No Air Conditioning

Hello,

Well, just like the title says… I turned on the air conditioning for the first time this season and nothing but hot air!

So, the first thing I did was to come here and do a search about air condition. I found a lot of people who had low pressure and a compressor that circulated on and off quickly…

I checked mine, and the compressor doesn’t seem to turn on at all! I checked both AC modes and defrost (because isn’t the compressor supposed to run in defrost mode too?), and nothing under the hood turned on or off. Does this automatically mean that the compressor is shot and needs to be replaced? Other than the AC Comp fuse, is there anything else that I should check before taking it into a repair shop for some incredibly expensive repair?

And on the topic of cost, if the compressor is bad and needs to be replaced, what would a fair price be for parts and labour?

If it matters, it’s a 1996 Blazer LS 4x4. 183,000 Kms and I’m on Vancouver Island in Canada.

Thanks for the help.


Z

You will need your R134a refrigerant topped up.

The low pressure switch will not turn on the compressor of the pressure is too low.

Make sure they use a sealer and a seal conditioner as well as the r134a when they top up your system.

Dude, I hope you are just a little mechanicaly inclined, becouse that is all it takes to work on this system. You probably do not have a bad pump, that would be the last thing I would check. more than likely your coolant is low.
Now, the reason your coolant is low is becouse you have avery small, and I mean very small leak. you may be able to put one can in it and run it all summer, which is how mine started going. If you feel you can handle it just go down to the parts store and buy an r134 ac kit, get one that has a guage on the hose, it should also come with a can of r134, just follow the instructions. now make sure you dont go over on the pressure becouse if you do you will blow the seals on your pump....but it takes alot to blow them so dont feel scared to do this. just keep an eye on the guage and youll be fine. I guess I could write up a how to on this with pics.....may do that soon....Im going to pull my system apart this summer and fix the leak in mine...that may be a good time to do the writeup.

Dude, I hope you are just a little mechanicaly inclined, becouse that is all it takes to work on this system. You probably do not have a bad pump, that would be the last thing I would check. more than likely your coolant is low.
Now, the reason your coolant is low is becouse you have avery small, and I mean very small leak. you may be able to put one can in it and run it all summer, which is how mine started going. If you feel you can handle it just go down to the parts store and buy an r134 ac kit, get one that has a guage on the hose, it should also come with a can of r134, just follow the instructions. now make sure you dont go over on the pressure becouse if you do you will blow the seals on your pump....but it takes alot to blow them so dont feel scared to do this. just keep an eye on the guage and youll be fine. I guess I could write up a how to on this with pics.....may do that soon....Im going to pull my system apart this summer and fix the leak in mine...that may be a good time to do the writeup.

Sadly, in Canada, we can't use one of those recharge kits nor do they sell them here.

We are only left with going to the shop, bending over, lubing up and biting down on a piece of wood.

I've got a friend that'll re-charge mine, but he still wants $200.00
I don't know how much he'd charge Joe Blow off the street, and I don't want to know.

On the good side the product that he uses is compatable with the old R-12 or whatever came in my vehicles.

I'm 1/2 thinking of getting my own ticket. It would pay for it's self with just my 2 drivers alone. Depending upon the cost of the freon of course.

R-12 is quite expensive, but you can always find a shop that will do it rather "cough" cheaply if they don't have to provide a receipt.

R-134a is actually more affordable seeing it is the common refrigerant used today.

Sadly, in Canada, we can't use one of those recharge kits nor do they sell them here.

We are only left with going to the shop, bending over, lubing up and biting down on a piece of wood.

BlazerLT
The link below would help a DIY on the proper way to do it there self if they are inclined to do so.
But as always the proper equipment and know how is needed.
http://www.autoacforum.com/

The little Wall Mart recharge kits are Death traps.
I would advise against anyone using one.
A person should never attempt to recharge an air condition system without a recharge manifold with a high and low side gauge.
If something goes wrong. Pressure in an air cond system can reach 500 lbs or more.
Newer air condition systems also need an exact set charge.
Too much or too little will lead to system problems.
Also if it is leaking off very bad the leak needs to be fixed before recharging.
Not that people on this site do not know there stuff on air condition systems.
Here is a link to a air condition site that do them all of the time and have very good info on them.
Most info is already there or you can ask if you do not see what you need.
Good Luck
http://www.autoacforum.com/

MT

ahh, the new r134 is relativly safe, and there is no way the r134 could ever reach 500lb. the seals in the compressor will go way befor that...I know, I blew mine out at 75lbs. and the r134 guages in the kits Im talking about, only go to 100lbs.
you dont need all those guages to just add coolant to your r134 system.
Those guages are used if you are vacuating the system.
and the kit I got is from oriely auto parts.

ahh, the new r134 is relativly safe, and there is no way the r134 could ever reach 500lb. the seals in the compressor will go way befor that...I know, I blew mine out at 75lbs. and the r134 guages in the kits Im talking about, only go to 100lbs.
you dont need all those guages to just add coolant to your r134 system.
Those guages are used if you are vacuating the system.
and the kit I got is from oriely auto parts.

The kits are dangerous both to the person installing with them and to the system.
That is why they are refered to as death kits.
R-134 is more dangerous than R-12 as far as pressure goes and does build more pressure when compressed or overfilled.
If you get to much in it or if there is a problem with your system it can reach 500lb or more under pressure and heat.
All the more reason to have a high side gauge and watch the high pressure side.
MT

We can't DIY in Canada MT-2500.

We don't have access to the kits or the equipment, you have to be licensed.

We can't DIY in Canada MT-2500.

We don't have access to the kits or the equipment, you have to be licensed.

10-4 BlazerLT
I see says the blind man.
That does create a problem.
But not being able to get one of the Wal Mart recharge death kits may be good. :grinyes: :lol:
In the USA only R-12 is under the license law.
Which amounts to a big joke.
Years ago when I got mine the test and lisense only amounted to having the 20$ Us.
The answers on pass the test was gauranteed to pass.
Just hand them the 20 and they would mail it to you.
How hard is it to get a license in Canada?
MT

Quite an ordeal really, only mechanics are allowed with previous training.

We are left with going to a shop only, sucks, I know I could do the recharge myself.

Hey,

Thanks for the help...

So, being in Canada, it looks like I have no other choice but to take to a shop.

So with that in mind, what should I be looking to pay for the most common air conditioning services (recharge/check for leaks/seal any leaks/etc)?

Any ball park figures would sure help as start phoning around to see where I should take it to get fixed.

Thanks again.


Z

Hey,

Thanks for the help...

So, being in Canada, it looks like I have no other choice but to take to a shop.

So with that in mind, what should I be looking to pay for the most common air conditioning services (recharge/check for leaks/seal any leaks/etc)?

Any ball park figures would sure help as start phoning around to see where I should take it to get fixed.

Thanks again.


Z

I would phone several shops. At least 10-15 for a good price range for your area.

Pricing vary for the area.

Can you e-bay the parts for the recharge? Allot of people are selling those R-134a shot cans and adapters. Maybe even have somebody state side hook you up. You probably only need a few ounces as your entire system is a total of 20 oz.
By the way for any intrested parties, when charging a system with 134a, you have to maintain the fan running and RPM's at 1300-1500 to have a true charge. Little info that the book won't tell you is that is the optimal running speed for charging and checking a system also has a fan running at the car to simulate real world conditions.
Also, there are more than 4 differant R-12 replacements. One I have used is called "hot shot" and is compatable to add to R-12 running vehicles. Don't let DuPont know I told you, they still make money from R-12. Liquid gold.

I don't think the boder will allow it.

Can you e-bay the parts for the recharge? Allot of people are selling those R-134a shot cans and adapters. Maybe even have somebody state side hook you up. You probably only need a few ounces as your entire system is a total of 20 oz.
By the way for any intrested parties, when charging a system with 134a, you have to maintain the fan running and RPM's at 1300-1500 to have a true charge. Little info that the book won't tell you is that is the optimal running speed for charging and checking a system also has a fan running at the car to simulate real world conditions.
Also, there are more than 4 differant R-12 replacements. One I have used is called "hot shot" and is compatable to add to R-12 running vehicles. Don't let DuPont know I told you, they still make money from R-12. Liquid gold.

Good grief them Wal Mart R-134 death trap recharge kits are bad enough.
But are you aware that the R-12 blend crap contains butane/propane mixers.
Enough exposive in a can to blow the top and sides and windows out.
Do some research on that crap.
It is not safe to even think about using it. :grinyes: :rofl: :lol:
MT

Yeah all refrigerant are inherantly dangerous. Besides frostbite from exposure to the liquid, Phosgene gas will kill you before you know it (when an ignition source hit refrigerant). It does take a bit of knowldge to work with but some people with the right direction can handle it.

Yeah all refrigerant are inherantly dangerous. Besides frostbite from exposure to the liquid, Phosgene gas will kill you before you know it (when an ignition source hit refrigerant). It does take a bit of knowldge to work with but some people with the right direction can handle it.

10-4 ON THE ALL DANGEROUS.
The R-12 blends with the propane /butane mixers at the top of the list.
Then the wal mart recharge death kits with only a low side gauge.
A air cond system can not be safely or proper recharged with out a low and high side. If something is bad on system or if overcharged I have saw 500 lbs or more of pressure in a system.
And that was a good idea on the fan in front of the rad when recharging.
That sure helps keep that high side pressure down.
On the R-12 blends that are dangerous to use because of the butane mixer.
I see no reason why a person would even want to use them now with the R-134 A reto fit kits as cheap as they are.
Why not be safe and just change the old systems over?
MT

I am a refrigeration mechanic by trade and I am sometimes hesitant in using the stuff. 134a runs off higher pressures so sometimes (say a 80 camero) if you change over to 134a instead of juicing the 12 blend you could rupture. Plus some garages like to take people to the cleaners because they say words like "E.P.A" and "reclaim" and throw the $25,000 scare tactic for blowing off to the atmosphere. If I had to pay for it by a garage, I wouldn't do it. In South Carolina I used the 60/4/60 technique. 60cfm by 4 windows rolled down at 60 mph kept me cool.

In South Carolina I used the 60/4/60 technique. 60cfm by 4 windows rolled down at 60 mph kept me cool.
haha thats what i have to do. i got a pretty refrigerant leak under my pass side dash. i recharged it twice and it was gone within 4 days. don't know what's busted. i got access to 2 big tanks of r12 and r134 so recharges have never costed me a thing.

Hey,

I have been getting some pretty high estimates just to even look at the air conditioning system...

So, I am just trying to think of everything before I take this thing into a shop and have them overcharge me for something I could have done myself! With that in mind I ask (again) if this could be an electrical problem? What if it has nothing to do with the refrigerant at all? Remember, I said that right now my compressor NEVER turns on – not even in defrost mode.

As I mentioned in the original post, I checked and even swapped the AC Comp fuse – nothing changed… Could it be a relay? Isn’t there a group of three relays up by the firewall that have something to do with the air conditioning? Could one of these have gone bad since last summer? Is there anyway to check that these relays are working properly?

I just want to be sure that I have done everything I can to find this problem before breaking down and spending a load of money at a repair shop.

Thanks again for the help.


Z

Again, if the refrigerant is low, the compressor will not turn on.

Anything is possible, but there's a 99.99999999999% chance that it's the freon level.

The only other thing that you can do is get a shop manual and double check each and every wire on the system

It's really going to be hard to troubleshoot without access to a set of gauges. You can eliminate the possibility of most of the system being bad pretty quickly though. There is a pressure switch on the side of the accumulator. This is the switch that prevents the compressor from coming on when the pressure is low. Start your engine and turn the a/c on max. Remove the plug from the accumulator's pressure switch, jump the two wires. If the compressor kicks on, it means that you're low on refridgerant or the pressure switch is bad. At that point the most likely problem would be low refridgerant.

Keep in mind that the compressor gets it's lube from the oil circulating in the
refridgerant. Operating one with no refriderant can damage it, so if the compressor kicks on, disconnect the jumper immediately.

I am a refrigeration mechanic by trade and I am sometimes hesitant in using the stuff. 134a runs off higher pressures so sometimes (say a 80 camero) if you change over to 134a instead of juicing the 12 blend you could rupture. Plus some garages like to take people to the cleaners because they say words like "E.P.A" and "reclaim" and throw the $25,000 scare tactic for blowing off to the atmosphere. If I had to pay for it by a garage, I wouldn't do it. In South Carolina I used the 60/4/60 technique. 60cfm by 4 windows rolled down at 60 mph kept me cool.

I would rather have a rupture than a blow up. :grinyes: :lol: :rofl:
And some are outlawed by EPA. And EPA says reclaim R-12
Not that all blends may have propane/butane mixer.
But a lot do. So be carefull out there.
And yes R-134 will build more pressure and some light built systems are a little hard to change over.
I have reto fited many systems with no problems.
A few need the cycling switches and pressure switches change for the R-134.
Here is a air cond forum link with a lot of good info on it.
http://www.autoacforum.com/
The main thing or rule of the thumb is on a change over is to cut your set charge by 10-15% and make sure the condenser has good air flow or cooling.
MT