Oxygen sensor extension
xXxFLiPKiDxXx
05-02-2002, 08:25 PM
How would i be able to extend my header's oxygen sensor?
What kind of wire should i use?
Connectors?
Insulation or protection from engine heat?
Thank you in advance
What kind of wire should i use?
Connectors?
Insulation or protection from engine heat?
Thank you in advance
drift
05-02-2002, 10:42 PM
Originally posted by xXxFLiPKiDxXx
How would i be able to extend my header's oxygen sensor?
What kind of wire should i use?
Connectors?
Insulation or protection from engine heat?
Thank you in advance
you cant just extend the wires. the additional resistance caused by lengthening the leads could alter the sensor signal, providing false readings.
How would i be able to extend my header's oxygen sensor?
What kind of wire should i use?
Connectors?
Insulation or protection from engine heat?
Thank you in advance
you cant just extend the wires. the additional resistance caused by lengthening the leads could alter the sensor signal, providing false readings.
fjt
05-03-2002, 08:59 AM
Originally posted by drift
you cant just extend the wires. the additional resistance caused by lengthening the leads could alter the sensor signal, providing false readings.
Are you serious????? Mines where extended.Is it bad idea????
you cant just extend the wires. the additional resistance caused by lengthening the leads could alter the sensor signal, providing false readings.
Are you serious????? Mines where extended.Is it bad idea????
igo4bmx
05-03-2002, 09:18 AM
Originally posted by drift
you cant just extend the wires. the additional resistance caused by lengthening the leads could alter the sensor signal, providing false readings.
I'm getting an A/F gauge and need to tap into the O2 wires. will that affect the senors, since i will be connecting them in parrallel?
you cant just extend the wires. the additional resistance caused by lengthening the leads could alter the sensor signal, providing false readings.
I'm getting an A/F gauge and need to tap into the O2 wires. will that affect the senors, since i will be connecting them in parrallel?
j.fuggi
05-03-2002, 09:52 AM
just connect it to your ecu instead. easier...
drift
05-03-2002, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by igo4bmx
I'm getting an A/F gauge and need to tap into the O2 wires. will that affect the senors, since i will be connecting them in parrallel?
no, since the tap will not create resistance since the line isnt patched or extended.
I'm getting an A/F gauge and need to tap into the O2 wires. will that affect the senors, since i will be connecting them in parrallel?
no, since the tap will not create resistance since the line isnt patched or extended.
drift
05-03-2002, 03:36 PM
Originally posted by j.fuggi
just connect it to your ecu instead. easier...
the lead off the ecu is a direct line to the sensor. either way, an A/F meter wont harm the readings.
just connect it to your ecu instead. easier...
the lead off the ecu is a direct line to the sensor. either way, an A/F meter wont harm the readings.
drift
05-03-2002, 03:42 PM
Originally posted by fjt
Are you serious????? Mines where extended.Is it bad idea????
yes.
here's why:
Bosch style oxygen sensors (all are bosch style for auto applications) measure the amount of fuel in the exhaust. the sensor uses one volt, i repeat, 1 VOLT, and monitors the resistance. as unburned fuel collects on the sensor, it decreases the resistance on the sensor, lowering the output voltage of the sensor. if the motor is burning fuel properly, then there will be less unburned fuel running thru it, allowing the resistance to increase and the sensor sends out a lower voltage. it works on 0-1 volt, and changes monitored to the 100th of a volt. if you add more wire to lengthen the leads, the wires have resistance themselves, and will lower the total output voltage at any reading. with 12 volts, this is not much of a concern. at 0-1 volt being measured to the hundredths to determine fuel mixture, this could lead to leaning out of the fuel system due to the erroneous readings. .45-.55 volts is considered stoichiometric, or "perfect combustion"
Are you serious????? Mines where extended.Is it bad idea????
yes.
here's why:
Bosch style oxygen sensors (all are bosch style for auto applications) measure the amount of fuel in the exhaust. the sensor uses one volt, i repeat, 1 VOLT, and monitors the resistance. as unburned fuel collects on the sensor, it decreases the resistance on the sensor, lowering the output voltage of the sensor. if the motor is burning fuel properly, then there will be less unburned fuel running thru it, allowing the resistance to increase and the sensor sends out a lower voltage. it works on 0-1 volt, and changes monitored to the 100th of a volt. if you add more wire to lengthen the leads, the wires have resistance themselves, and will lower the total output voltage at any reading. with 12 volts, this is not much of a concern. at 0-1 volt being measured to the hundredths to determine fuel mixture, this could lead to leaning out of the fuel system due to the erroneous readings. .45-.55 volts is considered stoichiometric, or "perfect combustion"
SilverY2KCivic
05-03-2002, 04:22 PM
Damn, well how would one go about lengthening the wires to the sensor, if say I were to want to add headers to my 6th gen Civic DX since removal of the stock headers would also elimiate the stock catalytic converter, and I'd need to get an EX or after market cat which would sit a bit further back than the stock one....
drift
05-04-2002, 01:09 AM
Originally posted by SilverY2KCivic
Damn, well how would one go about lengthening the wires to the sensor, if say I were to want to add headers to my 6th gen Civic DX since removal of the stock headers would also elimiate the stock catalytic converter, and I'd need to get an EX or after market cat which would sit a bit further back than the stock one....
buy the EX oxygen sensor. crimping on longer wires or using lower quality wires will increase resistance. using an OEM harness of the proper length will keep this to the absolute minimum.
Damn, well how would one go about lengthening the wires to the sensor, if say I were to want to add headers to my 6th gen Civic DX since removal of the stock headers would also elimiate the stock catalytic converter, and I'd need to get an EX or after market cat which would sit a bit further back than the stock one....
buy the EX oxygen sensor. crimping on longer wires or using lower quality wires will increase resistance. using an OEM harness of the proper length will keep this to the absolute minimum.
igo4bmx
05-04-2002, 08:46 AM
Originally posted by drift
buy the EX oxygen sensor. crimping on longer wires or using lower quality wires will increase resistance. using an OEM harness of the proper length will keep this to the absolute minimum.
getting higher quality wiring or even thicker wiring should help right?
buy the EX oxygen sensor. crimping on longer wires or using lower quality wires will increase resistance. using an OEM harness of the proper length will keep this to the absolute minimum.
getting higher quality wiring or even thicker wiring should help right?
xXxFLiPKiDxXx
05-04-2002, 11:41 AM
where would they sell OEM harness'?
drift
05-04-2002, 05:51 PM
Originally posted by xXxFLiPKiDxXx
where would they sell OEM harness'?
www.oxygensensors.com
where would they sell OEM harness'?
www.oxygensensors.com
drift
05-04-2002, 05:51 PM
Originally posted by igo4bmx
getting higher quality wiring or even thicker wiring should help right?
yeah, but you'll have to solder the leads, not crimp connect.
getting higher quality wiring or even thicker wiring should help right?
yeah, but you'll have to solder the leads, not crimp connect.
Tofuboy
05-04-2002, 09:34 PM
Bosch style oxygen sensors (all are bosch style for auto applications) measure the amount of fuel in the exhaust. the sensor uses one volt, i repeat, 1 VOLT, and monitors the resistance. as unburned fuel collects on the sensor, it decreases the resistance on the sensor, lowering the output voltage of the sensor. if the motor is burning fuel properly, then there will be less unburned fuel running thru it, allowing the resistance to increase and the sensor sends out a lower voltage
Sorry to bust ya drift, this is not how an Oxygen Sensor works.
The O2 sensor is actually a little battery (galvanic Generator). It has the ability to produce a low voltage signal, but it has to be hot (approx. 600 F) before it will send a signal that the ECU will respond to.
The O2 sensor compares the oxygen content in the exhaust stream to the oxygen content in the ambient air not the HC (raw fuel). There is a passage from the top of the O2 sensor to the inner chamber to permit outside air to enter.
As the exhaust gas passes by the O2 sensor in the exhaust manifold, the O2 sensor will "sense" the amount of oxyen that the exhaust gas content, not the amount of fuel, and generate a voltage signal.
When the exhaust gas is lean (more oxygen), the voltage output is low, below approx. 450 mV. When the exhaust gas is rich (less oxygen), the voltage output is high, above approx. 450 mV.
The voltage output of a normal O2 sensor will fluctuate rapidly back and forth between approx. 100 mV to 900 mV (0-1V).
In reality there is a big difference on sensing the O2 instead of the HC and that's why it's called an Oxygen sensor, not HC sensor.:smoker2:
Sorry to bust ya drift, this is not how an Oxygen Sensor works.
The O2 sensor is actually a little battery (galvanic Generator). It has the ability to produce a low voltage signal, but it has to be hot (approx. 600 F) before it will send a signal that the ECU will respond to.
The O2 sensor compares the oxygen content in the exhaust stream to the oxygen content in the ambient air not the HC (raw fuel). There is a passage from the top of the O2 sensor to the inner chamber to permit outside air to enter.
As the exhaust gas passes by the O2 sensor in the exhaust manifold, the O2 sensor will "sense" the amount of oxyen that the exhaust gas content, not the amount of fuel, and generate a voltage signal.
When the exhaust gas is lean (more oxygen), the voltage output is low, below approx. 450 mV. When the exhaust gas is rich (less oxygen), the voltage output is high, above approx. 450 mV.
The voltage output of a normal O2 sensor will fluctuate rapidly back and forth between approx. 100 mV to 900 mV (0-1V).
In reality there is a big difference on sensing the O2 instead of the HC and that's why it's called an Oxygen sensor, not HC sensor.:smoker2:
Si2000 Vtec
05-05-2002, 04:11 AM
While we're on the topic of 02 sensors, OBD2 have two 02-sensors: One on the header, and one on the cat.
I build a test-pipe for my cat, so there isn't a home for #2 02 Sensor. From what I've heard, I can just ground out this 02 sensor and it won't trip a code on my ECU. Right now, when the car warms up, it's setting the check engine light off.
Know anything about this?
I build a test-pipe for my cat, so there isn't a home for #2 02 Sensor. From what I've heard, I can just ground out this 02 sensor and it won't trip a code on my ECU. Right now, when the car warms up, it's setting the check engine light off.
Know anything about this?
Tofuboy
05-05-2002, 12:52 PM
OBD2 have two 02-sensors: One on the header, and one on the cat.
I don't know the exact position of the 2nd O2 sensor (on the cat? so it has a hole on the cat and an O2 sensor lives there? that's wried). Anyway, I am assuming the 2nd O2 sensor is somewhere toward the end section of the cat where air flows out the cat.
And NO it will NOT work if you ground the 2nd O2 sensor.
The second O2 sensor's job is quite different, rather to check your emission, it is used to monitor to see if the cat is doing it's job.
There is a look up chart in the ECU's PROM for the 2nd O2 sensor, when the exhaust gas comes out of the cat and passes by the 2nd O2 sensor it checks how good of the converting did the cat do.
If you ground out the 2nd O2 sensor, it will tell the ECU that the cat is doing such an excellent job that there is no pollution coming out of your cat, then the ECU smell fishy about the O2 sensor and spits the check engine light at your face. :smoker2:
Si2000 Vtec--where are my tires? j/k :D
I don't know the exact position of the 2nd O2 sensor (on the cat? so it has a hole on the cat and an O2 sensor lives there? that's wried). Anyway, I am assuming the 2nd O2 sensor is somewhere toward the end section of the cat where air flows out the cat.
And NO it will NOT work if you ground the 2nd O2 sensor.
The second O2 sensor's job is quite different, rather to check your emission, it is used to monitor to see if the cat is doing it's job.
There is a look up chart in the ECU's PROM for the 2nd O2 sensor, when the exhaust gas comes out of the cat and passes by the 2nd O2 sensor it checks how good of the converting did the cat do.
If you ground out the 2nd O2 sensor, it will tell the ECU that the cat is doing such an excellent job that there is no pollution coming out of your cat, then the ECU smell fishy about the O2 sensor and spits the check engine light at your face. :smoker2:
Si2000 Vtec--where are my tires? j/k :D
Si2000 Vtec
05-05-2002, 07:04 PM
Haha, you can have the damn tires :D
Anyway, right now my 02 sensor is just tied to a tortion bar under my car, and its trippin' code after it gets warmed up. It runs perfectly fine, I just have to deal with the yellow light of death shining in my face as I drive down the road.
Anyway, right now my 02 sensor is just tied to a tortion bar under my car, and its trippin' code after it gets warmed up. It runs perfectly fine, I just have to deal with the yellow light of death shining in my face as I drive down the road.
Tofuboy
05-06-2002, 12:55 AM
right now my 02 sensor is just tied to a tortion bar under my car
why don't you just unplug the wire and take the sensor out, that way you might avoid losing the sensor.
Yes, there shouldn't be a problem running the engine, just you will have to live with the light on.
why don't you just unplug the wire and take the sensor out, that way you might avoid losing the sensor.
Yes, there shouldn't be a problem running the engine, just you will have to live with the light on.
stefan525
05-07-2002, 04:41 PM
Hey, I did a swap on my 97 civic and I had to extend my O2 sensors. What I did is, I extended the wire harness before the plug of the O2 sensor. It seems to be easier and safer than try to extend the wires after the O2 sensor plug. Good luck. stefan525 vroom vroom
fourreel
10-12-2004, 08:31 PM
all an O2 sensor is, is a thermo couple (exhaust gas temp [EGT] probe). bi-metallic packed in potassium or something. The hotter the probe gets the more voltage (very low) it puts out. If the puter picks up too high of a voltage (lean burn) it enrichens the fuel/air mixture, too low of a voltage and it leans out the mixture. It does not sense anything but heat. One or two wire systems do not usually have a pre-heating element (for start up) 3 or more wires usually have a pre-heating element. The length of wire won't matter as long as it isn't too obnoxious, inches won't matter.
CivicSpoon
10-12-2004, 08:44 PM
This thread is 2 years old. Please pay attention to the dates of the thread before posting in them.
fourreel
10-12-2004, 08:49 PM
In case anyone is doing a search AS I AM, it is good stuff to know. Who gives a crud how old it is. Ya get bitched at for not searching and ya get bitched at for searching.
CivMoeEJ8
10-12-2004, 08:52 PM
I'll sell you a plug and play O2 sense extension. I'll get you some pix if you want them. I got them with my Apex'i header and didn't need it. Let me know. Email me at [email protected]
CivicSpoon
10-12-2004, 09:27 PM
In case anyone is doing a search AS I AM, it is good stuff to know. Who gives a crud how old it is. Ya get bitched at for not searching and ya get bitched at for searching.
Why do I say? Hmmm...because of sh*t like this...
I'll sell you a plug and play O2 sense extension. I'll get you some pix if you want them. I got them with my Apex'i header and didn't need it. Let me know. Email me at [email protected]
And no you don't get bitched at for searching, you get bitched at for posting in old ass threads that have long since died. Also there are a lot of people who have been here for years and have seen all the topics before, so when a bunch of newbies continually bring back old threads to the top it tend to get annoying really quick.
Why do I say? Hmmm...because of sh*t like this...
I'll sell you a plug and play O2 sense extension. I'll get you some pix if you want them. I got them with my Apex'i header and didn't need it. Let me know. Email me at [email protected]
And no you don't get bitched at for searching, you get bitched at for posting in old ass threads that have long since died. Also there are a lot of people who have been here for years and have seen all the topics before, so when a bunch of newbies continually bring back old threads to the top it tend to get annoying really quick.
CivMoeEJ8
10-12-2004, 10:43 PM
Why do I say? Hmmm...because of sh*t like this...
And no you don't get bitched at for searching, you get bitched at for posting in old ass threads that have long since died. Also there are a lot of people who have been here for years and have seen all the topics before, so when a bunch of newbies continually bring back old threads to the top it tend to get annoying really quick.
You b!tch more than my granny and girlfriend combined! SHUT UP!!
If this forum was on top of it's stuff then there would be an archived section where old threads would be stored (still easily searched through). And BTW, I'm not a newb!
And no you don't get bitched at for searching, you get bitched at for posting in old ass threads that have long since died. Also there are a lot of people who have been here for years and have seen all the topics before, so when a bunch of newbies continually bring back old threads to the top it tend to get annoying really quick.
You b!tch more than my granny and girlfriend combined! SHUT UP!!
If this forum was on top of it's stuff then there would be an archived section where old threads would be stored (still easily searched through). And BTW, I'm not a newb!
GScivic7
10-12-2004, 11:19 PM
If this forum was on top of it's stuff then there would be an archived section where old threads would be stored (still easily searched through).
If you don't like how this forum doesn't have an archive, cause we really wouldn't need one if people would pay attention to post date, then leave.
BTW:
You b!tch more than my granny and girlfriend combined! SHUT UP!
there's the pot calling the kettle black.
If you don't like how this forum doesn't have an archive, cause we really wouldn't need one if people would pay attention to post date, then leave.
BTW:
You b!tch more than my granny and girlfriend combined! SHUT UP!
there's the pot calling the kettle black.
CivicSpoon
10-12-2004, 11:21 PM
You b!tch more than my granny and girlfriend combined! SHUT UP!!
If this forum was on top of it's stuff then there would be an archived section where old threads would be stored (still easily searched through). And BTW, I'm not a newb!
Go screw yourself. Maybe if you paid attention you wouldn't look like a moron posting that you had a sensor available, had you actually looked at the dates of the post; or even read my post above that stated it was a 2 year old thread. Don't blame your stupidity on me jackass. And yes you are a newbie; look below your Username: AF Newbie, look at your joined date: Today. You are a newbie. I never said you were a newbie to cars or H/A's, but to this forum you are; and your mistake clearly shows that. What's considered archived are posts 6 months old or older, and it is looked down upon when someone other than the original poster brings it back. Sorry if this is too hard of a setup for you...:rolleyes:
If this forum was on top of it's stuff then there would be an archived section where old threads would be stored (still easily searched through). And BTW, I'm not a newb!
Go screw yourself. Maybe if you paid attention you wouldn't look like a moron posting that you had a sensor available, had you actually looked at the dates of the post; or even read my post above that stated it was a 2 year old thread. Don't blame your stupidity on me jackass. And yes you are a newbie; look below your Username: AF Newbie, look at your joined date: Today. You are a newbie. I never said you were a newbie to cars or H/A's, but to this forum you are; and your mistake clearly shows that. What's considered archived are posts 6 months old or older, and it is looked down upon when someone other than the original poster brings it back. Sorry if this is too hard of a setup for you...:rolleyes:
CivMoeEJ8
10-13-2004, 06:57 AM
How about this, I'm going to bump this thread up just to piss you off cuz I see how mad it makes you!!!! hahahah
fourreel
10-13-2004, 04:17 PM
Let's bump it one more time. I'm taking this site off my list. I've yet to see an intelligent answer for anything that is half way difficult. Thought there might be some knowledgeable peeps on this site but just must be a bunch of back yard mechanics. I didn't know this site wasn't for newbies!!
CivicSpoon
10-13-2004, 05:10 PM
Let's bump it one more time. I'm taking this site off my list. I've yet to see an intelligent answer for anything that is half way difficult. Thought there might be some knowledgeable peeps on this site but just must be a bunch of back yard mechanics. I didn't know this site wasn't for newbies!!
It's just not a site for newbies who are too lazy to search first and ask questions second. And if there is an intelligent questions that hasn't been asked a million times then it gets answered. If you don't like it or can't take it then yes you should leave. Sorry not everyone is willing to hold your hand thru a question to make sure you get a satisfactory answer. Bump.
It's just not a site for newbies who are too lazy to search first and ask questions second. And if there is an intelligent questions that hasn't been asked a million times then it gets answered. If you don't like it or can't take it then yes you should leave. Sorry not everyone is willing to hold your hand thru a question to make sure you get a satisfactory answer. Bump.
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