Why oh why

Are Enzo detail kits so expensive??

I'm feeling a bit sad after checking prices...no detail kits for me :crying:

Shoot...I'll be lucky if I can budget the CF decals!

All good stuff costs money. Fact of life.

Forget the detail kits. The Tamiya Enzo is the very last kit to ever need a detail set. There's not much that can be added to it- all it needs is paint.

There's not much that can be added to it- all it needs is paint.

Respectfully, I disagree.

Hmmmm maybe you're not lookin' in the right places . . . Sure, SMS's and Studio27 detail sets are astronomical but, there are a few other nice detail set out there that can be had reasonably . . .

I picked a few up here and there all for under 20 bucks . . .

Check out Ebay . . there's usually some on there too. .

MPWR - aren't you the guy who makes his own detail kits? That's why you don't want to buy one :naughty: j/k

I've got 2 Enzos in my stash together with the SMS detail kit and the Studio 27 PE set. And while I've not made one yet (which rather limits my right to have an opinion on the subject :smokin:) I have opened the boxes sooooo many times it's almost a joke.

I've got to say that I think that although the basic kit is awesomely detailed and for sure would look great OOB. It will just look "even better" (and maybe offer a more interesting build process) with those metal shocks, PE meshes etc etc. added.

Of course at $125 per pop, the SMS kit is damned expensive and it's "value" is going to be relative to the modeler but the Studio 27 kit is much more accessible at around $15 and easier to "justify".

None the less I agree with your basic premise that the Tamiya Enzo doesn't "need" a detail kit to look good if it is well built.

my :2cents:

All good stuff costs money. Fact of life.
Amen ! :D

agreed, but I LOVE details... so I would say, the more detail the better!! :D

That's my :2cents:

S27's PE set is $12 at www.best1hobby.com, so I think that's acceptable for me (and also that's how I'm making one of my Tamiya Enzo kit). The others (SMS and Acu-Stion) are kind of too much for the level of details the Tamiya kit already has.

OK, I guess I may be in the minority here, but let's take a look at what S27 gives you:

http://www.hlj.com/images/s27/s27fp2464.jpg http://www.hobbyeasy.com/esupplier/images/HOBBY1234/S27FP2464.jpg
(I included two images so that hopefully at least one would work with everyone's firewalls. If not, view the set here (http://www.hlj.com/product/S27FP2464).)

1. A bunch of grilles- Don't need them. Tamiya has already inlcuded nylon mesh in the kit, which will look just as good. Besides, based on my experience with S27, they're not going to fit anyway!

http://img438.imageshack.us/img438/7217/11313671wv.jpg

These are the intercoolers for my F40, and one of the grille overlays S27 thoughtfully includes in their 'upgrade' set. Note the impeccible quality of S27's fit. If you really don't think that Tamiya's nylon mesh will do the trick, get a sheet of K&S PE brass mesh for $10 at your local model railroad hobby shop. Cut it to shape with the patterns Tamiya already includes with the Enzo kit. Use the rest for the next five models you build.

2. Ferrari logos/emblems- Don't need them. The ones Tamiya included with the kit are superior.

3. Brake disk overlays- Don't need them. The Enzo has carbon disks, not steel, so a shiney chrome looking part is incorrect. the color you want is dark flat gunmetal. Besides, the kit parts are the very best brakes I've ever seen in injection molded plastic. Just paint them, and add a wash, and they will look spectacular.

4. Taillight reflectors and mirrors- Don't need them. The ones Tamiya included with the kit are superior.

5. Pedals- The kit parts painted up will look as good or better.

6. Windshield wiper- I've never been able to get one of S27's windshield wipers to look like anything other than a bent piece of photoetched metal- besides, they hardly fit. The kit part isn't spectacular, but between the two, I'd probably use the kit part.

Did I miss anything?

So tell me, what in this 'upgrade' will actually add anything to the kit? If you're modeling skills are up to it, just painting the kit parts will look better than PE replacements. If you're modeling skills aren't up to it, PE is not going to help you much.

Sure, if you want to shell out for the SMS set there are some nice goodies in it. I can't seem to get myself to pay more than double the price of the kit itself for a detail set. If I ever do manage to spend this much for aftermarket parts, it's not going to be on a kit that needs as little help as this one. On the other hand, their walk around photo CD is awesome.

What this kit needs are some scratch built rear dampers, and maybe some radiator and oil cooler lines- and you can add these for much less than the cost of a PE set.

Please, don't compare SMS with S27 !!!

Please, don't compare SMS with S27 !!!

I agree, S27 and Acu-Stion are making junk lately. Not worth buying. SMS on the other hand, while not perfect, is a LOT better product.

But for $10-12 S27 is actually not bad. P/E mesh grilles are usually much easier to work with - they won't flex and bend during assembly, and easier to glue to the model than Tamiya mesh. I agree that they are not superior in appearance to Tamiya mesh, but some of the mesh pieces are almost impossible to replicate with Tamiya (flexible) mesh, such as front fender vents, and rear gearbox mesh. S27 parts are not the best here though - Sakatsu set is wonderful.

Brake disk overlays are actually very nice thing to have - its easier to paint plastic part black, and then paint P/E part in correct carbon color, and then just glue P/E parts over palstic parts and detail paint and wash . Holes in P/E parts are also make brakes look more realistic. But I agree, with carefull drilling and detail painting you can make kit parts look just as nice - but it takes TIME! Just as with mesh above, its just easier and faster.

Photoetched wiper combined with plastic part will actually make a nice wiper. Pedals are also look much nicer when made from thin, drilled out metal, than plastic. Same for the passenger kick-board - looks a lot better than decal or paint. And again, its not that you can't make plastic part look good - its easier and faster to use P/E.

Finally, if you place kit decals over 3D P/E Scuderia shields and Ferrari emblem and soak them with setting solution, and then clearcoat heavily, they look amazingly real. Much better than just decals! Same thing with the third stop-light.

All I'm trying to say here is that even though Tamiya kit doesn't really NEED P/E set, for al lthe above reasons, the price of $12-15 for S27 set is more than justified.

SMS set is MUCH superior, and I highly recommend buying at least $35 P/E set. My .02 cents.

I'm hearing nothing but bad about S27 and to a degree Acustion. Still the enzo is a really good kit, and my painting skills are most certainly one of my strong areas.. Well, I think they are.. So spending like £100 + on detail upgrades for a kit that is superb already isn't a good idea for me. Might buy new shocks or something and the SMS P/E does look nice, did fancy the brakes, but MPRW is actually right.

Now, I'm planning to build a Revell Ferrari 2003 GA. And I've already got SMS detail sets as the brakes from the SMS set are most certainly needed, CF Decals, replacement decals with missing names and sponsers etc and a second kit just in case I need to kit bash as this is a kit that needs help for sure.

I have to agree with MPRW detail sets are not sometimes needed for already good kits. 360 spider has built stunning enzo's, and with detail kits from SMS etc they are stunning however the cost of these builds must have been high to only replace what was already in the kit - at a already good level of detail in plastic.

I do not like P/E badges all to much. I cheat with them, and use them with the kit decal to just give a 3d depth. And PE number plates are of no use, I'd rather use the kit decal TBH. The enzo kit is stunning out of the box, save your money and buy detail up sets for models that need them.

Fujimi 550 or 575 spring to mind, as does Revell 2003 GA or Revell Corvette C5R etc... these kits need more help, whereas Tamiya 360, Enzo and even Porsche GT do not need aftermarket parts to make them look good. They do enrich the build, but not required.

Edit - Just noted 360 spide replied, and mentioned using the Pe badges with the decal. I thought I was cheating...!! But if the master does it, then it's all good..!!!!

Grrr....

It's MPWR- as in

http://www.bmw2002.co.uk/MEngine.jpg

:rolleyes:

I've seen kit decals placed over the etched emblems, and seen it look good (if you can eliminate the silver edge that sometimes results from doing this)- but the vast majority of auto maker emblems these days (including Ferrari's) are flat, and don't actually have any depth to them.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d1/RL_1958_Ferrari_250_Testa_Rossa_Scuderia.jpg

Kit decals alone are more accurate.

but the vast majority of auto maker emblems these days (including Ferrari's) are flat, and don't actually have any depth to them.
Kit decals alone are more accurate.

Not on Enzo, and not if you order Scaglietti Scuderia Shields option:

http://ferraris-online.com/cars/FE-ENZO-134282/images/P026Web.jpg

Decals are correct for early Modenas and pre-2002 Ferraris.

Eek..!! Sorry I’m a little dyslexic, and misread words sometimes and also type them in wrong a lot of the time. I use a lot of computer generated spelling etc to help me. I’m typing this right now in MS word with software that highlights potential mix up of letters in words.

I know its MPower and MPWR – sorry no offence intended.

As for the decals over PE badges. Perhaps you're right, but it still looks cool if done correctly. I think what you are saying is that the upgrades for the enzo are TBH a waste of money, or not all of the upgrades are needed. See your point, and were S27 P/E upgrades ever any good?

I used the S27 set on my white Enzo for the Mesh only and was quite pleased with it. They fit well and look better than the nylon mesh in the kit I think.

mickbench- No worries! I'm really not much of a typist either. I don't know if S27 was ever any better, or if some sets are appreciably better than others. I've really only used two, but have been pretty disappointed with both. The others I've seen also tend to be cluttered with completely unnecissary stuff.

CADguy- Nice to know that the mesh screens fit your build. I'd pretty well most faith in S27's ability to do that.

360spider- All right, you got me there. And they do look pretty sharp- especially on black. So a bit of silver on the edges would be correct after all.

Btw, Model Factory Hiro recently released very nice Scuderia Shields and Emblems stickers - yes, stickers. They are really thick (almost half a mm), and have thick clearcoat on them, which makes decal underneath look 3D - set costs $5 and its really, really nice! Not a very good picture here: http://www.hlj.com/product/MFHE800

As for Studio 27 - many years ago their P/E stiff was about the only game in town - P/E sets were rare, and S27 was the only company that made them for the cars I wanted to build. And the quality was simply outstanding! I still think of S27 as a benchmark, even though they are not anymore! Acu-Stion stuff was also good in the beginning, but then they started commercializing, releasing a ton of stupid Ferrari (and other's) P/E sets that don't fit. S27 tried to do the same, and quality started to suffer...I still prefer S27 P/E to many others though... They just released P/E sets for 550 and 575 Maranellos, and also for 365 GTB/4 Daytona Spyder and 288 GTO Enthusiast kits - again - for $15 a piece - you can't go wrong.

Anyone want to buy my useless SMS super detail kit?

No serious offer refused :))

Gents, everyone is right but somehow I think an important part of the "value" equation is always gets dropped in these kind of discussions - subjectivity.

Value is subjective just as is what gives you a buzz in your hobby.

Objectively, I know that 125$ for that SMS kit is a bit mad (espescially in my hands! :) ), but subjectively I am sooo looking forward to the challenge of playing with it.

My longer standing hobby of watches is a good example - even my best friends can't understand why I would want the equivalent price of a small car on my wrist when a Timex/swatch will tell me the time. Why? I appreciate the effort, skill and precision that went into it.

Btw, Model Factory Hiro recently released very nice Scuderia Shields and Emblems stickers - yes, stickers. They are really thick (almost half a mm), and have thick clearcoat on them, which makes decal underneath look 3D - set costs $5 and its really, really nice! Not a very good picture here: http://www.hlj.com/product/MFHE800



They look great... And you say they are sticky back, Do they hold forever more, or fall off as sticky back items tend to loose grip over time and peel off..

Still look really nice. Might order a set anyhow as I got a few ferrari models to build..

Anyone want to buy my useless SMS super detail kit?

No serious offer refused :))

Gents, everyone is right but somehow I think an important part of the "value" equation is always gets dropped in these kind of discussions - subjectivity.

Value is subjective just as is what gives you a buzz in your hobby.

Objectively, I know that 125$ for that SMS kit is a bit mad (espescially in my hands! :) ), but subjectively I am sooo looking forward to the challenge of playing with it.

My longer standing hobby of watches is a good example - even my best friends can't understand why I would want the equivalent price of a small car on my wrist when a Timex/swatch will tell me the time. Why? I appreciate the effort, skill and precision that went into it.

I think I know where you are coming from with that statement.. Basically if you love doing something or just like taking part or whatever no price is too high..

As the old saying goes -

"it's only worth what someone is willing to pay for it".

Heh, I forgot about this thread. I have absolute faith in my detail painting skills, I was just looking around (trying to find TS8 and CF decals, actually) and saw the price on the kits...they shocked me! I love the way the suspension parts look though *drool*