Why is TS-13 (clear) so bad?

Howdy all,

I've noticed a lot of people over past months shy away from TS-13 (Tamiya lacquer clear), or recommend against it, etc, etc. It seems most find it hard to use, or low quality, or something like that... I'm not quite sure.

Having just bought some which I plan to decant, I just thought I'd ask... what exactly is the problem with TS-13?


Captain Mark

The gripes I've seen are that it eats decals (which any non-acryl clear does if you're not careful) and that it comes in a spray can (which can net bad results if you're not careful). Moral of the story: It's good if you're careful.

I've used all kinds of clear like Tamiya TS-13, Gunze Mr. Spray (lacquer), Gunze Top Coat (water base acrylic), Testor Gross Clear, Dupli Color Clear, and none of them have given me any problem. Now, I'm using TS13 almost exclusively (almost, I occasionally use urethane clear). Just follow common precautions discussed often like build a protective layer with a few mist coat, then apply additional thin coats. Don't wet coat until you know the knack of how much wet coat you can add on a dried paint. It just takes some practice.

I've never had any problems with it either.....and I've clear coated over lots of decals!

All good and interesting comments.
I guess I'll just use the same techniques I have been, and take what tips I can. Shooting it through my airbrush I'm sure it'll be fine... (famous last words)

I've had TS13 dissolve paint on my finished body and pull it out of teh panel lines but that was BEFORE I read all the advice here about starting with light mist coats etc. etc.

The "horror" stories are true if you are not careful. Be cautious and you should be OK :)

I had problem in past with TS13 on decals (only white decals kind) and some melted paint, also with 2/3 mistcoat and after wetcoat(may be havy:evillol:): it's really important to do mist coat before but also let the laquer cure for some hours behind layers. Also I not do like wetcoat just now, little less then wet, this probably give me more orange peel to rub down but it's absolutly safe for decals

to stop the destruction of decals, could you brush some X-22 clear over them first? anyone tried this before? i got a couple of LeMans cars to do, and don't fancy wreckin the shells after spending ages on the chassis/engine!

matt

I've used TS-13 a few times, however the first time I used it I didn't read up on it and applied it too wet after the first few mist coats. It promptly melted the mica base coat, panel lines appeared white and looked a mess.

Second time I used it on a TS-17 silver paintjob I applied 5 mists before I applied a slighty heavy coat and then two final wet coats. What a mess around, but it worked.

I used Automotive clear once on my 300ZX and it was the hardest drying clear I've ever applied, however even though it was hard to notice, I had a small section where a mold line ghosted. Too hot, but it didn't melt the base coat as I used automotive paint for the whole process.

With X22 it was easy to apply, really does gloss up after about 6 coats and does polish out after around 14 days of going hard. TS-13 takes around 7 days to go hard. Automotive clear takes like 2 hours..!! Well OK more like a day.

It's a mix n match thing I think. X22 Acrylic is easy to airbrush and is good over decals, TS-13 is good if no decals are being overcoated or used with caution if decals are being cleared. Automotive clear is good if you are in a hurry, and enamal clear is perhaps best avoided if you want to polish the the paintjob out this year..

In a nutshell, I shy away from TS-13 is decals are being cleared, otherwise I do use it but very carefully. And if I want super fast drying times, automotive clear all the way.

To sumarise, TS-13 can be bad becuasue it is a hot paint with strong solvents that can eat into underlying paint and decals. However, if used cautiously it is just about the best clear coat there is IMHO.

I wouldn't recommend aplying TS-13 over X-22 clear. Careless mixing of laquers, acrylic and enamels can also lead to heartache.

'i ve only hade a bad reaction with TS 13 and that was the first time i used and I sprayed a heavy coat(and i really mean HEAVY) over the colour (also tamiya spray can) it dissolved the paint a littl and wormed those spidery crinkels.. since then i spray some mist coats and then wet coats.. all in 1 day and i never had problems of that kind. Some times it dries rather matt, but thats is easy to polish out.

TS-13 is a tricky paint. As said it's hot and can melt the base coat underneath. But the times I've used it has never given a matt finish, but it does polish out nicely. It is worth noting that the recommendation towards using TS-13 over TS sprays is either start to apply the clear coats within an hour of the last colour coat, or wait 30 days. I feel 30 days is all a little exccessive, so spray TS-13 after my last wet colour coat about 45 mins afterwards.

Normally wait about 7 days for TS-13 to harden then polish it out with Tamiya Compounds. Always buffs out nicely, but then so does Acrylic X22. Just takes twice as long to harden off, so I wait 14 days sometimes longer before I buff X22 out.

I think its all a case of use what you feel comfortable with. I don't feel comfortable with applying a hot laquer to decals, as it's a risk and it could destroy them so I use Acrylic, whereas if I haven't go any decals to worry about go with TS-13.

Brush painting X22 over decals has been done, one member on here applied X22 clear with a large flat brush over decals, and it looked airbrush as clear can sometimes dry nicely if brush painted, but I prefer the thinner coats of airbrushing. And I really wouldn't apply TS-13 over any arcylic paints, as this is just asking for problems.

to stop the destruction of decals, could you brush some X-22 clear over them first? anyone tried this before? i got a couple of LeMans cars to do, and don't fancy wreckin the shells after spending ages on the chassis/engine!

matt

believe: just a couple of mistcoat and then 3/4 thin coats, little less then wet, try before on a waste model for practice. After that you can polish for a great shine.

I've had no issues using TS-13 clear. in fact. its all I use.

This one has a Tamiya base, cheap aftermarket decals, and then Tamiya Clear. and it worked out great.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v211/gasman03/FinishedJack21.jpg

and this one has Mr. Serfacer primer, Model Master new laquer color, and Tamiya clear. and its one of the best paintjobs i've ever done.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v211/gasman03/S5300003.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v211/gasman03/FinishedJack21.jpg


Is it supposed to 07 or the 20 is on the wrong side ? :icon16:

Is it supposed to 07 or the 20 is on the wrong side ? :icon16:
:crying::crying: they replace the old truck with those:screwy:

its right,

http://www.jayski.com/schemes/2005/cup/07jd-daytona.jpg

Be careful if you use it even after Tamiya sprays. I had a beautiful TS-58 shine which I let dry for about 1 day before hitting it with clear. Big mistake. I had massive crazing from dissimilar drying rates. Best bet is to wait at least a week.

Is it supposed to 07 or the 20 is on the wrong side ? :icon16:

Jack Daniels = Old No. 7!!

Be careful if you use it even after Tamiya sprays. I had a beautiful TS-58 shine which I let dry for about 1 day before hitting it with clear. Big mistake. I had massive crazing from dissimilar drying rates. Best bet is to wait at least a week.

Mark hit the second nail on the head. Aside from the possibility of melted decals (test on a decal from the sheet, which you aren't going to use), you MUST spray the TS-13 an hour or so AFTER the wet coat of the body color, or wait at least 1 month (just to be safe). The reason is crazing (as described above) due to dissimilar contraction and gass-out rates.

hth,
Bill

well. a month isn't realy necesary in my exerience. Just let you"re wetcoat of you're color dry in a warm enviroment (20° is enough) and i think 2 weeks will be sufficient