cooling system problem

my problem began with my 93 grand am low coolant light came on. i filled it and it kept sucking up more water each day. i noticed i had water getting into the oil. at first i assumed head gasket, but i've read some about this lower intake manifold problem causing water leakage. today i also noticed water has started dripping from the motor somewhere(i can't tell exactly where from). any ideas... and would the lower intake manifold cause water in the oil AND dripping under the car??? any help is much appreciated.

welcome to the forum matt. It deffinately sounds like you have the notorious Lower Intake Manifold issue. Yes, the LIM would cause both of what you described. If you don't get it fixed very soon, the coolant can eat through your engine bearings. I wouldn't reccomend driving the vehicle unless absolutely neccesary until you have the problem resolved.

thanks for your quick reply, is this a really hard job(i have some experience ) and do i only need to replace a gasket or two. also is there any way to verify that Lower intake gasket is definately the cause

Welcome Mattpiper. It does sound like the LIM gasket. they also leak under the throttle body on the intake where u use a rubber gasket. It's a 6-8hr job by GM books. You have to take all the stuff that connects to the intake, and the engine top pretty much. its not a Hard job just requires alot of remembering and or a manual. they booth should be replaced, since ur already in there. Hell i even changed my head gaskets the last time I changed mine. my 99's blown a few.LOL! the last i done, and done in record time, 4hrs! i was told it could not be done that fast, but if i worked at the dealershits you'd still get the 6-8 hr charge(what bastards) and about 1k$ less in ur pocket. So if ur up to it give it a try, just get a manual of sorts . \,,/

As a guy who has replaced hundreds of intake gaskets, let me give you a little advice.
Get a manual, follow the directions to a T, mark the location of your componants and take your time (and take a second to read my sig line)


but if i worked at the dealershits you'd still get the 6-8 hr charge(what bastards)

xeroinfinity You obviously have not worked as a professional mechanic under the flat rate system (dealer or independant shop).
You act like the tech gets the 60-100 an hour charge that is billed to you.
Lets set some things straight here
1. Under the flat rate system, if you're not working, you're not getting paid. You are right on one thing, if the tech beats the time, he does get paid for the whole job...but what about the jobs that take longer to do than the time allows..well he only gets paid the time and no extra

2. out of that 60-100 bucks per hour that is charged, the tech gets 10-20 % of that
And the tech has to buy his own tools...I don't know if you have priced professional hand tools (Snap-on, Matco,Mac) but they are 200-400% more than Craftsman..just to put things into perspective, my investment in tools for my job equalls $75,000 and not one tool was supplied or purchased by my employer

3. If there is no work coming in the door, then the tech doesn't make any money..as much as people bash GM and say the product sucks, just the opposite is true..the product is far better then it was 20 years ago when I started..Warranty coverages are up, maintence schedules are down and the product quality is pretty damm good (less warranty repairs)..all these things add up to less vehicles rolling into dealer repair facilities for work, that means that dealers are slimming down their service departments ( firing techs)

The only advantage to being a proffesional mechanic is that the labor is free

i hav worked for GM flat rate 90-94, thats why i NOW make $60+ HR. ON my own with no help(employes). I know GM, DODGE any car Tech in dealershits hardly make enough to pay for lunch and TOOLS.

I own Snap-on tools and they didnt cost me 75k$!LOL! maybe 15-20K but I own close to $75K worth of equipemnet in my NEW Shop.

And I'm sorrie if Techs in dealers garages arnt makeing any money, but maybe if they fix things right the first time customers would come back again. My wife bought a warrenty on our 99' GA and took it in over 10 times before they found the coolant leak, 10 times 50$=500$ thats half the warrenty cost right there. And all it was , was the radiator craked the cheapass plastic, then u have "the weakest link syndrone" fix one thing two week later its somethng else. I know the game and I know it WELL.
I;m not bashing any GM Techs, or anyone else. I was just answering Mattpipers question, so dont bash me, please. Also I'm sorrie if u work in a dealer(s) shop and arnt makeing the money u used to or would like to, its NOT my Fault and if u dont like it quit and start ur own garage!

Mattpipers get a manual! LOL! \,,/

Hey fellas, were here to help people with problems, not start problems between us! xeroinfinity, im sorry you had a bad experience with gm tech's, but im sure it wasn't GMMerlin, you can take your GM vehicle to any GM dealership for warrenty repairs, I'd suggest you try a different one next time. Sounds like both of you are good mechanics, I have seen you both help people out in other threads, and both were right on the money, so lets try to focus on that, not tearing each other apart. well there's my 2 cents, (tell me to duck before you throw the penny back PLEASE).

I'm sorrie Gmack, I was trying not take it personaly and I didnt. I was just explaining my experiances and such. GMmerlin just seemed like he was quot bashing.LOL! I didnt make shit when i worked for them(GM) so i understand what GMmerlin said. Newer cars need less and less work. And I'm aware how dealers shops work and the TECH gets nothing when they're not working on something.
When i went to school i picked Gm because it was easy, parts are cheaper. I'm a MOPAR man at hart thats what i've been workin on for years before schooling. My budies went to Ford and Chrysler-dodge. So we have all domestic cars covered. I think Gms r the easyest to diagnosis and work on. I never said GMs were crap, or any other car/trucks. Just how the system works, and we cant control it, unless u do ur own work.

So GMmerlin dont take what i siad wrong, or out of text. i was retorting to ur comments.
Now days i work 60-80 hrs a week on evrthing forein/ domestic, John Deer, IH , Kubotas, Even diesels and i have No training for it but I get the job done. Most of my work is people who have little or no money and the ones who just cant work on their own stuff, the ealderly, and farmers who are broke down sometime on the road or the feilds. I never know what jobs up next when farmers are working. So please dont be offended ANYONE. i might bark but i dont bite. :)

but if i worked at the dealershits you'd still get the 6-8 hr charge(what bastards)

That was your quote and from what I read, you are implying that the techs are ripping you off. (which interests me because you claim to be a mechanic)
Now I'm here to educate people, not to bash..the educational process includes repairs and also includes things that people don't really have a clue about such as where the money they pay for repairs go and some inside info on the hows, whys and wheres on why they are not offered warranty coverages after their warranty expires.
I have owned my own shop and know for a fact that you are not pocketing the 60 dollars a hour that you are charging..matter of fact after you pay for your equipment and fixed operating costs (electric, taxes, other utilities and license fees) your actual take home is a lot less.
Now I will admit that there are a number of people working at dealers and other repair facilities that are no more than a DIY level person.
I on the other hand, am one of the most highly trained GM techs in the country (not bragging..just facts) and am 1 of 5 GM World Class Techs in my state and 1 of about 600 in the country..I am also trained by GM as a Service Advisor and a Service Manager..add my 20 some years of experiance with GM and I can say that I know a thing or 2 about a GM vehicle.
gmack221 had and excellent comment "you can take your GM vehicle to any GM dealership for warrenty repairs, I'd suggest you try a different one next time. and that is something I have told people here on the forums many times...
I have read thread after thread of people bashing GM for one thing or another and many of them I have taken to task because the problems weren't on the GM side, but the fact that they were the problem (you cant expect the world to be given to you if you are not willing to meet half way).
If someone makes statements against techs or dealers, I will educate them on the facts and make suggestions on how to handle the situation.
My techniques may be abrasive, but you will just have to get over it..
The reason I came on board here was because of 2 things
1.
There was a ton of mis-information being given to people asking about vehicle problems
2. To educate those who continue to bash dealers and technicians.
Now lets fix some cars :p

ok,ok i see your point. It wasnt GM i was knocking it's the whole system that surounds the Tech and all the AUTO manufacturering industry. I admit the Techs are under payed, they should get at least 25 if not 40 persent of the fees collected. They do all the work. Just some r knuckle heads that have No bussines working on anything. Its hard making a living in anything you do for your self these days, someone will always do it cheaper but at what cost..
My shop fees are very little, taxs and what needs restocked. My new shop and new house are, "off the grid" as my friends say. I sell power back to my power company most all summer long. And because i'm in a Zone 3(out of city limits), i think it is, I need no bussines licenses'. And I pay insurance for accident, they will happen.
This is my second bussines i've had, the first was a Sheet Rock Crew(mid 90's), worked out great till i was in a car wreck in 97' and had to Re-habilitate my intire life. But now I'm happy at what I do, and the customers keep lining up, SO YA Lets fix some damn cars! Sorrie for any inconveniamces GMmerlin I ment no direct disrespect to u or any other Good mechanics. Just those knuckle heads! LMAO! \,,/ \,,/