a Nissan. Reliability wise and performance wise. I can say this because I own both, and love both, but realistically Honda makes a better product, better fit & finish-thats why there are more on the road.

By todays standards & pricing the new TL Acura competes directly with the new Max. I have driven both, and although it has 5 (measely less horse) the TL BLOWS away the new 6th gen Max. Once again proving Honda products have an edge.

awfully bold statements; the heat is coming...



Welp, I can't definitively speak for a cl s-type, but I can say (hopefully without getting berated) that my 2003 Accord V-6 (with no Mods) is faster by quite a bit than my almost new 4th generation Maxima SE (29k Miles on it-no mods)-I have tested it several times. My Accord V-6 has a 5 sp auto trans with 240 HP and it really puts the Max to shame in a straight quarter mile, so I don't know what some of you are talking about the CL S-type not beating a 4th gen Max, because the CL will beat my Accord, which will beat a 4th gen Max. So use logic, and be realistic, and swallow some of your Nissan pride, because it is FACT.

I have owned Hondas for years, and everything and I mean EVERYTHING, is better built than a Nissan. Reliability wise and performance wise. I can say this because I own both, and love both, but realistically Honda makes a better product, better fit & finish-thats why there are more on the road.

By todays standards & pricing the new TL Acura competes directly with the new Max. I have driven both, and although it has 5 (measely less horse) the TL BLOWS away the new 6th gen Max. Once again proving Honda products have an edge.

I have ran a few, haven't lost yet...totally destroyed one of them, prolly bad driver though. The new TL probably is faster than the 6th gen, but anyone who buys a new Maxima over a G35 deserves to lose anyways. A 6 sp. G35 will piss on a TL, while costing less and looking a whole lot better doing it.

EDIT: Don't say G35 isn't direct competitor for TL, that is invalid at this point. Infiniti chose, correctly, to send power through the rear wheels for its new sports/entry luxury sedan. Acura, on the other hand, chose to go wrong wheel drive and suffers the consequence. Advantage: Infiniti (owned by Nissan)

Welp, I can't definitively speak for a cl s-type, but I can say (hopefully without getting berated) that my 2003 Accord V-6 (with no Mods) is faster by quite a bit than my almost new 4th generation Maxima SE (29k Miles on it-no mods)-I have tested it several times. My Accord V-6 has a 5 sp auto trans with 240 HP and it really puts the Max to shame in a straight quarter mile, so I don't know what some of you are talking about the CL S-type not beating a 4th gen Max, because the CL will beat my Accord, which will beat a 4th gen Max. So use logic, and be realistic, and swallow some of your Nissan pride, because it is FACT.



By todays standards & pricing the new TL Acura competes directly with the new Max. I have driven both, and although it has 5 (measely less horse) the TL BLOWS away the new 6th gen Max. Once again proving Honda products have an edge.
my friend has an 01 cl type s and it's not all that fast, i could hang with him in my 4th gen and when i got my y pipe i'd pull on him and he had 260 hp and 213 lbs/tq. the CL S weighs 3400 lbs., a whole 1/4 ton more than a 4th gen max. so once you factor in the weight (100lbs=~10hp) you're realitically comparing a 210hp car to a 190 hp car, they both have similar tq Acura has the advantage by a measly 8 lbs of tq pushing an extra 500 lbs of body weight. he was auto i was 5 speed so it's totally feasible. we never got to really race but we'd always go cruising together and one time we were just flying from like 30 mph up to 130+ and neither one of our cars made any significant headway against the other. since the acura boasts 70 more hp I'd say even if it tied the max,
it lost.


I have owned Hondas for years, and everything and I mean EVERYTHING, is better built than a Nissan. Reliability wise and performance wise. I can say this because I own both, and love both, but realistically Honda makes a better product, better fit & finish-thats why there are more on the road.

dude performance wise my ass. i had a 96 SE-R that would consistently put SI civics to shame and any integra's below Gs-r's and maybe even a gsr, i never raced one in it. my 190 hp 95 maxima smoked gsr's, hung with type r's (yes i beat one once) and type S's, and murdered preludes making the same 190 hp. I killed a 200 hp RSX type S with 3 kids+myself in my car versus this one kid and his girlfriend in his car,beaten by at least 4 cars. if you take a 5th gen maxima with 227 hp and race a regular cl or tl (not type S) making thr dame hp The Acrua'll get murdered, the only way it could compete was to up the hp to 260. that's why the CL type S came out in 01, to top the best selling V6, the maxima. then was redesigned again in 04, to top the best selling V6 maxima, again. so it finally did, big deal. it's about damn time.

Honda/Acura's been trying to best nissan for the last 10 years by waiting until nissans new vehicles are released and then trying to make something better and failing. in 1995 the 4th gen maxima is introduced and is given title "best v6 engine in it's class". that same year acura introduced the 95 TL with 227 hp trying to best nissan, they failed. in 2001 after nissan had won its 6th "best v6 in it's class" award, acura tries to best it with the type S, and failed, nissan STILL got best v6 in it's class with an engine at a 23 hp defecit. now the 2k4 maxima comes out with 265 hp and low and behold, here come the new acura TL with 270 hp. Not to mention that Acura is honda's top of the line name. it's not even infiniti they're competing with, it's "low end" nissan.

my 2003 Accord V-6 (with no Mods) is faster by quite a bit than my almost new 4th generation Maxima SE (29k Miles on it-no mods)-I have tested it several times

Are you speaking of 0-150MPH, 1/4 mile time, or other MPH ranges? There is not question, that most cars of equal HP/Weight ratios will outrun a 4th Gen Maxima on top, as the engine falls on it's face after 5200 - 5500 RPMS.

. My Accord V-6 has a 5 sp auto trans with 240 HP and it really puts the Max to shame in a straight quarter mile, so I don't know what some of you are talking about the CL S-type not beating a 4th gen Max, because the CL will beat my Accord, which will beat a 4th gen Max. So use logic, and be realistic, and swallow some of your Nissan pride, because it is FACT.

Ok, lets talk fact.

Honda Accord LX-V6 (lightest V6)
Curb Weight: 3274
Crank HP: 240
Crank TQ: 212
%20 drivetrain lose (average)
WHP: 192
WTQ: 169.6
Power to Weight: .0586
TQ to Weight: .0518
Magazine 1/4 mile times: ?

2k1 CL-S
Curb Weight: 3510
Crank HP: 260
Crank TQ: 232
%20 drivetrain lose (average)
WHP: 208
WTQ: 185.6
Power to Weight: .0592
TQ to Weight: ..0528
Magazine 1/4 mile times: 14.6 - 15.1

4th Gen Maxima (lightest)
Curb Weight: 3000 (actually slightly less, but I won't split hairs)
Crank HP: 190
Crank TQ: 205
%20 drivetrain lose (average)
WHP: 152
WTQ: 164
Power to Weight: ..0506
TQ to Weight: .0546
Magazine 1/4 mile times: 14.7 - 15.3

Now, although these number are highly inacturate, they are grounds for comparison. Having a better TQ to Weight ratio, only helps shoot the Max to equal if not better 1/4 mile times than the Accord. Also, the fact of the matter is, that between the V6 Accord and the 4th Gen Max, the max has a higher hp, tq average. The area under the curve is more inportant than Peak numbers.

[IMG=http://forums.maxima.org/customavatars/avatar5928_0.gif]

It's this very same fact that gives the Max a 1/4 mile battle with the CL-S, which, as I described in a previous post, is why it comes down to the driver.



I have owned Hondas for years, and everything and I mean EVERYTHING, is better built than a Nissan. Reliability wise and performance wise. I can say this because I own both, and love both, but realistically Honda makes a better product, better fit & finish-thats why there are more on the road.


Well, to say EVERYTHING would be a little over dramitic, now wouldn't it? I admit, that I do like Honda's build quality, but I would take a VQ against any engine that Honda had on the consumer market. Top ten list...blah...blah..blah... I'm not going to go there. The reason for more Hondas on the road then Nissans, is because of company marketing and structure, not because of "better" product vs. "not a better product". Toyota makes one of the safest, most fuel efficient cars in the world...but how many of them do you see on the road? It's a matter of persepective with many hidden aspects, not simply, "My dad can beat up your Dad!". Oh, and BTW, ever heard of the rb26dett? It's the engint that propelled the Skyline GTR to nearly a decade of victories.


By todays standards & pricing the new TL Acura competes directly with the new Max. I have driven both, and although it has 5 (measely less horse) the TL BLOWS away the new 6th gen Max. Once again proving Honda products have an edge.

Using one product as a comparrison is hardly evidence by which to base such a bold statement on.

Well, to say EVERYTHING would be a little over dramitic, now wouldn't it? I admit, that I do like Honda's build quality, but I would take a VQ against any engine that Honda had on the consumer market. Top ten list...blah...blah..blah... I'm not going to go there. The reason for more Hondas on the road then Nissans, is because of company marketing and structure, not because of "better" product vs. "not a better product". Toyota makes one of the safest, most fuel efficient cars in the world...but how many of them do you see on the road? It's a matter of persepective with many hidden aspects, not simply, "My dad can beat up your Dad!". Oh, and BTW, ever heard of the rb26dett? It's the engint that propelled the Skyline GTR to nearly a decade of victories.



Using one product as a comparrison is hardly evidence by which to base such a bold statement on.[/QUOTE]

How may Toyota's do I see on the road? A whole hell of alot, thats why they have the #1 selling car in America. And correction, Honda always leads the charge on fuel efficiency, always have, always will. Nissan's marketing campaign in the last few years has been much stronger more noticible than either Honda or Toyota put together. Honda sells more for two reasons, pricing, build quality and the name. Nissan is still recovering from the the backlash of some poor decisions and virtual bankruptcy in the 90's.

Bottom line is, I am not here to split hairs and look at stats too much or compare the companies annual reports..Analysis paralysis if you ask me. I can say for certain my 2003 Accord smokes my 4th gen Max.

I can say for certain my 2003 Accord smokes my 4th gen Max.
not to beat a dead horse, but it should. it's the same size engine with 50 more horses; too bad it took honda 8 years to top what nissan did while on the verge of bankruptcy; with almost any nissan versus a comprable honda the nissan comes out on top.
Honda's got better sales for one reason. Civics. ask yourself how many honda's you see, then ask yourself how many of them are civics(del sol's/ crx's) if you exclude the civics, then you don't see all that many honda's, not around here anyway. 11 of my friends own honda's. i swear 8 are civics, 2 are accord's and the other's the 3.2 type S. it's funny cuz my one friend with a 96 accord is always driving his girlfriends 99 altima.

not to beat a dead horse, but it should. it's the same size engine with 50 more horses; too bad it took honda 8 years to top what nissan did while on the verge of bankruptcy; with almost any nissan versus a comprable honda the nissan comes out on top.
Honda's got better sales for one reason. Civics. ask yourself how many honda's you see, then ask yourself how many of them are civics(del sol's/ crx's) if you exclude the civics, then you don't see all that many honda's, not around here anyway. 11 of my friends own honda's. i swear 8 are civics, 2 are accord's and the other's the 3.2 type S. it's funny cuz my one friend with a 96 accord is always driving his girlfriends 99 altima.


If I had a choice, I would drive a 99 anything over a 96, it is newer. I don't disagree with you on the 50 more horse point you brought up, it is exactly what I am trying to say to the person who earlier in this thread claims their 4th gen Max could beat a Type S. Paaaaalease!

How may Toyota's do I see on the road? A whole hell of alot, thats why they have the #1 selling car in America. And correction, Honda always leads the charge on fuel efficiency, always have, always will.


You're not reading my post accurately. I did not ask how many Toyotas you see on the road, nor did I imply that Honda was not concerned with fuel economy, but rather to point out two facts.
1. "Better" is a subjective term.
2. Based on the response you have about fuel economy, it would appear that you value it. The #1 rated hybrid car in the country right now is the Toyota Prius, not a Honda. But, there aren't very many of them on the road, now are there?


Bottom line is, I am not here to split hairs and look at stats too much or compare the companies annual reports..Analysis paralysis if you ask me. I can say for certain my 2003 Accord smokes my 4th gen Max.

In a 1/4 mile race, a 4th gen 5spd Max should be able to take the accord, but the unltimate vicotory goes to the better driver. After the 1/4 mile, the accord has more top end power to take the Max. Maybe your view about your Max is a result of being able to drive the Accord better, that your Max is out of tune, or that the Accord "feels" faster.

In any event, the dead horse is more black and blue than it has ever been. Facts are facts, and opinions are opinions. Only facts can be proven.

...what I am trying to say to the person who earlier in this thread claims their 4th gen Max could beat a Type S. Paaaaalease!
Offer us some proof. The numbers I've given prove that it is possible in a 1/4 mile race. Show us something that proves it is not possible.

Offer us some proof. The numbers I've given prove that it is possible in a 1/4 mile race. Show us something that proves it is not possible.

Of course it is possible. But anything pre 5.5 Gen will have a damn hard time keeping up, assuming same tranny types. A decent driver in the CL-S will beat a very good driver in the Max.

someone pointed out earlier and I agree; Nissan is in Honda's class while Acura is in Infiniti's. each has it's premium line. The fact that the Max vs. the Acura is even a discussion is saying alot about Nissan - you're talking about running a $45k car against a $25k car and it's competetive. There isn't a generation of Accord that comes close to competing with the corresponding Maxima generation. Similarly the TL or CL's shouldn't be mentioned in the same sentence as Infiniti with regard to performance.


If I had a choice, I would drive a 99 anything over a 96, it is newer. I don't disagree with you on the 50 more horse point you brought up, it is exactly what I am trying to say to the person who earlier in this thread claims their 4th gen Max could beat a Type S. Paaaaalease!

You're not reading my post accurately. I did not ask how many Toyotas you see on the road, nor did I imply that Honda was not concerned with fuel economy, but rather to point out two facts.
1. "Better" is a subjective term.
2. Based on the response you have about fuel economy, it would appear that you value it. The #1 rated hybrid car in the country right now is the Toyota Prius, not a Honda. But, there aren't very many of them on the road, now are there?



In a 1/4 mile race, a 4th gen 5spd Max should be able to take the accord, but the unltimate vicotory goes to the better driver. After the 1/4 mile, the accord has more top end power to take the Max. Maybe your view about your Max is a result of being able to drive the Accord better, that your Max is out of tune, or that the Accord "feels" faster.

In any event, the dead horse is more black and blue than it has ever been. Facts are facts, and opinions are opinions. Only facts can be proven.


Dude, go take your twisted logic and sell crazy someplace else, this is not a philosophy debate...You never mentioned 'hybrids' until it suited your offbase argument. At this point I am confused, and in fact may even be permanently dumber from having read everything you wrote.

Like I said, and I will repeat it for you since you are having trouble understanding my simple point, my Accord 'feels' faster than my Maxima because IT IS faster than my Max (I have 50 more HP to prove it to you). No 1/4 mile race and the 4th gen takes the Accord, NO NO NO...I OWN BOTH AND THE ACCORD BEATS THE 4th GEN! Driver or no driver, smokes it, beats it, top end, bottom end..Jeez whatta ya think I am lying to you here or is this just some exercise in what you think is intelligence? Let me simplify it ACCORD = FASTER, 4th Gen Maxima (not out of tune-29k miles) = SLOWER. That should help you Simon.


P.S. Proof shmoof skeptic/data boy...I have no reason to tell fibs or insert 'opinions' here, and thats about all you need for proof, and the fact that I own both cars and you DON'T..But if you really need proof meet me in a 4th gen Max and I will show the empirical data you so desire when I whiz by you in my Accord.

This argument is done, moving on..Peace :)

You never mentioned 'hybrids' until it suited your offbase argument I simply worded it incorrectly. The #1 rated fuel efficient car in the country, which happens to be a hybrid, is the Toyota Prius. It's rating is based on build quality, drivability, safetey, etc...


Like I said, and I will repeat it for you since you are having trouble understanding my simple point, my Accord 'feels' faster than my Maxima because IT IS faster than my Max

It is not faster that a 5spd 4th gen in a 0 - 1/4 mile race. But, it is close enough that driver ability will dictate the win.

(I have 50 more HP to prove it to you).
And I'm glad that you, like most of of the people purchasing cars, believe the peak HP numbers means you are faster. As I said, Honda's marketing has put them on top of the game, and it is because of people like you believing in "fluff" like this. If I have a 5-10 HP gain over you through the entire upswing of the RPM range, with the exception of the final 1000 rmps, where you peak higher than I peak, I am still faster. How much time do you spend in that rpm range vs the amount of time you spend in the range when I have more HP?


Jeez whatta ya think I am lying to you here or is this just some exercise in what you think is intelligence?

No, I just think that you are missinformed and generalizing things too much.


P.S. Proof shmoof skeptic/data boy


You don't have to believe me, that's fine. I just don't want the other people who are reading this to take your opinion as fact without data to support your arguement.


But if you really need proof meet me in a 4th gen Max and I will show the empirical data you so desire when I whiz by you in my Accord.

Anybody else want to take this challenge with a 5sp Max? I don't have my Max anymore. I would be willing to bet that if you are both average drag drivers, the Max will win the 1/4 mile.

You are right, this argument is dead, but it was fun while it lasted.

To all those reading, take from this what you will, but if there is one thing you take away from this, know this. Peak HP numbers are just a very small measurment of an engine/car's ability to accelerate. The total HP/TQ curve is what is important. Take total measurements and compare them with things such as drive train lose, drag coefficient and power/weight ratios, and you can roughly calculate how thing actually rate.

I simply worded it incorrectly. The #1 rated fuel efficient car in the country, which happens to be a hybrid, is the Toyota Prius. It's rating is based on build quality, drivability, safetey, etc...


It is not faster that a 5spd 4th gen in a 0 - 1/4 mile race. But, it is close enough that driver ability will dictate the win.


And I'm glad that you, like most of of the people purchasing cars, believe the peak HP numbers means you are faster. As I said, Honda's marketing has put them on top of the game, and it is because of people like you believing in "fluff" like this. If I have a 5-10 HP gain over you through the entire upswing of the RPM range, with the exception of the final 1000 rmps, where you peak higher than I peak, I am still faster. How much time do you spend in that rpm range vs the amount of time you spend in the range when I have more HP?


No, I just think that you are missinformed and generalizing things too much.



You don't have to believe me, that's fine. I just don't want the other people who are reading this to take your opinion as fact without data to support your arguement.


Anybody else want to take this challenge with a 5sp Max? I don't have my Max anymore. I would be willing to bet that if you are both average drag drivers, the Max will win the 1/4 mile.

You are right, this argument is dead, but it was fun while it lasted.

To all those reading, take from this what you will, but if there is one thing you take away from this, know this. Peak HP numbers are just a very small measurment of an engine/car's ability to accelerate. The total HP/TQ curve is what is important. Take total measurements and compare them with things such as drive train lose, drag coefficient and power/weight ratios, and you can roughly calculate how thing actually rate.



Blah, Blah, blah, blah...My closest friend has a 4th generation 5sp Maxima and I have raced and beat him on several occasions. I don't know what part of this you refuse to understand. You can live in denial all you want, but the new Accord will beat your 4th generation Max. Like it or not it is the truth. Driver ability means absolutely nothing in a quarter mile either, you step on the gas at the right moment and let the car do the work, so quit being foolish. Like I said stop splitting hairs and deal with the fact that your Max is outdated and slower than the new Accord. And if you want to sit here and say this is my opinion, I can't argue with that, it becomes a philisophical argument of words. I am TELLING you I have put this to the test extensively, in the field! And what happens in the field is very different than what happens on paper ya simpleton, any good engineer will tell you that. Get over your stats, numbers and pride and deal with it.

You know what I find funny... We are having a conversation about a car that is almost 10 yrs old going against cars today and the agruement can still be made that the 10 yrs old car can beat those new cars. That by itself is a testament of how good the Nissan VQ is. If this point had been covered already then sorry... I have not read the entire thread yet. :P When I had the 96' Max, there was nothing within it's price range that could touch it. I still drive a 2003 Max and it doesn't lose to anything in its class.

Blah, Blah, blah, blah...My closest friend has a 4th generation 5sp Maxima and I have raced and beat him on several occasions. I don't know what part of this you refuse to understand. You can live in denial all you want, but the new Accord will beat your 4th generation Max. Like it or not it is the truth. Driver ability means absolutely nothing in a quarter mile either, you step on the gas at the right moment and let the car do the work, so quit being foolish. Like I said stop splitting hairs and deal with the fact that your Max is outdated and slower than the new Accord. And if you want to sit here and say this is my opinion, I can't argue with that, it becomes a philisophical argument of words. I am TELLING you I have put this to the test extensively, in the field! And what happens in the field is very different than what happens on paper ya simpleton, any good engineer will tell you that. Get over your stats, numbers and pride and deal with it.

I too have friends with these cars, in addition to seeing multiple videos of Maxima owners beating Accords, CL-S's, and plenty of other cars in 1/4 mile races, modded and not modded. These cars are in FACT evenly matched enough that driver ability will determine the win. Which part can't you understand? Maybe you can't cope with the notion that an "outdated" car, can hang with your "newer" car? Maybe your friend can't drive a stick well enough to match your ability to drag your Accord (although, according to you, it doesn't take much skill). Your experiences are not a controlled environment, documented, or objective enough to say "Accord will always beat the Maxima", which although are not your exact words, it tends to be the point you are making.


Tell you what. Answer these questions honestly, and let this be the end of it.

1. Do you think that the Accord can lose to a 4th gen Max in the 1/4mile, ever (a yes or no answer is required only)?

2. By how many cars lengths have you beaten your friend in a 1/4 mile race? (mind you, your answer will give us a rough determination to how fast you were traveling, and a good guess as to what your actual 1/4 ET would be. It will also help to understand how well you and your friend are at drag racing.)

3. What is your 1/4 drag time for your Accord (so that we don't have to calculate it based on your response above)?

4. Did I ever say that the Max couldn't lose to the Accord in the 1/4 mile?

5. Do you actually believe that a peak HP number is more important than a balanced hp curve?

Oooohhh now your tune is changed to the Max can 'hang' with the Accord huh? Before it was the Max could beat it. And why are you trying to make it sound like I am embarrased that one of my cars is slower than the other? I own them both you foolish dolt, and love them both for different reasons, but the fact is the Accord is faster than the Max in every way (as it should be since it is newer etc)...So paaaalease dude, don't try and corner me with your useless close-ended questions to try and force the answers your so hopelessly looking for, this conversation is over..Boy, you are an incorrigible SOB, good luck to you an yours.



P.S. get a life.

Oooohhh now your tune is changed to the Max can 'hang' with the Accord huh? Before it was the Max could beat it. And why are you trying to make it sound like I am embarrased that one of my cars is slower than the other? I own them both you foolish dolt, and love them both for different reasons, but the fact is the Accord is faster than the Max in every way (as it should be since it is newer etc)...So paaaalease dude, don't try and corner me with your useless close-ended questions to try and force the answers your so hopelessly looking for, this conversation is over..Boy, you are an incorrigible SOB, good luck to you an yours.



P.S. get a life.

Why not just answer the questions?

Do, you really enjoy dancing around the subject by focusing on fictitious details? I had hoped to “force” you to address them by asking simple questions, but you seem unable to do even that, possibly as a result of that fact that your responses demonstrate that you lack skills such as reading comprehension and analytical thought.

Accord:

¼ mile times both mid 80 degrees

Relative Humidity 85 %Rh
Without injen cai
60’ 2.369
330 6.529
1/8 9.869
MPH 74.03
1000 12.792
1/4 15.249
MPH 91.93
April 16, 2003

Found: http://www.v6performance.net/forums/showthread.php?threadid=2337&highlight=1%2F4+time

97 5spd STOCK: 14.7 or any other time you may want to take your pick from here: (NOTE, not all these times are for stock Maximas) http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?t=242988

Perhaps the only way to prove it better is if I posted actual timeslips?

dammit everyone needs to chill out. skids just disagree's. it's his right as an american. i disagree with him so...

If I had a choice, I would drive a 99 anything over a 96, it is newer. I don't disagree with you on the 50 more horse point you brought up, it is exactly what I am trying to say to the person who earlier in this thread claims their 4th gen Max could beat a Type S. Paaaaalease!
well i posted this

"my friend has an 01 cl type s and it's not all that fast, i could hang with him in my 4th gen and when i got my y pipe i'd pull on him and he had 260 hp and 213 lbs/tq. the CL S weighs 3400 lbs., a whole 1/4 ton more than a 4th gen max. so once you factor in the weight (100lbs=~10hp) you're realitically comparing a 210hp car to a 190 hp car, they both have similar tq Acura has the advantage by a measly 8 lbs of tq pushing an extra 500 lbs of body weight. he was auto i was 5 speed so it's totally feasible."

and i stand by it, except that it's 232 tq not 213. i didn't race the 6 speed cl, i know for a fact that would probably have handed me my ass, it was the 5 speed auto w/ manual mode, but when you figure in acura's tendency to make their cars so overweight, their hp ratings are nothing more than pretty numbers dulled down by the cars obesity. HP sells cars that's how they move their units. like the "amazing" the 240 hp S2000. they fail to mention that it only has 159 lbs of tQ and needs to be redlined every gear to actually move the vehicle. the 190 hp Type R teggie. that thing weighs 2800 lbs. a measly 95 lbs less than the maxima. however the maxima makes 63 more lbs of TQ. same with the 99 SI with a whopping 160 hp but a meager 113 lbs of Tq. i used to beat them all the time in my SE-R cuz it had 25 lbs of tq more and weighed less, the 15 less hp didn't mean anything. same goes for the 200 hp RSX type S with it's 140 lbs of TQ. saying a 190 hp car can't beat a 240 hp car is stupid, especially when that 240 hp car makes almost the same Tq and weighs significantly more. i'm not saying i could have beaten an accord, or that i have, i'm just saying making judgements like that based solely on the HP rating is stupid. a cl type S runs a 15.3 in the 1/4


look:
Motor Trend, Road Test, June 1994
"Our tester, a five-speed SE version of this fourth generation of Maxima, produced a blazing 6.6-second 0-60-mph time, and a 15.2-second, 92.4-mph quarter-mile run. Ask us,
and we'll tell you how the Maxima SE will whip the Integra GS-R, and Taurus SHO;
the new Maxima also shows no mercy on its Nissan stablemates: It'll stomp the normally aspirated 300ZX, and drivers of automatic-transmissioned 300ZX Turbos best not be snoozing when the light goes green.
This demure-looking family car is the quickest Japanese sedan available in the States."

the N/A 300zx's at that time made 220 hp, which is 30 more than the max, but look what happened.

i just wanna make it clear that i think a 4th gen max will lose to a 3.0 accord. i also think that a 3.0 accord will take a CL type S. i've driven in the cl many times: rarely as a driver but often as a passenger it's just a very good looking car that's grotesquely over weight.

And...

Just because something is "old", it doesn't mean that it is slower than something that is "new". I can name 10 cars off of the top of my head that are at least a decade older than the Maxima, and can hand the Maxima its butt. I'm not playing favorites, just facing facts.

And...

Just because something is "old", it doesn't mean that it is slower than something that is "new". I can name 10 cars off of the top of my head that are at least a decade older than the Maxima, and can hand the Maxima its butt. I'm not playing favorites, just facing facts.
BUICK GRAND NATIONAL. 'nuff said.

And...

Just because something is "old", it doesn't mean that it is slower than something that is "new". I can name 10 cars off of the top of my head that are at least a decade older than the Maxima, and can hand the Maxima its butt. I'm not playing favorites, just facing facts.

And I could prolly name 50 new cars off the top of my head that would show a Maxima it's taillights. Like a Saturn Ion Redline, or an SRT-4 for example. Yours is a moot point; of course a Ferrari, Lambourghini, Porsche, or the likes will smoke a Maxima. There are a whole shitload more cars now that would dust a Maxima than there were in 1984. This is the fact; cars are WAY FASTER than 20 years ago, or even 10. Hell, that Ion Redline would piss on any Mustang GT before the 1999 model year. Now that is some crazy shit.

Why don't we compare the 2002-2003 Maxima to the CL-S instead of the 4th gen.

This should be the comparo:
2002 Maxima SE 6-speed
2002 or 2003 CL-S 5-speed


Now who gets the spanking?

The CL has .2 liters on the 4th-gen Maxima, plus it has two doors and a different purpose as a car.

At least this will take focus off the long lost Altima vs Maxima thread to a new place.

MAXIMA is better. Thats my $10.00. Pick was right to compare the 6th 2k2 to a 2k2 CL, a bone stock 6 speed runs about a 14.5 from the numbers I've seen people post with acuras, I have seen more Nissans touch lower 14's with stock cars and even have the time slips to show it.

And its sad that the Maxima is that good that it needs to be compared with Acuras best which even is a luxury sports coupe, not sedan.

Better yet, let's compare the TL with the Maxima. The 6-speed owners of the TL-S owners are lucky for their transmission to survive after 50,000 miles.


Or try this: G35 vs. CL-S.

Let's not even go there. :iceslolan

Actually the G35 Auto is kinda slow, never been in a CL-s, but the thing has no balls for 280hp, I guess it doesnt help when you just got out of your friends GT stang :D.