$30,000 Full-Size Sedan Comparo

A friend of mine is looking for a full-size sedan that stickers for $30,000 or less. Her priorities are lots of interior space, good build quality, and good acceleration performance. An automatic transmission is required. We've narrowed it down to three contenders:

- 2005 Toyota Avalon Touring: $28,600
- 2005 Chrysler 300 Touring: $27,270
- 2005 Nissan Maxima 3.5 SE: $27,500

All three of them should have enough interior space and sufficient build quality to satisfy her, so it's gonna come down which one looks better, drives better, and ends up costing the least. The Avalon has Lexus-like refinement and an awesome 280 hp V6. The 300 has RWD and attention-getting looks. The Maxima has a long and successful history, and a very sporty demeanor. My money's on the Avalon, but all three are really great choices. So, which one do you think is the best choice?

Also, for reference, here is an edmunds.com comparison between the three, with all the info on them you should need: Click Here (http://www.edmunds.com/apps/nvc/edmunds/VehicleComparison;jsessionid=Cp9WyDh1cZ3Bbhw2xJrVM 3TbH4MvZGdFTClwPMnmQKR4bwxN356c!-1169600705?styleid=100510857&styleid=100378297&styleid=100457504&maxvehicles=5&refid=&op=3&tab=print)

well if she is looking for good acceleration performance among those cars, the 300 touring is the weakest. 250ish hp in a car around 4000 lbs is not gonna be that quick.

A friend of mine recently bought the avalon (not the 2005 but maybe a 2002) and is very pleased with it. and with the 280 hp that car is gonna move pretty well. Also the refinement as you said is quite nice.

The maxima is also a good choice, a very sporty looking car with good acceleration. I have been in one and the ride is smooth. I would say have her test drive the avalon and maxima, and forget about the 300 unless she upgrades to the hemi or (very unlikely but worth a shot) srt-8.

She can afford the HEMI, but she wouldn't like to spend more than $30,000. Oh, and the 300 Touring only weighs 3766 lbs. With 250 hp, it isn't slow, but I agree that it certainly isn't as fast as the Avalon or Maxima.

I have driven in a 05 Maxima. Very nice car. I was very impressed by it. The seat would come back for you to get in than move back to its previous position once you shut the door. Beautiful interior, Plenty of power for what it is. Attractive on the outside, moreso than the toyota in my opinion. Lots of features and attractive is what I liked about it. It also had that long sunroof.

The only one of these I've driven is the 300, and I loved the quality of the suspension - it felt very German. The interior was a bit cheap, though. According to the automotive press, the Avalon is cleaning up the competition, and on paper, it certainly looks the best. I haven't given a whole lot of thought to the Maxima. It's definitely the sportiest and boldest of the group - I'm not sure exactly what that will translate into on the road, though.

I admit to not having driven either of the other two, so I can't really give a unbiased comparison. All I can say is the Maxima was very nice and I suggest taking one for a drive while you shop around.

Sluggish acceleration with base V6
Not as much fun to drive as a Chrysler 300

i think that sums it up pretty well right there...:D

i would take the maxima...your basically driving a G35 sedan backwards with the maxima being FWD.

im sorry but i dont like the 300C...the look is nice but i am personnaly already tired of seeing it and i felt like i was siting on a yacht, not a car. and the 6cyl makes it that much worse...chrysler didnt have straightline performance in mind at all when they built the 6cyl. no shiftable automatic (not a big deal, but a cool feature that is coming standard on most cars now)...and it is alot slower than the HP/TQ numbers would leave you to believe.

the avalon is nice...and i must say it looks a hell of alot better than the previous 2 models. nice features...but the maxima takes tke cake for me. even how nice the avalon is, the maxima is a tad better with a better price tag.

my :2cents:

The "base V6" that Edmunds is referring to is the 190 horsepower, 2.7L V6. The 250 horsepower V6 will get the 300 to 60 mph in about seven seconds flat. It's not as quick as the Avalon or Maxima, but still more than adequate.

i have driven all 3 of them, and i hate to admit it, but the new avalon is very very nice. it looks great, the interior is even better then the maxima. this is probrably the only toyota sedan i will ever buy. they really got rid of the old man's car image that was embedded with the old avalons.

my second choice would have to be the maxima. they look great, and has a very unique interior, but its not quit on par with the avalon, this normally would've been my first choice ( being a nissan guy and all ) but the avalon is just too nice to deny ( even though i'm not a fan of toyota )

and last place brings me down to the 300. the non v8 300's have ugly rims, and the interior is cheap. oddly enough, even the dodge maginum has a better interior then the 300. also these cars like all american cars will depreciate like crazy.

Why does everyone forget the Subaru Legacy GT in these types of comparisons?

Also, if you a AWD sedan that is a bit more luxury oriented then performance there is always the Jaguar X-Type.

Another very reasonable car, which everyone seems to pass over as well, is the Pontiac Grand Prix, with the GTP being a pretty nice performance bargain.

And lets not forget Hyundai with their new Azera, which looks about as well draped as a Lexus GS300, it is FWD, at a much cheaper price. Not to mention coming standard with a pretty powerful 265hp V6.

He may not have forgotten them, he only said that he narrowed it down to the 3 listed above. Could be he didn't like something about them or since it was a girl, she just didnt like the way they looked.

i would go with the Nissan Maxima, they're really nice inside and out, good performance, handling, comfortable ride

He may not have forgotten them, he only said that he narrowed it down to the 3 listed above. Could be he didn't like something about them or since it was a girl, she just didnt like the way they looked.

I guess you have a point there. If it were between those three, then if you want performance I would go for the Nissan Maxima. However, if you are leaning more towards interior space and luxury then the Chrysler 300 would be it. As for quality the Toyota Avalon would probably prevail there, as well as pretty good interior space.

When it comes down to it, the best and probably most balanced in those three characteristics even though the slowest when it comes to acceleration would be the 300 Touring, which I didn't realize before but also has AWD.:icon16:

well he wanted a full size car. the legacy gt is kinda small. its hardly a mid size. but if that is not an issue, then the subaru is also a very very nice car.

Why does everyone forget the Subaru Legacy GT in these types of comparisons?

Also, if you a AWD sedan that is a bit more luxury oriented then performance there is always the Jaguar X-Type.

Another very reasonable car, which everyone seems to pass over as well, is the Pontiac Grand Prix, with the GTP being a pretty nice performance bargain.

And lets not forget Hyundai with their new Azera, which looks about as well draped as a Lexus GS300, it is FWD, at a much cheaper price. Not to mention coming standard with a pretty powerful 265hp V6.

I like the Legacy GT quite a lot, but it isn't anywhere near full-size. It's barely a mid-size as it is.

I find it very, very funny that you recommended the X-Type. Why? Because that's what she's currently driving (the lease is about to be up), and take it from both of us, that thing is a piece of SHIT. It's also nowhere near full-size.

While the Grand Prix is by no means a junky car, it's not put together nearly as well as the Avalon, 300, or Maxima. And it'd need the supercharged motor to make the same kind of power as those three. Since she's not going to be modding the car at all, there's no point in getting a supercharged motor over an N/A motor. She's not looking for a pure sports sedan; she's looking for a luxurious and refined sedan with some pep, a luxury-sport with ample amounts of both.

I've never heard of the Hyundai Azera. I have, however, heard of the Hyundai XG350. Unfortunately, its acceleration is far slower than the competition's (194 horsepower from a 3.5L V6? The three I listed are all making 250+). And the styling is unbearably bland.

Sorry, but don't bother recommending any other than the three I have listed. Believe me, we've looked over all the possibilities carefully, and these are the best contenders in our book.

Actually the Subaru Legacy is more of an actual mid-sized sedan rather than barely (http://www.edmunds.com/apps/nvc/edmunds/VehicleComparison;jsessionid=CqL9VWHrvqsWymNnJjHs9 11jYRFrbybZLXk2pWtt96GSbPqfYtwS!-1570105463?styleid=100396976&styleid=100457505&styleid=100510857&styleid=100473429&styleid=100398514&maxvehicles=5&refid=&op=3&tab=specs), as well as the Mazda6 if you take a glance at the dementions. Even though they're roughly 10 inches smaller in length and width, thus being a full class smaller then the others you compared.

As for the Jaguar X-Type, I have heard of it being unreliable but I guess how unreliable, I don't know and with hearing from many owners hear about how problematic it is, it is probably not worth getting as a good all around sedan.

As for the Hyundai Azera, it isn't too surprising that you don't know about it. It made its first appearance at the New York Auto Show, and had some good coverage but obviously not as much as any of the concepts or a more luxurious plus extensive sedan such as the Acura RL. But that doesn't make it a bad sedan, actually far from it. To sum it all up it is slotted to replace the XG350 by Fall 05. It is a full-sized sedan that it meant to compete with a baseline luxury sedans such as the Lexus ES330 and Acura TL at the price of a entry level sedan, sort of like the Grand Prix. However unlike the Grand Prix the Azera will receive many things standard such as the 5 speed automatic with triptonic shifting, dual climate control and the 3.8l 265hp V6 with CVVT, so it shouldn't be underpowered, as well as other features. From what is reported the Azera should start out at $21-23k and in the late $20s fully loaded. Here (http://www.hyundaiazera.com/) is Hyundai's site on the Azera, as well as an article (http://www.autoweb.com/content/shared/articles/templates/index.cfm/article_id_int/461) that covers it and if you are too lazy or can't find the specs here (http://www.hyundaiazera.com/features_specs/specifications.aspx) it is. So if you and your friend are still looking around for a sedan in Fall, give the Azera a try.

What I meant is that the Legacy is small for a mid-size, and we're looking for full-sizes anyways. Thanks for the blurb about the Azera, I'll definitely keep it in mind. Her lease isn't up for another two months, so if she hasn't bought something before then, the Azera may be available.

How about a used Chrysler 300C?

Negative. She doesn't not want a 300C because its priced higher than $30,000. She just doesn't want or need that much power. Why pay for a used 300C what you can for a new 300 Touring, and get better gas mileage to boot?

I'd go with the Maxima. I'm not fond of the Avalon's looks, and if the new Maxima performs like the previous models it's a winner in my book.

C&D liked the Avalon in a similar comparison to this, and I tend to agree with them.

PS. Happy 50th C&D

C&D liked the Avalon in a similar comparison to this, and I tend to agree with them.

Car and Driver and Edmunds, my two most trusted resources, both had a full-size sedan comparison recently, and the Avalon won both of them. So yeah, that's part of why I think I'll like it so much.

I'd cut my balls off before driving a Toyota Avalon, unless I drove a taxi, since that's all Avalons get used for, I've only ever seen about 5 or 6 Avalons that weren't Taxis.


The new Maximas have cool engines, but they're also fugly and not that good to drive, also the Interior quality of the NZDM version (aka Teana) I drove was mediocre.


The 300C is the only way to go, certainly better than the unimaginative cloned crap that the Japanese makers are spewing out.


The Japanese big cars will be more reliable, but that's about all they have going for them.

I don't give a fuck what you think about the old Avalon, because the new ones are completely different. I already stated why she's not considering the 300C, so read the rest of the fucking thread. If you're basing your opinions off of NZDM cars, then you shouldn't have posted, because a quick check of my profile will reveal that I live in the USA, so don't use that excuse, either.

What is honestly the difference between a USDM Maxima and a Teana? Nothing much, different body (US Maxima is just as fugly), slightly bigger, slightly heavier and probably an even cheaper interior.


The new Avalon still looks boring, it's just as dull as anyother Toyota, still simply a clone of every other car on the road, still nothing in the way of originality. I'll give you my impressions of the new one after my next trip to the airport, unless of course I get picked up by a Maxima.

At least the 300 (Or 300C or whatever you call it) is original and won't end up as either a taxi or company car.


I'm simply giving the Point of view of a car enthusiat, I'm not sure if your friend likes cars or not, but if she doesn't, then a Japper is perfect for her, as they were designed for people who see cars as an appliance, much like a fridge or a dishwasher.

The new Avalon is significantly better then the previous version. I didn't like the old one either, it was definitely the Japanese Buick; but the new one is very different. 280hp, 0-60 in 6 (C&D). If it weren't for the Toyota badge and the lowish cost, you would think it was a Lexus. It is probably the best FWD large car on the market (well, maybe the Acura TL).

I'm not sure if your friend likes cars or not, but if she doesn't, then a Japper is perfect for her, as they were designed for people who see cars as an appliance, much like a fridge or a dishwasher.

The 300 isn't a particularly interesting car either. If she wanted something fun in this price range, she would be looking at a 325i or a G35; rather she is looking for something more practical.

I'm simply giving the Point of view of a car enthusiat, I'm not sure if your friend likes cars or not, but if she doesn't, then a Japper is perfect for her, as they were designed for people who see cars as an appliance, much like a fridge or a dishwasher.


its funny you said that because here in the states, its boring american cars that are used as fleet and government vehciles such as the boring ford crown victoria, chevy impala, and all the other ford crown vic clowns are used for taxi's.

in the states, the japanese cars such as nissan are considered very very sporty, and its the american cars that are considered mundane boring appliances such as the ford taurus, dodge intrepid, countless buicks, and chevy impalas, or monte carlos. all are utter boring crap that can't perform for anything, let alone handle.

also the chrysler 300 that they are comparing is not a the 300c which means it not a hemi powered v8. but a more mundane v6 with ugly rims and crappier interior compared to all the japanese cars mentioned in the list. if you thought the nissan had a crappy interior, then the chrysler 300 or most american cars ( including the viper and corvette) will you give a heart attack.

What is honestly the difference between a USDM Maxima and a Teana? Nothing much, different body (US Maxima is just as fugly), slightly bigger, slightly heavier and probably an even cheaper interior.


The new Avalon still looks boring, it's just as dull as anyother Toyota, still simply a clone of every other car on the road, still nothing in the way of originality. I'll give you my impressions of the new one after my next trip to the airport, unless of course I get picked up by a Maxima.

At least the 300 (Or 300C or whatever you call it) is original and won't end up as either a taxi or company car.


I'm simply giving the Point of view of a car enthusiat, I'm not sure if your friend likes cars or not, but if she doesn't, then a Japper is perfect for her, as they were designed for people who see cars as an appliance, much like a fridge or a dishwasher.

Sorry, but it's a HELL of a lot different in the States. I doubt I will ever see a 2005 Avalon used as a taxi, and I live in Las Vegas, so I see a shitload of taxis. The car is basically a Lexus ES 330 with more passenger space, more power, better handling with the Touring model, and a lower cost. The 300, on the other hand, is used as a taxi all the time around here. The 300 looked fresh when it came out, but the styling has already gotten mundane, and the interior is not even in the same class as the two "Jappers". It's not as sporty, either. You'd think that with rear-wheel-drive, it'd outhandle the Avalon and the Maxima, but it doesn't even come close, and the acceleration is nearly a full second slower. The 300C solves the acceleration problem, but as I've said three times now, she's not considering a 300C, just a 300 Touring. Don't get me wrong, the 300 has its merits - the passenger space is superb, the suspension is very nicely damped, and the aggressive styling still has an impact on the common non-car enthusiast passerby - but it's the black sheep in this comparison, in my opinion.

Anyways, I don't know if you're racist, biased, or just ignorant about the "Jappers", but your opinion isn't very helpful. The Japanese sedans here are perceived as being sportier, more refined, and more aggressively styled than their American competition - hardly what I'd call "appliances".

I'd cut my balls off before driving a Toyota Avalon, unless I drove a taxi, since that's all Avalons get used for, I've only ever seen about 5 or 6 Avalons that weren't Taxis.


The new Maximas have cool engines, but they're also fugly and not that good to drive, also the Interior quality of the NZDM version (aka Teana) I drove was mediocre.


The 300C is the only way to go, certainly better than the unimaginative cloned crap that the Japanese makers are spewing out.


The Japanese big cars will be more reliable, but that's about all they have going for them.

emm that's not a NZDM car....is Asia oceania car....i been in Teana before, they interior is great, wood that u can tell is wood and seat that are soft and comfortable. not sure about the acc though, but from the previouse generation (I30 in the US) 3.0litre is more then enough if u want to eat E class off the line

dodge intrepid

The Intrepid has been replaced by the rwd Charger.