Infiniti dealers not happy about Nissan-badged GTR

By KATHY JACKSON | AUTOMOTIVE NEWS

4/17/2006

NEW YORK -- Infiniti dealers were incensed last week by Nissan Motor Co.'s decision to sell the high-performance GT-R sports car under the Nissan brand.

Infiniti lacks a sports car, and dealers desperately wanted the GT-R as a halo for the brand. It goes on sale in the United States in spring 2008.

Carlos Ghosn, CEO of Nissan Motor, said this week at the New York auto show that every country except the United States wanted the redesigned model to be a Nissan. The U.S. unit could not prove that branding the car an Infiniti would generate more sales or profits, he said.

"I was very neutral" about the matter, Ghosn said.

The decision bothers dealer Ed Lennon, chairman of Infiniti's National Dealer Advisory Board. Lennon, owner of Circle Infiniti in West Long Branch, N.J., says the company never promised the vehicle to Infiniti. But he says the U.S. executive team favored the vehicle's becoming an Infiniti in this country.

"We thought that Ghosn would abide by the regional needs, but that didn't happen," Lennon says. "Now they need to tell us where we're going. We're very disappointed. We truly counted on that vehicle to be a halo for us."

Infiniti sells four car and two SUV models in this country. Sales are down this year on every model except the M sedan. For the first three months of this year, overall sales were down 9.0 percent to 29,187 units.

In November, Infiniti dealers are expected to get a redesigned G35 sedan, the marque's sales leader. The FX crossover was freshened earlier this year, but dealers say the company is mum on any other future products.

"We're limited; we're not a complete Tier 1 brand," Lennon says.

Jack Collins, chief product planner for Nissan North America Inc., acknowledges that the Infiniti lineup is narrow.

"There is more room for us in the luxury crossover segment," he says. "We have no convertible for the G35. That is another obvious opportunity. Our biggest constraint is manpower. We have the capital but not the manpower" to develop new products quickly.

Ghosn says Infiniti has more product now than it ever has, adding, "We will be giving them more product in the future."

The GT-R concept was shown at the Tokyo Motor Show in October. The production model will be shown in Tokyo in 2007.

The GT-R is expected to sell for an estimated $65,000, with targeted sales of about 1,500 in this country. Sources say it could make more than 400 hp.

How does Infiniti lack a sport car, isn't the G-35 coupe one?

Damn @ $65,000. I hope that goes down.

Oh wah... Infiniti dealers can get over it. It would be a travesty and a mockery of the GT-R nameplate to slap an Infiniti badge on it, it is traditionally and will always be a Nissan. As for the price, it won't go down, I assure you... I know we're not quite used to this in the states, but the GT-R is not a car for every teenager to own... it's a supercar, and has always been one of the most expensive cars produced by Nissan! It's never been a cheap car, I would think that was understood when the fact is... to buy a converted USED GT-R from MotoREX in the states, it's only about 10,000-15,000 less than the new GT-R's price point!

well, which sounds better...Nissan GTR or Infiniti GTR? will they even have the SKYLINE badge on the next GTR? I like Infiniti Skyline GTR M-Spec NUR..if there is ever one

well, which sounds better...Nissan GTR or Infiniti GTR? will they even have the SKYLINE badge on the next GTR? I like Infiniti Skyline GTR M-Spec NUR..if there is ever one

Nope, no Skyline badge, the new GTR isn't Skyline based. First one ever to not be.

yea who cares about infiniti. I mean it should rightfully be a nissan. And badges??? its always better to de-badge the ride lol. I dont see why america has all these stupid off brands of the same brand anyway. So dumb.

yea who cares about infiniti. I mean it should rightfully be a nissan. And badges??? its always better to de-badge the ride lol. I dont see why america has all these stupid off brands of the same brand anyway. So dumb.


I care about infiniti, and nissan. I drive an Infiniti. My point is, the GTR has always had the Nissan badge and they would be doing a disservice in the way of brand recognition to slap the Infiniti halo on it, despite it's price tag. Most Infiniti drivers don't even tend to realize their car is a Nissan... same as many Lexus drivers... the point of Badge engineering was to give Acuras, Infinitis, and Lexuses a chance against domestic and German Lux. lines like BMW, MerzBenz, Caddy, and Lincoln... granted, they don't need the extra badge these days, but when they started up... no one was going to take a Luxury car from Honda, Nissan, or Toyota seriously, that is why the brands were made. Another good example of Badge engineering (although in opposite... a BIG mistake for GM) which car would you rather buy, A Toyota Sprinter or a Geo Prizm... Yeah... I'd rather have the Sprinter, but guess what? They're actually the same car.

oh yea i get your point and new that. My mom has a infiniti g35. I didnt mean to make it sound like infiniti sucks lol. Because they are nissan. I grew up in a nissan family and respect them greatly. I just think its so dumb that all that had to happen. Like i bought a scion xb for a daily, 4-door, fuel efficient, cheap driver. People are like who makes it? I say, "scion, which is made by toyota" everytime. Then there like oh ok ok. So it should run for quite some time.

oh yea i get your point and new that. My mom has a infiniti g35. I didnt mean to make it sound like infiniti sucks lol.

I didn't figure you were, I just wanted to point out why badge engineering happened. My car is one product of Badge Engineering, the Infiniti I30, known in Japan as the Nissan Cefiro, basically a high-luxury version of the Nissan Maxima, another Cefiro based vehicle.

My point is, the GTR has always had the Nissan badge and they would be doing a disservice in the way of brand recognition to slap the Infiniti halo on it, despite it's price tag.
Well actually, The GTR has always been a skyline, which has not always been a Nissan as the G35 is a skyline. This is splitting hairs, I know, as the GTR version of the Skyline has never been in Inifinit form, but isn't that what the point is? It wouldn't be that out of character, especially considering they are dropping the "Skyline."

I understand the rest of the world's opinion and I respect that Nissan must consider the cost of rebadging the car differently in the States, but I here are two good reasons as to why it should be an Inifinit (albeit the decision is already made).

Having worked in both mainstream dealerships and upscale dealerships, like Ford/Lincoln, Honda/Acura, Nissan/Inifniti, and Toyota/Lexus, there is a major difference in how the customer is treated. It begins with purchase, but the REALLY heavy hitting difference is in post sales service. The two are not comparable. And if I were to drop $65k for a GTR (which I might) I could give two craps by what tradition they named it by, but I care a whole hell of a lot about what kind of service I get after the sale, and I'd expect the kind one would get at an Inifinit dealer and NOT at the Nissan. I should know as I have owned a 300zx for years, and I get the same blah blah service there as the sentra people do. it is the same deal with my Harley edition F150 at the Ford dealer. Meanwhile, an employee of mine who has an stripped Infiniti G20 has received primo service for her $12k car since the day she bought it new. So I’ve paid nearly quadruple for my cars and yet because of branding have missed the service probably owed to the money spent. I swear this hurts the Corvette too more than GM admits to.

The second reason is the opportunity cost of not boosting Infiniti's sales. Even if they wouldn’t sell any more or less GTRs as an Infiniti vs a Nissan, Nissan sales are kicking. The cool trucks, suv’s, and 350z marques are driving those sales and I don’t believe they need the GTR. Infiniti sales are diving, and they desperately need the GTR to revitalize interest in that brand.

Nissan/Inifinit is my favorite brand, and Skyline is my favorite car. I am working as hard as I can to import 40 of them right now, so I have an interest beyond idle fascination, but there is a lot more to the branding of a car than what people are used to calling it, and to brand the Skyline as a Nissan because people outside of our region are used to the idea is a bad executive decision imho.

I think you've hit the nail on the head, peachsb.

I've owned two Nissans and an Infinity J30, and there is a big difference between the service quality of the Nissan and Infinity franchises that I've visited. In fact, I'm so much happier with the local Infinity service that, when I have to have dealer work performed on my Z, I take it to the Infinity store and they either cross part numbers or get the parts from their brother Nissan dealer. Why? The Infinity dealer is quick to do things that Nissan doesn't- like supply a loaner car, get your car in the bay ASAP, or at the very least, follow up and make sure that you were completely satisfied with the service and overall experience. At the Nissan dealer it seems like everything is a royal pain in the rear, and the general attitude often seems to be that they are doing you a favor by even looking at your car.

At first I wasn't sure if my experience was the result of my relationship with the service manager, or simply the way that my local dealership worked- but it seems like most of the people I talk to have had similarly positive experiences with Infinity service as well.

I'm not saying that Nissan service departments are incompetent, but I do think that Infinity dealers will be better suited to supplying the kind of post sale service that buyers of 70 thousand dollar cars expect.

Good points Peachsb.

I have never bought a Nissan or Infiniti from the dealership so I don't know of these experiances first hand. But for me it only seems logical that the GTR be sold under the Infiniti name. Most Americans can justify buying a $70k C6 Z06 simply because it's an American car and it has a legacy here, but I can't see the average American paying over $60k for a Japanese sports car they know nothing about (out side of the cult following). The hype over the Skyline is shared only by a small portion of the automotive population. Hell, even the AF GT-R is almost unknown to the announcers of the SCCA World Challenge on Speed. Playing devil's-advocate I guess the WRX was pretty unknown and now it's huge in the US market.

The GT-R will be a first class vehicle and deserves the service of one.

my 2 cents.

Hmmm... $70,000 nissan?

Not what I would like to see. As a rule of thumb you want to buy the cheapest car from an expensive brand, not the most expensive model from a volume brand. Nothing like paying $70 large to wait in line behind all the 15 year old p.o.s. cars waiting to be serviced.

Who knows Nissan may find a way to tailor their dealerships and service depts to meet the need. In Japan they have Nissan "Red Stage" shops that are set up specifically to deal with their line of sports cars. My GTR always got work done at the "Red Stage" and they did good work with good service. But I still think Toyota (Lexus) had better service in Japan.

-AL

Oh wah... Infiniti dealers can get over it. It would be a travesty and a mockery of the GT-R nameplate to slap an Infiniti badge on it, it is traditionally and will always be a Nissan. As for the price, it won't go down, I assure you... I know we're not quite used to this in the states, but the GT-R is not a car for every teenager to own... it's a supercar, and has always been one of the most expensive cars produced by Nissan! It's never been a cheap car, I would think that was understood when the fact is... to buy a converted USED GT-R from MotoREX in the states, it's only about 10,000-15,000 less than the new GT-R's price point!

Yap..i agreed with paultyler_82. The GT-R should be badged under a Nissan because this brand name which was bought/brought the skyline name from Prince in 1950's. The Infiniti GT-R:nono: ...well I feel it didn't suit at all..in fact the GT-R always synonym with nissan since the GT-R was born in Nissan/Datsun Stable in 1970's. If the Infiniti so desperate to have a GT-R on board in it's line model for Coupe segment...i suggest asked the :grinyes: NISMO house to tuned up the G35 and Turbo Charge it with the existing V35 engine and call it the G35 GT-T or GTS-T for 2007 model....got it and sell it for USD40Grand..and people that can't afford to buy GT-R will buy this car as long it has a presence of GT-R...well..what do you think:naughty: ?

i feel that infiniti should get that type of car, the price at least, i wouldn't go into a nissan dealer and go look at a sticker price and see 70g, but i know the legacy of the car, therefor seeing it in nissan badging would make it feel better, i think magazines should hype the car, do covers and articles about the older r series gtr's, so americans that will buy the new gtr, will know what the originals were like. i also think that lexus infiniti and acura should be done away with, tho acura is now going international, i think people in this country relize that those companies don't exist outside of america, i sorta have owned foriegn cars, a porsche 924, good car, and i still have it, it's for sale, it doesn't run, it was hit in the fender by an ambulance, also i have a neon i drive it now, it sux ass. the pride and joy i own is a stealth tt, sorta american yet still japanesse. but right, i think the nissan gtr is better, as long as they don't put the gtr badge in the middle of the trunk i'll be fine, i'll go on ebay and buy a skyline badge and put it on myself