help - Luxury w/ preformance for under $30,000

Hey, my last car got stolen so I'm now in the market for another car.
Cant spend over 30,000
I want preformance, speed & suspension.
needs to be nice or luxury.

I just had a lexus sc400, so anything better than that basically ;)

cars I've been thinkin of so far
Infinity g35
Cadillac CTS
Lexus IS300
the new GTO

not sure what to think of past those, not a fan of Mercedes.
dont really want anything FWD
any suggestions or opinions are appreciated.
thanks.

99 m3 convertible!!!

cars I've been thinkin of so far
Infinity g35
Cadillac CTS
Lexus IS300
the new GTO


Yea an E36 M3 would be my guess w/low miles so you can have that happy balance of performance and luxury.

The new GTO I wouldnt really call a luxury car...but it sure has the grunt.

If you want a newer BMW...you could always try to get a slightly used 330ci or 330i.

Another car I would consider would be an A4 Quattro either 1.8T or 3.0 V6.

Personally I think the CTS is ugly so maybe you could consider the Charger or 300C.

I'd get a certified used BMW 330i/Ci w/ either the Sport or Performance package.

The interior build quality of the 3-series is much better then that of Cadillac, Infiniti, or Pontiac... and I personally like it more then the IS300, but that is arguable. BMW basically built its reputation on building a blend of luxury and performance in their cars and I would argue that they still do it better then anyone else out there. As I always say, the BMW 3-series is the best all around vehicle out there for less then $40,000.

I think these two C&D comparos do a good job of highlighting just how good the E46 3-series is.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article_id=2577&page_number=1

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=15&article_id=1983

Between these two comparos, the 330i beats out literally all of its real competition. No car has been quite as dominant in one class as the BMW 3-series, especially the 330i, is. It isn't the most powerful, it isn't the most luxurious, and it isn't the fastest of the group anymore, but when you drive the 3-series there are absolutely no major flaws like you would find on the other cars. The CTS has nothing going for it except its engine, the G35's interior feels very cheep, the A4 isn't as fun or as reliable, etc. If you are at all like me, when you drive the 330i you will get a bigger smile on your face then with any of these other cars.

Possible alternatives...
2006 IS250- Very good car, and you might just be able to get one new, just not very well equipped.

E90 325i- On paper the new E90 325i is very close to the outgoing E46 330i. 215hp v. 225hp. The only problem is again, a new 325i rarely goes for less then $32-33,000, which is over your budget. I like how the E90 handles but I like the interior in the E46 more. Its a tough call for me.

My final advice would be to just go out and test drive all of these cars. Having a bunch of faceless posters tell you what they like the most is one thing, but you really shouldn't buy anything until you have tested everything.

not too sure if I like the whole BMW idea, plus the fact that it would have to be slightly older than I'm looking for... What are some of the preformance specs for the 99's and up? I wasn't too impressed with earlier versions as far as speed goes.

Yea the gto isn't really luxury, but its on the other end of my spectrum as far as what I want. I think the interior looks good enuf and I like the LS2 engine.

as far as my personal (albiet uneducated) opinion goes, I think im leaning twards the infinity g35

the car I get is also going to have to be quite reliable, as its probably gonna have 15-20thousand miles per year put on it.

I dont know much info about the audi's, but I've heard good things. Any specs as far as preformance goes? or sites I can find more information about them and the different types of them?

thanks.

I'd go with the G35 or the cadillac. the GTO's not luxury enough and the IS300 really isn't that fast. peronsally i'd take the G35 cuz i like nissans and i love the VQ motors. the caddy's nice but for what you're gonna pay for it you can get the G35 which has about 50 more hp and 25 ft-lbs of tq.

I'd say either the G35 or the CTS 3.6L. The CTS has 255hp and 252lb-ft, and the G35 has 280hp and 270lb-ft so it's going to be a little faster than the CTS, but you can't go wrong either way.

^ the Manual G35's actually have 300 hp, the auto's have 280.

2001 7-series. You could find a 750iL model with about 70k miles for $25k. And that's with navigation, privacy screens... just a darn nice car. Right now on Ebay there is a 2000 750iL with the V12, fully loaded with 67k miles at a buy it now of $29,500. Now that's luxury and performance. If you've never driven one, give yourself the joy of just a test drive.

^ the Manual G35's actually have 300 hp, the auto's have 280.
Do you think he'll be able to get an 05 for 30k with a manual? I'm pretty sure they run more than 30k but I may be wrong.

Do you think he'll be able to get an 05 for 30k with a manual? I'm pretty sure they run more than 30k but I may be wrong.
umm....what?

G35's brand new only run $35k dont they? i see it being possible...

E36 M3??? pftt....i can get a 01 E46 M3 for a tad under $30k in my area.

I would get a manual 2dr G35 if i had to pick out of those options...

they had the same motor in 04 so it's not like he has to buy it brand new. i'm actually in the market for a G35 myself so i've been doing the reasearch and there are a lot of pre-owned G's with low mileage in and around that price range. with some good bargaining skills i'm sure you could get a nice 04 G35 6 speed coupe for less than $30K

Finnaly had a small ammount of time to go look at cars before work this morning. Went to a few dealerships in a local automall.
Test drove a used g35, very nice car... love how it handels, but I don't know if It was just circumstance or just my area, because every used g35 coupe I saw was atleast 33k and thats 04's too, (Live in sacramento ca)

Was very impressed with the chrysler 300hemis, nice car... wish they were within my price range ;)

Havn't got a chance to look at the bimmers yet, but I'm gonna go spend all day on thursday at another automall drivin shit so I'm sure ill find a few bmw's

saw some good deals on brand new pontiac gtp's but I still dont think im into the whole fwd thing.. just dosn't feel right. anyone have experiences with these cars?

any other imput would be appreciated, im still up in the air and its startin to bug me ;)

another thing is, no matter what I get it has to be an auto. I know there are alot of differences in auto's between car makers, so which ones should I stay away from and which ones are good as far as automatic trannys go?

2005 GTO. 3 series are a dime a dozen.

http://ultimategto.com/bondurant04cars1.htm

http://www.pontiac.com/images/gallery/gto/sm_image5_enlarge.jpg

3 series are a dime a dozen.
With good reason :)

If you don't care about fuel economy, as in really don't care, you can get an RX-8 for as low as $20k. It may not have the acceleration of the G35 but it makes up for it in handling and its interior can rival the Infiniti as well. Also, rotary engines actually improve in performance as you add mileage.

Ill check out the rx8...
Dont think I can get the gto, has to be an auto, and with the auto's it bumps the fuel economy down just enuf to where I would have to pay a gas guzzeler tax on it which makes it too expensive.

also for the bmw's what are the 1/4mi times with them, I never know where to look online to find 1/4mi times and stuff for specific cars.

E46 330i Performance Package: 235hp 1/4 mile in 14.3 seconds (C&D)

E46 330i Sport: 225hp 1/4 mile in 14.8 seconds (C&D)

Those are both 1/4 mile times in sedans w/ manual transmissions. The coupes should be a little faster, the automatics should be a little slower.

Don't forget that with a BMW comes much more expensive maintenance and insurance costs. I wouldn't but a 3 series unless it was an M, they are overpriced and underpowered compared to the competition, especially the G35. Infiniti has the best service in the biz, and they are built much better than bimmers.

Don't forget that with a BMW comes much more expensive maintenance and insurance costs. I wouldn't but a 3 series unless it was an M, they are overpriced and underpowered compared to the competition, especially the G35. Infiniti has the best service in the biz, and they are built much better than bimmers.

I would really like to see a third party source say that BMW maintenance and insurance is highter, or that Infiniti has the best service, or that they are better built.

I've done a little research, and JD Powers said the quality of the 3-series is above that of the G35. The Kelly Blue Book resale value on BMWs is still better then Infiniti, Lexus, Benz, or anyone else in the class. KBB also ranked the BMW 3-series 5 of 5 in mechanical quality, the G35 got 4 of 5 in mech. quality. Yes, as a whole, BMW's reliability is not where it should be, but upon further inspection, most of the recent reliability problems stem from the 5 and 7-series and IDrive, not the 3-series. What I've found as far as service goes is it all depends on the dealership, not the parent company. I've been to good BMW dealerships and I've been to bad ones. Its no different with any maker.

http://consumercenter.jdpower.com/cc/rd/cc/auto/compare.asp?activeList=JDPlistSub

www.kbb.com

Prove me wrong please

Ill check out the rx8...
Dont think I can get the gto, has to be an auto, and with the auto's it bumps the fuel economy down just enuf to where I would have to pay a gas guzzeler tax on it which makes it too expensive.

also for the bmw's what are the 1/4mi times with them, I never know where to look online to find 1/4mi times and stuff for specific cars.

If your criteria is for only for an automatic, than in that case the RX-8 would probably be a disapointment since it has 197hp and 167 torque, since the amount you rev your rotary is plays a huge role on how much hp plus torque you get. The sports suspention also comes standard in the manual models.

If you want something with a good automatic tranny you should consider some sports sedans such as the Infiniti G35x, Legacy GT and even the 3.0l Jaguar X-Type. Those all have 5 speed automatics with sports shift.

I would really like to see a third party source say that BMW maintenance and insurance is highter, or that Infiniti has the best service, or that they are better built.

I've done a little research, and JD Powers said the quality of the 3-series is above that of the G35. The Kelly Blue Book resale value on BMWs is still better then Infiniti, Lexus, Benz, or anyone else in the class. KBB also ranked the BMW 3-series 5 of 5 in mechanical quality, the G35 got 4 of 5 in mech. quality. Yes, as a whole, BMW's reliability is not where it should be, but upon further inspection, most of the recent reliability problems stem from the 5 and 7-series and IDrive, not the 3-series. What I've found as far as service goes is it all depends on the dealership, not the parent company. I've been to good BMW dealerships and I've been to bad ones. Its no different with any maker.

http://consumercenter.jdpower.com/cc/rd/cc/auto/compare.asp?activeList=JDPlistSub

www.kbb.com

Prove me wrong please

Woops, my bad, Infinit got edged out in the most recent survey by 3 points (out of 1000), sorry. But not by BMW, not a chance.

http://car-reviews.automobile.com/news/lincoln-dealers-rank-highest-in-customer-service-according-to-j-d-powers/169/

Here's another one, you can see Infiniti very near the top (has slipped a little) and BMW just barely above average.

http://www.jdpower.com/news/releases/pressrelease.asp?ID=2005092

Better built? Sure, not a problem. Infiniti stomps BMW with almost 50 less problems per 100 vehicles built.

http://www.cartest.ca/2005_most_reliable_vehicles.html

Maintenance costs? Well, I couldn't find any numbers, it turns out those aren't really kept track of in a standardized manner as are reliability, service, etc, but if you really want to argue that BMW's are as cheap to maintain as Infiniti's, there not much I can say to you. You should know this already though, just compare the price of the extremely expensive 10w60 motor oil that your M3 REQUIRES to any other synthetic. I don't see why you're so opposed to Infiniti building a more quality vehicle with better service. BMW does not have better resale due to better quality, it's based on strong demand for their vehicles.

And Kia is ranked one of the highest in customer satisfaction and service, your point is?

Also, the Subaru Legacy is more ranked higher in reliability than the BMW and Infiniti, but low in customer service which is mostly due to part costs because of their smaller shipping volumes.

Do you see a Kia anywhere in this comparison? We are discussing the merits of the 3 series vs. the G35. so where in the hell do Kia or Subaru enter into this? Go wase your worthless posts elsewhere.

Exactly, the G35 vs. the 3-series, not Infiniti vs. BMW. BMW's reliability issues rarely have to do with the 3-series. BMW's biggest problem cars are the X5, pre-facelift 7-series and the 5-series, not the 3. Look for 3-series specific information, like the link I sent earlier, not necessarily company vs company, but car vs car.

Plus, BMW covers all maintenence under warranty, correct me if I'm wrong, but Infiniti doesn't do that. So everything from oil to breakpads to windshield wipers can be replaced for free for the first four years / 50,000 miles.

I also have problems with that customer service ratings chart. There is no way Lincoln, Saturn, Cadi, and Pontiac are better dealers then Toyota, Nissan, and Honda.

Your 3rd link didn't work.

Comparing company against company is one thing, comparing car against car (which we are doing) can be a very different thing.

Do you see a Kia anywhere in this comparison? We are discussing the merits of the 3 series vs. the G35. so where in the hell do Kia or Subaru enter into this? Go wase your worthless posts elsewhere.

I was just stating if customer service is the biggest issue when purchasing a plush performance car. And yes it is, but not still not as important as a number of other factor that contribute to the satisfacation once you get the car and not taking it to a dealer.

As for Subaru= a waste of time. Perhaps you should as well as Hank should check out the specs, interior packages and most importantly the pricing of the Legacy GT. And then you might arrive to the conclusion that aside from the upcoming Mazdaspeed6, this car has a great bang for the buck, nice interior which just borders on Lexus quality as well as great reliability. Some just have to get over the Camryesque exterior. The topic author stated in the title a performance oriented luxury car for under $30k, and I don't think he meant used.

Exactly, the G35 vs. the 3-series, not Infiniti vs. BMW. BMW's reliability issues rarely have to do with the 3-series. BMW's biggest problem cars are the X5, pre-facelift 7-series and the 5-series, not the 3. Look for 3-series specific information, like the link I sent earlier, not necessarily company vs company, but car vs car.

Plus, BMW covers all maintenence under warranty, correct me if I'm wrong, but Infiniti doesn't do that. So everything from oil to breakpads to windshield wipers can be replaced for free for the first four years / 50,000 miles.

I also have problems with that customer service ratings chart. There is no way Lincoln, Saturn, Cadi, and Pontiac are better dealers then Toyota, Nissan, and Honda.

Your 3rd link didn't work.

Comparing company against company is one thing, comparing car against car (which we are doing) can be a very different thing.

Well, you asked me to provide 3rd party verification and I did, if you don't have faith in JDPower rankings, there's not much else I can do to convince you.

Sure, BMW has free maintenance for the first 4 years, but let's look at why that is. Their parts ARE more expensive, no doubt about it...their maintenance program was launched to boost sales exactly b/c people are turned away by high cost of ownership. Free maintenance = lower cost of ownership = less buyers scared off by pricey maintenance. Now we're talking about used vehicles here that will likely run out of that maintenance period, and then you're stuck with higher maintenance costs AND poorer service (I'm sticking with the JDPower and personal experience, every Infiniti dealer we've been to has been phenomenal, whereas service on my Maxima has been less than stellar in comparison)

FYI, I love BMW's and am currently in the market for an E46 M3, so there's not much bias here...

I also have problems with that customer service ratings chart. There is no way Lincoln, Saturn, Cadi, and Pontiac are better dealers then Toyota, Nissan, and Honda.

You would be very surprised. While Toyota, Honda, and Nissan and clearly ahead of Lincoln, Saturn, and Cadillac right now, the American brands are making a strong push, especially in the customer service and dealership treatment department. Around here, at least, the Toyota and Nissan dealerships are full of complete pricks (they're nearly as bad as BMW, for god sakes).