Supra vs Panda, Carrera S vs Panda

Ok, leaving the Dyno place. Which is dominated by Supras. I was being tailed by a modded out Supra.

It was white with carbon-fiber hood, wheels, slight body kit. The usual pretty stuff. It also had a nice exhaust, not sure of other mods. But if it's like any of the other Supras that dyno'd it was 370+whp.

Anywho, he had a buddy ridding with him. He pulls up behind me and I gun it then let off letting him know I'm game. He jumps out into the other lane and blasts by me. I pull along side and the Gods part the traffic ahead and give us clear lanes at the red traffic light.

My buddy is following me in his Saturn, watching. I'm waiting, not sure if he's gonna go for it. He's not reving out or 'staging'. Light goes yellow, I hear him rev up a little... Our light goes green. I rev up slightly and let the clutch out a bit too fast and bog out for a moment.

The Z regains herself and I sling shot through the intersection which was all chopped up asphault... I hit second gear and the rear started to step out due to the road being sooo uneven. Once it caught itself, I get half way through second gear and a car pulls out infront of me and I have to get hard on the brakes.

The Supra was about 2 car lengths behind me the entire time. My friend said, when the guy hit it... he had massive axel hop and the car bogged out. The downside to having too wide of a tire, I suppose. It's better to burn out slightly.. IMO.

Given the lead I got at the launch, it probably would of taken him till about 90-100mph to catch back up. But, on a residential street with a limit of 35mph. I wouldn't of gone that far.

We get around the car, and I take off.. give him a thumbs up.

We fooled around a few times, but he never did want to line up again evenly. We all took a turn down another street. I got beside him again, and he wouldn't go for it.

It's like he originally underestimated me, then when I shot out off the line far quicker than he... he didn't want his butt hurt again. But, I know... had he launched for reals. I probably would of gotten wasted. I know when a car far out classes me. :lol:

He falls back some, and gets on it... I try to downshift to get some boost on the motor to stop his advance. But he's already moving way too fast. And.. it's a Twin Turbo Supra... I'll need a bit more than what I've got to fuck one of them up from a roll.

Although, to my defense. Once I got into some boost, the Supra was only 1.5 cars ahead... and wasn't pulling me very hard. It wasn't moving all that fast really. We let off at around 80-85mph.

Now that I think about it, maybe he wasn't as modded out as I thought. Maybe just the normal BOV, Exhaust and pretty body mods.

At any rate, we slow down for a nasty dip. And start to cool it down, I let my buddy catch up and pass me, since I needed to follow him to where we were going to eat.

He pulls up to the Supra as they're driving, and here's the conversation according to him... and judging by the body language of the Supra guys. I don't doubt it...

Friend: Heyy... that little white car is pretty fast huh?
Supra driver: yeah... its okay
Friend: Nah, It's pretty fast... I saw it get you at that light...
Supra driver: whatever!

:lol:


Then the Supra guy turns off into a left-turn lane and we go by I give them a final thumbs up and the Supra guy just sorta gives me a unhappy smile and a slight nod... I guess he was pretty miffed that somebody had seen him... and told him that they saw him get worked by a 33 year old car. Even if it only lasted 2 gears.:rofl:


Skip ahead a few hours...


Meet back up with my buddy with the Saturn. For coffee and the usual BS... and to talk more about the Supra dude.

I go to take off, hop on the freeway and a newer Carrera S goes past. I think nothing of it really, but I've that mood for racing... dyno pulls... horsepower... race gas... racing Supras... I was still ready for some racing.

I slowly make my way up to him. And pace him about 3 car lengths back at about 80mph. I guess he wasn't happy about me following. So he stepped it up to 95mph. So did I.

He must of thought I was like...and Audi... or some other Euro car. Cause he started to pick his way through traffic about 100mph. I followed, albeit better lines than him cause I was actually gaining on him through traffic... not to mention I bumped myself up to 110mph.

Not that there was much traffic, was fairly light. I go around a car and end up back behind him. He then steps it up a notch to 120mph.

I guess he figured he'd lost me, but what he didn't realise was that as he went around another car, I went into the other lane to his right... rather than follow. I could see him checking his mirrors as I sat pretty much in his blind spot at 120mph. Then I gave her a bit more gas to come along side of him...and came into the lane next to him...

My nose was at his door, when you could see his head slowly turned to his right... it looked like he had this quizzical look. As if to say, "hmm... I can't see that car that was following me anymore... excellent... wait... what's this in the corner of my eye.... " that's when his eyes saw me sitting door to door with him at 120mph.

His mouth opened slightly... in what looked like shock. He couldn't see the shit eating grin on my face :D, but I'm dead sure he saw me give him a wave. Then traffic slowed us down, we had plenty of time to slow down...

After that, I was a head... cruising at about 80mph. I saw him keep trying to come up on me. But I just kept giving it gas and keeping him back. He never would follow me over 100mph from that point. And honestly, had he gone full bore he would of left me behind.

Carrera S's aren't slow... especially on the freeway. But I think he lost nerve going that speed. I don't blame him, sometimes it scares the helloutta me. Even if it's on the same stretch of freeway I've done in on before.

When I head to my offramp... i put my window down to give him a thumbs up. But he wouldn't even look at me.

Ugh, oh well... I guess it was my day to race with not so fun people. Fun day though!

:thumbsup: Good job on the Supra and the S. Your car is mean mother f*cker.

You still sure you want to get rid of that car Matt? Isn't satisfying to beat up on new age sports cars with a relic? I know I love it.

Nice runs dude.

A Supra cant be beat. Ever. Not by nothing...














Lol, JP. I used to Love Supras so much, thought they were unbeatable. I still want one all sexed up, but not as much as some other cars. Good kills.

It is fun to play with the newer cars and show them that old cars still have game in this day and age.

But, sadly... with it being old... it's just not the best daily driver. As I say, the Z is only fun to me now when it's going fast. And that's not a good thing. :lol:

Friend: Heyy... that little white car is pretty fast huh?
Supra driver: yeah... its okay
Friend: Nah, It's pretty fast... I saw it get you at that light...
Supra driver: whatever!



Why is it that everyone has that one friend :dunno: that does all the trash talking for ya? Nice runs. Saw a carrera S today as well...unfortunantly, we were following it in a Jeep Grand Cherokee, so we were more than a bit outclassed...

Why is it that everyone has that one friend :dunno: that does all the trash talking for ya? Nice runs. Saw a carrera S today as well...unfortunantly, we were following it in a Jeep Grand Cherokee, so we were more than a bit outclassed...



I dunno, but it keeps me outta trouble so I'm cool with it. Plus he's 6'2" 200+lbs... not too many people will talk back.:lol:

Nice kill on the Supra. I think the guy in the S was just shocked to see a car that old keeping up with him.

Nice kills :thumbsup:

What did the panda pull on the dyno anyway?

Nice kills :thumbsup:

What did the panda pull on the dyno anyway?


Check the thread here... (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=416642)

hehe nice write up man, love the s story, hehe love messen with the rich bastards that think they own the roads. lol

keep zing dude!

nice runs, sound like a day of good old fashion Z kills

My bad, I should've known it was in the non-specific forum. Thanks for the link...

nice run on the supra.

What have you done to your Z to make it so fast bro?

Some good times eh. Glad to hear you had them in the Z.

What do you mean with the fact you only like to race it. Is it so uncomfortable to ride in, or does it make to much noise?

I would love to ride a nice old fast car like yrs. but that's probably personal taste.

What have you done to your Z to make it so fast bro?

S13 Redtop SR20DET
S13 5 speed
R200 3.9 Differential
Autometer Air/Fuel Ratio Gauge
Autometer Boost gauge
Autometer Sport Comp 10,000rpm tach
Tokico lowering springs
Greddy style intake manifold
Equal length turbo manifold
3” Turbo back (Full) Exhaust
Megan N1 Racing Muffler
Tial blowoff valve
Blitz electronic boost controller
Blitz turbo timer
Howes Racing Radiator
Electric Fan
Large Intercooler (flows 510hp)
Fidanza 9.5lb lightweight Flywheel
ACT street/strip clutch
Greddy Rocker Arm stoppers
Power Slot slotted rotors
Hawk Ferro-Carbon brake pads
Earls Stainless Steel brake lines

oh thats it? no NAWS sticker for an extra 200whp? jk, impressive list. how long did it take you?

S13 Redtop SR20DET
S13 5 speed
R200 3.9 Differential
Autometer Air/Fuel Ratio Gauge
Autometer Boost gauge
Autometer Sport Comp 10,000rpm tach
Tokico lowering springs
Greddy style intake manifold
Equal length turbo manifold
3” Turbo back (Full) Exhaust
Megan N1 Racing Muffler
Tial blowoff valve
Blitz electronic boost controller
Blitz turbo timer
Howes Racing Radiator
Electric Fan
Large Intercooler (flows 510hp)
Fidanza 9.5lb lightweight Flywheel
ACT street/strip clutch
Greddy Rocker Arm stoppers
Power Slot slotted rotors
Hawk Ferro-Carbon brake pads
Earls Stainless Steel brake lines



That's an impressive list for a VR-4!!!


:lol:



It took me about 5 weeks, and my main sponsor: Visa

Lol personal credit card sponsor or a real sponsor?

Gorgeous

Lol personal credit card sponsor or a real sponsor?


haha, credit card... that'd be sweet to have Visa as your sponsor though.

I mean, you could buy anything... from any manufacture without worrying about pissing off another Sponsor. Like, a Greddy intake manifold and a HKS exhaust manifold... nobody would care. :lol:

Some good times eh. Glad to hear you had them in the Z.

What do you mean with the fact you only like to race it. Is it so uncomfortable to ride in, or does it make to much noise?

I would love to ride a nice old fast car like yrs. but that's probably personal taste.


Shit, almost forgot your post...


What do I mean? I mean like, that the car is only fun to me when I'm racing/going fast. Otherwise, it's uncomfortable... noisey... hot in the summer (no A/C)... cold in the winter (no heater). And the exhaust gets on my nerves sometimes... buzzing and droning in the cabin. Not that I removed any sound deadening, the car never had any. That is to say, Z's never came with it back in the day. So it gets old hearing buzzing and rattles of the car at lower speeds, it only quiets out when the motor is running hard. Funny how that works.

Not to mention, I get tired of driving stick sometimes. Most of my driving is in the city... in traffic. And people around here don't know how to pace themselves so that they catch all the green lights.

They all sprint ahead to a red light. So they can wait. :screwy:

Thus, I get stuck pushing a damn pedal all day. :lol:

I don't mind driving stick, I love it. Just not everyday. I'd like an automatic vehicle of some sort next, and maybe something that sits a bit higher. The car is pretty low, so I can't see through or over traffic like I can in my work vans. I like that feeling, being able to see things happen way ahead and being able to slow down without having that sudden paniced "oh shit" stop like I get in the Z every now and again.

Hope that explains it.

Old fast cars are not only fun, they're great. But not everyday. It's nice to get into a newer vehicle and just cruise in relative silence and zone out. :lol:

Excellent story! :icon16:

I've always liked Datsuns, and I wish we had more Datsuns up here because I want a 510.....

Toronto is a crappy place that only sells Civics, Accords, Camrys or Corollas, and people who can't drive. :disappoin Rarely do I ever see a Japanese car on the roads that were made prior to the year 2000. I am so jealous.

Not to mention, I get tired of driving stick sometimes. Most of my driving is in the city... in traffic. And people around here don't know how to pace themselves so that they catch all the green lights.

And people always ask why if I get the ///M3, I want the SMG. I agree with ya there, I've had to drive a freinds stick. I suck at getting a stick moving (once I get going, I'm fine, just need practice is all), but in the city, it just blew.

Still...if I had the money, and you were selling it and I had the means to get it, I might make the offer. I think lots of people would. Wouldn't be bad to have as a funday driver. And there are hardly any older Zs around here. Well...any that are running in any way shape or form.

I've had to drive a freinds stick. I suck at getting a stick moving (once I get going, I'm fine, just need practice is all), but in the city, it just blew.

And I just realised how bad that sounded...

Hey redneck, have you ever taken it to the track? What the heck does that thing run?

Edit: I'm coming home from Iraq in Feb-Mar. '06, am i gonna beable to get a shot at that thing?

i dont think he has ran on a track, but i remember him running with a gtech pro a 13.2 i believe with almost no traction in first and a shitty 60ft.

makes me proud to own something remotely close. I have 2700lbs or so in the 240sx but how much do those damn z's weigh? Why don't you go buy a bigger turbo if you're aiming for a vehicle suited for daily driving. Nothing like being able to keep out of full spool at 3000rpm like shortshifting at 2500rpm through traffic and going to use that 3000rpm+ power when you really need it.


Really though, my mod list isn't all too far off from yours, I'm thinking if I got a good tune and a chance to turn the boost up we'd be a good match, I've been learning lately ever since I got my cars about traction woes on medium boost, we'll have to let loose a couple sr20dets of full boost fury onto the streets if you don't wind up selling.

rednecks z weights around 2000lbs.

i dont think he has ran on a track, but i remember him running with a gtech pro a 13.2 i believe with almost no traction in first and a shitty 60ft.

It was 13.4 @ 106 with a 2.2 60ft on some dusty back round that was crap for traction. But it was empty enough to test on. Plus I had 2000LS1Z28 sitting shotgun, I think he weighs close to 180lbs. Tall guy... not to mention that night was the first time I'd drivin the car in 2 months. So, I'd forgotten how to launch the damn car. :lol:


makes me proud to own something remotely close. I have 2700lbs or so in the 240sx but how much do those damn z's weigh? Why don't you go buy a bigger turbo if you're aiming for a vehicle suited for daily driving. Nothing like being able to keep out of full spool at 3000rpm like shortshifting at 2500rpm through traffic and going to use that 3000rpm+ power when you really need it.


Really though, my mod list isn't all too far off from yours, I'm thinking if I got a good tune and a chance to turn the boost up we'd be a good match, I've been learning lately ever since I got my cars about traction woes on medium boost, we'll have to let loose a couple sr20dets of full boost fury onto the streets if you don't wind up selling.


How would buying a bigger turbo help out daily driving? Short shifting at around 2500-2800rpm is fine. Problem is, it does not solve any of the other problems I have with the car. It wouldn't make it anymore comfortable. It wouldn't add A/C. It wouldn't add a heater. And I'd still have to shift it everywhere.

Problems = not solved.

Upgrading to a larger turbo would be about a $2400 job. Cause I'd need the turbo, injectors and some form of ECU tuning and Fuel management system. Then, once I do hit boost... it'll have even worse traction problems.

To solve that, that's another $3800 in full suspension, wheels and tires, and of course a good LSD unit.

So that's $6200 more, just to make it more 'streetable'? Logic escapes me thinking about that. Ontop of that... gas milege as decent as it is. Will go to shit soon as you touch injectors and tuning.

Let us not speak of interior upgrades. To make it comfortable, you'll have to spend another $800 for a quality seat and harness, Double that amount if you want the passenger to be comfortable as well. To make it more comfortable, cause now the car has full suspension. It'll most definately ride stiffer. Due to it being lighter in the front and not enough weight to preload the suspension such as with a I6 or V8 Motor.

Techinically speaking you've made the car lighter, but the balance of the vehicle is disrupted. It is my personal belief that the Z was designed to have a nose heavy load out. With SR20, it does not. Thus to get that balance in handling it once had, you have to carry stiffer springs in the rear to push the weight forward.

But, that makes the ride harsh. And after watching my friends SR240z with full suspension. Ride down a freeway, the front end bounces and isn't as planted as one would think. Spring rates are off maybe? I think it's lack of too much weight.

The one flaw in the SR20DET powered Z. Not enough weight over front axel... not enough traction... not enough down force... understeer.

Cause... and effect.

Can it be fixed? That I'm not sure of. Am I willing to spend an unknown amount of money to find out?

No.

It's a fun car... very fun to toy with. But, I ultimately think it is a flawed design. Although, I seriously hope I'm wrong. Cause it is so fun.


:2cents:

EDIT: I didn't even mention brakes to stop all the power. That's about $1500 alone.

yep that totally explained it. Tx.
I understand it now and i agree with you. When you have no other car it could get irritating some time.

It was 13.4 @ 106 with a 2.2 60ft on some dusty back round that was crap for traction. But it was empty enough to test on. Plus I had 2000LS1Z28 sitting shotgun, I think he weighs close to 180lbs. Tall guy... not to mention that night was the first time I'd drivin the car in 2 months. So, I'd forgotten how to launch the damn car. :lol:





How would buying a bigger turbo help out daily driving? Short shifting at around 2500-2800rpm is fine. Problem is, it does not solve any of the other problems I have with the car. It wouldn't make it anymore comfortable. It wouldn't add A/C. It wouldn't add a heater. And I'd still have to shift it everywhere.

Problems = not solved.

Upgrading to a larger turbo would be about a $2400 job. Cause I'd need the turbo, injectors and some form of ECU tuning and Fuel management system. Then, once I do hit boost... it'll have even worse traction problems.

To solve that, that's another $3800 in full suspension, wheels and tires, and of course a good LSD unit.

So that's $6200 more, just to make it more 'streetable'? Logic escapes me thinking about that. Ontop of that... gas milege as decent as it is. Will go to shit soon as you touch injectors and tuning.

Let us not speak of interior upgrades. To make it comfortable, you'll have to spend another $800 for a quality seat and harness, Double that amount if you want the passenger to be comfortable as well. To make it more comfortable, cause now the car has full suspension. It'll most definately ride stiffer. Due to it being lighter in the front and not enough weight to preload the suspension such as with a I6 or V8 Motor.

Techinically speaking you've made the car lighter, but the balance of the vehicle is disrupted. It is my personal belief that the Z was designed to have a nose heavy load out. With SR20, it does not. Thus to get that balance in handling it once had, you have to carry stiffer springs in the rear to push the weight forward.

But, that makes the ride harsh. And after watching my friends SR240z with full suspension. Ride down a freeway, the front end bounces and isn't as planted as one would think. Spring rates are off maybe? I think it's lack of too much weight.

The one flaw in the SR20DET powered Z. Not enough weight over front axel... not enough traction... not enough down force... understeer.

Cause... and effect.

Can it be fixed? That I'm not sure of. Am I willing to spend an unknown amount of money to find out?

No.

It's a fun car... very fun to toy with. But, I ultimately think it is a flawed design. Although, I seriously hope I'm wrong. Cause it is so fun.


:2cents:

EDIT: I didn't even mention brakes to stop all the power. That's about $1500 alone.


oh well my swap came with A/C and all that good stuff :lol:
Sits pretty comfy too. I was half sarcastic when I mentioned the idea of a bigger turbo because the larger injectors needed along with the tune you'd have to run would rape you as far as gas would be concerned. I still like the idea of full spool at 3000rpm though. Too bad you didn't get her swapped into a 240sx (half sarcastic of course once more as it is a really cool project/car from my perspective) because my ride is amazing with the stock suspension.

oh well my swap came with A/C and all that good stuff :lol:
Sits pretty comfy too. I was half sarcastic when I mentioned the idea of a bigger turbo because the larger injectors needed along with the tune you'd have to run would rape you as far as gas would be concerned. I still like the idea of full spool at 3000rpm though. Too bad you didn't get her swapped into a 240sx (half sarcastic of course once more as it is a really cool project/car from my perspective) because my ride is amazing with the stock suspension.

Hehe, understood...

But, I've got that fancy exhaust manifold, so I get full spool around 3500-3800rpm. Which I'm happy with.

damn supras!

nice races, sorry i didnt catch this thread earlier

the car in stock form weighs around 2350 lbs. The sr20 is quite a bit lighter but not enough to bring the car down to 2000 lbs. Since the car still has stock brakes, stock gas tank, stock dash. Guessing its around 2200-2250 lbs right around there without driver.

You ricer. Claiming victory after only 2 gears. Psshtt!

hahah

hahah

Lol. I figured you'd get the "two gears" joke, considering I have a GM Powerglide tranny, lol.

And go buy you a damn car trailer and use that super fast Econoline Van to pull it around and turn that Z car into a real racecar! Build you a small block, powerglide, and get ya a narrowed rear end and just turn that thing into a racecar. If you think its fun now when you're racing, then you'll really think its fun then!

Yeah... we'll see about that.

Don't hold your breathe on it though Matt! :lol:

Lol. Well its a thought. And since you're down close to 2000 lbs, then you'd wind up weighing around 2500 when you got through with everything you needed. Maybe even less. Anyways, weight is where you get your speed! I wished mine only weighed 2300 or so instead of 2700. I'd have a 9 second car no doubt.

I mean it'd run into some money, but you'd be spending alot on a new car as well, lol. I konw you can get a professional tube frame and 12-point roll cage where all you got to do is weld it together from JEGS for less tehn $600 I THINK. You've probably already got rack and pinion steering, but if not, you can get that with the frame (also can get a 4-link or ladder bar rear suspension). Now that gets expensive, but I'd say for around $5000-6000 you could have a rolling chassis that's professionally designed, and thats how you make a super good race car.

That's what I want to do for mine one of these days. I've got a tube frame, but its home made out of triple strenght steel and its big and VERY heavy. That'd also give me a rack and pinion steering, and front discs (got rear disc, but front drums).

...Let us not speak of interior upgrades. To make it comfortable, you'll have to spend another $800 for a quality seat and harness, Double that amount if you want the passenger to be comfortable as well. To make it more comfortable, cause now the car has full suspension. It'll most definately ride stiffer. Due to it being lighter in the front and not enough weight to preload the suspension such as with a I6 or V8 Motor.

Techinically speaking you've made the car lighter, but the balance of the vehicle is disrupted. It is my personal belief that the Z was designed to have a nose heavy load out. With SR20, it does not. Thus to get that balance in handling it once had, you have to carry stiffer springs in the rear to push the weight forward.

But, that makes the ride harsh. And after watching my friends SR240z with full suspension. Ride down a freeway, the front end bounces and isn't as planted as one would think. Spring rates are off maybe? I think it's lack of too much weight.

The one flaw in the SR20DET powered Z. Not enough weight over front axel... not enough traction... not enough down force... understeer.

Cause... and effect.

Can it be fixed? That I'm not sure of. Am I willing to spend an unknown amount of money to find out?

No.

It's a fun car... very fun to toy with. But, I ultimately think it is a flawed design. Although, I seriously hope I'm wrong. Cause it is so fun.


:2cents:

EDIT: I didn't even mention brakes to stop all the power. That's about $1500 alone.
Wait.....are you admitting that it just may have been a better idea to drop the 383 into the 240, rather than the SR20? Oh, man, I soo called this like a year ago..... :lol:

You and your quest for light weight..... psh. Wouldn't that 383 have weighed little more than the original I6 that was in it?

Wait.....are you admitting that it just may have been a better idea to drop the 383 into the 240, rather than the SR20? Oh, man, I soo called this like a year ago..... :lol:

You and your quest for light weight..... psh. Wouldn't that 383 have weighed little more than the original I6 that was in it?


Nope not saying that at all.

The 383 would of been a bad choice for that car, too much down low power. It would never of hooked, how many times do I have to explain that, that 383 would be making 400+ft-lbs @ 2000 - 4500rpm... That's not much off idle.

Never hook. :grinno:

not to mention he had to keep an sr away from the 240sx boys

Nope not saying that at all.

The 383 would of been a bad choice for that car, too much down low power. It would never of hooked, how many times do I have to explain that, that 383 would be making 400+ft-lbs @ 2000 - 4500rpm... That's not much off idle.

Never hook. :grinno:

You could have made it hook. It woudl have took a little more greenstuff, but you could have made it hook. Ladder bar or 4-link suspension and big tires and you could have got some traction. You may not have had much for going around curves, but who cares about going around curves!?!?!?!?

You could have got ya a turbo400 or so tranny with a stall converter and it woudl have brought the front tires off the ground if you'd had somebody to set the rear suspension up right.