More Problems with my 96 Blazer from hell

Hello,
I took my truck in because a clicking sound was coming from the engine and it will get louder with acceleration, so anyways I took it in and here is what they found:

1: The clicking noise is caused by a sticky lifter. The mechanic recommended Slick 50, so I bought some Slick 50 for high mileage vehicles, but it stats on the back add 10% to vehicles that take 6 qrts. Now what I want to know is can I take 15oz of oil out of my truck and replace it with the 15oz of slick 50? I just can't see spending $20 on this stuff and only using 10% of it.

2: Water Pump Leaks (Will Fix)

3: Oil Cooler Lines Leak (Should I worry about it?)

4: Trans Pan Leaks (Should I worry about it?)

5: Trans Mount Busted (Will Fix)


I would appreciate you input on this as I'm just going to add the full 15oz of the slick 50 to my crankcase after I remove 15oz of oil. I'm also going to replace the water pump and fix the trans mount, but I'm not worried about the other 2 as my trans fluid is full so how much can it be leaking??

NO SLICK 50!!!!!!

DON'T DO IT!!!!

If anything get some gunk engine flush from walmart and run it at IDLE in your engine for 30 minutes and then drop your oil and filter and do an oil change.

Slick 50 is a scam as has ingredients that will actually make the lifter worse.

Trust me on this, DON'T DO IT!

I hate gunk as it screwed up my Pontiac after using it.

I've heard great things from a few people about slick 50. What problem(s) have u had with slick50?

Thanks Rick

I hate gunk as it screwed up my Pontiac after using it.

I've heard great things from a few people about slick 50. What problem(s) have u had with slick50?

Thanks Rick



Ok! I'm gonna do it your way BlazerLT! I didn't want to believe slick 50 was junk as I spent $20 on it and lost my damn receipt.. The other shitty thing is I just changed my oil and now I have to do it again after I flush the engine, but I don't want anymore harm done to my engine with the stuck lifter and all.

I'm gonna check this thread when I return from work and get ready to do the flush. I would appreciate if you guys could give me your opinions if you think the flush will free the stuck lifter or am I just wasting my money??

Thanks, Rick

Ok! I'm gonna do it your way BlazerLT! I didn't want to believe slick 50 was junk as I spent $20 on it and lost my damn receipt.. The other shitty thing is I just changed my oil and now I have to do it again after I flush the engine, but I don't want anymore harm done to my engine with the stuck lifter and all.

I'm gonna check this thread when I return from work and get ready to do the flush. I would appreciate if you guys could give me your opinions if you think the flush will free the stuck lifter or am I just wasting my money??

Thanks, Rick

Ok, do the flush like I said and do yourself a favor and go get some Mobil1 synthetic and a good oil filter (NOT FRAM). This will definitely clean the lifter out for you over the next oil change and you will be amazed as to how much dirt the Mobil1 will remove.

It is not that expensive. Oh, also, replace your PCV valve.

Well, I got home late so I didn't do anything today, but I'd like to know after I do the flush and change the oil does the oil have to be changed again in a week or so or is the 1 change good enough to remove the flush??

one change should be good and the little amount of flush left in the system should easily be good for over 3000 miles.

Will you be using synthetic or conventional?

I'm going to go the whole 9 yards and get the synthetic oil and a K&N synthetic filter. I just hope this works.. I feel confident the flush will be more thorough then the slick50 and hopefully less abrasive on the engine as it does have 100k on it.

I also keep thinking how I have to do this in my unheated garage in 20F weather :(

Thanks for your help your a true asset to the forum.

Rick

I'm going to go the whole 9 yards and get the synthetic oil and a K&N synthetic filter. I just hope this works.. I feel confident the flush will be more thorough then the slick50 and hopefully less abrasive on the engine as it does have 100k on it.

I also keep thinking how I have to do this in my unheated garage in 20F weather :(

Thanks for your help your a true asset to the forum.

Rick

Don't worry about the K&N oil filter, get a good Mobil1 filter and some 5w30 Mobil1 Synthetic oil for after the change.

I would go for about 6000 miles with this change. You watch as that synthetic get dirty fast as it cleans your engine out. Mobil1 is known for that.

And thanks for the compliment, I only love to help.

Hello,
5w30 Mobil1 Synthetic oil is exactly what I bought along with the gunk engine cleaner, but it stats on the bottle run the engine for 5min. Should I still run for 30min? I'm also unsure of one other thing. Do I have to buy a special oil filter for the synthetic or is the conventional filters used for synthetic??

By the way what is wrong with Fram filters? Fram is the only brand I've used sense I got my first car.


Thanks, Rick :smokin:

1.) make sure you dump the gunk engine cleaner in the oil in your truck now. Don't dump it in the synthetic.

2.) Yes, 30 minutes and it is best that those 30 minutes are hot too. Go for a drive, come back and dump the oil in while it is idling and allow it to idle for 30 minutes. IDLE ONLY!

3.) Normal good NON FRAM oil filter is best. WIX, Napa gold, K&N, Purolator, AC Delco etc. are all good.

4.) Fram are absolute shit. Cardboard end caps, 1/2 the filter media and poor construction. Don't ue them, use anything but them.

The oil lines on the truck that are leaking, FIX THEM ASAP!! These lines have a tendency to blow out of there fitting. Just imagine what would happen if you were driving down the road and one let loose.... Can you say crate motor!! Seriously get it done.

*Update*

Saturday 11/19 I started work on my truck which includes:

Flushed Engine with Gunk

Changed the oil

Switched from conventional oil to synthetic.

Installed new water pump to fix the leaky one.

Found bad fan clutch

Installed new Fan Clutch

After finishing all the work the lifter was still tapping away and it was driving me crazy so I still had the bottle of slick 50 in the garage and I said what the hell and added it to the oil with no change what so ever, but 3 days later today I left to go to work and the tapping is completely gone and the engine is running completely smooth. I have to say the slick50 is responsible for it. I called slick50 to ask about harm to my engine and the man said the stuff is 80% oil and no harm will be caused to my engine and if anything was to occur that I can prove their product is responsible they will cover all damages, so I must stand by this product.. :smokin:

*Update*

Saturday 11/19 I started work on my truck which includes:

Flushed Engine with Gunk

Changed the oil

Switched from conventional oil to synthetic.

Installed new water pump to fix the leaky one.

Found bad fan clutch

Installed new Fan Clutch

After finishing all the work the lifter was still tapping away and it was driving me crazy so I still had the bottle of slick 50 in the garage and I said what the hell and added it to the oil with no change what so ever, but 3 days later today I left to go to work and the tapping is completely gone and the engine is running completely smooth. I have to say the slick50 is responsible for it. I called slick50 to ask about harm to my engine and the man said the stuff is 80% oil and no harm will be caused to my engine and if anything was to occur that I can prove their product is responsible they will cover all damages, so I must stand by this product.. :smokin:

Sucker born every minute.

Sorry but you are wrong, the Slick50 did nothing.

The synthetic oil is probably what stopped the tapping once it cleaned the sludge out of the lifter. Too bad you didn't give it a chance to do its job.

Slick50 is not an oil cleaner and couldn't have done what you think it could have done. Also, if it was the cure, it would have taken 3 days for it to work. Plus how can you say that the slick50 did it?

You just wasted your good synthetic oil change by adding a scam that will actually degrade your premium oil.

Come on BlazerLt, I know you have your way of doing things which probably have served you well and I have my way of doing things. I gave your way 3 days and the tapping was getting louder and I didn't want anymore harm done to the engine. I really like my blazer despite all the money it cost me in repairs. I gave the slick50 a chance so I can make my own opinion on the product and after using it it's been good. I can't say for sure the slick50 fixed it or your idea fixed it either way the lifter is working again. I wont add it to my engine again unless there is a problem cause I don't really support additives that much. On another note I disagree with a gas additive improving gas mileage that you seem to swear by. I don't think your a "Sucker" for buying into it as there are many factors involved that could have improved you gas mileage. Lets just agree to disagree.

I read your post about the head gasket and I have to say if you own a Blazer it Will happen to yeah if you own the truck long enough. My head gasket blew I think 2 months after I bought it and it cost me a bundle having it fixed. I want to say this the decision for GM to cancel further development of the blazer and focus on the future of the trail blazer was a good one because all we own is a whining money hungry woman. Gm is a company on it's last leg for sticking us with crap while the imports are keeping people happy. I have only owned GM vehicles because It's the only alternative to turning my back on this countries workmanship and going to an import, but the way things are looking my next vehicle will be engineered by the Japanese.

I think I'm going to try this slick50 stuff... I'm about 2k km away from my oil change. How long are you supposed to run it in your oil for?

I've tried Gunk already and it did nothing for my lifter tap (in fact in the following months it has worsened slightly).


Just on a side note, my tcase tranny separator seal is leaking right now. Do you think using their transmission fluid might help this until I can fix it properly (in 2-3 months)?

Hello,
Slick50 is an oil addictive they recommend adding it during an oil change just substitute 15oz of oil for the 15oz of Slick50.

I never used their Trans Product, but here is the info on that product I pulled from their site.

Slick 50® Annual Automatic Transmission Treatment
As transmission fluid ages the fluid components oxidize, gradually losing the ability to lubricate and protect your transmission as well as it did when the fluid was new. Oxidation and fluid breakdown are the single largest causes of transmission problems. Oxidation occurs when heat breaks down the chemical components of the fluid. This process not only can make the components less active, but often can create compounds like acids and sludge that can be harmful to your transmission. Slick 50® Automatic Transmission Treatment replenishes your ATF with vital chemical compounds to help prevent wear, oxidation and seal deterioration.

*Helps protect transmission life

*Helps prevent seal leaks

*Helps curb corrosion, rust and sludge buildup


I would appreciate it if you could post your results of your use of slick50.

Thanks,
Rick

Perhaps I should rephrase my question... do you change the duration of the oil cycle in which you are using slick50?

I'm looking forward to posting the results.. To be fair, you weren't exactly "scientific" if you didn't give synthetic at least a full cycle's try. With the help of people on this board I've decided on the synthetic I'm going to be replacing my conventional with and I'll see how my tap is affected after a few thousand kilometers. Depending on the results I'll put the slick50 in then.

Slick50 and the like are using PTFE. (Teflon to you and me) Even DuPont says that teflon was never, EVER meant to be used in engines. The micro-fine suspension of Teflon eventually pools and sludges at wherever it rests. (Oil pan, lower oil galleries, valvetrain, etc) It turns into a rock hard, white sludge eventually and will never come out.

If you feel you MUST put an oil additive in these blocks, I have only one recommendation:

Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment. It comes in a 15 Oz. *Silver* bottle, not to be confused with the stuff in the red bottle. (Valvoline Synpower Engine Treatment) There is nothing in the formulation of Valvoline Synpower to percipitate out of solution, and it thouroughly beefs up an oil really nice. A single treatment of this stuff completely silenced out a sticky, ticking lifter in a 3500 Dodge Caravan V-6 I look after for a roomate. The Valvoline product also has the ability to slightly extend an oil's life, but I still would not put any more than 5-7K miles on it, as it does a fine job of cleaning stuff up. The stuff it knocks off deposits itself into the oil and the filter and would warrant a quick oil change within the mileage mentioned above when used for the very first time.

I would never put Slick-50 in any engine or transmission I cared about or expected to run for any length of time. Google around for Slick-50 on the web...and then read how many lawsuits, engine failures and general "It doesn't work one bit as advertised" threads come up. You're throwing money away on this man. :) I also shy away from Penzoil with Slick-50 already added in. If you want a balanced, well formulated oil with good stuff alread in it, look to Chevron Supreme with Techron already added into it. That, or one quick, 3000 mile oil change on Shell Rotella before switching over to a *good* fully synthetic oil to keep an engine clean and running super tight. The money you blow on a single bottle of Slick-50 gargabe buys you all you need for a wicked synthetic media oil filter and a crankcase filled with Mobil-1. But, this is just my opinion, and unfortunately, the opinion of alot of other folks that used Slick-50 only to have junked up engines that die from oil starvation and gelling. YMMV. Good luck! :D

Oh, and FYI - nothing in a bottle will fix a leaking tranny seal. The only solution is to take the transfer case down and out, pick the old seal out from the spline shaft at the rear of the tranny tail housing with a seal remover or a screwdriver; then place a new one snugly back in with either a seating tool or a large enough socket that spans the seal and shaft, but fits within the lip of the tail housing. Junk in a bottle never fixed a transmission that had trouble for me, and they should only be used as a last resort. But ultimately, the only way to take care of that issue or any tranny issue is to get it fixed. Oh, and if you serviced your tranny on schedule as it says in your owner's manual, the ATF and filter would not get junked up with debris or give the fluid time to oxidize at all. Food for thought! It's cheaper to maintain a vehicle than to try to "band aid" it with bullsh*t cures in bottles that honestly - Don't work.

Slick50 and the like are using PTFE. (Teflon to you and me) Even DuPont says that teflon was never, EVER meant to be used in engines. The micro-fine suspension of Teflon eventually pools and sludges at wherever it rests. (Oil pan, lower oil galleries, valvetrain, etc) It turns into a rock hard, white sludge eventually and will never come out.

If you feel you MUST put an oil additive in these blocks, I have only one recommendation:

Valvoline Synpower Oil Treatment. It comes in a 15 Oz. *Silver* bottle, not to be confused with the stuff in the red bottle. (Valvoline Synpower Engine Treatment) There is nothing in the formulation of Valvoline Synpower to percipitate out of solution, and it thouroughly beefs up an oil really nice. A single treatment of this stuff completely silenced out a sticky, ticking lifter in a 3500 Dodge Caravan V-6 I look after for a roomate. The Valvoline product also has the ability to slightly extend an oil's life, but I still would not put any more than 5-7K miles on it, as it does a fine job of cleaning stuff up. The stuff it knocks off deposits itself into the oil and the filter and would warrant a quick oil change within the mileage mentioned above when used for the very first time.

I would never put Slick-50 in any engine or transmission I cared about or expected to run for any length of time. Google around for Slick-50 on the web...and then read how many lawsuits, engine failures and general "It doesn't work one bit as advertised" threads come up. You're throwing money away on this man. :) I also shy away from Penzoil with Slick-50 already added in. If you want a balanced, well formulated oil with good stuff alread in it, look to Chevron Supreme with Techron already added into it. That, or one quick, 3000 mile oil change on Shell Rotella before switching over to a *good* fully synthetic oil to keep an engine clean and running super tight. The money you blow on a single bottle of Slick-50 gargabe buys you all you need for a wicked synthetic media oil filter and a crankcase filled with Mobil-1. But, this is just my opinion, and unfortunately, the opinion of alot of other folks that used Slick-50 only to have junked up engines that die from oil starvation and gelling. YMMV. Good luck! :D

Oh, and FYI - nothing in a bottle will fix a leaking tranny seal. The only solution is to take the transfer case down and out, pick the old seal out from the spline shaft at the rear of the tranny tail housing with a seal remover or a screwdriver; then place a new one snugly back in with either a seating tool or a large enough socket that spans the seal and shaft, but fits within the lip of the tail housing. Junk in a bottle never fixed a transmission that had trouble for me, and they should only be used as a last resort. But ultimately, the only way to take care of that issue or any tranny issue is to get it fixed. Oh, and if you serviced your tranny on schedule as it says in your owner's manual, the ATF and filter would not get junked up with debris or give the fluid time to oxidize at all. Food for thought! It's cheaper to maintain a vehicle than to try to "band aid" it with bullsh*t cures in bottles that honestly - Don't work.

Smarter words have never been spoken, listen to this man.

Perhaps I should rephrase my question... do you change the duration of the oil cycle in which you are using slick50?

I'm looking forward to posting the results.. To be fair, you weren't exactly "scientific" if you didn't give synthetic at least a full cycle's try. With the help of people on this board I've decided on the synthetic I'm going to be replacing my conventional with and I'll see how my tap is affected after a few thousand kilometers. Depending on the results I'll put the slick50 in then.

DO NOT, I REPEAT DO NOT USE THIS STUFF!!!!!

Here is some more information:

The Case of the Awful Additive
There's probably not a better-known name in the world of oil additives than Slick 50. They pretty much defined the market. Which makes it all the more interesting that they've been sued, big time.
The Federal Trade Commission took the first shot by filing a Complaint in 1996. In this complaint, they alleged that Slick 50 was lying when the company claimed that engines need Slick 50 during startup; or to prevent premature engine failure; or to reduce engine wear; or that it coats engine parts with PTFE; or that it increases horsepower or fuel efficiency, or lowers engine temperatures or emissions; or that it meets military specs or is used in government vehicles. Which is basically everything that Slick 50 claims in their advertising.

This case dragged on for a while, even as the company changed hands. Eventually Slick 50 elected to settle with the FTC. This settlement bars Slick 50 from making any of the above claims about the product and required Slick 50 to distribute at least $10 million in rebates.

What fascinates us is that Slick 50 is no longer allowed to claim a benefit from using their product. Yet it still sells. People will buy anything. Don't be one of them!

But it doesn't stop there for Slick 50. The class-action lawyers stepped in.

Although there are several suits against Slick 50, the one we have information on is Raysic v. Quaker State-Slick 50 Inc.. They made it easy by creating a Slick 50 Class Action Information Center (now offline). Here's the deal:

According to the Preliminary Settlement Notice, shortly after the FTC action began, Slick 50 was hammered with eight class-action lawsuits. Some of these eventually consolidated with Raysic while others are still pending.

These class-actions all basically held the same grievances as the FTC action and resulted in much the same solution: Slick 50 saying they did nothing wrong but paying out tons of money.

The settlement provides for the distribution of $20 million in rebates -- which, in our mind, suggests that Slick 50 would rather make a huge payoff than face a detailed scrutiny of their business practices. Which, further, suggests that Slick 50 should be avoided at all cost. Which is what we intend to do.

This $20 million in rebates is available to anyone who has purchased a bottle of Slick 50 before 23 September 1997. Each person will receive $15.00 in rebates per purchase of Slick 50. The catch is, it's not cash. You have to buy Quaker State products to get your money. For a product which is generally acknowledged to cause the occasional engine seizure, this seems more like a slap in the face than a settlement. But there you go.

At least the lawyers get rich. The Preliminary Settlement Notice also provides for the lawyers to pursue $3.25 million in cash to reimburse expenses.

We have the original Federal Trade Commission Complaint and Notice, with all the accusations; the Agreement Containing Consent Order; and the Decision and Order, which details the final settlement.

http://neptune.spacebears.com/cars/legal/

Seems like you and I read the same "claptrap" rubbish on the web BlazerLT. Good show! And here I was busting a nut to find the very same class action as it currently stands. Excellent backup, bud. Thanks!

:cheers:

Also read here:

http://www.ftc.gov/opa/1996/07/slick.htm

Information on PTFE which is the main ingredient in Slick 50:

http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=5;t=000909

Seems like you and I read the same "claptrap" rubbish on the web BlazerLT. Good show! And here I was busting a nut to find the very same class action as it currently stands. Excellent backup, bud. Thanks!

:cheers:

I will do EVERYTHING in my power to stop people from using something that will harm their engines.

PTFE will also react and form an acid in the engine as well.

No you don't have to change your maintenance schedule after you add slick 50 because the product is only recommend every 12,000 miles for superior protection.

Perhaps next time I'll throw my lab coat on when I use a product and decide to take the time out to post the results on this forum.

I agree the time waited is insufficient to conclusively say slick50 is solely responsible for freeing the lifter, so I would recommend trying the flush and the synthetic oil to see if that frees it if not add the slick 50 and see if that helps. Of course your test really won't prove me wrong or right because every engines condition over time is different because we all don't maintain and drive the same. So in conclusion just give it a shot and form your own opinion.

No you don't have to change your maintenance schedule after you add slick 50 because the product is only recommend every 12,000 miles for superior protection.

Perhaps next time I'll throw my lab coat on when I use a product and decide to take the time out to post the results on this forum.

I agree the time waited is insufficient to conclusively say slick50 is solely responsible for freeing the lifter, so I would recommend trying the flush and the synthetic oil to see if that frees it if not add the slick 50 and see if that helps. Of course your test really won't prove me wrong or right because every engines condition over time is different because we all don't maintain and drive the same. So in conclusion just give it a shot and form your own opinion.

yea, take a shot and introduce a additive that has been filed a class action lawsuit over and introduce a chemical that turns to an acid or a hard tar in your oil pathways.

I swear if you can't read the information in this thread you might as well continue sticking your head into the sand.

The only way that PTFE would "work" to coat parts is one of 2 methods:

1) Chemically catalyzed and bonded. However, these chemicals are extremely toxic, cannot be bottled safely in a consumer product; and reacts TERRIBLY with engine oil chemistries.

2)Heat and pressure. The pressure and heat that would allow this process to occur will NEVER be reached in a healthy engine. Never. *Ever*.

Teflon, teflon based products and the ilk are *junk science* when it comes to internal combustion engines. It simply DOES not work. Period.

Now what does work to reduce friction to almost nothing, especially in the conditions found in a piston engine? Ready for this one now? :lol:

Conditioner - the stuff you use as a final rinse of your hair and a shampoo. No shit there...it's the Zinc in it that provides awesome barrier/border lubrication on moving metal parts.

And the other is Bleach. Chlorine is extremely slippery stuff. But it is UNSTABLE and reacts violently in the presence of pressure and heat. It *attacks* steel, iron and aluminum, let alone the materials that engine bearings and journals are made of to rapidly etch and pit straight through it.

A quick show of hands now....Who here pours bleach and hair conditioner into their engine oil after an oil change? Be honest! Anyone? Hello? C'mon, it reduces operating temps, makes the engine rus super slick and smooth, and you can pop the valvecovers off and toss handfulls of sand and spray it with water and it will keep on running! (For a VERY, VERY short time) Hell, an engine on any of these materials can be drained dry and ruuuuuuuuuuuuun for a few miles with no immediate sign of any wear too. But at what cost down the road?

Now for the scariest fact of all? Many, purely JUNK oil additives that promise the things that Slick-50 did back in their day USE chlorinated compounds to this day. They use materials not too disimilar from just dumping chlorine into the engine. I will not go into the loooooong list of names of products to avoid, but - I stand firm on what I can personally endorse and USE and have used with most excellent results in my former post. There is not *anything* that can go wrong with the Valvoine chemistry and you have everything to gain. Especially at a mere $3.75 a pop. I special order in the stuff by the case through a local Valvoline retailer and give them as gifts to my friends, etc.

I hate to sound like a Capital One commercial, but:

"Whutz in yer crankcase?!" *grunt-grunt*

EDIT: For comedy! Dress up hard facts with something to make folks laugh - they'll remember it. :D

This just in:

My roomate who is not particularly technologically or automotive savvy has this to say after shoulder surfing:

"Slick-50? Hah! I watched my old man destroy three car engines with that crap. He believed the commercial printing on the label and bought a bottle for every car in the house. They *shrug* ... all just stopped working one day a few months later."

His minivan, which survived by him being adamantly *against* using Slick-50 went on to tow a 4,000 pound trailer cross-country to be where it is - running strong and healthy under my care. ;) Forget the lab coat, pull on your thinking cap and reading glasses. I admit, it's purely anecdotal in nature but - come on. THREE cars within weeks of one another DYING and showing signs of oil starvation within months of application of this "miracle" product. Pffffft. Looks like you'd be doing two oil changes within a week if you just simply read the info behind the links BlazerLT provided. :)

In the beginning? Well, I was...erm, well I AM a nerd. I looked at the label and read, "Wow, contains Teflon...wouldn't work in an engine...what *is* this used for?" and never looked back. Put that box down like it was a hot brick. Since then DuPont's lawyer team forbade Slick-50 and other "engine treatment" manufacturers from using their trademarked product name. THey got tired of people calling them up to sue because the "Teflon" didn't work. In fact, it was destroying engines it was being put into. So you know what SLick-50's marketing team did?

The smart thing to do would have been to *reformulate* the product into something that would work as advertised. Nope, they dropped DuPont's trade name as requested and now refer to the *SAME* formulation by it's acronym. P.T.F.E.

If you read on ANY label, on ANY product that is meant to go into use in your car or truck engine that reads P.T.F.E. - put it back on the shelf. Teflon's for frying pans and .45 caliber Glasier or Hydra-shok Talons IMO. *shakes his ammo box* :evillol:

If your going to post that rubbish you mine as well get your facts straight!

Yes! They were sued for lying and saying you have to use their product or you'll destroy your engine.. Now that bullshit and they should be sued!


Yes! Slick50 does contain a controversial ingredient called PTFE that dupont said "We don't know how a oil would benefit from PTFE being added to it"

No! Dupont did not say it would damage a engine. I pulled that from Duponts website.

Here is the non doctored info about PTFE:

In addition, there is some evidence that certain supplies of PTFE powders (from manufacturers other than DuPont) are of a cruder version than the original, made with larger sized flakes that are more likely to "settle out" in your oil or clog up your filters. One fairly good indication that a product contains this kind of PTFE is if the instructions for its use advise you to "shake well before using." It only stands to reason that if the manufacturer knows the solids in his product will settle to the bottom of a container while sitting on a shelf, the same thing is going to happen inside your engine when it is left idle for any period of time.

Now if you go to Duponts web site they list there product is being used in slick50 against there advice and is not from another company that can cause harm to an engine...

I will continue to spread the love for slick50 until my engine blows up from using it once... I'm glad you guys hate this product so much when I can pull up so many web sites they say gas addictives cause more harm then good BlazerLT.

Put it in your engine if you want, but everyone knows that oil additives are not needed when using a good motor oil.

You just degraded your synthetic with that crap.

When I read it, (Several years ago mind) DuPont stated, "...DuPont does not recommend the use of Teflon(tm) in any engine..." (emphasis is mine) Further dilution over the years of lawsuits and of the "facts" renders what you see today. Gotta remember, they're trying to cover their arses. Second:

If they are claiming that they do not know of any benefits of it's application in engine oil - are you risking your investment of hard earned money to R&D for them? Or are you being paid by them or any other subsidiary company to do so?

No? Then why are you risking your engine and transmission on it? What IS proven is that *regular* maintenance, exchanging fluids and watching mile markers to fix or service engine and transmissions using conventional methodology WORKS. It works far better than any miracle product ever designed. Further enhancement is gained by employing synthetic fluids and revised fluid spec materials in both longevity, performance and economy. This can be easily obtained at a mere fraction of the cost overall when figured against the lifetime of a vehicle from just performing "by the book proceedures" as opposed to using additive products and general neglect/disregard for what's printed in your owner's manual. THIS IS FACT. This is proven methodology and one I have my money invested in. I have driven classic automobiles to EXTREME mileage before they succumbed to problems not at all having to do with lubrication. I drove an '84 Oldsmobile Delta 88 the equivalent of several, 'round the equator trips before the block cracked literally in half. All on regular, well timed oil changes and filter changes with *ZERO* additives in the fluids. Show me where it would have not cracked it's block if I used some oil additive.

Third: Getting a little too emotional for my likes. I am sorry if I stepped on a nerve, it was not my intent. But on an emotional note - you're going to find little love for this product here. Of that, I am sorry. There is more, hard, inarguable facts and people's experience that is far too negative to ignore when the Slick-50 beast rises it's head up. So here is your task:

Find ANY and I mean ANY, public information in the public domain that is NOT tied to Slick-50, Penzoil, Quaker State and DuPont or being paid to advertise the product that shows 100% proof that it works as advertised. SHOW me where it has *also* proven to extend engine life beyond that would easily be accomplished with just maintenance alone. Go forth, and please, prove me wrong. I have a nice 4 day weekend to peek in on this from time to time to check in on your progress. Happy hunting - this is going to be a hard turkey to shoot. :icon16:

Edit: Yikes, you know you're tired when you toss grammar out the window. The usual corrections and whatnot. *yawn* Going to call it a night here soon. Happy Turkey Day to everyone!

Newsflash: MSDS on Slick-50, dated in 2002:

http://wd-wpp.com/msds2/000006d4.pdf

I am betting the "Proprietary" contents of 10-15% by volume/weight's P.T.F.E. With neither Slick-50 or DuPont releasing specific, hard as stone facts on how their products actually DO anything for our engines, is it worth the expense for frankly, imagined results? If not for the insoluble P.T.F.E. content mixed in with the main carrier/constituent oil, this product would work better in your *gas tank*. (Don't do this! Your injectors have super-fine "finishing" filters in them that will plug up DEAD if you burn this in the truck's gas)

You wouldn't cut a premium, PAO synthetic oil with an unknown/uncertified oil would you? But this is what happens in essence when you use this particular additive with a fresh batch of Mobil-1. That Mobil-1 would have freed that lifter by itself, and gotten you thousands of more miles out of it's lifetime if you saved the Slick-50 to be burned in your string trimmer. :) All Slick-50 is according to this is...um, oil. Very light oil with a detergent/buffering agent which is needed to prevent the P.T.F.E. from settling out of solution. Which it will when it bonds to other particles flowing in the oil which get logded where again? You oil filter (plugging it up) or embedded in bearings. You have effectivley "cut" the good Mobil-1 oil with...well, paper shredding machine oil with grit in it.

Edit: Wrong link originally - and completely wrong commentary...I am tired...*sigh*

LOL, give it a rest... I already used the stuff and I'm satisfied with the results. I called slick50 and asked them about it and they said their product has never caused any harm to an engine or at least it has never been reported to them. The guy admitted with out me even saying a word they were sued for wrongfully saying their product must be used or a engine will wear out quicker. The man is also sending me several test reports on the product showing no harm will come from the product while being used properly. It took a little talking for him to tell me what the ingredients are in the slick50 and he said there are small trace amounts of P.T.F.E. Which is laced with a anti-clogging chemical that doesn't separate from it's carrier. I totally disagree the additive ruined my synthetic oil as 150z of the product is 80% oil and only 20% is chemicals. I've used products like this for years and my cars always last over 200k with no problems so your arguments are unfounded and there is no scientific evidence stating otherwise. I'm going to cut my oil filter open at my next oil change and examine the effects of this so called snake fluid and did I mention my truck has a new oil pump? It was installed right after I bought my truck and I guess this slick50 is going to destroy it as of right now my truck gets excellent oil pressure. I'm also going to call GM tomorrow and ask them about the product. I know they wont recommend adding anything to your oil or gas, but when I called 3 mechanics and asked them they said it's a safe product and is used in a number of their customers vehicles. My friend has a 2002 blazer which he says he used the stuff in his truck with no problems so until you can tell me the stuff has caused harm to a persons engine instead of these articles that stat the product "May" cause harm to oil screens. I would like to ask if this stuff is so harmful why does a lot of oil filter companies use it in their filters??

I feel as if I'm lead council for pensoil/quakerstate with all these arguments we've been having. I'm glad you folks are so passionate about hating this product. It's weird the leading oil additive on the market today is hated so much and was given a 4.5 out of 5 by the mechanical institute.

Thanks, Rick

Do you know what those chemicals do? Do you know the base formulation of your oil? Can you show me any of thse links I asked for? I did qualify that your information had to come from outside sources, NOT what an additive product company says. If you were so passionate about what you *thought* this product does, you would have come up with links and references online to how this additive chemistry WORKS. I have shown how it doesn't. You have yet to answer any of my questions in a fun, logical debate which ultimately shows - you have no proof.

You can't work on "feel good" fuzzy feeling "I sleep better at night" statements by yourself, or companies pushing the stuff. Do a little research into how lubrication and oil technology works and THEN figure out where Slick-50 fits into the equation. There is a wealth of information on the WWW on how you can become or make yourself an arm-chair tribologist. (I differ in that I have access to specialized hardware that CAN analyze samples) I have done my homework on this. Have you? OR are you still relying on percieved information and the line of tripe from a company pushing product. Remember, their stuff never stinks. Ask your mechanics how many of them actually KNOWS what engine oil does from the moment it's poured in cold to the point when the engine's hot and ripping down the highway. I had a LOT of fun talking and educating my mechanic on the subject and now he commands a premium, well rounded business from the people he supports with hard *knowledge* of oil. His customers under his care have since yet to have any lubrication related issues - and much of his manner now goes completely against what much manufactures and product producing companies "recommend". Ask your technician up in Quaker State how many of them USE and believe in their product and get them to submit that in writing too. I bet you're going to get alot of excuses or finely crafted double-speak.

Anyone that *KNOWS* anything about lubrication wouldn't touch this stuff with a 10 foot cattle prod. I have said my last word on this. Live long in ignorance and in what Quaker State wants you to believe. I am obviously not making any sense to someone who ignores the truth and hears only what they want to hear from people that want him to buy into their junk science. Slick 50 rates up there with "Tesla programmed fuel conditioners". They don't do any harm, but they don't work either - and yet people BUY them. Congrats, you got on their hook and paid $20 for the "right" to do so.

Back to the fold with you and the rest of the sheep...you're ultimately getting fleeced. ;) I am off to go DJ a T-day party and bring dessert. Rock on everyone. :D

Gotta love this forum. Thanks wolf and lt.. I obviously hadn't looked in to slick50 much. I'm getting fed up with this lifter noise though, so I really hope the synthetic change is going to do it for me.

LMAO,!!

Wolfox, you haven't given me any scientific evidence on slick50 all you've done is post links from unfounded sources that the results they post all originate from the same article so therefore there has only been one study done on it. I don't rely on stuff on "WWW" I get out there and I ask people who know and used the stuff not sources you present that heard it from a friend of a friend of a friend. If you have the equipment that can break this stuff down and analyze the chemicals then do it and quit posting rubbish links that prove nothing. I'm arguing with you because your not proving you case you post a link to chemical information that was useless and a waste of my time. I'm glad your done with this post because I'm done with your "Links" because their weak and have no grounds to make me change my mind.

On a side note I want to post a article on Acetone which seems to used here.

"1. Acetone will eat most plastics and synthetic rubbers. I know, I use to work at a plastics factory and one of the tests we use to perform on our plastic was to soak it in acetone to see how the plastic broke down over time ("how" it broke down was very important to QC.) Most seals in your fuel system are made of synthetic rubbers like around your fuel pump and sending unit in your tank, any rubber fuel lines and your seals around you injectors. And lets not even mention that most of the injector's body is made of plastic!.

2. One cars with O2 sensors this is also a very bad idea. For one because the acetone may cause your O2 sensor to send an inaccurate signal to the ECM which can either hurt fuel economy or increase emissions (or both). And second, the O2 sensor is very sensitive to contamination. Once an O2 sensor is contaminated, it stops working all together and the only thing you can do is replace the O2 sensor. This is why they have "street legal" and "off road only" octane boosters. The street legal booster won't contaminate the O2 sensor where the off road only WILL contaminate the O2 sensor!

This is a very bad idea and NO ONE should try it. If you do don't say you weren't warned!"

Here wolfox a link I guess now it has to be true. http://digg.com/mods/Acetone_In_Fuel_Said_to_Increase_Mileage
----------------------
I have many more where that came from if you would like a link done by the chemical institute let me know I'll post.

Cailen,
I've fought so people can decide what products to use in their vehicles and NOT rely on 1 bogus article, but I guess you can't think for yourself :loser: . Go ahead thank wolf I haven't been very helpful here anyway!!

I'm sorry, I said I would not speak on Trick-50 anymore, and I won't. But someone has a chip on their shoulder it seems. You must be a very young fellow. Well, here's another little piece of distaseful information for you...

I have a Blazer that just went 300 miles on half a tank of gas. I must be doing something really, terribly wrong, and just simply do not know what I am talking about. I am sorry for ever opening my mouth on this matter, but - I am not in the business of saving lost minds or souls. The name's Wolfox....not St. Wolfox.

And again, you will find if you opened you mind, ears and eyes, that the concentrations that Acetone was used to test components are far, FAR greater than in the amounts that would be present in fuel to gain maximum benefit. I use acetone, on the order of *thousandths* of the overall volume in my gas tank. Not 50/50 or 100% concentrations the marketing/manufacturing groups are toying around at.

Second, what is Acetone? Do YOU know what acetone is? Aromatic hydrocarbons. Aromatic hydrocarbons constitute...ALL of the total volume of gasoline in your tank, minus the alcohol it is cut with in the winter months. This is like saying, "O2 sensors will become contaminated with gasoline..." Which in fact, in time, they do. ;)

Better go pick a fight elsewhere before someone pokes your eye out with that stick of yours me laddie. ;D

Thank you for proving me right... You are arguing for a product you use as am I.

I guess the people who have done the studies are wrong Acetone!! (Does that sound familar?)

I pick a debate with you not a "fight". if I wanted to fight you I would take a different approach to it. I won't insult you as you've done me because I'm better then you. I respect your opinion as you should respect mine.

In closing I'm glad you decided to come back and post because now I can leave this thread alone knowing you've proven my point!!

Thank you for proving me right... You are arguing for a product you use as am I.

I guess the people who have done the studies are wrong Acetone!! (Does that sound familar?)

I pick a debate with you not a "fight". if I wanted to fight you I would take a different approach to it. I won't insult you as you've done me because I'm better then you. I respect your opinion as you should respect mine.

In closing I'm glad you decided to come back and post because now I can leave this thread alone knowing you've proven my point!!

What point, that you know jack shit and the fact you took the word of some idiot mechanic?

Face it, you know dick all here and all you are being is ignorant and won't listen to good research and better than that, you are telling people to try it based on your 3 day test that doesn't even prove that the Slick50 did it seeing it changed 3 DAYS LATER!!

YEA! FOR SURE IT WAS THE SLICK 50 AND NOT THE SYNTHETIC OIL YOU PUT IN THERE RIGHT?

TOOL.....

BlazerLt,
LMAO good argument.... At least wolfox sounded knowledgeable in his posts, but he to let his temper get the best of him and decided to insult me as you have. Your just mad because your using a product they say destroys your engine... And that idiot mechanic worked for ford for 24yrs...

Tip: You two might want to rethink your arguments as I can find a article on every product on the market stating it does harm to an engine it don't mean shit... I go by what I've seen and people who've tested it. Not by a couple of forum bullies!!!! :rofl: :nono:

BlazerLt,
LMAO good argument.... At least wolfox sounded knowledgeable in his posts, but he to let his temper get the best of him and decided to insult me as you have. Your just mad because your using a product they say destroys your engine... And that idiot mechanic worked for ford for 24yrs...

Yea, and dealer mechanics are the best aren't they. Cream of the crop. You basing your decision to introduce this crap into your good engine based off one mechanic is ridiculous and you know it. Then you think you now have the knowledge to recommend it to people? I don't think so.

Ask your mechanic if he knows what is in the Slick50. I bet you he knows nothing about what it contains and bases his information off of the commercials.

Tip: You two might want to rethink your arguments as I can find a article on every product on the market stating it does harm to an engine it don't mean shit... I go by what I've seen and people who've tested it. Not by a couple of forum bullies!!!! :rofl: :nono:

yea, ok, forum bullies? No, how about people trying to show you what you have done wrong and you being too thick-skulled to realise the screwup you did.

Your arguements are pointless and you have brought up nothing to say we are wrong.

Enjoy the slop in your engine, there is a fool in every crowd.

I just searched google for "Slick50" and I found this site where studies have been done in the U.S and UK and they agree slick50 is good stuff
http://skepdic.com/comments/slickcom.html
Here is one quote I like best:
-----------------------------
Alex Williams
Automotive Switch Engineer


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3 June 2004
Is anyone familiar with the "5 Minute Lie"? It takes 5 minutes to lay out an accusation. It takes weeks, months, and years to disprove it. Sometimes it can never be disproven. Just ask the Republicans. Everyone loves to "dis" on Slick50. I have no financial interest in the product and do not work for the company in any way. I am an independent consumer.

People always ask: Why don't the auto companies require this product?" Well, Geeze Loueeze, wake up and smell the coffee. Anyone ever heard of "planned obsolescence"? The auto industry is in the business of selling cars. They have no interest in seeing cars last twice as long. Why do you THINK they don't endorse a product that makes their engines run longer? Why would they?

So ask a couple other questions: Why do so many other companies market a copy cat? Why does Slick50 offer an engine warranty when using their product? Why has Slick50 lasted so long without being shown to cause "damage"?

As you say "There are about 50 other products on the market which make similar claims, many of them being just duplicate products under different names from the same company." Emulation is the highest compliment. Maybe its just because it makes money - BUT - if Slick50 were causing damage "sometimes" - do you think they would still be around? Not only have they been tested by market forces but others can't wait to get into the deal as well.

As for settling with the FTC I can't really speak for the company, but have you ever been sued by the US Govt? It costs and costs and costs. Settlement doesn't equal admission of wrong. Would Slick50 settle if they weren't making false claims? You bet - to avoid millions of dollars in attorney fees, expert witnesses, independent studies, etc, etc, etc. Of course, the legal system isn't perfect. You CAN be right and still lose - AFTER spending millions on fees and costs. It isn't a perfect world.

In your own words: "The University of Utah Engineering Experiment Station found that after treatment with the PTFE additive the test engine's friction was reduced by 13.1 percent, the output horsepower increased from 5.3 percent to 8.1 percent, and fuel economy improved as well." OK, let's expand THAT part of your whole story, rather than dismiss it lightly. Isn't it amazing that the whole tenor of your article scares consumers away from a product that BY YOUR OWN ADMISSION provides all of the benefits that they advertise? 13% friction reduction is nothing to sneeze at. Obviously engine oil alone is NOT as good. Case closed, no?

-----------------------
Here is a letter by the Slick 50 Vice President Doug Ross who replies on the "Snake Oil" articles out there.
http://www.miata.net/garage/slick50.html
------------------------
I feel really "warm and fuzzy" now.. :)

We are not saying it doesm't make things less slippery, we are saying that PTFE doesn't belong in a combustion engine.

The cons outweigh the pros.

Use a good oil and enjoy your truck.

BlazerLt, good point, Teflon wasn't developed for that purpose, but we've advanced so much by improving upon other companies products.

I would like you to read the link I added to the bottom of my post after u replied.

I appreciate your time and advice, but not the some what severe criticism and hostility towards me, but I understand your passionate about your way of doing things.

without any prrof as to what tests they actually did, that one page does nothing to discredit the information brought forward about the negative traits of teflon in an engine.

I just searched google for "Slick50" and I found this site where studies have been done in the U.S and UK and they agree slick50 is good stuff
http://skepdic.com/comments/slickcom.html
Here is one quote I like best:


Ahhh, a true genius at work here, you picked and chose your snippets, but obviously failed to read the whole article behind this URL where they did cite engine failure when using this product. It choked their oil filter dead closed, and without a block bypass in those engines - oops.


-----------------------
Here is a letter by the Slick 50 Vice President Doug Ross who replies on the "Snake Oil" articles out there.
http://www.miata.net/garage/slick50.html
------------------------
I feel really "warm and fuzzy" now.. :)

For swallowing the tripe from the company's president. Strike two. I asked before, and I ask again, find absolute proof that these products can and do extend engine life and performance far above regular maintenance alone from *independant sources* not affiliated with Slick 50, Quaker State, Pennzoil or organizations/studies sponsored by coporate interest.

You have one more chance before I start showing just how impolite I can be. ;) I do not take kindly to being accused for something I haven't yet done to you yet. I was merely giving you a warning as to my temper and sheer weight of experience and understanding of the matter before I swallow you whole. :evillol:

And no, thank you for proving *my* point. Keep going, you have about 3 yards to go before you feel the noose tighten. Forget my comment on the pointy stick...you're already blinded by your ill-founded faith. Were you always like this, or did you have to pay your $20 first?

Man, that was a great party. Got to hug on some of the honies, joke with the guys - drink my arse off. Luckily the roommate was driving tonight in his freshly re-born Minivan engine. He too sees operation on a single tank of gas for more than a month on a single fill-up, with more power than he ever remembers that minivan ever having before. He gets 35 MPG average on a vehicle EPA rated at 21 MPG highway. When you're finished toying around, I might just crack the safe on the knowledge on how to really unleash the power that's hidden in vehicle engines, fuel efficiency and power - and done for pennies on the dollar for COTS solutions. No tricks, snake-oil, or pricey snake oil trying to pass itself off as legitamate products. I build my power on stuff you can find in almost any store. And when I am not tweaking on my truck or other vehicles friends trust to my care - I am building gas turbines out of throw away parts found in the auto junk yard. My babies will NOT ever run on any of those bogus products, let alone Slick-50. Straight up synthetic lube is simply the best out there to do it with in both of these applications.

Commercial turbines - that is another story altogether. You will certainly see no dicking around there with this sort of thing. And it's not needed, as these materials like Slick-50 and the like *destroy* these sensitive, precision balanced machines. If it was really that good, wouldn't we see it in application elsewhere? Nope, consistantly you see it being taken up by the generally ignorant general public who cannot even fathom what happens the moment you turn the key in the ignition. Present company excluded of course.

Face it - you're just getting in a snit 'cause you were caught out in a mistake. Saving face will cause you to dig deeper and deeper holes and all to my personal delight. So dance on my litle puppet...dance. :rofl:

well said.

I've used slick 50 in my old astro that made it too 425,000kms before I sold it(it still ran), but in all honesty I don't know if I would use it again. GM has an oil supplement that you can use that will correct your ticking lifter for good, and it is a GM endorsed product, so no harm will come out of it if you use it on a regular basis. You can use it with conventional oil or synthetic, and it does a great job. I have used the GM oil supplement as regular maintenance, about every other three oil changes, because it helps keep the engine clean. Also if you want strong(er) crankcase cleaner, use GM's. I don't work for GM, at any dealership, or anything, but I have tested quite a few of different products, cleaning agents and stuff, and I have found GM's products (crankcase cleaner, oil supplement, upper engine cleaner, I think its called Cleens, all work wonders for poorly running engines, and I confident that these cleaners won't really harm my engine, since they are prepared and tested by GM for their products.

Indeed, and true. I have looked into the formulation of GM's cleaning and performance improving products. Following what it says on the label will get you quick and safe results. Not to mention, though pricier that I would like, they do indeed do what they claim to do, and well. The chemistry and formulation in the GM cleaners/silencers is indeed very compatible with all oil chemistries, and based on solid science. Though there is little "in effect" and little chemical difference between some of these products and say, Marvel Mystery oil - at least none of them directly nor indirectly can be linked to any harm being done as long as you follow directions. Anything to excess is quite baneful and you would be surprised how little is needed to actually help an engine along to keeping or obtaining top form.

Regular maintainence with a little more direct action is all that is needed to help an engine up there in mileage to come back to like new strength and efficiency, which is the cornerstone of my argument all along. Once brought in line into regular maintenance, keeping atop of it and switching to a known good synthetic chemistry for your oil's all you really need to keep it in top form. Nowhere in my regimen is there room for additives, especially aftermarket, third party and excessively expensive materials that can't be proven to do much of anything at all. It is unnecissary, and potentially harmful. At least Slick-50 in recent years has reformulated it's products to be less harmful, but now, there is no proof that they do anything at all.

Since 2002, all that's in the bottle is synthetic carrier oil, detergents, buffers and a dose (in less quantity) of P.T.F.E. that *has yet* to be attributed to engine longevity. *Short term* results seems impressive, especially if you were running an outdated oil spec on conventional oil; however, draining the crankcase and dropping in synthetic *alone* nets the same benefit without the patchwork of shady chemistries and untested balance of materials.

Most (note my wording now) additives serve only one purpose:

To move money from your pocket to the pockets of those that would pass off unfounded claims and benefits in a product that they sell. There would be no niche market for this stuff if:

A) People actually took care and maintained their engines.

And lastly :

B) They didn't prey directly on people's desires to "have the best performance".

Slick-50 is a product of social engineering, NOT hard, real science and engineering. They made something in a flashy bottle that *looks* like it is worth the price of the product that *mixes* into oil without immediate, perceivable harm. And indeed, a stout ad pack and a token amount of Ester/PAO synthetic fluid dropped into old oil alone will make the car feel like new and run a few more horses on the dyno - but what happens over time as the already worn oil breaks down beyond the hope of the added product to protect against? People mistakenly think that "special stuff" in the oil percludes any further maintenanc and there is where we really see trouble. ESPECIALLY if they neglect the small print on the bottle where it states to change oil and filter before use. Though sub-5 micon in suspended particulates, these particulates are no longer as easily suspended when the whole package is diluted into oil. If you add more detergents/buffers to counter this? Well, it breaks the host oil down into sludge even FASTER than straight oil alone. Sludge, chunks of insoluble Teflon, etc. begins to percipitate, and being an amalgam of detergents, insolubles and clumpy bits of carbon and crud - plugs filters, passages, bearings...wherever it rests. And due to the polar nature of the synthetic carrier - sticks it right to all the metal it touches when it settles.

It's false hope, all of it. And it quickly comes down like house of cards at the slightest poke.

Now, do you WANT to know what DOES "plate up", coat and protect surfaces with a polar, metallic bond? Moly. Organic Moly...

And what has tons of this material that works safely, and does work to reduce friction through the use of Organic Moly plating?

Just look at my post above where I recommend a recipe for cleaning up and then maintaining an engine. Valvoline may have been a latecomer in the battle for a piece of the additive market, but they went about their chemistry and design *perfectly* in both my experience and opinion. There is little else on this planet with more "bang" or the buck or protection at so little cost that puts everything else to shame and boosts even mediocre organic oil composition up to stellar levels of protection and longevity. Oh, and a good plate of Moly in addition to freely flowing, clean passages makes for *zero* noise and if the engine's healthy.

Wolfox, I read you first response to my links and I really don't have to read anymore to know your full of shit.. Later

P.S I'm surprised you didn't get a mod to delete blazes939 post as it supports my point. No harm will come from using slick50.

Yes, yes... now take your ball and go home. Oh, and for the record, I am a dick. Not a completely flaming asshole. I am happy to let this alone and agree to disagree with you at this point and carry on happily on anything else you wish to discuss. Cool?

:cheers:

Cailen,
I've fought so people can decide what products to use in their vehicles and NOT rely on 1 bogus article, but I guess you can't think for yourself . Go ahead thank wolf I haven't been very helpful here anyway!!

I'd rather rely on someone who's researched the subject than someone who put two things in his truck at once and decided "oh it must have been the slick50". Like LT said... "tool".

My point was that I'm going to ACTUALLY test the effects of switching over to synthetic before I dump some $20 crap in my oil that is so hotly contested. Frankly I don't even care how well the shit works anymore because my truck is for work. If I even hear whispers of something potentially doing harm to something that makes my bread and roof possible, there's no damn way its going in my baby. You see.. I'm a man who, unlike you (obviously), requires hard evidence rather than heresay and what you might call a "test" (3 days running synthetic is a joke buddy) to jump on the bandwagon and suck the proverbial slick50 dick.

My favorite part was when you said *I* couldn't think for myself...

wolfox, Yes, I'd like that if there are no hard feeling because there are none here. I was wondering if you could give me some advice on my new car :yugosmili?

Thanks, Rick
P.S Cailen, you have really added some very credible information there. I guess I was wrong.. (Wink)

Yes, have that Yugo crushed into a cube. They function better as coffee tables than vehicles. That or buy two more. One to drive, and the other two to yank parts from to keep the one running. I hear that they can be made into great flower planters that move around the yard. Oh, and the best accessory you can get on one of those is to get a rear-window defroster. So your hands stay warm when you push it in winter. :D For a quick 20 Horsepower boost you can wind the rubber band a little tighter than usual in the morning. :rofl:

Okay, kidding aside, do you actually have a new car?

I was made a very attractive offer on my 96 blazer and I'm thinking about selling it and going with a 2002, but I can't make up my mind because I put over 2k in my truck with all the repairs and upgrades I've done to it.. If I do decide to see it I might do the unthinkable and go with a 2003 Explorer.

Your best bet there would be to hop on over to http://www.cars.com

Once there, click on "research a car" and compare. They have some reviews and overall reliability of the vehicles over time reports and the like. I picked up the Blazer I got now after researching a few candidates when my Isuzu blew the hell up in my face after getting it 2 months from the dealer.

My choices were a Nissan Sentra 2.2 SE, A Subaru Legacy 2nd Gen wagon with a turbo, and the Blue Blazer I have now. Though the Blazer had lower overall reliability and value retention rates, I got the truck. I actually needed to haul crap and go off-road with it to reach some of the areas I hang out and work in As far as the slightly lower reliability rate? C'mon, it's a GM - the pull-yards and parts counters all over the world have access to the materials to keep them running. And being a young buck when I got my first vehicle (It being a GM) the territory is one that I am intimately familiar with. GM still gets my recommendation because of these facts, and they are relatively easier to work on and maintain. They run just as long or longer as the imports if you keep after them, but they are nowhere near as "maintainence free" as some foreign vehicles can be. I like working and tweaking on my ride anyway, makes it more....mine in a way. But to each their own. Good luck!

So then you agree I should dump my blazer while I still can?? I never thought I would have a big debate about what I put in my truck then be selling it that same week.. lol My truck runs great that's why I don't know if I should let it go for a truck that is going to have problems. You know when you get a truck it's rough and you have to put in some mods and tweaks here and there until the truck is you?? Well, that is how I have my truck right now, but I like what the 2002 blazer and 2003 explorer has to offer.

I am not agreeing to dumping the truck. Hell if it still runs and gets reasonable economy, I hold onto my vehicles until they ae driven so far into the dirt that they no longer move. It's less expensive sometimes to just keep fixing the minor troubles and getting at least another year out of a vehicle than to get into debt over financing, IMO. But the general rule of thumb I subcribe to is this:

If a given repair or series of repairs will cost me more than half of the current blue-book value of a vehicle, I will start shopping for another used project vehicle. It's cheap as hell to buy used (in decent shape) and fix it up, and keep fixing as needed to keep it rolling. I hate to be in debt to anyone, so I go about matters like that. Oh, and offering cash usually helps to get your vehicle in your hands quickly and for less money than if you financed. The SUbaru I was considering had a sticker price of $9.800, used, but factory and Subaru certified. I offered $6,000 cash on the spot for it and they agreed that if I gave them the money that day, I could drive away in that car, paid.

If you do not have that kind of bankroll, then try this approach instead:

Fix and keep the current truck and keep it running right until you can save back a nestegg of cash to outrightly purchase a vehicle. Divide the cash you have saved in half and save that half. Use the other half to puchase a vehicle. Once you get it home, use the other half to pay for your registration, sales tax, plates, etc. and to immediately take care of all of the maintenance parts, tune-up parts, all fluids flushed and changed and fix the minor little things that will eventually annoy the snot out of you. (Like broken power window and lock switches, crummy radio, that missing piece of trim or stone-chipped windshield glass and dry-rotted tires with bulging sidewalls, weak batteries, etc...)

P.S Cailen, you have really added some very credible information there

I'm glad you could take something useful from my post, but what I'M really looking forward to are the facts that will be provided by a genuine, controlled, non-half-assed test.

As far as your truck goes, I would go with your instinct. One of the reasons I did my lower manifold was so I could get a feel for what I really had. Now I know I have a truck that's going to last me a couple years. Think investment. Sure, on any vehicle you're going to have gas and maintenance costs, but think of the depreciation too. You're going to lose more money by buying a 2002 than keeping yours for a few more years.