93 won't start at all
texasgal
11-10-2006, 10:56 AM
HELP!! I think I have a compounded problem which now involves the VATS. My 93 LeSabre won't start... after reading everything I could get my hands on in this forum, and trying just about everything suggested, I'm down to one conclusion, but would like to get some feedback before I go to such drastic measures. Apologies ahead of time for the lengthy post.
Several months ago, I drove to pick up a friend, cut the engine, on an incline. (This was originally my mother's car and she said that idling in the parking lot and going up an overpass would cause the AC to start blowing through the defrost vents. True, but not sure if this is even related.) When I went to start the car, nothing, it didn't make a single click or noise when I tried to turn it over except weak electrical dings. I thought maybe having the radio on had caused the battery to run down enough that I wasn't getting enough juice. I left the key in the ignition but in the Off position and waited a little while, and it did finally start. A few days later, in my driveway, it did the same thing, wouldn't start, no noise at all except the same weak dings like the battery had run down.
I took the battery to Autozone to have it tested after multiple jumps didn't work. They said the battery was run down, old and probably wouldn't charge so I bought another one. Didn't work. I managed to have a mechanic come to my house to help diagnose the problem. I'm not sure what he did, but he did something to the starter with a flat head screw driver, made the starter work and the engine turned over then immediately die. He told me the starter was fine, the battery was fine, but it was most likely the cylinoid. He said a bad starter/starter cylinoid might cause a battery drain. I took the starter to Autozone for testing. The guy connected it to his machine and ran it. It made a horrible sound and when he opened the door to his machine there was smoke coming out. He said I'd probably gotten a little oil on it, but that the machine said the starter was fine. So I bought a new cylinoid and replaced it instead. This time, I had juice and the dings from the key and open doors sounded fine but it still wouldn't start. I checked all the fuses, cleaned and replaced the screws to the battery, and checked for corroded wires from the battery to the starter.
Someone then mentioned that I should just replace the entire starter so I did. I also had the old starter retested at a different place and it made a grinding noise on their machine and he said it was bad anyway. But after putting in the new one... Same problem. Then, while sitting in the car, tearing my hair out:banghead:, I noticed the sercurity light was flashing. I honestly can't say if this was on or not the entire time, so I did some research. The security light indicates something with the VATS. I have the key with the little metal thing at the end (Pass Key-2?) So, I tried a spare key that I have and know is good, the steering column in different positions while trying to start it, wiggled the key, tried it in R,N,D... nothing changes. I used Hot's information about the 15 min in the on position fix 3x's... repeatedly, no change. The power windows work, keyless entry works, radio, ac fan blows and when I turn it from Off to ON I can hear something mechanical engaging, and it did that before this problem started. But when I turn it from the On to the Start.. nothing. And one thing that seems important here... after 15 mins the flashing security light is supposed to go off? Mine NEVER goes off, even after leaving it in the On position for 30 mins. Also, I can't tell from these posts if the TCM and the PCM are seperate components or even where they're located or can be replaced seperatedly.
From what I understand about the VATS, (and of course, you can tell that its not very much) the power from the battery to the starter may have been disengaged as well as maybe the fuel injectors? And maybe this problem may have originally been a starter issue, but now is a VATS problem since the mechanic tried to bypass the ignition when he tested the starter with his screwdriver? I think the key was in the ignition when he tried it, although I don't remember for sure.
So... now what... buy a thing from Radio Shack to sauder to the wires on the VATS system behind the glove box to bypass it completely? I don't feel like I could do anything INSIDE the steering column, but could probably bypass the system at the box as suggested in one of the posts earlier. I just don't want to get into this if the fact that the light never going off indicates a complelely different issue. And taking it to the dealership is NOT an option at this point. Replace the ignition switch? I guess the only thing I have left to try before tearing out the glovebox is to spray wd-40 into the ignition switch itself. But I'm leary about doing this since it IS electrical and also because in the ON position I get activity from the car's electrical system.
Someone posted something about a "harnessplug for ICM" having a short and causing his car not to start. I think I'm going to try to get that translated and try to see if that is my problem in the meantime.
Help!! I have to get this thing running before the city tows it since the inspection sticker has now run out.
Several months ago, I drove to pick up a friend, cut the engine, on an incline. (This was originally my mother's car and she said that idling in the parking lot and going up an overpass would cause the AC to start blowing through the defrost vents. True, but not sure if this is even related.) When I went to start the car, nothing, it didn't make a single click or noise when I tried to turn it over except weak electrical dings. I thought maybe having the radio on had caused the battery to run down enough that I wasn't getting enough juice. I left the key in the ignition but in the Off position and waited a little while, and it did finally start. A few days later, in my driveway, it did the same thing, wouldn't start, no noise at all except the same weak dings like the battery had run down.
I took the battery to Autozone to have it tested after multiple jumps didn't work. They said the battery was run down, old and probably wouldn't charge so I bought another one. Didn't work. I managed to have a mechanic come to my house to help diagnose the problem. I'm not sure what he did, but he did something to the starter with a flat head screw driver, made the starter work and the engine turned over then immediately die. He told me the starter was fine, the battery was fine, but it was most likely the cylinoid. He said a bad starter/starter cylinoid might cause a battery drain. I took the starter to Autozone for testing. The guy connected it to his machine and ran it. It made a horrible sound and when he opened the door to his machine there was smoke coming out. He said I'd probably gotten a little oil on it, but that the machine said the starter was fine. So I bought a new cylinoid and replaced it instead. This time, I had juice and the dings from the key and open doors sounded fine but it still wouldn't start. I checked all the fuses, cleaned and replaced the screws to the battery, and checked for corroded wires from the battery to the starter.
Someone then mentioned that I should just replace the entire starter so I did. I also had the old starter retested at a different place and it made a grinding noise on their machine and he said it was bad anyway. But after putting in the new one... Same problem. Then, while sitting in the car, tearing my hair out:banghead:, I noticed the sercurity light was flashing. I honestly can't say if this was on or not the entire time, so I did some research. The security light indicates something with the VATS. I have the key with the little metal thing at the end (Pass Key-2?) So, I tried a spare key that I have and know is good, the steering column in different positions while trying to start it, wiggled the key, tried it in R,N,D... nothing changes. I used Hot's information about the 15 min in the on position fix 3x's... repeatedly, no change. The power windows work, keyless entry works, radio, ac fan blows and when I turn it from Off to ON I can hear something mechanical engaging, and it did that before this problem started. But when I turn it from the On to the Start.. nothing. And one thing that seems important here... after 15 mins the flashing security light is supposed to go off? Mine NEVER goes off, even after leaving it in the On position for 30 mins. Also, I can't tell from these posts if the TCM and the PCM are seperate components or even where they're located or can be replaced seperatedly.
From what I understand about the VATS, (and of course, you can tell that its not very much) the power from the battery to the starter may have been disengaged as well as maybe the fuel injectors? And maybe this problem may have originally been a starter issue, but now is a VATS problem since the mechanic tried to bypass the ignition when he tested the starter with his screwdriver? I think the key was in the ignition when he tried it, although I don't remember for sure.
So... now what... buy a thing from Radio Shack to sauder to the wires on the VATS system behind the glove box to bypass it completely? I don't feel like I could do anything INSIDE the steering column, but could probably bypass the system at the box as suggested in one of the posts earlier. I just don't want to get into this if the fact that the light never going off indicates a complelely different issue. And taking it to the dealership is NOT an option at this point. Replace the ignition switch? I guess the only thing I have left to try before tearing out the glovebox is to spray wd-40 into the ignition switch itself. But I'm leary about doing this since it IS electrical and also because in the ON position I get activity from the car's electrical system.
Someone posted something about a "harnessplug for ICM" having a short and causing his car not to start. I think I'm going to try to get that translated and try to see if that is my problem in the meantime.
Help!! I have to get this thing running before the city tows it since the inspection sticker has now run out.
texasgal
11-10-2006, 10:57 AM
oops multiple posts..
texasgal
11-10-2006, 11:19 AM
And just an afterthought... will the original key/spare key with the resistor in it still work if I use the resistor bypass method?
spinne1
11-10-2006, 11:16 PM
Firstly, ouch. Secondly, yes, your original keys with the resisters will still work if you bypass the VATS system. If you do bypass it, make sure you find the correct resistor range:
http://www.thirdgen.org/vats_passkey_system
You can find the resistance by touching a voltmeter to the two metal spots on each side of the resistor in the key. By testing both of your keys and then comparing those values to the published chart, you should be able to tell which resistance value you need.
It was unfortunate that you've had so much trouble with this, and also that you've spent money that likely did not need spending (the starter and solenoid diagnoses were mere guesses it seems).
As for the mechanic touching the starter solenoid lead with a screwdriver that was attached to a positive power source, this is a normal test and is okay and did not do damage to the car (but you can kill a battery if you touch the screwdriver to ground--but usually it would not do so).
While a wiring issue going into your PCM could certainly be your problem, the odds are that it is not. I would exhaust all other issues first. Keep in mind that besides the VATS issue, a broken or misadjusted transaxle position switch can also cause symptoms of a car that will not crank. Or the ignition switch could be broken, or the wiring from the ignition switch could be faulty.
The way your system works basically is this: you put the key in, the resistance is read by the VATS module. If it is in range, the VATS module allows your ignition signal to pass eventually to the transaxle position switch. One of the switch's jobs is to only allow the car to start in either park or neutral position. If the switch is operating correctly, then it passes the battery voltage from itself on to the wire that goes to your starter solenoid. When the starter solenoid gets 12V, it closes a connection inside which allows the giant fat red wire running from the battery to the starter to give all its juice to the starter motor which then cranks your engine.
Therefore, you know your problem is in either the power source itself (battery and posts and wiring), or getting the power from the ignition switch to the starter solenoid. You seemed to have eliminated the first possibility by replacing the battery and posts. You can also check to make sure the fat red wire is tight at the starter, and that the fat black ground wire from the battery is tight at the engine block where it is bolted.
The flashing security light is a major clue. According the page I linked above, the light will stay on if the car has a code 53. Check your engine codes. Take a paper clip or wire and jump positions A and B in your under dash wiring harness. (It is directly under the steering wheel in the black plastic shield towards your foot pedals. A and B are the right most positions towards you.) Do not try to start the car!!! Simply put the key to the run position and watch the check engine light. It will blink once, then twice (or "12") three times, then will blink for any engine codes you may have three times, then when done with stored codes, will go back to 12 again. Write any codes down and report back. If you have a 53 you likely have a VATS issue. If not, I'm not sure.
As for the AC blowing out the defrost, that is usually caused by a vacuum problem. It often is that the line going to the black plastic v shaped box on the firewall is either off or leaking. Check all your vacuum hoses under the hood and replace any that are bad.
I don't know what a TCM is. The PCM (or ECM or "computer"--all the same thing) is located under the passenger side dash. You have to remove the black plastic shield, then look for a silver box about 1 1/2 thick, 5 inches tall and 7 inches wide. It will have three wiring harnesses going into it, at least one of which may be green (it is on a 92).
If you find that you need a new PCM a junkyard is a good place, especially a pull-it-yourself place.
According the VATS page linked above, the security light will flash for four minutes if the VATS module detects a key with the wrong resistence. It says it will stay on continuously if the VATS module detects a failure while the engine is running. But it also says that it will allow the car to be started after such a detection is made. For that reason I am a bit stumped.
Do the checks recommended above and bypass if you want to. Report back with results and folks here will try to help further if we can.
http://www.thirdgen.org/vats_passkey_system
You can find the resistance by touching a voltmeter to the two metal spots on each side of the resistor in the key. By testing both of your keys and then comparing those values to the published chart, you should be able to tell which resistance value you need.
It was unfortunate that you've had so much trouble with this, and also that you've spent money that likely did not need spending (the starter and solenoid diagnoses were mere guesses it seems).
As for the mechanic touching the starter solenoid lead with a screwdriver that was attached to a positive power source, this is a normal test and is okay and did not do damage to the car (but you can kill a battery if you touch the screwdriver to ground--but usually it would not do so).
While a wiring issue going into your PCM could certainly be your problem, the odds are that it is not. I would exhaust all other issues first. Keep in mind that besides the VATS issue, a broken or misadjusted transaxle position switch can also cause symptoms of a car that will not crank. Or the ignition switch could be broken, or the wiring from the ignition switch could be faulty.
The way your system works basically is this: you put the key in, the resistance is read by the VATS module. If it is in range, the VATS module allows your ignition signal to pass eventually to the transaxle position switch. One of the switch's jobs is to only allow the car to start in either park or neutral position. If the switch is operating correctly, then it passes the battery voltage from itself on to the wire that goes to your starter solenoid. When the starter solenoid gets 12V, it closes a connection inside which allows the giant fat red wire running from the battery to the starter to give all its juice to the starter motor which then cranks your engine.
Therefore, you know your problem is in either the power source itself (battery and posts and wiring), or getting the power from the ignition switch to the starter solenoid. You seemed to have eliminated the first possibility by replacing the battery and posts. You can also check to make sure the fat red wire is tight at the starter, and that the fat black ground wire from the battery is tight at the engine block where it is bolted.
The flashing security light is a major clue. According the page I linked above, the light will stay on if the car has a code 53. Check your engine codes. Take a paper clip or wire and jump positions A and B in your under dash wiring harness. (It is directly under the steering wheel in the black plastic shield towards your foot pedals. A and B are the right most positions towards you.) Do not try to start the car!!! Simply put the key to the run position and watch the check engine light. It will blink once, then twice (or "12") three times, then will blink for any engine codes you may have three times, then when done with stored codes, will go back to 12 again. Write any codes down and report back. If you have a 53 you likely have a VATS issue. If not, I'm not sure.
As for the AC blowing out the defrost, that is usually caused by a vacuum problem. It often is that the line going to the black plastic v shaped box on the firewall is either off or leaking. Check all your vacuum hoses under the hood and replace any that are bad.
I don't know what a TCM is. The PCM (or ECM or "computer"--all the same thing) is located under the passenger side dash. You have to remove the black plastic shield, then look for a silver box about 1 1/2 thick, 5 inches tall and 7 inches wide. It will have three wiring harnesses going into it, at least one of which may be green (it is on a 92).
If you find that you need a new PCM a junkyard is a good place, especially a pull-it-yourself place.
According the VATS page linked above, the security light will flash for four minutes if the VATS module detects a key with the wrong resistence. It says it will stay on continuously if the VATS module detects a failure while the engine is running. But it also says that it will allow the car to be started after such a detection is made. For that reason I am a bit stumped.
Do the checks recommended above and bypass if you want to. Report back with results and folks here will try to help further if we can.
texasgal
11-13-2006, 10:09 AM
Thank you so much for your reply Spinne1. I haven't done anything as far as the diagnostics codes since I didn't realize you could, let alone how. :) Hoping for a diagram, I found this link in the forums for my car for "SES" diagnostics codes:
http://autorepair.about.com/library/ts/obd-i/bl-dtcs-31a.htm
At the bottom, it says its in the "passanger compartment". I am assuming they mean under the dash on the passanger side? I got under there and looked but the only thing that remotely looks like this module is directly below the steering column (you have to nearly stand on your head to get to it). This is visable without removing the kick panel from either side. Isn't this the same thing they connect to their diagnostics machine for the annual emissions tests? Well, either way, there IS a module where YOU indicated it would be. :) So much for How-to manuals.:uhoh:
BUT, this brings up the question of "are there two modules", one for regular diagnostics and one for the VATS? Their description says 16 plugs, but usually only 8 wires are used. That doesn't match the one I have located which is 12 plugs but only 6 wires used (and in the link I provided, they said 12 plugs, only 8 might be used.) So, you see my confusion, and I'm hoping you can clarify this for me. :eek: (UPDATE: Buick dealer said it was the same module, under the steering wheel column.)
Now, assuming I have the right module located, I paperclip short A and B. And according to your directions A and B are on the right side .. that's top row? I just want to doublecheck this position before I start sticking metal objects into places that were build for something else. LOL Two rows, 1 and 2, and 6 columns A-H and then M, where I, J, and K are missing? And L is...uhm.. non-existant? Okay, then the "SES" light (or similar light on the dash) will blink 1 time long, pause and 2 times short.. meaning it is diagnosing. Key should be On, but not in Start position? Then, hopefully I'll get 5 short blinks, pause, 3 short blinks for 53 indicating the VATS? And if its the transaxle switch - 3 long, pause, 6 short for 36? (according to the link above.) Any code will repeat for a total of three times displayed, then blink 1 long, pause, 2 short (12). Is that correct?
I did WD-40 in the ignition switch... of course nothing changed. And funny, I read your link.. it says don't do that. Figures. :banghead: Hoping I didn't mess things up more.
Now, there's just the question of the transaxle switch (and when I called and asked for a price for replacement, the guy acted like I'd lost my mind and said he had no idea what I was talking about, unless it was the Neutral Safety Switch -- which tells the car whether its in Park or Neutral.) So, I guess I'll go try the code thing, and worry about that switch, where it is and how to 'wiggle' it later.
Thanks again. :grinno:
http://autorepair.about.com/library/ts/obd-i/bl-dtcs-31a.htm
At the bottom, it says its in the "passanger compartment". I am assuming they mean under the dash on the passanger side? I got under there and looked but the only thing that remotely looks like this module is directly below the steering column (you have to nearly stand on your head to get to it). This is visable without removing the kick panel from either side. Isn't this the same thing they connect to their diagnostics machine for the annual emissions tests? Well, either way, there IS a module where YOU indicated it would be. :) So much for How-to manuals.:uhoh:
BUT, this brings up the question of "are there two modules", one for regular diagnostics and one for the VATS? Their description says 16 plugs, but usually only 8 wires are used. That doesn't match the one I have located which is 12 plugs but only 6 wires used (and in the link I provided, they said 12 plugs, only 8 might be used.) So, you see my confusion, and I'm hoping you can clarify this for me. :eek: (UPDATE: Buick dealer said it was the same module, under the steering wheel column.)
Now, assuming I have the right module located, I paperclip short A and B. And according to your directions A and B are on the right side .. that's top row? I just want to doublecheck this position before I start sticking metal objects into places that were build for something else. LOL Two rows, 1 and 2, and 6 columns A-H and then M, where I, J, and K are missing? And L is...uhm.. non-existant? Okay, then the "SES" light (or similar light on the dash) will blink 1 time long, pause and 2 times short.. meaning it is diagnosing. Key should be On, but not in Start position? Then, hopefully I'll get 5 short blinks, pause, 3 short blinks for 53 indicating the VATS? And if its the transaxle switch - 3 long, pause, 6 short for 36? (according to the link above.) Any code will repeat for a total of three times displayed, then blink 1 long, pause, 2 short (12). Is that correct?
I did WD-40 in the ignition switch... of course nothing changed. And funny, I read your link.. it says don't do that. Figures. :banghead: Hoping I didn't mess things up more.
Now, there's just the question of the transaxle switch (and when I called and asked for a price for replacement, the guy acted like I'd lost my mind and said he had no idea what I was talking about, unless it was the Neutral Safety Switch -- which tells the car whether its in Park or Neutral.) So, I guess I'll go try the code thing, and worry about that switch, where it is and how to 'wiggle' it later.
Thanks again. :grinno:
texasgal
11-13-2006, 10:56 AM
Okay, diagnostics was easier than I thought it would be. It seems this module under the steering column has wires going to A, B, G, H, I, and J. But of course.. I got NO information from that... I plugged a paper clip into the terminals that were labeled on the module A and B.. the usual "getitng ready to start" noises and the radiator fan kicked in (which it doesn't do when I just try to start it normally)... Waited to get past the 1 long, an 2 short.. it didn't. That's ALL it blinked. And I noticed when I got in the car, the charge is halfway between 8 and 9 now when it was at 13 day before yesterday. Sigh. This is hopeless.
maxwedge
11-13-2006, 01:31 PM
It is only hopeless if a qualified mechanic cannot trace this problem, you get the hint I am sure.
texasgal
11-13-2006, 02:45 PM
0.o The Hint? In other words take it to a mechanic? Sure thing.. will do, in March 2007. Until then though, I'm unfortunately stuck trying to figure it out here. :( And you'll have to excuse my frustration at this point.
I've left the resistor bypass for the VATS as a final last attempt. I've been focusing on the Neutral Safety-Transaxel- Ignition Lockout Switch. The pictures I previously found are here.
http://www.bwdbrand.com/web_app/catalog/bwd_bgBulk.aspx
Simple question.. am I misinformed as to the location of this part? Under the dash, on top of or near the steering column?
Thanks again for your helpful input.
I've left the resistor bypass for the VATS as a final last attempt. I've been focusing on the Neutral Safety-Transaxel- Ignition Lockout Switch. The pictures I previously found are here.
http://www.bwdbrand.com/web_app/catalog/bwd_bgBulk.aspx
Simple question.. am I misinformed as to the location of this part? Under the dash, on top of or near the steering column?
Thanks again for your helpful input.
maxwedge
11-13-2006, 04:15 PM
Top of the trans where the linkage goes into the trans, lt side under the exhaust crossover. I understand your frustration here, again, this is a result of not being equipped ,qualified or experienced enough to tackle this. We will help as much as possible here, but as a result of the situation we as well as you are handicapped. Battery voltage readings of 8-9v are insufficient to start, operate or run any accessory, address that first. The pcm is seperate from the vats module, that( vats) cannot be accessed without a highline scanner.
spinne1
11-13-2006, 07:02 PM
Disregard what I said about code 53 being tied to your VATS system. I don't have the codes memorized and see that code 53 is the EGR system. Not only that but you don't have any codes anyhow.
Maxwedge is right, this is a fixable problem but it may be more than you want to tackle. His description of the transaxle position switch is right, and to further aid you, follow the wire from the starter solenoid (the "little) wire connected to the starter. It goes directly back to a wiring harness, which then goes into the transaxle position switch. The switch is actually a metal piece about 3 inches by 3 inches and about 1/2" thick. It has the end of the linkage right in the center of it which shifts the transmission into Park, Drive, etc. when you move the gear selector. There is more than just the one wire going into it. It has two groups of wires going into it, but towards the switch all the wires should be wrapped in black plastic wire covering. The first thing I would do if you is get a 3/32" drill bit. Loosen the two 13 or 14mm bolts holding the switch in place a little (enough to freely move the switch left or right). Now, put have someone attempt to crank the car while you slowly move it to all positions. If it will not attempt to start in any position, more diagnostics are needed. If it does start in some, put the drill bit in between the plastic notches in the area near the center where the shifter bolt is. There is a gap meant to be aligned with a drill bit there. It will be aligned right when the drill bit will sit in the whole groove (you have to look at it to know what I mean). If you get no cranking, then you need to determine whether the wire coming from your ignition switch/VATS module is actually feeding 12V at the time you turn the key to the start position. How to determine that? Subscribe to Alldata.com and look up the engine wiring diagrams and locate the starting system. You should find the wires coming from the transaxle position switch. Trace the one going ultimately to the VATS system. When you find it, note the color and which wiring harness it is in and the position in the wiring harness and then go out to your car and pull the wiring harness in question apart and hook a voltmeter to ground and to the wire in question on the end of the wiring harness NOT going into your transaxle position switch. Then have someone attempt to crank the car while you look at the voltmeter. Does the signal go to 12V when the car is in the start position? If so, the transaxle position switch or the wiring involved with the switch is faulty. Replace the switch.
I would not bypass the VATS system unless I was certain that that was my problem.
EDIT: the drill bit is 3/32" not 13/32" I believe.
Maxwedge is right, this is a fixable problem but it may be more than you want to tackle. His description of the transaxle position switch is right, and to further aid you, follow the wire from the starter solenoid (the "little) wire connected to the starter. It goes directly back to a wiring harness, which then goes into the transaxle position switch. The switch is actually a metal piece about 3 inches by 3 inches and about 1/2" thick. It has the end of the linkage right in the center of it which shifts the transmission into Park, Drive, etc. when you move the gear selector. There is more than just the one wire going into it. It has two groups of wires going into it, but towards the switch all the wires should be wrapped in black plastic wire covering. The first thing I would do if you is get a 3/32" drill bit. Loosen the two 13 or 14mm bolts holding the switch in place a little (enough to freely move the switch left or right). Now, put have someone attempt to crank the car while you slowly move it to all positions. If it will not attempt to start in any position, more diagnostics are needed. If it does start in some, put the drill bit in between the plastic notches in the area near the center where the shifter bolt is. There is a gap meant to be aligned with a drill bit there. It will be aligned right when the drill bit will sit in the whole groove (you have to look at it to know what I mean). If you get no cranking, then you need to determine whether the wire coming from your ignition switch/VATS module is actually feeding 12V at the time you turn the key to the start position. How to determine that? Subscribe to Alldata.com and look up the engine wiring diagrams and locate the starting system. You should find the wires coming from the transaxle position switch. Trace the one going ultimately to the VATS system. When you find it, note the color and which wiring harness it is in and the position in the wiring harness and then go out to your car and pull the wiring harness in question apart and hook a voltmeter to ground and to the wire in question on the end of the wiring harness NOT going into your transaxle position switch. Then have someone attempt to crank the car while you look at the voltmeter. Does the signal go to 12V when the car is in the start position? If so, the transaxle position switch or the wiring involved with the switch is faulty. Replace the switch.
I would not bypass the VATS system unless I was certain that that was my problem.
EDIT: the drill bit is 3/32" not 13/32" I believe.
Bassasasin
11-14-2006, 09:16 AM
VATS cuts off the fuel injector pulses..
The engine will turn over and start for about 10 seconds and quit. If the engine is already running and the VATS gets a bad key signal it will continue to allow injector pulses until the key and engine is turned off.
Your symptoms are possibly bad battery cable or ground. AND
You have a vacuum leak.
Antenna motors have been known to drain a battery ... put a light bulb in series with the battery and turn everything off in the car and if the light lights, you have a parasitic drain on your battery. The offending part allows the bulb to light.. You then pull fuses till the light goes out and then check the devices on the fuse circuit.
Just thinking here..
Good Luck
The engine will turn over and start for about 10 seconds and quit. If the engine is already running and the VATS gets a bad key signal it will continue to allow injector pulses until the key and engine is turned off.
Your symptoms are possibly bad battery cable or ground. AND
You have a vacuum leak.
Antenna motors have been known to drain a battery ... put a light bulb in series with the battery and turn everything off in the car and if the light lights, you have a parasitic drain on your battery. The offending part allows the bulb to light.. You then pull fuses till the light goes out and then check the devices on the fuse circuit.
Just thinking here..
Good Luck
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