Used car buying question

I'm in the market to replace my '97 Chevrolet Venture. I want to replace it with a Chevrolet Uplander. Before I do anything I usually do a lot of research and ask questions. This time is no different. I originally was looking at a 2007 in the color that my wife REALLY wants (light amethyst) as it is a new color for next year. After looking all over the place and not finding one by myself, I contacted my local dealer with whom I've done business with in the past. They found one in a nearby town but after talking with them they wouldn't come down on the price to a range I was willing to pay. (They wanted $519/mo. for a 6yr loan and $474/mo. for a 7 yr. loan.) I convinced my wife that we could do better with a used van as all the depreciation has been knocked off the price. Her second choice was a dark red color. I found a 2006 with only 8,647 miles for $17889, a far cry from the $27,500 the new car dealer wanted. My question is this: It has been 8 1/2 years since I've purchased a used vehicle from a dealer. I know the industry has changed a great deal since then. Can I still "haggle" with the dealer on the price of the used van in the same way you can with a new car? I went to edmunds.com and appraised the value of the van I was looking at. Their dealer retail came out to $18,753 slightly more than their asking price. Is there room to try and get a lower price? If so what would be a fair counteroffer? I really like this van and it has just about everything we want in the van. I called the guy and put a small deposit down to "hold" the van so we can look at it late tomorrow or Saturday. I am buying it from one of those used car dealers that have cropped up over the past decade that offer a lot of cars at great prices. I know years ago the supply of used cars wasn't like what it is now, between leases, rentals and executive cars being resold. It's funny when I look back and realize that when I purchased my 1997 Venture back in '98 I paid $19,995 and the van had 16,200 miles on it. This van is 8 years newer, has 8,000 less miles on it and costs over $2000 less.

Hell yeah you can still haggle, that's where half the fun is! Also NEVER go in or call a dealership telling them you want a specific color, they will almost always tell you that "it's a rare color" or "high in demand" and you'll end up getting screwed out of thousands just for the color...it almost happend to my parents.

Go in with an open mind, don't tell them you want to trade in until AFTER you've haggled them down to the price you want, then bring up the idea of trading in your van and haggle them up on the trade in value.

Yeah, I know about the color thing, just try and explain it to my wife:banghead:. Actually I don't think I'll see that many vans in that color as they pretty much seem to be white, silver,and gold. I've noticed a lot of these vans are used as rental or fleet vehicles, hence the limited choice of colors. I've already selected the van we want and the salesperson knows the color and everything else, so I won't get to hide the fact about color anyways. When I checked the appraised value on edmunds.com , the color red was actually a "liability' in determining the value as there was a negative adjustment in the final price because of that. I will use that fact in negotiating if the salesperson brings the color "card" into play. I also don't plan on trading my old van in, I will sell it privately as there are issues with it and that lessens it's value. Besides I also have another '97 I plan to sell with it as a package deal.
What do you think is a fair starting price to open the negotiating process? They want $17889 with the edmunds retail value at $18,753. I was thinking in the ball park of high $16,000's and try to settle for low $17,000's. Is that realistic thinking or should I go higher or lower?
I was going to link to the page but after I spoke to the salesman he removed it because I had placed a deposit on it. I saved a copy of the webpage to my computer, but don't know how to post it here so I copied and pasted the info from it:2006 Chevrolet Uplander LS 4dr Ext Minivan

Miles: 8,647
Fuel Economy (MPG): 18 City / 25 Highway
Stock#: PT21563

Print Window Sticker
Bordeaux Red Metallic with Gray Cloth Bucket Seats

Basic Features - See More Details...

Comfort
Air Conditioning
Rear A/C & Heat
Vanity Mirrors
Convenience
Steering Adjustment: Tilt-adjustable
Drivetrain
Drive Type: FWD
Transmission: 4-Speed Automatic
Type: Gas
Engine
Cylinders: 6
Size: 3.5L
Entertainment
Audio System: AM/FM In-dash Single CD Player With CD MP3 Playback
Rear DVD System: DVD Player
Instrument Panel
Tachometer
Power
Power Door Locks
Power Mirrors
Power Windows
Roof/Glass
Rear Defogger
Rear Wiper
Safety
Antilock Brakes
Brakes: Ventilated Front Disc / Solid Rear Disc
Daytime Running Lights
Passngr Airbag: Occupant Sensing Deactivation
Seats
Seating Capacity: 7
Type: Bucket Front Seats
Folding
Thirdrow Seat Folding: Manual Folding Split-bench

I would start negotiating around $15,500 if it was me then settle somewhere in the middle.