Brake Help

Okay guys, I need help. I know this is a 3s forum but I figured brakes are universal so maybe someone here could help with this problem. My buddy's '93 Honda Civic's brakes went out on him. He was entering the freeway and his brakes just lost pressure and he had no way of braking so he ran into those yellow tubs on the side. So question: what can it be? I can't go out there until Saturday so that gives us some time to try and figure out what happened.

1st thought: his brake fluid was empty but he popped it open and it was topped off. However, I think it may still have something to do with the brake cylinder system (not sure if there's a master and a slave for the brake system) seeing that when my clutch slave cylinder went out, the master cylinder was topped off but I still had no pressure. So yeah, maybe the brake cylinder somewhere? Are there more than 1?

2nd thought: I was thinking that maybe one of the brake lines has a hole in it. If so then it would be obvious as there will be fluid around the hub, right?

3-maybe there's just a clog somewhere!?! Afterall, his car's like a '93 or something so it's highly likely, right? So if that's the case then just do a thorough flush on all 4 maybe?

4-brake pads...but I'm thinking that the pads would be squeeking if it was gone and that it would be hard to stop, not lose complete pressure.

5-he said he thinks it's the heat because it was super hot today but I said I don't think so. Not sure if heat could cause a complete lost in pressure...

Well, let me know what you guys think. Again, all that happened was that he lost complete pressure in his brake pedal and could stop.

Thanks a bunch guys....

If his pedal went to the floor, then he sprung a leak somewhere. Probably a rusted line or a blown out wheel cylinder in the rear if he has drums on the back.

You can't just top off brake fluid, it's a closed system, meaning it's never supposed to go down. If it does, then there's a problem. (it will go down a little as the pads wear, but when you replace them and push the caliper piston back its level will go back up) Topping it off does nothing essentially.

Look for brake fluid under the car, and inside the rear brake drums.

yea, definite lack of hydraulic pressure. 4 and 5 are out. even with the pads completely worn to shit there would be a gradual loss, and with the temps that brake pads operate at, the difference between an 80 degree day and a 100 degree day is practically nothing.

Yeah, it definately sounds like he sprung a leak somewhere along the line. As Twizted said, check around for fluid that amy have come out either in the drums or anywhere along the lines.

Okay guys, here's something weird that happened...he has pressure again. No bleeding, no replacing of any hose or parts or anything and the pressure just came back. Any ideas? Should we still take things apart? If so what? I'm about to head over there pretty soon but if you guys have any ideas in advance that would be great. Thanks.

Bad news...we weren't able to take off the stupid rear drum because we can't find the right bolt/screw and I broke off the bolt that the lug nut screws on to because it was stripped somehow. :( Hard to fix? How bad is it for a car to run on 3 instead of 4 lugs???

lug nut bolts, i think, have to be pressed in/out. any shop could do this for a minimal price.

as for the brakes, yes, i would still check the system. there IS a leak somewhere, that's how he lost pressure. the braking system is a SAFETY system...i wouldn't take a chance with it. check all the rubber brake hoses near the wheels for leaks, cracks, and tighten any connections of they are loose.

Check this link (http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=907985)

Well, all we ended up doing was bleeding the system. We took off the wheels and checked the hose, wheel cylinders, and drums but nothing was visibly leaking or cracked. So that was pretty damn annoying. Remember the lug bolt that I broke? Well, luckily there was enough bolt left so we were able to buy a new nut and just used that to hold it in place for the meantime. Thanks for the link Vert.

Aside from that, the bleeding did absolutely no good as far as the feeling of the brake pedal goes. I mean, it stops but I still think there's some type of air getting into the system or the system just has air still because there's still a bit of play before it actually stops. Can the brake system be gravity bled the way the clutch system can? Stealthee?? Because if it could then he could do it by himself again...although it is a bit "scary" since two of the nipples were semi-stripped. Yeah, he's in college and I can't drive out here every weekend so you know...

So yeah, feeling a bit damn depressed seeing that I feel like I caused more harm than good.... :o/

Theres a leak somewhere. It might even be a pinhole sized leak that mists out the brake fluid, but if the pedal goes to the floor and you're losing fluid, theres a leak. The reason it stops now after you tried bleeding it is because you added fluid, it will always stop somewhat if there's fluid in there, but once it leaks out you won't be able to.

^^Well, that's the thing. I found out today that when his brakes went out, he would depress the pedal with no pressure, but the pedal would still come up. It didn't just sit there but came back up. So he said maybe it just wasn't stopping because he was going downhill but that doesn't make sense!?! At any rate, I don't think he's losing any fluid because it was topped off but it still doesn't explain why there wasn't any pressure and then all of a sudden it just came back without us doing anything. As a matter of fact, he said about an hour after the accident, he had pressure again but just didn't want to take the chance of driving it in the freeway so he just had it towed home.

So yeah, today was a freakin' waste in my opinion. Drove all the way out there, broke a freakin' wheel bolt, was running around back and forth looking for parts (luckily we had all our tools), forgot my wallet over there when I came home, and I'm sick!!! I think I f*ckin' have the stomache flu again because I couldn't hold anything down during dinner (if you know what I mean). This sucks balls!!!

But yeah, so what do you guys think? Okay for him to drive it short distances, no driving at all and take it to a mechanic, or it should probably be fine!?!

Thanks for all the help guys.

Um, I think a) look at the link (which you did) but use it, replace that, because at the bare minimum, he is ruining his rotors if he doesn't
b) you have a leak, whether you find it, whether you dont, whether it all works fine, you have either a leak or an air bubble. Either way, that system needs to be fixed and bled. He may be able to drive short distances, he may be able to drive long distances, but the fact of the matter is, you never know when your brakes are gonna fail you. You have a pretty clear indication that they are on that path, there is a leak, whether you choose to find it or ignore it could very well mean the difference between your friend's ride getting him home or ending up in a ditch.

the same thing happened to my sisters taurus and it eventually got pressure back...it was the master cylinder

why didnt he just use the ebrake?

why didnt he just use the ebrake?

if he has a manual, then he could downshift to slow the car, then use the ebrake under 20mph. but i don't know if his car is a MTX or ATX. the ebrake isn't an effective way of braking for normal day to day driving. better to fix the problem. (master cylinder, leak, whateveritmaybe).

I dunno....he downshifted I know that but he didn't think of it I guess. :o|

Vert, you think the rotors will still go bad even if we have a nut on the bolt? Granted that it's not the full length of the bolt but since there was enough thread for the nut to go on will things still be ruined?

If it is enough to hold the lugnut on, AND they are all torqued down equally, then you should be good. I'd just be wary, you know? I mean I havn't seen it so I don't know how much is still there, but if there are only a few threads, going halfway through the nut...I wouldn't consider that safe (longterm). :dunno: