what you got your Timing set to?

I am debating the pros and cons of advancing my ignition timing in the hope of gaining some extra power.

I have heard some of you guys advancing as far as 19 degrees.

So what do you consider to be the safe limit?
also what do think are the risks of any engine damage?
lastly what improvement have you noticed?

I guess I would also need to know what grade of fuel you would be using after the change.

I will just say the cons as I'm sure everyone else here will tell you the good stuff. The main one that I will say is that advancing it too much will do damage. Some damage to the tranny. It will always go in forced or just like bang into gear if you drive an automatic. And probably do some damage to the internals.

Oh - thanks for the warning. Perhaps I should have given a bit more detail. I should have added that I drive a UK Primera GT manual 5 speed.

My timing is currently set to 19 degrees. I'm guessing you have the SR20 motor in your Primera? I live in Arizona, where the temp can easily hit 110+ on any given day during the middle of summer, and so far I've been detonation free (running 92 octane gas of course). I gained right around 6hp from bumping my timing from 15* to 19* on the dyno last time I was there, all the gains were found from about 4.5K up to about 7K with the advanced timing, it was weird, but a nice increase. If you're already running 92 octane or higher, i'd recommend running 19*, however your motor may react different than mind did, so please be cautious once you advance your timing. I still listen to my motor when it's real hot out (110+) to make sure it's not pinging or knocking.

This octane thing. Here in the UK we have a choice of iether 95 or 98. Is this the same scale/measure as the USA - surely we can't have better grade gas than you guys!

Originally posted by geoff200
This octane thing. Here in the UK we have a choice of iether 95 or 98. Is this the same scale/measure as the USA - surely we can't have better grade gas than you guys!

Actually, you guys do have better gas than we do.:D

Well if its any concellation I can assure that we pay double for the privilege.

Originally posted by geoff200
Well if its any concellation I can assure that we pay double for the privilege.

Gee thanks!:rolleyes: :D :D

I want that higher octane gas man! This country has so many damn regulations it isn't even funny. I believe the highest we have is 94 octane and only a select few of gas stations carry it. Anything above that, we have to buy an octane booster. I think I will leave this country now!:D :D :finger: :finger: Not!

Originally posted by DVSNCYNIKL


I think I will leave this country now!:D :D :finger: :finger: Not!

As long as you dont head to this part of the world i will feel safe..:finger: :finger: :finger:

Originally posted by primera man


As long as you dont head to this part of the world i will feel safe..:finger: :finger: :finger:

This is mainly directed to Primera Man, You will never feel safe!:devil: :devil: Muahahahaha!!:finger: :finger:

Originally posted by DVSNCYNIKL


This is mainly directed to Primera Man, You will never feel safe!:devil: :devil: Muahahahaha!!:finger: :finger:

im shaking involuntarrily with fear and weakness of your presence:finger: :devil: :devil: :devil:

I'm in Southern California and my friends have bought higher than 92 octane at a pump station...only gas station I ever heard of selling higher octane is UNOCAL 76...one in pasadena sells 100 Octane but its hella expensive...double the price of 92....Anyways there are also other UNOCAL 76 stations elsewhere that carries it...oh and anything over 100 Octane has lead in it..100 Octane is lead free...laters

I just dump in 1 bottle (one a half tank) of NOS octane booster for the track and advance to 22* for the track only.

What cons and pros of timing it to 17 degrees? Seems like 19 can cause some damage, and I dont want to take do something that Im not sure about. Would 17 give you any added performance?

Also...how do you get the timing changed? What kinda of places do that stuff?

When stock, what is the timing set at??

stock is 15

Originally posted by Koojo
Seems like 19 can cause some damage, and I dont want to take do something that Im not sure about.
I don't know where you get this impression but if you run premium gas you won't have a problem. If you can't, or don't want to, afford premium gas then don't set your timing to 19 BTCD; keep it at the stock setting.

I don't have a problem about running good grade fuel, in fact I am forced to put 95 or higher in. I guess I could set the timing to 19 degrees without worries then. What would this do to the torque curve? would I loose some low down power in exchange for more power at higher rpm or visa versa, or more power all round? How do you set the timing - do you turn the distributor like on cruder cars? or is this an ECU remapping thing?

The only thing advanced timing costs you is the extra money for the premium gas.

As to the procedure go to www.se-r.net and look for it on there. You have to do some raindance ritual that involves revving the engine 3 times to 4000rpm then holding the revs are ~2000rpm for 1 minute or so, disconnecting the tps, blah, blah...check out se-r.net for the actual details. Oh BTW you need a dialback timing light too.

Originally posted by geoff200
What would this do to the torque curve? would I loose some low down power in exchange for more power at higher rpm or visa versa, or more power all round?

I think every motor is going to act a little different when the timing is advanced, but I don't think you will lose power anywhere, unless you were to possibly overadvance the timing, then you may lose power???

With 19* timing my dyno didn't lose power anywhere, the dyno was almost identical to the prior run except from about 4500rpms on up to about 7000 rpms. It looked like someone just pulled the line up for that 2500rpm range and left the rest of the graph the same. However, your motor may react different, so I'm not totally sure how it'll react.

ive checked out se-r.net but cant seem to find any info on the proceedure for setting the timing 17 or 19 degrees BTDC, can anyone post a link to the specific page? Thanks:D

http://www.se-r.net/engine/about_timing.html ;)

I've got my timing advanced to 19*. I run 92 octane gas no problems. Throttle response is an enormous improvement. When I first checked my timing it was at 13*. It's really easy; just get a dialback timing light and follow the se-r.net procedure. Oh and all the Sunocos around here (Toledo, OH) sell 94 octane for about $.10 more than 92.

Originally posted by Dshaft96
When I first checked my timing it was at 13*.

Yep, I think the Nissan slave workers / robots set the timing trivially to somewhere around 13 to 15. Seems there is no consistancy lol...

Do you think 19 is better than 17. The Se-r.net link says 17. Also have any of you tried it on a European Primera which I have been told has slightly higher compression than US G20's.

not sure about the compression issue.


Many people have done 19* safely. I have mine at 17*


One thing Geoff, I've heard that US octane levels are not measure the same way as other countries.

Your octane may be + or - what ours is...


For example.. if someone in the US says they run 19* advanced with 92 octane, in the UK you may need 95 octane, or maybe only 89 etc...


Not sure which way it varies, but I have heard this several times.

Nissan specify that the timing on a Euro spec SR20DE should be 15 +/- 2 degrees. You should be able to set the timing to 17 degrees using standard 95RON petrol, but I'd be wary of going higher than that unless you use 98RON petrol. Even with 98RON, I wouldn't go above 19 degrees if you value your engine, as the higher compression of Euro spec SR20 motors (10:1 vs 9.5:1) means you won't be able to safely increase the timing as much.

Remember - if you set the timing too high the engine will begin to "pink" under load. The SR20 series engine's have a built in knock sensor, so the ECU will "hear" this pinking and pull the timing right back. Therefore you are likely to get WORSE performance than if you'd left the timing at 17 degrees.

Thanks for the advice - it's 17 degrees for me then.

If anyone has experience of a JWT chip on a european G20 please post, because I know some of you are fitting these instead of advancing your ignition. The JWT chip must advance extra through its mapping.

Please everyone, I might be splitting hairs here but JWT sells ECUs. You cannot get a chip for any G20. Unless you have a modified ECU that takes chips. :D

Originally posted by DVSNCYNIKL

Actually, you guys do have better gas than we do.:D

No. We do use a different scale from the rest of the world. Their octane rating is Research Octane Number. Ours is an average of RON and MON (Motor Octane Number).

Originally posted by geoff200
Thanks for the advice - it's 17 degrees for me then.

If anyone has experience of a JWT chip on a european G20 please post, because I know some of you are fitting these instead of advancing your ignition. The JWT chip must advance extra through its mapping.

JWT don't sell an ECU that'll work in a P11 Primera I'm afraid Geoff :( Get yourself a Unichip less than it'll cost you to get a JWT ECU imported, and get the same or better results :)

Originally posted by Anthony


JWT don't sell an ECU that'll work in a P11 Primera I'm afraid Geoff :( Get yourself a Unichip less than it'll cost you to get a JWT ECU imported, and get the same or better results :)

Anthony,

have you specifically asked about JWT not "preparing" P11 ECUs or you are inferring? Last I asked they said that they had not programmed any European SR20DE ECU so they did not know how it may end. Still, the advice I got was to send in an ECU from my car and they could try (and probably succeed) to program it.

Also, on the subject of Unichip, do you ny any chance know whether any of those will work on a P10? I have a 1992 Sunny GTi and trying to decide which route I should follow. If you have any info on Unichip and 92 SR20DEs I would appreciate it.

Chris

Last I heard, JWT would only accept pre-98 US ECUs for programming. The European P11 ECU is the same as a post 98 US ECU I believe, hence I didn't think they would do it.

Also, remember that there are differences between US and European SR20DE engines (different compression, no EGR etc) which means the ECU code has to be different. I doubt these differences would be too much of a challenge for the JWT boys though.

The Unichip will work fine with any SR20DE engine to the best of my knowledge.

Originally posted by Anthony
Last I heard, JWT would only accept pre-98 US ECUs for programming. The European P11 ECU is the same as a post 98 US ECU I believe, hence I didn't think they would do it.

You are correct in the pre-98 US ECU programming. I did not know P11s were post 98-like, hence my "uninformed" question.

Originally posted by Anthony
Also, remember that there are differences between US and European SR20DE engines (different compression, no EGR etc) which means the ECU code has to be different. I doubt these differences would be too much of a challenge for the JWT boys though.

YEs the code IS different but the info I got was that the lack of emmision stuff does make programming easier than US-spec ECUs. In any case it should be a "we will try to program it and see what we will come up with - no guarantees though since we have not done it before" affair.

Originally posted by Anthony
The Unichip will work fine with any SR20DE engine to the best of my knowledge.
OK thanks. Next step is to contact my local dealer.

Chris