Another power struggle!!

Help me out guys, in my ongoing research and everlasting quest for more power, I have started to waiver on my future goals.

Some of you may know, that for some time now I have been set on simply boosting my D16y8, and converting it to manual transmission. However, Im not sure now, and I am wondering if I would be better served giving in to the swappers. So, I have come to ask for your help...BUT WAIT!!!!!!!! Before you fly in here giving me suggestions of what engines to plop in, let me set out some guidelines here.

1.) I am working with a $5000 budget, and it is solely dedicated to things that make me faster.
1b.) If I stick with the D16 an automatic $1000 comes out of my budget for an auto to manual swap. (That dollar amount is my number, just humor me and go with it.)

2.) I refuse to do any frankenstien swaps, thats just my personal preference and I simply dont trust them.

3.) Give me examples, I want prices on swaps and the year of engine I would be getting. Id rather not buy an engine that is 10 years old, and ideally I would be getting an engine the same year as my car 2000.

4.) Back up the suggestion with results, what 1/4 mile times, dyno numbers, etc.

5.) My endless research brings these results from a GReddy turbo D16:
GReddy turbo on stock engine 6psi: 14.63 sec. 1/4 mile
GReddy turbo on stock engine 10psi: 14.28 sec. 1/4 mile
I believe all the necessary fuel management items and intercooler
can be had for about 4000 if not less.

So, give me your best shot guys, convince me just to swap. :D

h22!
it should be about 100lbs more weight than a b18 ....
that shouldn't be that bad... think about all those people with 100 lbs stereos..

b18c1 or a b18c5. check www.hondamotorsonline.com

I'll itemize my list of parts I had to buy for my swap. The price of the engine alone is not all you'll need. Expect to pay upwards of $500 for extra parts/sensors etc. Nothing worse then getting half way through the swap and not being able to finish it cause you have no more money.

Here's all I can think of right now off the top of my head.

JDM B18C - $3550 shipped
ACT HDSS Clutch - $400
Clutchmasters flywheel - $295
DC Sports 4-1 Header - $280
Apexi WS exhaust - $415
Del Sol AC bracket - $150
New IAT and IAC sensors - $75
Shift linkage bushing - $15
Oil, MTF, Antifreeze, PS fluid, misc hoses, connectors etc. - $50
Labor: $40, I had to take my friends out to dinner

Total ~ $5270 give or take a couple hundred bucks.

I ran the 1/8 mile at 9.51. Will run 1/4 this Sunday, and expecting at least 14.5. Engine has a lot of potential though. CTR cams, pistons, turbo or whatever route you choose etc. You turbo a SOHC, run 14.2, thats it. You'll have to build the bottom end more, stronger rods, etc for more boost to make it faster. I hate D series, especially trannies. They're weak. 2nd gear grind sucks. Others will say otherwise, thats their choice.

Turbo is also more maintenance than just an engine with I/H/E. And it goes without saying more wear on the engine as well. Just a couple things to think about.

You can always go the route of a B16. They'll cost about $2500. I thought about it, then realized no because it has about the same torque as your stock EX and I wanted the "only 10 extra horsepower." Plus the fact the B18C1 has more potential sold me on it.

My friend paid $1500 to get his auto-to-manual swap in his Integra.

That's all I can think about right now. I'll add more lately maybe if need be.

CivicEx95, thanks for the details. I actually am mainly considering the GS-R engine if I do eventually swap. I half expected better times than just 14.5, but I understand you are only guessing at this point. Like I said, the SOHC has shown to run 14's on even the stock 6psi, which is looking pretty impressive. I know to get much lower than high 13's and still have an engine that isn't blown, Ill have to build it up some. I am just trying to assess what route is going to get me the most bang for my 5 grand. Right now, by your figures it seems over budget, but not by much. You are right about the reliability factor as well, you can't beat a good old stock Honda engine.

14.5 - Remember, this is in a 2300+ lb. EX coupe. CX hatchbacks weigh about 2000, so expect low 14s from those. I'm buying a camcorder friday and running the same night. I'll post some videos ASAP.

You also don't have to buy a header, exhaust or anything else like that. That'll put you under 5k. But replace anything else internal to the engine. It's a lot easier to do it when the engine is out then already in the car.

a 2000 b18c1 is going to cost a good bit more than the regular old 8 year old JDM b18c. If you ask me, it's worth getting a USDM engine over a JDM one. If I remember correctly, you have an EX. With a b18c1 swap, you looking at about a 14.9-15.1 quarter mile time. Doesn't sound too good, but there is much room for improvement, even with just bolt-ons. I personally like the b18c1, but I don't have the extra money to spend on it. I opted for the b16a2. I'm going to spend the extra money that I have on a quality header and cat back exhaust. The header I'm looking at is about $700. I'm probably going to get a 2.5" carsound cat and a 2.5" catback. I already have an ARC Intake box. I'm going to be building the motor when I get my new position (and twice the money I was making before:eek: ) at work. I'm just aiming for a 13.99 built all motor(stock bore, no millwork), 96 EX Coupe. I should have the motor in by July or so at the latest. I come down to Chicago fairly often so if you want to meet up (maybe HIN?) or something to check it out and drive it, whatever. Plus, I could finally meet you and perhaps Xivera if that cac would be interested:finger:

I'm putting the d16y8 in the CX hatchback and then I'm selling it. I've decided to rock the heavy ass EX coupe from now on and no more selling or buying so-so cars. That and I love the sunroof:D .

I know the B18 has room for improvement, tons more than the D16 certainly. The thing is, my wallet may not have room for improvement. I am stopping at the $5000 mark, and after that I may not touch anything else on the car, or perhaps start saving for a used S2000. So you see what I mean here, what is going to get me the best bang for the buck with $5000 and stops there.

About meeting up, I would definitely like to man, Ive seen you on PH for a while now and its always talked about but never done. HIN sounds good, but we gotta be a bit more organized I think. By the way, how much are you selling the hatch for? I assume it is manual transmission right?

Originally posted by piscorpio
I know the B18 has room for improvement, tons more than the D16 certainly. The thing is, my wallet may not have room for improvement. I am stopping at the $5000 mark, and after that I may not touch anything else on the car, or perhaps start saving for a used S2000. So you see what I mean here, what is going to get me the best bang for the buck with $5000 and stops there.

About meeting up, I would definitely like to man, Ive seen you on PH for a while now and its always talked about but never done. HIN sounds good, but we gotta be a bit more organized I think. By the way, how much are you selling the hatch for? I assume it is manual transmission right?

yep, it's a five speed....I might not sell it though, if I can't handle the $70 a month payments:rolleyes: :D

HIN sounds good to me....I'm not really into the show scene but I don't mind checking out others' hard work. I am definetly able to go so we should do it if your available.

Also have a few questions about swapping engines and pretty new to this. Have a stock Ex except for an intake and some wheels/tires. On that Hondamotors online, shows USDM also, do you just tell them you want an engine from here and how do you tell once you have it.

I've heard that when you replace the engine it is suppose to be newer than the one you replaced it with. Again how can you tell what year the engine is and on that site do you tell them the year you want.

Live in Houston and as of May 1st they have inacted stricter smog laws because we are one of the smoggiest cities. Was wondering if there would be any problems faced with passing this down the road when i have to renew.

Also once you have swapped and have the car for how ever long you want it, what do you do with it when you want a new car? Can't really trade it in and taking the engine back out and selling it on ebay or something like one does with bolt-ons parts is very unlikely. Would really like to have my car for a long time, mod it throughout that time but also am thinking of getting a new Ram, so thats why i ask the question. Thanks for any information and if i asked something stupid sorry in advance.

i personally am going to get a b18b (cheap i here, cos they arent super poerful). i want to get one cos its cheap, good for turbo, has more torque than most honda engines, and i can swap on a vtec head to create a frankenstien (frankenstien 0wns j00!) as for the automatic, sell it and buy a new car !!

Hmm, Im starting to think sticking with my d16 is best. (Im stubborn and tough to convince I guess.)

The thing is, Im not super power hungry. I don't race, so I only need so much speed, that is why I am pretty convinced I would stop at the 5000 dollar mark. So when all is said and done, it seems to me, at least right now, that for 5000, a properly done turbocharged d16 will get me the most speed? How much do H22's run, and how fast will they get me? Im pretty sure a B18c5 is out of the question, the engine alone is already $5000 if not more.

As for selling the car, its not an option right now, Im too attached to it and Ive already done some suspension work on it.

If your giong to go turbo, I am going to suggest a transmission swap. It's not a very difficult thing to do if you have the correct parts. The transmission itself should cost no more than $300. The rest of the parts are probably about $100 or so. It just takes a little time and elbow grease. Then you can get a good turbo setup, maybe a used drag 3 kit or a new greddy kit with a slightly larger turbo. In total, you could probably run low low 13s and probably dip into the 12s on slicks for $5000 (including the trans swap, probably a stage 2/3 clutch, and a lightened flywheel).

If you want to do the H22a, it will cost about $3500-4000. That will easily get you into the mid 13s. You would want to upgrade to a bigger rear sway and probably a larger front sway. I would go about 23mm rear with the Beaks SRK and a 24mm front to up the front rates to handle the extra 80lbs from the H series. It would also be a good idea to relocate your battery to your trunk to lessen the weight effect of the H22 and even the weight distribution. It would be a fun car to drive, but not the best setup for the twistie. Although it is possible for it to handle well, you will be able to tell the difference.

If you ask me, wait around for a b18c1. I love turbo and I love the torque of the 2.2, but the b18c1 is a great motor. Search on www.car-part.com for b18c1 in your area, you should be able to find one relatively cheap in upper IL. Probably looking at $3000 and the cost of renting a uhaul to pick up the engine. Or if you know someone with a truck and trailor, bonus.

Yep, keeping the automatic is not an option for any scenario I am working with here, so Im definitely taking that advice. Im hoping I can get everything necessary for just 400 bucks, then I think it would be an easier decision. I was thinking a thousand would be closer to what Id spend. As far as swap candidates go, I think the H22 is a bit too much, and I really do want to keep my handling as crisp as possible. The B16 is just not enough of an upgrade to me, to be worthwhile. So right now, B18c1 or turbo d16 with tranny swap, thats what Im lookin' at right now. I think I need to ride in the actual cars with these setups.