Gtp Questions.
GTPSPEED
10-10-2006, 03:15 PM
ok well i just have a few questions.First thing is the intake for these cars,why does everyone seem to buy one of these expensive ass kits,cuz on my eclipse and on af eclipse talon laser they made fun of people who bought those real pricey intake when a peice of alluminum is a peice of alluminum wheather it says aem or k&n a pipe is a pipe so why on these cars does everyone seem to buy the mad expensive ones i just made my own yesterday like i did my eclipse and it works good,same rush of air noise maybe half a degree hotter cuz i didnt enclose it yet but it doesnt really matter i dont think there would be that much of a difference,ok now on part 2 of my question i saw that the tb screen removal is a pretty debatable thing here,well my eclipse didnt have one and i had no issues so why on this car would it be any different same intake same cone filter???.im just wondering so if anyone has some input here i would love to hear.thanks ~joe
04GTP-WhatLAG?
10-10-2006, 03:20 PM
the throttle body descreen mod is not worth it, you will notice no gains however a barrier of protection you once had is gone, so why do it?
as far as the intake, you NEED a heat shield or you IATs will be F'd up... the reason people buy the expensive kits is: A.) looks B.) the heat shield C.) laziness...
i'd rather spend $175 on a good kit with a PCm tray, heat shield, and precut pieces than have some riced out PVC home Depot Special for $40...
as far as the intake, you NEED a heat shield or you IATs will be F'd up... the reason people buy the expensive kits is: A.) looks B.) the heat shield C.) laziness...
i'd rather spend $175 on a good kit with a PCm tray, heat shield, and precut pieces than have some riced out PVC home Depot Special for $40...
GTPSPEED
10-10-2006, 04:41 PM
well that riced out intake does the same as your expensive one..hmm and i am not quik to beleive that no heat sheid is gonna do my car harm,did with my old car no problems for years,as for the screen i just got done reading on zzp how they did tests and it does increase flow.and if other cars have no problem without screens why would this one,well thanks for your input i will look into it more,as for anyone else please feel free to comment. ~joe here is what i read
CFM using 1 inch of vacuum
(higher numbers indicate more flow)
238 5" of straight 4" PCV
220 26" of straight 4" PVC
183 Above tube with added 90 deg bend
205 9" long 4" inlet dirty K&N filter
227 9" long 4" inlet clean K&N
181 7" long 3.5" inlet clean K&N
168 LS6 MAF with screen in
191 LS6 MAF w/o screen
159 26" PVC, 90 deg bend, LS6 MAF (no screen), 9" K&N
94 Stock GT TB with screen
104 Stock GT TB w/o screen
107 Stock GTP TB with screen
119 Stock GTP TB w/o screen
123 S1 GT HVTB w/o screen
138 S1 GTP HVTB w/o screen
What we learned in our testing was very clear. So much so that dyno testing, in car testing, and track testing was not needed.
We learned that adding a K&N filter to an intake tube will not decrease flow. In fact, at times, flow went up from an open tube (using clean large K&N).
We learned that small filters do not flow very well even if they are clean. A 4" inlet filter seems to be needed for maximizing flow.
We learned that MAF screens slow down air considerably and removing them will provide more air increase than a larger TB will at times. This does not always equal more HP because the MAF can read improperly but does make for interesting possibilities.A ZZP Stage 1 GT TB will outflow a stock GTP TB even though the GTP is 1mm larger in diameter. More airflow with a smaller diameter means drastically increased velocity.
The LS6 MAF outflows the TB by quite a bit in all applications making a good argument for doing a custom setup with the stock MAF removed and an LS6 MAF placed inline. By removing the screen from the LS6 there is potential for more airflow gains but these might be negated by the inaccurate reading of the MAF. The LS6 MAF with screen in outflows the stock MAF setups with screen out. This gives us the potential for full streetability and high flowing performance by using a stock TB (MAF removed) and an LS6 MAF sensor
CFM using 1 inch of vacuum
(higher numbers indicate more flow)
238 5" of straight 4" PCV
220 26" of straight 4" PVC
183 Above tube with added 90 deg bend
205 9" long 4" inlet dirty K&N filter
227 9" long 4" inlet clean K&N
181 7" long 3.5" inlet clean K&N
168 LS6 MAF with screen in
191 LS6 MAF w/o screen
159 26" PVC, 90 deg bend, LS6 MAF (no screen), 9" K&N
94 Stock GT TB with screen
104 Stock GT TB w/o screen
107 Stock GTP TB with screen
119 Stock GTP TB w/o screen
123 S1 GT HVTB w/o screen
138 S1 GTP HVTB w/o screen
What we learned in our testing was very clear. So much so that dyno testing, in car testing, and track testing was not needed.
We learned that adding a K&N filter to an intake tube will not decrease flow. In fact, at times, flow went up from an open tube (using clean large K&N).
We learned that small filters do not flow very well even if they are clean. A 4" inlet filter seems to be needed for maximizing flow.
We learned that MAF screens slow down air considerably and removing them will provide more air increase than a larger TB will at times. This does not always equal more HP because the MAF can read improperly but does make for interesting possibilities.A ZZP Stage 1 GT TB will outflow a stock GTP TB even though the GTP is 1mm larger in diameter. More airflow with a smaller diameter means drastically increased velocity.
The LS6 MAF outflows the TB by quite a bit in all applications making a good argument for doing a custom setup with the stock MAF removed and an LS6 MAF placed inline. By removing the screen from the LS6 there is potential for more airflow gains but these might be negated by the inaccurate reading of the MAF. The LS6 MAF with screen in outflows the stock MAF setups with screen out. This gives us the potential for full streetability and high flowing performance by using a stock TB (MAF removed) and an LS6 MAF sensor
BNaylor
10-10-2006, 04:55 PM
You can run without the TB screen if it does not trigger a SES light related to a MAF sensor error. As much as I like ZZP and buy their parts, the ZZP claims are more propoganda that proven fact so it must be taken with a grain of salt. Half the GT/GTP owners that remove the screen wind up with problems shortly thereafter. The screen helps channel and smooth out the airflow to the MAF. Remember the MAF sensor is located in/on the throttle body on a Gen III GT/GTP whereas on a lot of other make cars the MAF is located way before the throttle body input.
I prefer the CAI/FWI that are made by the name brand companies. I have a Trasher CAI. The purpose of a properly engineered CAI is to allow the engine to get cooler air from outside of the engine compartment and they take advantage of the high pressure area under the driver's side fender and headlamp assembly. When you see GTPs drag racing the driver's side headlamp is removed just to make sure there is max airflow to the input of the CAI.
BTW - The LS6/LS1 MAF mod is easier said then done. The PCM MAF tables have to be modified to work properly and it takes tuning time to get any benefit.
I prefer the CAI/FWI that are made by the name brand companies. I have a Trasher CAI. The purpose of a properly engineered CAI is to allow the engine to get cooler air from outside of the engine compartment and they take advantage of the high pressure area under the driver's side fender and headlamp assembly. When you see GTPs drag racing the driver's side headlamp is removed just to make sure there is max airflow to the input of the CAI.
BTW - The LS6/LS1 MAF mod is easier said then done. The PCM MAF tables have to be modified to work properly and it takes tuning time to get any benefit.
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