suicide is not a crime.....

so why do the police waste so much time trying to prevent people from doing it?Surely if I choose to end my life,and I am not endangering anybody or damaging property in the process,they have no right to stop me?Can anybody give me a valid reason why I shouldn't be allowed to chuck everything in if that is what Ihave carefully considered to be the best option ?

because there are people out there that will miss you if you were to "go".

i.agree.with.you.taranaki.
its.your.choice.to.make.if.you.want.to.live.or.not .
but.if.someone.was.really.serious,the.police.or.wh atever.could.not.stop.them.

unless.youre.bed.riddin.in.a.hospital.bed.or.somet hing.....
:(

Originally posted by tazdev
because there are people out there that will miss you if you were to "go".

so what?Is a person supposed to live the rest of their lives in misery for the benefit of a few people on the fringes of thjeir existence?whatever happened to the rights of a person to live as they choose?or am I only permitted a slow,expensive,painful and resource consuming death at the bottom of a long string of empty whisky bottles?

And as for the idea that if you really want to,nobody could stop you,I beg to differ.

Some people are in the position in which they themseleves can't commit suicide........ya know? The people paralyzed or have some sort of miscualar stiffness!

Have you heard of Dr. Kavorkian (spelling is way off! Dr. Death here in America???) He was charge and found guilty (forgot the sentence) for suicide assitance!

Here I have it! People that are mobile and can kill themselves think there life is so bad meanwhile there are people who need help but no one will because they are afraid of being charged with murder later or they don't want the person gone!!!

This doesn't mean anything personal to you does it??? I can't say to much since I've tried :(

Euthanasia does not equal suicide. Dr. Kevorkian was "assisting" suicide... but was in essence providing every means possible to aid in killing a person.

Do I think that euthanasia is wrong? Honestly, I've done quite a bit of research, and in some cases I truly think it is more humane to allow a permanently suffering person to die with dignity than it is to stand by the wayside and watch. There is one documented case in which a lady was resucitated upwards of 30 times because letting her go would be considered passive euthanasia. One nurse couldn't take it any longer, and let the alarm go off for "too long" before alerting the people, and she was arrested and charged with some outrageous murder-like sentence.

As for suicide (the original topic) I truly think that there is some way out that has not yet been found. Hell, most of us are unhappy in everyday life, and some of us are FAR more so than others. I know, I have lived it, and cut myself once, and seriously considered suicide as an option atleast twice. Each time I finally came to see a solution through my tears, and I worked to fix what I felt was wrong. Sure, my problems may not be paralysis or anything along those lines, but there is almost always a reason to live.

I can see both sides of the argument. Suicide is so final. What if it turns out that the many problems the person faced could have all been sorted out with help from others?? It’s too late to turn back the clock once you’re gone. :(

Well, if you do die, at least they dress you up real nice!!! :D:D:D

Just tryin to lighten the mood! :)

I got over my problems early before they could really affect me and now that I've moved to start over "again", it still sucks, but I'm closer to family and that's what counts the most! I also have friends spread around the world and even though they aren't here..........

Internet is the best thing since sliced bread!!! :D

Because of the basic unshakeable beleif by authority that because they have something to life for, you do. I hope this isn't anything going on for peepz here. Because it's all about perspective, man. Theres always something to live for - even if it hasn't happened yet. And if you kill yourself - you will never know 'what if'.

I think you’ll find most people have no real desire to die – they just find themselves in situations that they don’t see another solution for. Given time and the proper assistance, almost everyone will be able to work out what’s wrong.

Then again, there are some people who aren’t alright upstairs and those should be stopped since they don’t know any better.

There are a few others that should not only be allowed to take themselves out (murders, rapists and other lowlifes) but also encouraged to do so.

If someone is terminal or to the point of their life where they do not have any responsibilities to their family left and they decide its time to go, let them go. The main thing for these people is that they should wimp out and abandon their wife/husband and children. Those are truly the biggest cowards out there.

if you even consider suicide i don't want to give a shit about you because you're too weak to fight it out like the rest of us miserable bastards who haven't got much hope in life

Things are never so bad that you can't handle it. Terminally Ill is a slightly different case.

anyway heres this

MEMO FROM GOD

To: YOU
Date: TODAY
From: THE BOSS
Subject: YOURSELF
Reference: LIFE

I am God. Today I will be handling all of your problems. Please
remember that I do not need your help.

If life happens to deliver a situation to you that you cannot handle, do not attempt to resolve it. Kindly put it in the SFGTD (something for God to do) box. All situations will be resolved, but in My time, not yours.

Once the matter is placed into the box, do not hold onto it by
worrying about it. Instead, focus on all the wonderful things that are present in your life now.

If you find yourself stuck in traffic; Don't despair. There are people
in this world for whom driving is an unheard of privilege.

Should you have a bad day at work; Think of the man who has been out of work for years.

Should you despair over a relationship gone bad; Think of the person who has never known what it's like to love and be loved in return.

Should you grieve the passing of another weekend; Think of the woman in dire straits, working twelve hours a day, seven days a week to feed her children.

Should your car break down, leaving you miles away from assistance, think of the paraplegic who would love the pportunity to take that walk.

Should you notice a new gray hair in the mirror; Think of the cancer patient in chemo who wishes she had hair to examine.

Should you find yourself at a loss and pondering what is life all
about, asking what is my purpose? Be thankful. There are those who didn't live long enough to get the opportunity.

Should you find yourself the victim of other people's bitterness,
ignorance, smallness or insecurities; Remember, things could be worse. You could be one of them!

When you think you have it bad, their is someone out their that wishes he or she had it as good as you do.

Be nice to everyone, because everybody is wrestling with their own personal "giants".

FORGIVE AND FORGET. A grudge is like a termite in your soul.

Remember life is very short. The next life is very, very, very, very,
very, very, very, very, LONG. Somtimes our "big" problems are actually small ones.

Thanks for that,James..

For those of you who are happy to offer up the argument that suicide is the cowards' way out......have you ever actually tried to kill yourself?I can tell you from personal experience that by the time that you get to the point where you feel that it is the only way out,your mind may well be in a mess, but it is still no easy way out.Fortunately ,it takes a hell of a lot of balls to consciously put yourself in harm's way.If it was quick,painless and easy to kill yourself,there would be far more successful attempts.I wouldn't reccomend anybody attempt to simulate their own suicide,but you can take it from me,that it is the most terrifying feeling on earth,and one that takes a lot of balls to follow through.So please.....don't compound the misery of those who wish to divorce themselves from this planet by spouting sanctimonious claptrap about cowardice.

Sorry, you misunderstand about being cowardly. Its not the act of killing thats being cowardly. Its the fact they dont want to face the challenge that lifes thrown at them. If its someone who has no responsibilies (wife/children) and no friends or someone that cares for them, then I have no problem with them taking a dirt nap.

I figure someone can use the check list below.

Got no family - Check
Got no friends - Check
Dont care about myself - Check
Dont care about others - Check
Life feels misreable - Check
There is and never will be any hope for me - Check

Time to check out (however, I bet 99% of people considering or attempting suicide cannot truely answer yes to even half of those)

I CAN!!! And I actually hung on the side of my roof! Parentsstill don't know but oh well (2 years ago)

What kept me was my religious beliefs and from there I picked up. I still can check half of those, but I care so much for others, I want to help them and make them see what I saw when I tried! What scared me the most was that I thought if you killed yourself, you'd go straight to hell so I stopped, thought, nd turned around. I figure once life is more in my hands, it'll be much better!

And thank Darkness for reposting it on here! :)

Originally posted by taranaki
Thanks for that,James..

For those of you who are happy to offer up the argument that suicide is the cowards' way out......have you ever actually tried to kill yourself?

Never tried but there was a few times where I considered it.

Anybody who has ever read my poetry can say that there is stuff in there about that.

Originally posted by darkness


Never tried but there was a few times where I considered it.
Please don’t consider it again. :)

Originally posted by Spec2 Girl
Please don’t consider it again. :)

Don't worry;) I'm past it. I've gotten into the habit of fighting most of the things that get me that down.

Originally posted by Spec2 Girl
Please don’t consider it again. :)

And this is why we call you........ "The Matron"!

Hey, it's better than........."The Monkey"! :rolleyes:

Glad to hear it Darkness :)

Originally posted by Damien
Hey, it's better than........."The Monkey"! :rolleyes:
Not anymore you don't! :D :D :D :D

and yes, Darkness, that's definitely good to hear. :)

Suicide is definitley not illegal, but it is one of those things you must reconsider should a push come to a shove, remember you will leave behind a grieving family and friends, why give others an uneccasary burdan??? Is it all worth it????

Oh and darkness, good to see you have seen some sense.


As for me, suicide is and always will be out of the question :) :)

Originally posted by Moss1O6GTi
Suicide is definitley not illegal,

Actual untill quite recently in NZ it was, and in most states in the US it is.
The same is true for much of Europe.

However what they going to do? Send you to Jail for being depressed?
Its one of those laws thats very rarely used to send someone to prison, but instead is used as a reason to lock someone in some form of instituition.
This sort of behaviour is still done in NZ, but under a differnt set of rules, and justifications. i.e. committing ppl to prevent them harming them selves (or others).

Hey!! Taranaki and I agree on this one.
Somebody else' sucide is OK with me.

Just dont jump off a building onto my Car! Dont do it in McDonalds, or the Post Office, or your High School or wherever else that you take out a bunch of people with you.

I thought Dr. Kavorkian was doing the right thing. I never thought is was anything beyond assisted suicide. I would never have convicted him.
But can you depend on your inlaws????
What if they put you in that position, and hired Dr Kavorkian???

What he was doing was just too dangerous to be legalized. We couldn't let it get into the wrong hands.

Originally posted by Moppie


Actual untill quite recently in NZ it was, and in most states in the US it is.
The same is true for much of Europe.

However what they going to do? Send you to Jail for being depressed?
Its one of those laws thats very rarely used to send someone to prison, but instead is used as a reason to lock someone in some form of instituition.
This sort of behaviour is still done in NZ, but under a differnt set of rules, and justifications. i.e. committing ppl to prevent them harming them selves (or others).

Suicide is not a crime ,but the way that the suicidal get 'treated' should be..A lot of the people that I came into contact with recently were of the old-school 'lock'em up and keep 'em quiet' mentality,and to serve food that resembles industrial effluent to depressed people should be punishable by law.

Originally posted by Moppie


Actual untill quite recently in NZ it was, and in most states in the US it is.
The same is true for much of Europe.



phhhhbbbbbtttttt

Cop: We saw you walking with your head down, you look depressed
COP 2: You have the right to remain silent


Nope sorry doesn't make any sense :( :( :(

How can suicide be a crime, they need help, but it is in no way a criminal act is what I am getting at :bloated:

Here in America, it's not so much a crime if they see you depressed or something, but if oyu attempt and failed and the police come and get you. They'll send you to a health care facility and see what's wrong with you and all that other stuff.

:buck:buck

I dunno, I'm still thinking that it's kinda cowardly. Sorry. Yeah, I bet it takes a lot of "courage" to cut your wrist. Pain is scary. But, I think someone that feels suicide is an option and decides against that option for a cure to their problems is MUCH stronger the the one that pulls the trigger. As for the argument that there are no painless ways, I beg to differ.... You jump off a 30 story building, it ain't gonna hurt. You stick a shotgun to the roof of your mouth, it ain't gonna hurt. The reason we don't have MORE suicides is because most people tough it out til the reaper comes for them, they don't try and meet the guy half way... I think the trials and tests we go through, be them simple or the heaviest of burdens, are not reasons to try and end your life. If you aren't up to the test, and you need a way out, and the only way you can think of a out is to tie your self to the ceiling with your belt, only shows that you lack creativity in your problem solving skills, and should probably be investing time in to a loved one or a friend for help, rather then your Tommy H. Leather Belt...

The Theme song from some inane Sit-com out of the 80's.

I almost hate to say anymore on this subject. But it's interesting to read all the different perspectives.

One of my workmates wrapped his belt around his neck, with pad's on his neck where his Catorid Arteries run. He passed out in a short time, and time does the rest after he passed out.
When a guy thinks his Suicide out to that point, nobody could have stopped him from completing his mission.

The Detective's said its common in places like the Toumb's in NYC and other Jails. That's why they take all your Belts and shoelaces from you.

The Pathologist said its quite comfortable. You just get sleepier and sleepier with no pain at all. That's not even a Messy way to go out.

Another thing the Pathologist said: The Gunshot downward through the back of the Head (execution style) is the least painfull of all. The victim feels absolutly nothing. All that "Feeling" stuff is destroyed before the Messages can get there.

It's odd to me, that Suicide would be against the law. :rolleyes:

In previous threads about suicide, I've been of the mindset that if an individual so chooses to "check out," so be it. But I've rethought the issue in time, and I realize now that unless you can check off six out of six options on Yogs' checklist (nice work, by the way, Yogs), suicide is extremely selfish.

In most cases, imagine the financial and logistical, not to mention emotional, burdens that would be left in the wake of a suicide for most people (read: productive members of society, which I can confidently say that most members of AF are). And I also believe that even though it does take some nerve to commit to the act of suicide, isn't it much more daunting to "play chicken" with the troubles in life that have driven you to the point of no hope, to ram them like a Mack truck, in spite and deficance, to show that you can defeat that which holds you down? I know that's a very overdramatized description - you get the idea. The point is, human strength and integrity are determined in facing your most difficult challenges, even if they mean years of careful progressive fixing and walking on eggshells, to undo harm that has been caused. And in comparison to that, I agree that suicide is cowardly.

Youthansia is another issue, which from my limited perspective I am a supporter of. From my viewpoint, at my tender age of 25, I think that say in 50 years my health starts to fail, and my body begins to give out, I'm not going to want to wait around for death to slowly claim me, causing a drain on my family. Just get it over with.

Originally posted by YogsVR4
I think you?ll find most people have no real desire to die ? they just find themselves in situations that they don?t see another solution for. Given time and the proper assistance, almost everyone will be able to work out what?s wrong.
Then again, there are some people who aren?t alright upstairs and those should be stopped since they don?t know any better.
.....

I was in a situation a few years ago where I was extremely depressed for no reason at all. I truly did desire to die, as nothing earthly gave me any joy or seemed to serve any purpose. I had no 'insurmountable' problems. I am convinced that my problem was chemical (I was 15, it lasted about 8 months) and even now I'm not entirely sure what got me out. I kind of forced myself to become insane in an entirely different direction, and I believe that was part of the solution. So I am one of the people who "wasn't all right upstairs".

I believe that the reason suicide is illegal, is not so you can be sentenced to jail or whatever for it. I think it's so the law has grounds to protect a person from themselves. Once a person attempts suicide, they don't always want help. But as they have committed a crime, the law is able to forcibly install them in an institution or hospital where they will conceivably be helped. I'm not saying the system is perfect. I personally believe that healing from depression is impossible without the individual's commitment and participation. I don't think that simply throwing someone into a hospital will solve everything, especially if they're in love with their sadness. For a while I didn't want to be anything but depressed, because society sickened me and I wanted nothing more than to be alienated from what I saw as disgusting: everyone else. I thought that depression was positive, as evidence that I was different than the corrupted people around me. Eventually I was absolved of this mindset, but it's a long story and this stuff is hard to talk about.

JD said
" I think that say in 50 years my health starts to fail, and my body begins to give out, I'm not going to want to wait around for death to slowly claim me, causing a drain on my family. Just get it over with."

...and to that I'll confidently say, "Nay nay JD" you just wont ever feel that way. I'm there now, way ahead of you, and I'm having a good time in spite of it all.
Lot's of my High School class are gone now. I'm still here, and I'm staying till they come after me.....

Your statment is probably the best window to understanding why a Suicide over trivial issues is really a cowardly act.
Suicide because of terminal, severly painfull debhilitating physical disabilities is probably the only understandable condition that would justify Suicide.
Almost everything else can be prevented or lived through.
Even then, not very many people take the option. Where there's life there's hope!
I still cant imagine Suicide being against the law though....
By the way JD, what's YOGS' checklist? Where can I see it?

if you wanna kill yourself.. kill yourself..
not my kid , not my problem.. , there is no reason why one should not be allowed to kill themself... if they are unable to kill them selves.. as long as they are sane, and able to convey that they wish to die.. then they should be allowed to have someone give them a pill or something..
i mean come on this is just stupid.. if your on death row and your going to be executed via lethal injection.. it's a law to sterilize the needles they use.. who the hell cares.. it's going to kill them .. lol
i just don't get it..

Originally posted by taranaki
so why do the police waste so much time trying to prevent people from doing it?Surely if I choose to end my life,and I am not endangering anybody or damaging property in the process,they have no right to stop me?Can anybody give me a valid reason why I shouldn't be allowed to chuck everything in if that is what Ihave carefully considered to be the best option ?

Well, chemical depression is a real thing, as I have it, and am taking "anti-depressants" to repair it. I now understand that my brain wasn't working right, whereas before I started taking the drugs, I swore what I was thinking made perfect sense. In this case, someone might take their life when not thinking right. However, you could be proven to be thinking correctly by a team of doctors, if the law allowed the "assistance of death" by other parties. If assistance of death was allowed though, people would kill other people, and say they were just assisting him to commit suicide, and who is going to argue? The dead guy????

In ma view there are four main causes 4 suicide--
1) depressive illness
2) Schizophrenic attitude
3) physical illness which is intolerable
4) poverty, unemployment, frustration, disappointment, dowry problems etc..

Okay, 7 year old thread resurrected. Must be close to the record?