problem i don't understand

The problem I have is I can't find out where people are working who can afford to drive these cars and trucks. I'm mean come on $30,000 and well on up in the $50,000 range for a truck. I was dumb enough to pay $13,000 about 2 1/2 years ago a piece of shit chevy truck that I'm not at all happy with 98 4x4. All though with out a doubt it much better than the new body style. Now what I can't figure out is what is the real reason for the cost. It's not labor that for damn sure. sure in hell not for testing they would fail that. Technology no can't be that combustion engine in over a 100 years never change. How to improve gas mileage nope not there either. Instead we pay some stupid four year degree yuppy to come up with moving foot controls now there a feature we need. or how about turn signals in the mirrors oh can't live without those. people i'm not writing this to bash just GM trust me I'm bashing them but also doing the same to all car companies. See what I don't understand is why so many people are in love with these things. If people would open there eyes and start seeing the real picture and demanding what we want not what were told we should have. I know some many people whose house could use some work or whose kids are getting married and need some help to pay for it. Or even college. But instead mom and daddy get a new car every year or two. and the line of crap they use i need a dependable car to get to work. And they work 15 minutes from home. i drive 50,000 miles a year and my truck make it most of the time.

you may not agree but you should think about it

the same thing happend to motorcycles. the rub's "rich urban bikers" took over and would pay out of line prices for crap. now you have harleys that go for more than a new house. same bike but the cost is out of wack.

trucks were made to do work. I do a lot of long trips with the bed full of equpment. I am a poor boy just trying to make a buck.

now that trucks are the cool thing and yuppys need them to take there bikes on long trips. thay dont like the cheep rides and will pay the heavy cash for the un-needed options. who needs sports car like handling. its a truck it should be made to hual loads of stuff to the job site not cradle you bum and play mp3 or look good on a date.

who needs sports car like handling. its a truck it should be made to hual loads of stuff to the job site not cradle you bum and play mp3 or look good on a date.

It damn well better when it is your only car. It's my only vehicle, and I really don't want a second vehicle. See, I think that's where the confusion is coming in. Back when I was a kid, if you had a truck, you also had a car. I think this is not the case any more, at least most of the time. I have one vehicle, and that is my truck. I do construction work, so that's why I got a truck instead of a car. However, since it is my only vehicle, I baby it and keep it immaculately clean, even if it means washing it every day when I get home.

i think hes got a point, altho hes slightly misguided on sum stuff. prices r pretty crazy. and i hear u on the bikes too. my problem was always that im a 2wd guy cuz i dont need 4wd. ever lol. i could never bring myself to spend 30 or 40k on a brand new 4wd, jack it and put 36s on it and then trash it. i'd die. my "nice" truck is a red 2wd, and if i had big, built 4wd it would be 30 years old, primer gray, and i wouldnt worry about beatin it. im not hatin on anyone who drives a 4x4 everyday, believe me, im just sayin if i had one it would only be for a toy on the weekends. do i have any kind of a point here? or am i just rambling? lol

Well...I have 2 trucks. A 77 ford F-100 and a 99 Z71. The Z71 does cradle my bum and it also plays mp3's. oh..and XM too..I guess that makes it worse..and looks damn good on a date. Also will outrun nearly any truck around here. Thats what I bought it for. The 77 is my toy. IT has many dents, and a paint job from the can. It also gets 6 mpg.
Don't come in here and bitch about how I use my truck.
Thank you and Bye bye.

The problem I have is I can't find out where people are working who can afford to drive these cars and trucks. I'm mean come on $30,000 and well on up in the $50,000 range for a truck. I was dumb enough to pay $13,000 about 2 1/2 years ago a piece of shit chevy truck that I'm not at all happy with 98 4x4. All though with out a doubt it much better than the new body style. Now what I can't figure out is what is the real reason for the cost. It's not labor that for damn sure. sure in hell not for testing they would fail that. Technology no can't be that combustion engine in over a 100 years never change. How to improve gas mileage nope not there either. Instead we pay some stupid four year degree yuppy to come up with moving foot controls now there a feature we need. or how about turn signals in the mirrors oh can't live without those. people i'm not writing this to bash just GM trust me I'm bashing them but also doing the same to all car companies. See what I don't understand is why so many people are in love with these things. If people would open there eyes and start seeing the real picture and demanding what we want not what were told we should have. I know some many people whose house could use some work or whose kids are getting married and need some help to pay for it. Or even college. But instead mom and daddy get a new car every year or two. and the line of crap they use i need a dependable car to get to work. And they work 15 minutes from home. i drive 50,000 miles a year and my truck make it most of the time.

you may not agree but you should think about it

I had a 93 Ford that was nickle ,diming me so I thought I would up grade to a newer truck. I can`t afford a new one so I was looking for a deal on a used truck. The truck of my choice would of been a 02 up Dodge with the 4.7l. Since price was a factor I was open to all makes. I ended up with a 2001 Chevy z71 57000 mi $15,800. Believe it or not its hard to find a nice used truck for even $15 grand. Well my 01 is nickle diming me so I guess I should of kept the Ford. Its easier without payments. If the parts in my chevy weren`t so cheaply made it would be the perfect truck. The tie rods are about half the size my 88 chev was. New is nicer but not better. I never owned a Toyota but if they are as good as people say they are I might have to go that way next time. LIKE A ROCK THAT HAS CRUMBLED!

Before Vortec a Chevy drive train couldn`t be beat. Thats why people grew to love Chevrolet. The old enginers with the slide rulers did a better job than the wiz kids with computers. Longevity use to be a concern.

Before Vortec a Chevy drive train couldn`t be beat. Thats why people grew to love Chevrolet. The old enginers with the slide rulers did a better job than the wiz kids with computers. Longevity use to be a concern.

So, you're saying the intake components have taken the pep out of GM's drivetrain? I hate to tell you this, but other than the intake and other accessories (like alternator, a/c compressor, etc.), there is very little difference in either the 4.8L or 5.3L and the small block v8 chevy began using in 1955. All "vortec" is is their latest style of intake, which is only fuel and air delivery. Same old pushrod v8. About the only difference is that in 1955, the SBC did not have an oil filter, and then later it was a remote mounted option. The heads are now aluminum, but the mechanics are all the same. Chevy has probably had a dozen or so intake designs in the past 50 years on the small block. As more R&D occurs and technology increases, they update the intake, but no a lot else changes.

So, you're saying the intake components have taken the pep out of GM's drivetrain? I hate to tell you this, but other than the intake and other accessories (like alternator, a/c compressor, etc.), there is very little difference in either the 4.8L or 5.3L and the small block v8 chevy began using in 1955. All "vortec" is is their latest style of intake, which is only fuel and air delivery. Same old pushrod v8. About the only difference is that in 1955, the SBC did not have an oil filter, and then later it was a remote mounted option. The heads are now aluminum, but the mechanics are all the same. Chevy has probably had a dozen or so intake designs in the past 50 years on the small block. As more R&D occurs and technology increases, they update the intake, but no a lot else changes.

What I`m saying is the pre vortec engines are more durible. The 350 vortecs are prone to intake gasket failers. I know the 4.8 and 5.3 are the same. The basic design is the same as the old small block but they are different. I have a 5.3 that rattles to beat hell when cold that tells me the piston design must be different also. On the other hand my 5.3 is the smoothest engine I ever owned. It is powerful and for what it is it gets good gas mileage. The truth is GM needs to do better and can do better on their next truck. Like I said if they were to fatted up the parts a little they would have the perfect truck. My 1988 Chevy was much more solid and the 350 it had ,had 188000 miles on it, whisper quite, untouched.The current model GM isn`t winning many fans yet its a beautiful truck minus the 03 up Chevy frount clip lol! Vortecs are more powerful but they need to be wrenched on more often. For every improvement GM made on its current truck they went backwards somewhere else. The pre 96 models wernt nearly as nice as the 99 up models but over all a better truck in my own opinon. Buying parts gets old. Short term profit for GM. Long term damage for GM.

I agree with your opinion on this. The 305 and 350 TBI were amazing engines. They will run forever and really didn't have alot of problems. The intake gasket problem with the 96 and up engines were not the fault of the engine or the new intake and fuel delivery system. HOWEVER it WAS a BAD design on the new intake gasket. This problem was not only limited to the truck line. It was spread equally over the v6 and v8 lines, including cars, trucks, and suvs. Piston slap is a bad bad problem, I have it on my 96, although there are other makes and models that have it too, GM has the worst problem with this issue also, my 98 Venture has it so bad I am embarrassed to drive it anywhere before it is warmed up. It is evident that General Motors needs to do more research and development and testing before they put these new engines and vehicles on line and out on the road. I personally would love to see GM come out with a rotary engine in the general motors small suv and car line.

you said it jeverett......I do as I please with my truck......see you and bye-bye.....

Instead we pay some stupid four year degree yuppy to come up with moving foot controls now there a feature we need.
Sounds like you're a little bitter and resentful? May want to try and idiolize and admire people to succceed in life, not resent them.

I know some many people whose house could use some work or whose kids are getting married and need some help to pay for it. Or even college. But instead mom and daddy get a new car every year or two. and the line of crap they use i need a dependable car to get to work. And they work 15 minutes from home. i drive 50,000 miles a year and my truck make it most of the time.
And why the hell should I pay for their stuff that's broken. These people are the only ones with problems? Middle class, upper middle class, rich, EVERYONE has problems. What's the problem with a family buying new cars every few years? You lease them that's pretty simple to do. Most people that actually buy new every year work their asses off.

I'm from a middle class family, we aren't 'loaded' but we live nicely because we know how to save and spend wisely. That's all there is to it. My dad worked his ass off to get where he is today. He could have just sat around taking other peoples shit, but he got motivated and did something about it. It's not our fault people can't motivate themselves to get educated and attempt to move up in life. It's the one's who dwell on their own hardships and insecurities that don't succeed in life. You determine your own destiny, it's not laid out for you. You can't expect something for free.

Sounds like you're a little bitter and resentful? May want to try and idiolize and admire people to succceed in life, not resent them.


And why the hell should I pay for their stuff that's broken. These people are the only ones with problems? Middle class, upper middle class, rich, EVERYONE has problems. What's the problem with a family buying new cars every few years? You lease them that's pretty simple to do. Most people that actually buy new every year work their asses off.

I'm from a middle class family, we aren't 'loaded' but we live nicely because we know how to save and spend wisely. That's all there is to it. My dad worked his ass off to get where he is today. He could have just sat around taking other peoples shit, but he got motivated and did something about it. It's not our fault people can't motivate themselves to get educated and attempt to move up in life. It's the one's who dwell on their own hardships and insecurities that don't succeed in life. You determine your own destiny, it's not laid out for you. You can't expect something for free.

First of all I'm not bitter In fact I think it great that people have some eduction the the problem is what the hell do they learn in school I'm mean come on you pay these big bucks to go school and you don't learn nothing you would think they could have some better designs.

Now when you say it's not your fault I can't get motivated to to get some education and move up in life. I have more motivation than you ever dream of why because everyday i must use it to survive. Not depend on someone else to give me a paycheck I really don't see a need to have a piece of a paper that says i have a degree. I can tell you must a yuppy with all your fancy little saying. You think the only way to make it in this world is to have a education. Many before you and many after you have and still will succeed without that education your so in need of. I'm willing to bet your not self employed instead your one of those that says I have a better idea but yet you don't do anything about it. See I used hire college students that were getting a degree in construction management for the summer try to give some "training" these had to be the dumbest people ever working for me they try to bring book work out in the field sorry my friend it just doesn't work out here. And finally idolize someone what are you 2 years old you should want to be you own person not someone else.

one last thing while rereading your responce to my post it seems your saying everything oppisite to me so in closing your just as bad but you have a degree so your better.

You know, I'm not sure where this thread is headed. It seems to me that we are arguing over different ideas here. The fact is there are very, very few jobs a person can get with out a college education that pays well 45,000+/year. In fact, about the only job you can get w/o the education and make that kind of money is some sort of construction trade. Let me tell you from experience, that even a trade in construction requires education, Math, History, Public Relations, Government its all there.

I have to agree, with Tex. We chose our own pathes. We make our own decisions. If someone has done the work, and they are living with in their means, let them buy whatever they want, for what ever price they want to pay. (As long as its American, union made would be an added bonus :wink: ). On the same note, if you think a price is too outrageous for you to pay it, then don't, it really is that simple.

Yeah, my only problem comes when you see someone crawling out of a government housing project and get behind the wheel of a new lexus or something of the like. That, however, is a topic of a different discussion.

Yeah, my only problem comes when you see someone crawling out of a government housing project and get behind the wheel of a new lexus or something of the like. That, however, is a topic of a different discussion.
But not too far off the board.

boo whooooo.

I personally would love to see GM come out with a rotary engine in the general motors small suv and car line.

Hopefully it would be a better one than Mazda's rotary. They run great in the warmer weather, but if the compression gets even a little low, they will not start in cool weather. The fuel injection puts more fuel in them than the combustion process can handle with even slightly worn apex seals on the rotors, flooding them out. Once they are flooded, they will rarely start even after sitting. $10.00 EACH (x4) per spark plug, deflooding labor plus a tow bill. In my days in the dealership I had bought many RX7's from customers in the fall for just the cost of their compression test and tow bills.

I guess most of us drive what we can afford, and it's great we have a choice. I'm glad we don't all drive Kia wagons.

In my area, there are people that make great money and drive expensive cars mostly to impress their neighbors, and there are people that make great money and drive something cheap. They don't care if they impress anyone, they just do their thing.

Then there are people that can't afford what they are driving and either are gonna lose it or are doing without the really important things in life just to keep it.

There are people that can't afford an expensive ride and know it. There's absolutely nothing wrong with owning a vehicle or anything else, for that matter, that's not as 'nice' as your neighbors.

The folks that are driving something in their budget that may not be the newest, are probably sleeping better at night than the guy at the factory job that's driving the Hummer.

I don't have any soft spot for the welfare cases that are driving the Lexus' and Mercedes. I think the government is responsible for that, as said before, that's another story.

-slacker

I bought this one last July for $11,990 (after $5000 rebate), before ttl, with 4 miles on it. It has a V6/5spd (I LIKE to shift for myself). It came with A/C, tilt steering, and an AM/FM stereo. As of mid June, I'll have spent an additional 2k on it. Stereo upgrade, XM radio, K&N filter, tonneau cover, wheels, receiver hitch, flag decals, flares, step bars, and by mid June, a NU Image dash cover. Had I known what the dash cover would ultimately cost me, I'd have opted out, but hindsight is 20/20. Then I'll be done until it needs tires (I don't see any point in trashing a perfectly good set of shoes). I bought a little at a time with O/T money, and tax return. I priced everything on Ebay before I bought locally, and I now have the truck that "I" want, for a lot less than I would have paid similarly equipped at a dealer. I could have bought a nicer rig at the dealer, but didn't NEED all the gadgets that you have to take with the option packages. You just have to decide what YOU want and need, look around hard, and maybe wait until the right time of year, when the dealers are dumping inventory.

Don't come in here and bitch about how I use my truck.
Thank you and Bye bye.

you said it perfect jeverett