Help on Preformance sedan under $20k

Hey, I'm going to be getting rid of my current car (95 Lexus sc400) and sharing a car with my parents (mine basically, but they have only a truck and want a car for weekend trips)

Were looking into getting a 4 door car, its going to be driven alot so it needs to be reliable, decent on gas, quick (would like it to be faster than my current car), nice, and handle decent.

Cars that I've thought of already that fit into this category for me are:

2002~ Lexus IS300
2004~ Chevrolet SS(supercharged) Impala
2002~ Subaru WRX

any pro's/con's (dont know ALOT about these cars but I have a good general idea) also it would be appreciated if there are any other cars that fit my criteria or close (maybe even a 2 door) that you could suggest.

Thanks.

Might want to consider

Dodge Neon SRT4
Mazdaspeed Protegé
Acura Integra GSR Sedan
Mazda 6 Sedan
VW Jetta VR6/1.8T
Nissan Maxima V6
Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec V



BMW M3 Sedan (E36) = my choice for you and for myself if I was in that situation

Yea, I was thinkin M3 also... but I dont know too much about reliability on BMW's :\

and I forgot to put I'm not gonna get a maxima even though it fits my criteria pretty good, one of my friends has one.

Yea, I was thinkin M3 also... but I dont know too much about reliability on BMW's :\

and I forgot to put I'm not gonna get a maxima even though it fits my criteria pretty good, one of my friends has one.

You're not gonna find an M3 sedan under $20k unless theres something wrong with it. Plus, most people I know have flaws with BMW cars. I'm not trying to be biased, but if you want reliability then stick to Japanese cars. I would say get the Maxima but since you stated that you dont want it, what about the Altima SE-R? :iceslolan

Yea, I was thinkin M3 also... but I dont know too much about reliability on BMW's :\

and I forgot to put I'm not gonna get a maxima even though it fits my criteria pretty good, one of my friends has one.
Well, I've put close to 100,000 hard driven k's onto the clock of my 2001 330Ci on top of the 40,000 that were on it when I bought it and have had absolutely no troubles, so I'd have to say that there is absolutely faulting BMW reliability from this stand-point.

I've heard the WRX has reliability issues with the trans, but I don't know how severe they are and are more than likely a result of repeated hard launching, and too much spirited driving, however it may be something to consider. It wouldn't steer me away from them though. The Impala is a good car, the largest of the choices, and has enough power to move you through traffic without a problem. My choice though would have to be the IS300, I liked them when they first came and still do to this day. They look good imo, they are sporty, handle well, and are quick enough to navigate through traffic with ease.

Yea, I've been leaning twards the IS300 aswell, but I cant seem to find any information about the speed it has, anyone know how they are stock? ie 1/4mi times
as for the impala, how would reliability be for this one? I dont have much experience with stock sc cars and dont know how well they hold up. this car is going to be driven alot, probably 30k per year and half of that will probably be city.

Motor Trend got 0-60 in 7.4 with a 15.5 in the 1/4 in an auto, and Car & Driver got 0-60 in 7.2 and the 1/4 in 15.4 in a 5-speed. Plenty fast for city driving.

The Impala's reliability should be fine, and with most any American car especially a GM any problems that might occur are usually a cheap and easy fix. I've seen 3800 s/c cars with over 200k that run fine with out a rebuild.

You're not gonna find an M3 sedan under $20k unless theres something wrong with it. Plus, most people I know have flaws with BMW cars. I'm not trying to be biased, but if you want reliability then stick to Japanese cars. I would say get the Maxima but since you stated that you dont want it, what about the Altima SE-R? :iceslolan

Actually, there was someone here on the forum that bought a used E36 for a little over $18,000 and there was nothing wrong with his. You might be thinking of the E46 M3.

Also nsuck, BMW does not have a problem with reliability, once again, you might be thinking of Mercedes.

Yea, I know I can get an e36 for my price range. still pretty unsure of what to get, ill probably just have to go out and test the ones im interested in... any additional information or imput would be appreciated.

thanks

There are plenty of sub 20k E36 M3's...ones even in the 15's, but mainly close to 18-20k

I dont have much experience with stock sc cars and dont know how well they hold up. this car is going to be driven alot, probably 30k per year and half of that will probably be city.

i have a Grand Prix GTP Supercharged with a little over 75k miles on it. the only thing that has been done is the oil changed and spark plugs/wires changed when i got it. well, i need new tires right now...280ft/lbs of TQ (plus modifications) doesnt take to kindly to the front tires. anyways, it runs perfect and pulls just as strong as my buddies with only 15k miles. i have been told the engine is very strong and the engine had problems on very RARE occasions. its the transmission that usually goes at about 150k miles, quick rebuild and your ready to go for another 150k. but of course, these people with tranny problems are the same people with it on 'performance shift' all the time, racing, and neutral dropping the automatic.

i would say it is a very good buy. times range anywhere from mid 14's to low 15's more or less depending on the tires wear and temperature. most people can bet on a high 14 consistently in a stock GTP (same drivetrain as the SS Impala) when it is 90+ degrees here my GTP is a dog and the temperature gauge varies alot between up 160-180 degrees, 180 degrees when your laying into the boost.

just thought i would add my experience with the GM 3800 supercharged.

an e36 M3 would be a good choice, but you could get newer 330i with a lot less miles on it for the same price. they've got plenty of performance, a lot faster than the an IS300 at least, and i've seen plenty with well over 100k miles and still running perfectly

i'm also a big fan of the mazda 6

look into a maxima. they're good for mid 14's with the 255 or 265 hp VQ35 engines, they're available with a 6 speed and can be had for 15K or less, not to mention can average anywhere between 25 and 35 mpg.

it'll edge out an is300 no prob and can hang with and/or beat an E36 M3 as well, but won't kill your insurance like those cars will.

look into a maxima... can hang with and/or beat an E36 M3 as well, but won't kill your insurance like those cars will.

Umm...not entirely. E36's can run high 13's to even mid 13's. Check out some M3 Forums if you are skeptical. Plus the 0-60 of the M3 sedan is around 5.8 seconds while the Maxima is around 6.1-6.4. Finally, we know who wins the handling and braking issues here. M3.

i have a Grand Prix GTP Supercharged with a little over 75k miles on it. the only thing that has been done is the oil changed and spark plugs/wires changed when i got it. well, i need new tires right now...280ft/lbs of TQ (plus modifications) doesnt take to kindly to the front tires. anyways, it runs perfect and pulls just as strong as my buddies with only 15k miles. i have been told the engine is very strong and the engine had problems on very RARE occasions. its the transmission that usually goes at about 150k miles, quick rebuild and your ready to go for another 150k. but of course, these people with tranny problems are the same people with it on 'performance shift' all the time, racing, and neutral dropping the automatic.

i would say it is a very good buy. times range anywhere from mid 14's to low 15's more or less depending on the tires wear and temperature. most people can bet on a high 14 consistently in a stock GTP (same drivetrain as the SS Impala) when it is 90+ degrees here my GTP is a dog and the temperature gauge varies alot between up 160-180 degrees, 180 degrees when your laying into the boost.

just thought i would add my experience with the GM 3800 supercharged.

I agree with k3smostwanted. I personally own a Grand Prix GT (the non-supercharged version) and love it. Its really comfortable (I'm 6'5, so thats saying something) and the performance is good enough for me. I don't race much, so I dont need the power of a GTP. If you aren't going to race alot, I would go with the GT simply because of the gas mileage and not needing premium fuel, but if you need the added performance, a GTP is a great buy. Just my :2cents:.

As for the reliability of the 3800 engine, I've had my ups and downs. I bought the car with 83,000 miles on it, and have had to have the ignition coil, spark plugs, intake manifold, and starter replaced. Since then though, the car has run like a dream, and I blame those problems on the mileage. My parent's LeSabre has the same engine and they've never had major problems. IMO, the GM 3800 is one of the most reliable engines you can get.

i've edged out my friends M3 before, albeit it's a girl driving it. just cuz some really good drivers may get it into 13's doesn't mean it's common, typically it's a high-mid 14 second car(i've cheked m3forums.com as well as bimmerfourms.com), and i don't buy mid 13's stock for a second. it's still a 240 hp car that weighs 3200 lbs, the fact that it's a bmw won't help it to defy the laws of physics.

this vid here is a member of the maxima.org forums. it's 2k2 maxima 6 speed with only a CAI(in the far left lane) racing his buddy in an M3 in the far right lane, and being taped by a prelude in the middle lane. Click here to watch MaxvsLCvsM3.mov (http://www.gigashare.com/files/embed/874284505.html)

the maxima puts about 2 cars on the bimmer. it may not be the common outcome, but i didn't say the maxima was the hands down faster car, i said it'll hang with and/or beat and M3 while costing you less all around. it'll be cheaper to buy, maintain, and insure, while making similar straightline performance, handling and braking go to the m3 without question but considering the fact that he's looking for 4 door cars, i doubt he'll be seeing many track days.