AWD, but not VR-4?

I read through the FAQ and hunted around, but with something that I couldnt specify enough, even the search defeated me. ~_^

I could swear that I came across a model of the 3kgt that was not a vr-4, but still AWD. Am I just crazy, and me brain is making up things for me, or is it real? If so what year/model is it?

The only thing in the VR-4 that really attracts me over SL or base is obviously the Twin Turbos and the AWD, not so much the extra 78-98hp. But the insurance is so much higher on the VR-4 I doubt if I can maintain it. But I really want the AWD. Help me out please.

all the euro/jdm spec cars are awd. The models are the sr,tt,mr check the FAQ.

then i am more confused. I thought those models were the Stealth models. And the Stealths are horendous in my opinion.

then i am more confused. I thought those models were the Stealth models. And the Stealths are horendous in my opinion.
What makes them "horendous"? arent they exactly the same as a 3000gt?

^on the inside, but they had different styling on the outside. All the JDM 3kgt models were AWD, and stealths only existed here in North American *I don't if there are any in Canada, or Mexico, but it is a possibility, and that's why I said North America, instead of just the US*

They are in Canada. 3000gts werent originally sold in Canada at all, only Stealths.

^ gotcha, nice work stealthee :p

JDM has GTOs,

SR - AWD non-turbo
TT - AWD TT
MR - AWD TT (no AWS)

USDM has 3000GTs and Stealths

Stealth base FWD non-turbo
Stealth R/T FWD non-turbo
Stealth R/T TT AWD twinturbo

3000GT Base FWD non-turbo
3000GT SL FWD non-turbo
3000GT VR-4 AWD TT

the only cars that are in europe were imported privately or by dealers, no 3000s, GTOs, or stealths were built specifically for europe. THANKS TALSKINYGUY!

the only cars that are in europe were imported privately or by dealers, no 3000s, GTOs, or stealths were built specifically for europe.

That is incorrect. There are Euro spec 3000gt's. The Euro spec 3000's were the ones to have the optional 13g's. The GTO was only made for teh Japanese market though.

by talskinyguy: The 13G's were a "dealer option" only offered in the UK. Basicly a UK importer would install 13G's if the customer paid for them plus the install.

ok i got ya, so the 3000gts were sent to euro dealers, but the bigger turbos were put on by licensed dealers in the UK, sort of like Yenkos? (mitsu knew they were replacing the turbos and approved it, but they were not "factory options")

Did the bigger turbo's come with other upgrades as well? Or was it just the turbo's?

good question. wouldnt they need different injectors and other supporting mods to run higher boost?

i beleive you can run the same boost (12psi) with the 13's

THe UK GTO's that has 13g's had no other modifications. (remember 1st gen 9psi stock)

I ran my 13's at 12.5 psi for over a year with no fuel modifications.

O.o I would have thought that you'd need to upgrade fuel stuff. I guess that's why I don't have a VR4 yet:rolleyes:

^ well I mean, he's not really boosting past stock levls *well I mean he's .5 past, but you get the picture*... if he were at 14.5 PSI, now that'd be something.

^ well I mean, he's not really boosting past stock levls *well I mean he's .5 past, but you get the picture*... if he were at 14.5 PSI, now that'd be something.
Most guys will do 14.5 psi on stock fuel. When you start pushing past that is when you need to upgrade.

^ well I meant, if he was boosting at 14.5 PSI on 13b's w/o upgrading fuel, IDK how he'd be pulling it off...

^ well I meant, if he was boosting at 14.5 PSI on 13b's w/o upgrading fuel, IDK how he'd be pulling it off...
14.5 psi is 14.5 psi ;)

hmmm gotcha, I just thought that since they were bigger turbos, they'd flow more air at 14.5 PSI, but now that I'm thinking about it, you're right... 14.5 PSI, is just 14.5 PSI

hmmm gotcha, I just thought that since they were bigger turbos, they'd flow more air at 14.5 PSI, but now that I'm thinking about it, you're right... 14.5 PSI, is just 14.5 PSI
Yup. There have been some great discussions about boost on 3si. Basically from what I can remember the larger turbos are just more effecient at higher boost levels. Where the 9b's are able to hit 15psi peak they are not as effecient as a 13g at 15psi.

thusmeaning the 13g could hold the peak boost longer???

Or reach peak boost faster?

13g's peak boost is higher than the 9b's. My one friend has 13g's and has his boost set to 17psi if I remember right. Although I cant answer what their peak boost is or what they can hold to redline.

"Let's compare the stock TD04-09B turbo to the popular TD04-15G at 15 psi boost. The maximum effective volume flow table above indicates that the stock turbo should be running out of air somewhere near 5000 RPM. After this point, boost values will decrease, as the stock turbo cannot supply the required airflow. On the other hand, the 15G should be able to hold 15 psi boost clear to 7000 RPM. If we increase boost to 20 psi (with all the proper precautions such as an increased-capacity fuel system, forged pistons, and gauges) the stock turbo falls short by 4000 RPM but the 15G should be good to about 6000 RPM or so. For higher boost levels, turbos larger than the 15G may be the best choice, such as the GT368SX hybrid, the TD05-16G adaptations, and the IHI RHF55.

This bears repeating one more time. Just because a turbo is rated at 650 CFM @ 15 psi (for example) does not mean that the turbo flows that amount of air in our 3L V6 engine at 15 psi plenum pressure. The engine mass airflow is determined by the displacement, the RPM, the volumetric efficiency, and the air density (or plenum air pressure and temperature). At a given RPM and at the same plenum air pressure and temperature, the same amount of airflows regardless of which turbo is used. "



Taken from stealth316.com turbo upgrade guide. Good info in there.

owww.....my head......uugh.....

"Let's compare the stock TD04-09B turbo to the popular TD04-15G at 15 psi boost. The maximum effective volume flow table above indicates that the stock turbo should be running out of air somewhere near 5000 RPM. After this point, boost values will decrease, as the stock turbo cannot supply the required airflow. On the other hand, the 15G should be able to hold 15 psi boost clear to 7000 RPM. If we increase boost to 20 psi (with all the proper precautions such as an increased-capacity fuel system, forged pistons, and gauges) the stock turbo falls short by 4000 RPM but the 15G should be good to about 6000 RPM or so. For higher boost levels, turbos larger than the 15G may be the best choice, such as the GT368SX hybrid, the TD05-16G adaptations, and the IHI RHF55.

This bears repeating one more time. Just because a turbo is rated at 650 CFM @ 15 psi (for example) does not mean that the turbo flows that amount of air in our 3L V6 engine at 15 psi plenum pressure. The engine mass airflow is determined by the displacement, the RPM, the volumetric efficiency, and the air density (or plenum air pressure and temperature). At a given RPM and at the same plenum air pressure and temperature, the same amount of airflows regardless of which turbo is used. "

Taken from stealth316.com turbo upgrade guide. Good info in there.

So another words the bigger turbo will hold boost longer then the stock turbine but as for the amount of airflow it depends on the engines specfics correct. If not will beat my head against desk till i understand.

Pretty much correct. Each turbo, depending on size, will be able to work efficiently at higher psi's. A stock 9b can work efficiently (hold boost to redline) only up to about 10psi. Anything higher, say 12 or 15psi (given same conditions: air temp, altitude, engine displacement etc) the 9b wont be able to continually flow that much air at higher rpms. Larger turbos might not spool as quickly, but both their peak and hold will be higher.
That is why you will always hear people refering to how much psi turbo upgrades can hold to redline. However, after 14.5psi or so, the turbo will either be pushing too much hot air (if out of it's efficiency range) or boosting too much and flowing too much air for the fuel system to keep up. Therefore the need for upgrades to constantly keep knock under control.

so which injectors would you suggest for the modder that want to prep his fuel b4 his turbos 700s for big boost looking at 500awhp to the wheels?

It really depends. There was a great write up on injector sizing on 3si, I think by Trevor, awhile back. I would think you may only need 680s, possibly even 550ccs, but it really depends on which set up you go with. Also don't put in new injectors before the new turbos. If you buy them seperately, hold on and install them together.

fuel pump and rail need to upgraded as well i presume? or is this just my old camaro days showing again lol i'll check through 3si is it really worth paying for??

fuel pump and rail need to upgraded as well i presume? or is this just my old camaro days showing again lol i'll check through 3si is it really worth paying for??
You dont have to pay to sign up on 3si. You just have to pay to get access to the members area.

You don't have to pay, as said above. You only need an email that they will accept. THey don't allow free web-based emails like hotmail or yahoo. So you either have to use the email your isp provided you, like msn, aol, etc. or contact an admin like alanrttt and he can help you.

I think it's worth it, the vast amounts of info over there are great, and being able to use the search feature is key.

As far as the fuel pump and rail. The pump will definantly need to be upgraded, and hotwiring it isn't a bad idea either. As far as I know, you can keep the stock fuel rails, but it isn't a bad idea to upgrade. You may however need to upgrade your fuel pressure regulator.

Stock fuel rails flow tons.

15psi is 15psi is 15psi. But depending on the turbo there are a lot of other variables that effect power. While you can run your stock turbos at about 15psi and get close to 300AWHP with the right mods, if you put on some large TD05 turbos 15psi would put you around 400awhp and there is no way your 360cc injectors would keep up.

- AWD, but not VR-4? ya u can have that if your car was turbo an u forsa blow ur motor - an cant afford a tt replacement - u just thro in the 222 an its a awd N/A