8's rule!!!

i'm sick of people bragging about there tiny little rice burners...

yeah, i know, i dont give a flying **** if they do 14-15 quarters, who cares... if there so quick, why is it drag cars still use v8's??!!??

i remember a time when only milk and orange juice came in two litres...

people who beleive that there's no replacement for dislacment please post here, voice your support for the all mighty 350, 440, 351, 308 and many others i've forgotten to mention...

lol.. those 4 bangers usually need a lot of boost as well to break 14's, so an easy way to handle this issue would be to say..... slap a turbo or two on a new vette and what do you get? a new Z28? a new stang? ... thats right, you get a bad-ass, tire roasting, import bitch-slapping, speed-demon of a car. I rest my case.

youre right, there is no replacement for displacement... in drag racing. but there is more to being truly fast than driving in a straight line. my little 4 banger likes eating the ss camaros and ws6 trans ams on the autocross course. drag cars do still use big motors. but just about every other form of racing uses small ones.

true, never tried autocross before, heard its fun and addictive. I would like to try it sometime but its so damned expensive, at the track I go to anyways. not to mention the price of new tires evey so often.

Originally posted by MadZ
lol.. those 4 bangers usually need a lot of boost as well to break 14's, so an easy way to handle this issue would be to say..... slap a turbo or two on a new vette and what do you get? a new Z28? a new stang? ... thats right, you get a bad-ass, tire roasting, import bitch-slapping, speed-demon of a car. I rest my case.

as far as needing a lot of boost to break 14's, im at high 13's with $600 in parts and no boost. i have a 4 cylinder in the works that should get 12's on less than $1500, including the price of the car itself. there are quite a few 4 cylinders that can run consistant 14's and 13's bone stock and naturally aspirated. small cars dont need to make as much power as big ones to be as fast, its a simple power/weight ratio issue. some of the most interesting street machines to me are little MG's and austin healys and triumphs with LS1's or LS4's or LT1's. little car + big motor = :eek:

you just must have a lot of worthless rice where youre from ;)

actually many cars on the road racing circuits have V8's too,uuummmm.....NASCAR(I don't have a mullet I promise), formula 1(not all 8's, but not four bangers either), indy, actually I can't think of one form of racing that utilizes 4 cyl. cars. but I'm sure you'll enlighten me.

yes, too much rice lol:)

the formula cars use v8, but theyre small, likw 1.5 liter v8s. so the "no replacement for displacement" doesnt really apply, in my opinion anyways.

they have a smaller stroke for higher rpm's allowing them to get the best of both worlds... high rpm's and massive torque.

8's are awesome... get used to it, I6's arent too bad, i'm willing to give nissan/toyota some credits coz they can accept that you need more than 4 cylinders to go fast

as in supra and skylines

Ok, for dragracing, the 8's got it. Now, unless you take it a step higher (read diablo v-12's)

Now if you go the rice route with a Cobra, and gut the motha, then add a sequencial twin turbo, better intake and exaust, well, your going to be screaming 11's or 10's. Easy....

I constantly burn hondas, and acuras (read "powered by honda"). Dusted a 240sx tonight infact. I also wanna take on a Hundi (sp) Tiburon, never gotten to take on an eclipse, I want to though. Their 2002GT, Their 2002GT is a 14 sec car, no boost. Its not a 4 eather. I took on a WRX with an upgraded boost in my trans am, but it was a sad race *my shift cable broke, couldnt leave first*

I do love alot of rice, believe me, alot of those lil guys get me smiling. But thats just what they are, lil brothers and sisters to us muscle heads. Now, granted, in autox they generally will win, but i'm not talking about that. I see far too many civics trying to mob on my 5.0, and I cant help but laugh.

Now if a RX-7 rolls up, or an NSX, a S2000, a 300ZX, Type R (raced one, beat it once, then he beat me, and then cops rolled on him :hehe: ), Supra, or any other hot rice I am forgetitng to mention, then I will take them serously.

Other than that, there is hardly any compition from rice for the 8's

Oh, and for honda boys and gals, the 1.8L is about 100 cubes...Chopers are clowin on ya, and they only got two wheels.

so displacement doesnt matter at all... its all about number of cylinders?

for example which car do u think has more power potential- a 1,000 c.i. 4 cylinder or a 500c.i. v8? the 4 cylinder does of course, its simply bigger! number of cylinders has little to do with it. granted there arent many 1,000 c.i. 4 cylinders out there, but waaay back in the beginning of nascar i think ford ran a thousand-something c.i. 4 banger.

are you aware that there is a 4 cylinder car running 5's in the 1/4 mile. it makes over 3,000 hp. yes its a 4 cylinder. but its a damn BIG 4 cylinder.

ok, ok, that wasnt my point, I didnt get that across very well *I havent slept in roughly 26 hours thanks to work, which I got off from a few hours ago* Displacement has alot to do with it. The 2.2DOHC (it is a 2.2 right?) produces 145hp and 135 torque or something if i'm not mistaken, now, for its size, thats really impressive, but, if you were to max out the ford 4.6, putting DOHC on it, with a good intake etc...well...you have the SVT Cobra spec 4.6 engine.

Displacement: 4.6 liter/280 cid (DOHC 32 valve)
Compression ratio: 8.5:1
Horsepower: 390 hp @ 6000 rpm
Torque: 390 lbs.-ft. @ 3500 rpm

Displacement: 1998cc (DOHC i-VTEC 16 valve )
Compression ratio: 9.8:1
Horsepower: 160 hp @ 6500 rpm
Torque: 132 lbs.-ft. @ 5000 rpm


And ricers say that by adding a turbo, they can easly beat a cobra.....must be one hell of a turbo...and even then, why dosent the cobra just add a high psi supercharger?

my .0002cents (so cut me a break, I cant afford eather of these cars atm, I can just beat the second)

There's one other factor that is important in some cases. I like my strip car to be my daily driver as well. Try getting the 26-30mpg I get from my turbocharged 3L v6 from your V8.

As far as a cobra goes.. I bet I can smoke him on a long race.. he'll run out of gas.. :D

V8's are nice yeah... but I prefer turbo V6's alot more. There's no replacement for displacement, and you REALLY displace a lot of hot air.


Dramier

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
so displacement doesnt matter at all... its all about number of cylinders?

for example which car do u think has more power potential- a 1,000 c.i. 4 cylinder or a 500c.i. v8? the 4 cylinder does of course, its simply bigger! number of cylinders has little to do with it. granted there arent many 1,000 c.i. 4 cylinders out there, but waaay back in the beginning of nascar i think ford ran a thousand-something c.i. 4 banger.

are you aware that there is a 4 cylinder car running 5's in the 1/4 mile. it makes over 3,000 hp. yes its a 4 cylinder. but its a damn BIG 4 cylinder.

Dude im sorry, but you totally contradicted yourself. First you say "its all about the number of cylinders you have", then you say "number of cylinders has little to do with it":confused: :confused:

When someone says their is no replacement for displacement, there talking about cubic inches, not cylinders. Because thats what displacement is ci!

hey! that vette in your sig is the exact same one of a guy who used to post here (dunno if he still does) i think his name was bluevette or something like that... i mean its the same picture.

and when i said "its all about number of cylinders?" i was asking if thats what they were saying. hence the ? at the end. then i went on to argue my point that number of cylinders doesnt really matter, its all about displacement.

woo! after a little research, i have uncovered the original owner of that picture! his name was bluevette74 and here is the picture of his car:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/attachment.php?postid=110128

taken from this thread: http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=11605

and here is the pic of erricer's car:

http://www.flash.net/~kenm/corvette.jpg

something smells fishy here to me... whats the deal man?

Ok..........there's a place for 4-bangers and there's a place for V-8's. Think about it.........a Honda Civic, for example, is an economy car, and most people buy them to pick up their groceries and shit.......don't think "mom" wants a thundering V8 under the hood to go get grocercies and fill it up every time................ok..........now someone buys a Firebird.......they want to go fast.....and want to have a low, thundering sound while doing it......they want everyone to hear their power.....plus they're heavier.....so they get a v-8...............japanese cars..... 4's and 6's, domestics, 6's and 8's..........and 4's in small ass cars.....it's not a difficult concept......

my favorite turbo v6 would have to be the early 90's syclones. (and typhoons for that matter)AWD baby! a few simple mods, and they'll smoke most of anything on this board Theres a few around here running 11's and one in the 10's I believe. Gm should have brought that engine and drivetrain back for all of these "Xtreme" Sonomas you see putting around.

whoa.... lol, I was way off topic refer to page 1 for previous post.:D

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
woo! after a little research, i have uncovered the original owner of that picture! his name was bluevette74 and here is the picture of his car:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/attachment.php?postid=110128

taken from this thread: http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=11605

and here is the pic of erricer's car:

http://www.flash.net/~kenm/corvette.jpg

something smells fishy here to me... whats the deal man?


Ya, whats up with that?

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
woo! after a little research, i have uncovered the original owner of that picture! his name was bluevette74 and here is the picture of his car:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/attachment.php?postid=110128

taken from this thread: http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?threadid=11605

and here is the pic of erricer's car:

http://www.flash.net/~kenm/corvette.jpg

something smells fishy here to me... whats the deal man?
Yeah i was bluevette74, until i wasnt able to log on anymore. I thought i was kicked off until igor sent me an e-maill saying i could log on again, but i tried to and I still couldnt log in so i had to get a different name!

I hope you're not thinking that the vette is not my car, because i can post plenty of pics with me standing next to it. And i have the same pic in the corvetteforums!

And about the cylinders thing, sorry i didnt see the ?. But notice how i wasn't a dick about it!

oh, i guess that explains it, you ARE bluevette74. :p

okay nevermind, carry on!

528 man. that's the god. all bow down to the 528.

Originally posted by Dramier
There's one other factor that is important in some cases. I like my strip car to be my daily driver as well. Try getting the 26-30mpg I get from my turbocharged 3L v6 from your V8.

As far as a cobra goes.. I bet I can smoke him on a long race.. he'll run out of gas.. :D

V8's are nice yeah... but I prefer turbo V6's alot more. There's no replacement for displacement, and you REALLY displace a lot of hot air.


Dramier

I'm getting 26mpg friend :flipa: Used to be 28, but the few mods I've done have leveled it down a lil.

And with the hot air, seems you got pleanty with your turboed mouth, yopur 26 vs my 26...yah...gee...I see a big difference.

Oh, and with my decent milage, I have an LX, which means luxery, yah sure, heavier, but who cares, i'm fast anyway. So now go back and rethink your wanna-be dis.

Originally posted by MadZ
they have a smaller stroke for higher rpm's allowing them to get the best of both worlds... high rpm's and massive torque.


actually the Formula V8s dont make that great torque compared to the HP numbers


Remember Torque gets you moving, but Horsepower pulls you through when the torque curve fades.

Thats why they turn 16,000 RPM

3.5 liter Toyota V8 (turbo) makes approx 700hp at 16000rpm but makes like 400 something in Torque at like 8000RPM

How do i know this? Im close friends with the guy who builds the Formula1 V8s for TRD. They're engine plant is in Costa Mesa, California.


But yes, they're still kewl!

lol - only ricers give gas milage as a reason why 4's are superior to everything

strange off-topic fact: all cars torque and hp curves meet at 5252 rpm. if a car has 200hp at 5252 rpm, it will also have 200 torque at 5252 rpm.

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
strange off-topic fact: all cars torque and hp curves meet at 5252 rpm. if a car has 200hp at 5252 rpm, it will also have 200 torque at 5252 rpm.

i didnt believe you at first so i did some homework, and i guess you're right.. very interesting.


but i still dont believe you. yes i know i said i did, but i still have to be a dick!:D

maybe it's just a hellllllll of a coincidence?:D

--------
Quote: idelaysionl
it will also have 200 torque at 5252 rpm.
--------

200 what?, ft/lbs or newtonmeters?

ft/lbs... heres the reason why

hp = ft/lbs torque / rpm x 5252

so if rpm=5252 then the formula looks like this

hp = ft/lbs torque / 5252 x 5252

and obviously the number for torque divided by 5252 then times 5252 equals the original number. the same as saying: 4 divided by 2 times 2 = 4

which basically makes the formula say:

hp = ft/lbs torque

ouch my mind just blew up
can someone present us with some dyno charts so we can test this formula?

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
ft/lbs... heres the reason why

hp = ft/lbs torque / rpm x 5252

so if rpm=5252 then the formula looks like this

hp = ft/lbs torque / 5252 x 5252

and obviously the number for torque divided by 5252 then times 5252 equals the original number. the same as saying: 4 divided by 2 times 2 = 4

which basically makes the formula say:

hp = ft/lbs torque

AH i think i found a LOOP HOLE!

What about Diesels? They cant rev to 5252rpm.. they red line at 3800rpm! ... or LESS

its like 160hp for 350ft-lbs of Torque... at like 1300rpm

What about the Diesels Mr. Science? :)

lol... you've lost sleep over this haven't you? you've gone mad man!

haha, actually i was reading over the thread and it hit me.

what about the damn diesels? i dont think i've heard of many diesels hitting 5252rpm... and if they did... they didnt appreciate it.


i just wanna see what Mr. Bill Nye the Science guy has to say about that! :D

umm... i think... you would have to red line the hell out of the diesel for it to work

Originally posted by Steel
528 man. that's the god. all bow down to the 528.

Ah, the magic number. I found out that all top fuel drag cars race on 426 Hemis boared out to 500ci. It is hard to decide who to root for anymore.

But arent they alcohol injected

454's forever!

Originally posted by Polygon


Ah, the magic number. I found out that all top fuel drag cars race on 426 Hemis boared out to 500ci. It is hard to decide who to root for anymore.


All? ALL???? Eegad man... thats only the Mopars!

What about the Chevy guys? The FJORD?S

the Chevy's run 454 blocks bored out to about 496ci

Fords i do believe run like... 283s (4.6l) in everything now. haha kidding, i cant recall what they run now. but you get the point!

ahhh, the 4.6 is not a 283, its a 281. It may be small but it is high tech. Im talking about the motor.

Originally posted by 94svt5.0
ahhh, the 4.6 is not a 283, its a 281. It may be small but it is high tech. Im talking about the motor.

yeah i know i goofed.. after i posted that i logged off, and went to read my new Hot Rod mag... and it said its a 280ci i was like DOH! haha oh well.


i never said i was perfect.

its really 280.6ci so if you want to round up its 281. :rolleyes: its still small, but yes its a very Hightech and very Badass engine. I.E. DOHC!

Originally posted by ldelaysionl
so displacement doesnt matter at all... its all about number of cylinders?

for example which car do u think has more power potential- a 1,000 c.i. 4 cylinder or a 500c.i. v8? the 4 cylinder does of course, its simply bigger! number of cylinders has little to do with it. granted there arent many 1,000 c.i. 4 cylinders out there, but waaay back in the beginning of nascar i think ford ran a thousand-something c.i. 4 banger.

are you aware that there is a 4 cylinder car running 5's in the 1/4 mile. it makes over 3,000 hp. yes its a 4 cylinder. but its a damn BIG 4 cylinder.

damn thats a huge I4...

but i will quote myself on a honda/acura board post to add to this topic, this was in reply to people saying displacement doesn't matter nor cyclinders etc so basically same subject:

Originally posted by Bryan8412
sorry. its been said a million times and it's true, there is no replacement for displacement. you can turbo charge, make all your upgrades to a 2.0 I4, but the larger displacement engines can do the exact same thing. I'm not saying one would win either way, the civic won no contesting that, but theres no replacement for displacement. And YES it has been done. In fact ford has done this very thing:

the new mustang is a 4.7 l V8 supercharged, puts about 350 at the wheels tuned down. 5.0 magazine replaced it's air filter with a less restrictive one and gained 25rwhp. It also has DOHC and 4 valves per cylinder

the new GT40 will use a 5.4 l supercharged V8, DOHC, 4 valves per cyc, and puts out 500hp. And heres the kicker: it uses the same block as the lightning and when tuners have swapped the supercharger on the lightning for a quick-spooling turbo, they instantly gained 100hp, but given that the gt40's engine is larger displacement and already putting out more horses, the gains should be awesome.

I am in no way bashing civics, but there is no replacement for displacement it's as simple as that, and now V8s are catching the wave of technology, they've ditched the pushrods and put in DOHC's and quad cyc valves and now they're dipping into forced induction.

and as i mentioned later both those blocks/heads are aluminum.

I'm lazy and didn't read every post, but I thought I'd give ya'll my .02, Ok, so you're stupid if you don't know v8's are better than 4cyl. in hp/torque. But how hard is it to get hp out of a v8? Not hard at all. That's why 4cyl. are so fun. You have to really know your stuff to pull serious HP out of it. Someone tells me their v8 has 450hp, wow, that's pretty cool, but you tell me a 4cyl. has 450hp, and I'll piss my pants because it's almost unheard of. I got respect for v8's (one of my dream cars is still a '69 Pontiac GTO), but for me a 4cyl is more of a challenge to build, and that's why I'd take a 4cyl. over a v8. And for that comment about v8's and motorsports, I'd like to mention WRC because they are mostly 4cyl cars, and WRC is the coolest motorsport ever in my opinion.

Originally posted by Marc-OS
...I'd like to mention WRC because they are mostly 4cyl cars, and WRC is the coolest motorsport ever in my opinion.

thats because A) i think the most displacement you can have is 2.0 L (justifying both the evolution and the wrx's displacement) which would be useless on an V8 and B) Balance and lightweight are key issues in rallying. A straight 4 is much more balanced than a 8 in V formation, which requires balancers etc. And also both of these factors are important when using controlled oversteer, aka drifting, which is common in the dirt. A I4 has internal balance and contributes to the cars overall balance in prevention of rolling etc.