Car won't turn over sometimes

I have a 2K GT, and I have a problem with my car not starting which seems to have started happening as the weather got cold. From time to time when I turn my key my car doesn't turn over or anything at all. Same thing when I use my remote start. If I sit and turn the key over and over, eventually it will start every time, but sometimes it takes upwards of 100 turns before it starts to crank. I have no idea as to what could be causing this, so any help would be great!!

How old is the battery? You should consider getting it tested because cold weather affects it. When you get it to turnover how does it sound, is it sluggish when cranking? Also how are the instrument panel lights when in run and then start. Is the security light on? If the battery checks out then in a worst case scenario you could have a bad ignition switch.

Also check and make sure battery positive and negative cables are clean and tight.

Battery is original, but has been tested by dealer during recent service, and was said to be fine. I thought that the battery might be a weak link, but they said it was alright. Once it starts to turn over it sounds alright. I've noticed that it was taking longer to start than it did when I first bought my car. Instrument panel stays normal (same whether starting or not when trying to crank), and the security light does not come on. Would be ignition switch affect my remote start? With the PK3 bypass doesn't it go straight to the PCM anyways? I will clean/tighten my battery terminals/posts and see if it helps.

Might also have a problem with the starter/solenoid.

~Larry~

Battery is original, but has been tested by dealer during recent service, and was said to be fine. I thought that the battery might be a weak link, but they said it was alright. Once it starts to turn over it sounds alright. I've noticed that it was taking longer to start than it did when I first bought my car. Instrument panel stays normal (same whether starting or not when trying to crank), and the security light does not come on. Would be ignition switch affect my remote start? With the PK3 bypass doesn't it go straight to the PCM anyways? I will clean/tighten my battery terminals/posts and see if it helps.

To the best of my knowledge a remote starter bypasses PK3 providing that it is installed correctly and no doubt it bypasses the ignition switch.

To be safe you might consider getting the battery tested someplace like Autozone. It's free. I never trust a GM dealer. If it was working before the cold weather set in then the battery is still a possibility until ruled out.

Also check to make sure all ground wires at the engine/tranny grounding stud are tight and all cables at the starter solenoid.

The only other thing I can think of is some sort of parasitic drain/draw on the battery caused by some other electrical component or even the remote starter itself due to malfunction.

Well, by cold weather, I mean around October at which point the temps were getting around 0 celcius here. The guy @ my dealer said something about having done a parasitic drain test I think, and that there was SOMETHING drawing on the battery a little bit (5mV maybe? I don't remember exactly), but he wasn't sure what exactly. Said it could have been the alarm/starter, my stereo, or something else. I'd much rather not have to pull EVERYTHING aftermarket out of my car to find out what it was though, so that didn't really help my cause a whole lot. I've been wondering if it could be the starter/solenoid going, could that be the cause possibly? My gf just had hers replaced and it was doing the same sort of thing, except hers only took a few tries to start on a couple of occasions, and then totally crapped out and didn't work at all anymore.

Well, by cold weather, I mean around October at which point the temps were getting around 0 celcius here. The guy @ my dealer said something about having done a parasitic drain test I think, and that there was SOMETHING drawing on the battery a little bit (5mV maybe? I don't remember exactly), but he wasn't sure what exactly. Said it could have been the alarm/starter, my stereo, or something else. I'd much rather not have to pull EVERYTHING aftermarket out of my car to find out what it was though, so that didn't really help my cause a whole lot. I've been wondering if it could be the starter/solenoid going, could that be the cause possibly? My gf just had hers replaced and it was doing the same sort of thing, except hers only took a few tries to start on a couple of occasions, and then totally crapped out and didn't work at all anymore.

So far the general concensus is it could be the starter/solenoid. If you have a digital multimeter available and know how to use it, it is an easy circuit to troubleshoot DIY. Might rule out some of the guess work.

On parasitic drain/draw, there will always be some. It is measured in current - milliamps. The reserve capacity of a typical Grand Prix battery is around 120. Divide by 4 = 30mA. Therefore, parasitic drain should not exceed this amount of current.

The Grand Prix has battery run down protection via retained accessory power (RAP). After 10 minutes all accessories to include lighting will shut off. The only component really active after this is the body control module (BCM) due to theft deterrent, etc. but it draws way below 30mA.

If the dealer only got 5mA that appears to be normal. Good luck!

I have a DMM, so is it possible for someone to maybe explain how to check that myself? The starter/solenoid that is.

I have a DMM, so is it possible for someone to maybe explain how to check that myself? The starter/solenoid that is.

Good man. I have a lot of respect for people that will at least try DIY.

Start with the battery. With DMM in autoranging dc volts position check voltage across positive and negative terminals with ignition off. I normally get around 12.4 volts. Then try it with ignition to start with ignition key or remote starter and see what it reads. It should drop a few volts but hold steady until engine starts or attempting to start.

On the starter & solenoid are two wires of concern. A purple and black or red. The red or black should have a constant 12v at all times regardless if ignition is turned on. It comes directly from the battery positive. The purple wire is the starter solenoid 12v enable. 12v will be present with ignition in start or remote starter enabled. The 12v for the starter solenoid enable comes from the crank relay located in the engine compartment fuse box. If 12v is present at both of these points based on above conditions then it will be a bad starter/solenoid. If not present then you'll have to back track towards the crank relay in the fuse box and then check to see if the crank relay is energizing. The low (ground)commands to energize crank relay comes from the PCM module and transmission range switch. Hi (12v) from the ignition switch via fuses.

Note: The starter and solenoid is located on the bottom driver's side of engine, radiator side where the tranny hooks up to the engine. You'll need to jack up the driver's side for clearance and to get to it. It is recommended to remove the plastic splash shield below the radiator to make it easier to get to the wires at the starter. Also I would recommend using alligator clips or similar test prods to hook up to ground and the hot wires during troubleshooting and engine starting. Excercise caution because a car starter system has a lot of amperage/current.

I'm at work and wrote this up off the top of my head so it may be subject to some minor errors.

If you have any other questions feel free to ask. Someone should be able to help you. Good luck!

Should I be checking all of these things when my car is in one of its "I don't want to start right now" moods? Or any time?

Should I be checking all of these things when my car is in one of its "I don't want to start right now" moods? Or any time?

Best time to troubleshoot is when it's acting up and the problem is noticeably there. But the choice is yours. Good luck!

upon reading this thread, I too have a similar problem w/ my '94. I have dealt with this situation for a little over a year. I have gone through five starters. Usually no problems at first, then the starter will click, sometimes once or twice sometimes forever, and now with this new starter ( three weeks old ) the only click is the relay. Frustrating as h@#$. Somewhere I read that these vehicles came with bad ignition switches. Now doing virtualy all maintenance on my vehicles myself, my only question about changing this ign switch is the original key has that so called chip for the theft detterent, do I change it out with one from the dealer?

upon reading this thread, I too have a similar problem w/ my '94. I have dealt with this situation for a little over a year. I have gone through five starters. Usually no problems at first, then the starter will click, sometimes once or twice sometimes forever, and now with this new starter ( three weeks old ) the only click is the relay. Frustrating as h@#$. Somewhere I read that these vehicles came with bad ignition switches. Now doing virtualy all maintenance on my vehicles myself, my only question about changing this ign switch is the original key has that so called chip for the theft detterent, do I change it out with one from the dealer?

Iginiton switch assembly is always a possibility.

I am not sure about pre 1997 GPs but when an ignition switch and harness assembly is changed out it does not affect the Passkey theft deterrent system. The key tumbler/barrel is actually a separate part. The ignition switch has a module that interfaces with the tumbler. The module is the part that has the electrical contacts, cams and springs.

Hope the info helps.

Here is a pic of your ignition switch assembly:

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y186/lizzywiz/ignold.jpg

The solution maybe, I used to own a 1991 Pontiac GP it would not start either it would click and click and fianlly it would start or not. I spoke with a mechanic about this problem and believe it or not he said hit the starter with a hammer, he said that GM was famous for that. Corrosion builds up inside the starter and will not make a good contact so hitting it with a hammer nocks the corrosion loose so you can make contact. I thought it was funny when he said that, I was willing to try anything so I did it. IT STARTED! EVERY TIME! Note: I did not have to hit it on every start but when the situation arose I carried a 2 X 2 and a hammer in the trunk and used it when needed. I hope this may be good information for somebody.

my 94 gp does that too i get a click or too then nothing like a bad spot on the solinoid it did it in the summer so cold weather is not a issue butr when io toasted my voltage distributor in my alternatior when i installed my system would this have a part in it or ius it something different

You'll need a 12v test light when the starter is acting up to troubleshoot correctly. If you have power at the solenoid "s" terminal when the key is turned to start, you can eliminate the ignition switch and neutral safety switch as possible culprits. That puts the culprit as either a bad starter/solenoid, or bad battery/battery cable/bad starter. IF you "bump" the starter a few times with the key and it ends up starting, you have a bad spot on the starter armature, and a rebuild or starter replacement is the cure. Smacking the starter with a hammer as suggested above is only a good suggestion on older direct drive starters (it moves the armature off the flat spot causing the short allowing the starter to turn over.). Doing so on a newer style PMGR (Permanent Magnet Gear Reduction) starter will crack the ceramic magnets and ruin your starter. If you have no voltage at the "s" terminal of the starter when key is in start position, you have a bad ignition switch or neutral safety switch.