1995 lumina sedan - rack and pinion remove

I have a 1995 lumina sedan in pretty good shape. it was a gift from a family friend. it has one of the bushings missing - that are on the bolts that mount the rack and pinion to the motor. they are in the middle of the car left to right between the two front wheels.

two mechanics confirmed the one of two was missing. this car was involved in an auto accident hitting a deer a few years ago and while they fixed it all up, body, pain and so forth, maybe they did not put in the other bushing. the mechanic says it is a little round hard rubber piece with a metal center that fits on the bolt that goes up into the engine.

if you know about this car you know that there is a big amount of car metal covering this rack and pinion from the bottom of the car - and that needs to come off to get to the rack and pinion itself and then to the bushing.

i can get the parts - 2 bushings in a package for $20.

but how do my mechanically inclined (and auto saavy and experienced) friend and i remove the other parts and then the r and p - and put on the bushing

first, does the bushing need to be pressed on? or does it just slide over the bolt as a spacer. second, is there a manual or instructions and where - to tell how to remove the parts and then put them back on. even an honest mechanic wants $300. if we can do it for even four to seven or eight hours time it is very much much better for me.

i have ramps and jackstands and we have a lot of tools like heavy duty socket set and some big plyers and some vice grips etc - anything else we need?

and - is putting it back on harder than taking all that stuff off? any tips? i was told it is straightforward but is time consuming. one auto parts store person who says he has done it before estimated only 1-1/2 to 2 hours time to do it. even paying him - better than the regular mechanic.

lLou

Autozone.com/repairinfo has the procedure, but you will not have to remove the entire rack to do this, check it out.

thanks - i went to the site and found the rack and pinion info on removing and reinstalling it - but one thing I really want to know is how do we take off all that chassis bracketing underneath the rack and pinion in order to get to it?

Lou

thanks - i went to the site and found the rack and pinion info on removing and reinstalling it - but one thing I really want to know is how do we take off all that chassis bracketing underneath the rack and pinion in order to get to it?

Lou
Is a 95 still same as 91 body wise?
If so, its easy to replace or get too if you loosen the front 2 frame to body bolts a little, have car on ramps, put a jack under rear of frame behind engine oil pan, loosen and remove the 2 rear frame to body bolts, and slowly drop rear of frame a few inches watching nothing above binds or stretches.

If it were at all possibe to replace a missing bushing without disconnecting anything more than the bushing in question, i would surely try that first, as dropping the frame requires you to disconnect first the steering couple at the firewall, (part that attaches to steering coloum) tho disconnecting that isnt all that hard, its a pain in the rear to see, work space is limited, and usually a fight to get the thing back together as you raise the frame back up.(shaft only goes together ONE way)
A question, if missing bushing is one piece pressed in, with steel pipe inside it, what about cutting rubber in half in middle of bushing, pushing half thru with pipe in it, and pushing other half of rubber into the other side? Would sure beat dropping a whole rack..I mean in reality, this isnt a real critical, stressed out bushing.

Thanks, John. I will look under my 1995 and see if I can locate the bolts you mention. I am not sure though which bolts you re referring to - we saw three bolts on either side and two bolts at the rear. Two of the bolts - on the sides - the rear ones - are through a round piece. The ones forward just seem to bolt thru the frame. Are these what you are pointing out? But it does make sense from what we saw already. that the rear of the frame would lower while the front of the frame seems to be part of more frame into the front part of the car. Is this correct, what I am seeing is what you are directing me to?

AND - I am so glad someone more experienced than I has the same idea I had, about trying to get the bushing around the bolt.

HOW do I then glue? the two parts of the rubber together? Epoxy? What would you suggest?

As I said above I did find a man who works at the local AutoZone who said he has replaced a number of these bushings on different cars. He said it takes 1-1/2 to 2 hours. And he said that the gasket just slides onto the bolt and does not have to be pressed on. I'll ask him on Monday if he has experience with this particular car model.

This time frame he said is considerably less than the mechanic who quoted me in the high $200 range. But then, that mechanic quoted me $90 to change the transmission fluid and pan gasket, when a nearby Transmission shop would do it for $50.

That mechanic has been good to me for small items before - I just have to pick and choose whom I see, and let them know I am knowledgeable already. Getting info from folks here is very helpful.

I'll let you know what happens with what I can do. Thanks again to both of you.

Lou

[QUOTE=louisryoshin]Thanks, John. I will look under my 1995 and see if I can locate the bolts you mention.
The bolts i mentioned are the main frame bolts, they are on each side of the car frame, front and rear, they hold the whole shebang to the car body, frame,engine, tranny, all are bolted to this frame. The frame looks sorta like a letter "H"? at each end is a bolt that goes up thru a BIG donut bushing into the car body.


HOW do I then glue? the two parts of the rubber together? Epoxy? What would you suggest?

I cant see where if that bushing wont slide thru without cutting it in half, it would need glued at all. when both halves are on the little metal pipe, and tightened up, it being new, should compress the two haves together enough to be tight. If not, you can always grind a tad off the pipe end so the bolt will tighen against the rubber a little more, i mean really, as long as its tight, it isnt the critical.

I put a new rack in mine but didnt notice as everything was already in the rack.

Thanks a lot for the description, john, i'll look at it with my mechanic friend. we did see those donut like pieces that the bolts go thru, to the rear of the rack but not the ones up front of it.

Lou

[QUOTE=louisryoshin]Thanks a lot for the description, john, i'll look at it with my mechanic friend. we did see those donut like pieces that the bolts go thru, to the rear of the rack but not the ones up front of it.


If i remember right... Isnt the front bushings on top the frame, and "inside" a hole in the frame on the front?, and you go up thru the hole to loosen the bolt?

Thanks for the tip - I don't know as when the two of us looked in there we did not know to look for what you are saying so we will take a look for that.

I went to the guy at the autozone store and he tried to show me in the Haynes book they have something that it looks llike but it had no photos.

Let me ask you if this is right - I was under what seems to be a false impression that the bushings were little things that surrounded small bolts and the bolts were vertical up into the engine - but he was saying they are big wide rubber things that come split already and they get a clamp that surrounds them to hold them togethe and it is just rubber. And they go around the tie rods on the left and right ends of the rack and they go around the rod that goes left and right to the wheels - and not up and down as I was imagining.

Any ideas or info?

Thanks - Lou

Let me ask you if this is right - I was under what seems to be a false impression that the bushings were little things that surrounded small bolts and the bolts were vertical up into the engine - but he was saying they are big wide rubber things that come split already and they get a clamp that surrounds them to hold them togethe and it is just rubber. And they go around the tie rods on the left and right ends of the rack and they go around the rod that goes left and right to the wheels - and not up and down as I was imagining.

I am not sure what bushings you are talking about first, sounds like he is describing the inner tie rod boots, and not bushings.
If we are still talking about frame to body BUSHINGS, they have nothing to do with the rack, they are large, about 4 inch diameter, 1 inch thick rubber bushings that sit between the cars frame and the cars body, and have a bolt verticaly up thru their center hole with (dont remember exactly) something like a 9/16 - 5/8 - 11/16 Hex head on the bolt. They do not go "into the engine" at all either. They thread into the cars body.
Tell you what, if you cant get it, email me at user21954@verizon.net
And i will snap some pics of those parts on my car, and we can figure out where you are.

Hi

Pictures would help I think - you are very supportive to do this, thanks - here is somemore explanation of my clarity now from last nite getting more info.

The problem is that there is a rattle under the car when I go for instance across a dirt road or grassy area or sometomes hit a bump. The mechanic who put it up on a lift sai that one of two bolts that bolt the rack of the rack and pinion - is missing its spacer rubber grommet and the metal washers that go with that rubber grommet. That bolt is in there just as the bolt on the other side of the rack is in there but the one on the other side has the rubber grommet and the washers.

The fellow who looked under tha car with me who would help me fix it ourselve confirmed thismissing rubber piece and the washers are indeed not there and the ones on the other side are there and that both bolts are there screwed in.

The mechanic who put it on the lift and looked at it said the rack is bouncing and that makes the noise.

The fellow who looked under the car with me - who looked at the rack part (I did not crawl that far under.) said the other one looks somewhat worn.

He also saw that he tie rod end on the side where the rubber grommet and the washers is missing, that tie rod boot is gone and the tie rod end may need replacing.

The fellow who looked right at the bushings said - yes it is bolting to the frame of the car not to the engine as someone else said. The suto parts store guy said there are big rubber things that are split in half and go around the tie rod and there is a clamp around each one to hold the rubber on - on either end left and right of the rack. They have a clamp around each one left and right sides. He says they are both on there.

What is missing he said are - where two bolts bolt the rack to the frame of the car (the car body) - and one has the bolt and it also has washers and a rubber piece that goes around the bolt. One set of washers and the rubber piece with the washers - for one of the bolts - is missing.

This part blots the rack to the car body-frame. He said we would have to drop the fram that's of the car body lower to the ground - the part of the car on the bottomof the car in the front of the car - drop it lower by removing some bolts -

and then remove one of the big round rubber things over the tie rods, with its clamp - remove one of those to get to be able to unscrew the bolt that connects the rack to the car frame-body - in order to be able to unscrew the bolt so that we can put washers and the littler rubber grommet (or is it calles a little bushing) onto the bolt and then screw the bolt back into the frame and rack and then put all the big rubber bushing with its clamop and then the car frame piece we lowered - put them back where we loosened them from.

Where do we get the washers and rubber grommet for that bolt and what size is it? Do I go to the dealer? How does one undo the clamp around the big rubber piece?

Does that rubber piece with washers get pressed onto the bolt or does it just slide on?

How hard is it to unscrew and recrew the bolt?

HOW DOES ONE drop the frame to get to the rack and is it hard to do that and to put it back onto its bolt. And do we have to drop four or we see six bolts - three on each side left and right of this frame piece and then two at its rear on the rear side of the frame piece - and we only see so far that the rear side bolts (not the rear bolts) - the two of the three on each side - have the bolt going through a donut shaped round piece - the other bolts seem to go right onto metal frame.

Where do I get the rubber grommet and washers - dealer?
The big grommets are from auto parts store for $19.95 for the pair. But they are still on the car.

Is it hard to undo that clamp from the big rubber grommets?

The mechanic who put it on a lift weeks ago said the rubber and washers were missing and that they rarely go out so it is not easy to access them in the way the car is put together - whereas the big rubber things with clamps on them are easier to get at.

The fellow who looked under the car at the rack part said the bolts for that I have to replace one of the rubbers and the washers - goes into the rack from the sides left and right - through the frame and that is why we have to remove one of those big rubber things and a clamp. I had imagined they were vertical up and down but he explained otherwise to me last nite.

Are we missing anything that we need to do?

How long should it take a regular mechanic on a lift to do the rubber and washer replacement?

Are these big bolts going into threaded holes or do we have to look out for loose nuts?

Thanks Lou
321-726-9083 I can phone you back right away.
EST in Central east coast Florida. Has up to 3 min msgs as well.
Call anytime.
Also 24/7 voicemail with up to 3 min msgs 888-299-5973

You might want to try something first before replacing the rack,pour in Lucas and it works,seals up leaks too.Get the one for power steering and is sold at most auto parts stores.If replacing the rack,Lock the steering first and you do not want to ruin the clockspring(about $100.00 part from dealer only)

Oh, thanks for this. I doubt if I have to change or remove the rack - at least I hope not - I went to the parts store and saw an illustration - and I spoke with the fellow who looked at it - and it all agreed with what the mechanic had said - there are two bolts that hold the rack to the frame and they are supposed to have a rubber grommet or bushing that has a little piece of metal tubing thru it and some washers - and one side is missing the bushing and washers. The time consuming part is to undo the metal fram underneath it. The store has the pair of bolts and washers-grommetts for $10 for both sides they said.

I'll go to the dealer's parts dept tomorrow. and ask to see the illustration of all the area. And ask the service guys what to do.

Apparently - I think what happened - is that the college student grandson of the man who gave me the car had hit a dear in Georgia and his mother had the car repaired - and probably I am guessing that when they put it back together they did not have the washers and grommet and they just did it with the bolt. The mechanic who first looked at it said these things rarely ever go so that's why it is a lot of taking things off to get to the inexpensive part.

I will let you folks know - thank you all for the guidance - I was a VW campler van guy - 1977 and 1978 since the early 1990's and before that a 1977 toyota sedan and a 1973 VW station wagon - so all this new 1995 stuff is a learning process.

Lou


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