Junk Engines

If your a new to the art of busted nuckles and chrome and cold floors, and greese that never seems to come out of your nails, and you are looking for a engine to build, I have collected a list of engines not to build. Tho some of you have gotten some of these engines to run well, the engines I have listed are not really good for building.

If anybody would like to add an engine to the list write it here, or if you think one should be removed let me know why.

http://www.geocities.com/ramairgto72/TIPS/JUNK.html

I have to disagree with three engines: The 403 Olds, the Caddy exclusion, and the "all 307" engines.

You probably listed the 403 because of its windowed main webs. They aren't as weak as you think, and that monster bore and short stroke make one heck of an engine.

Just because 307s were all wimpy from the factory doesn't mean they can't perform. They are not as hindered by the small bores like the 305. They have enough extra room that it at least unshrouds the valves enough to get decent breathing. Not optimal, but the potential is there.

For that same reason, why didn't you put the 305 on that page? Terrible bore/stroke ratio, poor rod/stroke ratio, and tiny bores that shroud valves.

And why not a 472 Caddy? Almost as much displacement as a 500 and they only differ by stroke. Rock solid blocks, high nickel casting, excellent aftermarket support, and a very bulletproof engine.

Although I agree with the 350 diesel junk, they make killer starting points for a big bore gas engine. They have incredibly thick cylinder walls, thicker decks, more meat in the main webs, and just like their gas cousins switched to roller cams in later years. Not to mention they can be bought for a song if not free.

No offense, but it seems like you're basing your opinions of these engines based on their factory ratings. All of them have potential, even the 350 diesel. I've seen one in an S10 getting 14 psi from a turbo turning 13s all day and getting 30 mpg.

Take a look at their potentials and I think you'll see a whole different animal.

I wrote the engine list as a "guide" most 300 and slight above are not going to make gobs of HP unless you you want to dump a ton of money into the engine, and this makes no sense in the real world of HI-PO engines, if you want to run some sort of stock bracket, or road race, sure they will work.

The only engine that does not fit this would be the 305 chevy and ford 5.0, as thats Fords Chevy 350 and it's a good engine.

Sure you can get a lawn mower to run on NOS but how long is it going to last how much is the cost and how many runs are you going to get out of it, that was the "spirt" of the list.

I did forget the 472 Caddy, it is worth doing.

The 403 , is "crap" I am talking about the weak block, it's a sad fact that these engines made their way into T/As and Firebirds. The time you put the $$ into a 403 to run with a Pontiac 400 you should stop at every lawn to find a four leaf clover because your dealing engine death with each TDC turn.

I have not taken the time to read up on all the pros and problems with useing the Chevy 350 diesel so I did'nt add it, I don't know of anybody that has done one, I have allways heard that they make great engines but it's allways been a handed down as a comment that sounded like a question, know what i'm talking about?

If I can get some info on the good and bad I will write about it.
The 350 Diesel I was talking about was an Olds, not a chevy.

the 305 was not listed as a crap engine because of the 350 brother that fits just about everything on it, as well it's a strong bottom end, just as much as the 350, and like the ford 302 it has the ability to be just as nasty as a 302 ford, as much as the 5.0 has bolt on parts, the 305 is just as good.

I tryed to be even about it, like I said the spirt of the list was to keep people who "don't know better" not to put money into a block that would cost alot to build, parts, and such.

If you had a 1979 T/A with a 403 olds and you wanted to run with the big boys, would you yank the 403 for a 400 PMD engine? Or would you put 2 times the cost into the 403 and allways be looking in your rear view for those nice polished parts all over the road?

Olds 403 engines are like 301 pontiacs, trying to save weight and not made for race.

It was 2004? in the HOT ROD fastest road car drag race, a guy had a 475 Caddy with factory crank and forged pistons running NOS fogger in a 90's mustang, he was running 9's! Good Night thats crazy, it's nuts and I love it!

Know of any other engines that should go on the "don't build list"?

The 5.7 Diesel from GM is the Olds. I know of no "Chevy" version. As stated above, the block is a beast. So is the crank (high qiulaity forging). If the piston pins weren't so large, the rods would be good as well.

The 403 does have weaker mains than the earlier versions of the 350. The later 350s also have the "windowed" mains (have one here in the shop right now!). However, with good preparation and some special attention to the block, and keeping revs under 7,000, they seem to live well. We HAVE seen them break the crank at the snout, due to block flex once 700-plus HP and 7,000 RPM are achieved.
There are a few 403s in SS. There are a BUNCH in Stock. They're factored "favorably", so they're gaining in popularity. We are doing a "Stock Class" 403 for a '77 T/A right now. His best buddy has a L/SA '77 Formula with a 400P in it. The Olds isn't as quick, but it lives!

The 307 Chevy DOES have some redeeming qualities, especially when compared to 305. The 307 Olds is a dud, period.
I knew a man many years ago in Tucson, that had an '80 Firebird Esprit, full interior and all steel, went 10.80s all day with a 283! Yup, it's true. The little beast would launch around 8,000 and pull well past 10K. The car apparently was original with 305 CHV, so he decided to prove the point, and prove it, HE DID!

Chester Houghtaling, of Ashland, Virginia, builds a C/E small block at 290 CID, The thing makes over 800 HP on gasoline, no adders. He says, if it leaves undeer 9,000, shut it down, it will NOT recover...
Just for some food for thought over "little" engines than CAN!

Jim

Nope no such Chevy 350 Diesel is, or has been.

I went and did some reading and even tho the Factory did dab into it, they never made a production Chevy Diesel 350, I know of 2 people who have chevys that have the olds diesel, tho now I know they are Olds they payed them as Chevys, the one guy is an ass and the other shows up at car shows and never opens his hood.

Lies, Lies , Lies, good night, are Cevy guys so wound up they have to lie about whats under their hood.

Anyhow I still back up it being a crap block, even more now since I have read about the 21:1 compression with only 4 bolts on each jug. I guess that it's not a good idea to use them at all because even after it's life as a Diesel to gas the Block was known to be cracked and twisted (broken crank snounts).

Stay away from the olds Diesel or gas.

Nope no such Chevy 350 Diesel is, or has been.

I went and did some reading and even tho the Factory did dab into it, they never made a production Chevy Diesel 350, I know of 2 people who have chevys that have the olds diesel, tho now I know they are Olds they payed them as Chevys, the one guy is an ass and the other shows up at car shows and never opens his hood.

Lies, Lies , Lies, good night, are Chevy guys so dorked up they have to lie about whats under their hood.

Anyhow I still back up it being a crap block, even more now since I have read about the 21:1 compression with only 4 bolts on each jug. I guess that it's not a good idea to use them at all because even after it's life as a Diesel to gas the Block was known to be cracked and twisted (broken crank snounts).

Stay away from the olds Diesel or gas.

http://members.tripod.com/~A350Diesel/index-17.html

Mr. P don't know if you read it not, but i answed your Pvt mail, but replyed to your shop email.
me

Yup, got it!

Thanks,

Jim