Could you hit a girl back??
fredjacksonsan
07-15-2005, 11:45 AM
First instinct is of course to save oneself. But death for me is not the worst thing to happen. Call it idealistic, but the phrase "a coward dies a thousand deaths; a soldier dies but one" holds true here. Like if I really saw it as going against my principles to hit a woman in a life or death situation, I think I would rather die.
And I never said I would never use violence in any given situation, I said HIT!! Restraining a person can be very violent e.g. choke holds, arm twisting etc.
It is impossible to have a situation where hitting is the only solution.
Having said that, if it was the only solution...I can't say. I have no idea what I would do until that critical moment to act. I simply don't know.
I think it comes down to that this situation you speak of is pretty much impossible since you always have something else you can do if you're close enough to hit her.
I think it's safe to say that most of us have not been in a life or death situation. True that it's hard to imagine a situation in which you die or hit your aggressor, but the point is made: you must choose between your own death or a principle. Frankly, I think that dying to no end over a principle is foolish, especially since self preservation is quite a strongly ingrained thing. However I applaud you for your staunch adherence to your code of ethics.
In my case, I would try to restrain the person (female or male) that was assaulting me, or at least step back to avoid their onslaught. I would give them one chance, and one chance only, to stop and I would warn them of this. [You're right in saying that a female is usually not as much of a threat, and each case has to be taken on its own merits. 5'(152cm) and 95 pounds(43Kg) you can pretty much grab and hold, while the 7'(213cm) 300 pound(136Kg) bloke is much more of a threat. But there are 6' 250# women out there that can put a hurt on you; I have seen them. :lol2: ]. If they continued, then the amount of force necessary to stop them would be used.
I find that when a girl/woman is coming after you, asking them if they want to fight, or simply suggesting that you will hit them back is enough to stop them. However the point has been made throughout this thread that some women are beyond reason and more of a "firm" approach has to be taken.
I'm just not going to stand there and take it, nor would I run.
And I never said I would never use violence in any given situation, I said HIT!! Restraining a person can be very violent e.g. choke holds, arm twisting etc.
It is impossible to have a situation where hitting is the only solution.
Having said that, if it was the only solution...I can't say. I have no idea what I would do until that critical moment to act. I simply don't know.
I think it comes down to that this situation you speak of is pretty much impossible since you always have something else you can do if you're close enough to hit her.
I think it's safe to say that most of us have not been in a life or death situation. True that it's hard to imagine a situation in which you die or hit your aggressor, but the point is made: you must choose between your own death or a principle. Frankly, I think that dying to no end over a principle is foolish, especially since self preservation is quite a strongly ingrained thing. However I applaud you for your staunch adherence to your code of ethics.
In my case, I would try to restrain the person (female or male) that was assaulting me, or at least step back to avoid their onslaught. I would give them one chance, and one chance only, to stop and I would warn them of this. [You're right in saying that a female is usually not as much of a threat, and each case has to be taken on its own merits. 5'(152cm) and 95 pounds(43Kg) you can pretty much grab and hold, while the 7'(213cm) 300 pound(136Kg) bloke is much more of a threat. But there are 6' 250# women out there that can put a hurt on you; I have seen them. :lol2: ]. If they continued, then the amount of force necessary to stop them would be used.
I find that when a girl/woman is coming after you, asking them if they want to fight, or simply suggesting that you will hit them back is enough to stop them. However the point has been made throughout this thread that some women are beyond reason and more of a "firm" approach has to be taken.
I'm just not going to stand there and take it, nor would I run.
drunken monkey
07-15-2005, 04:26 PM
You have no idea how fragile people can be. You hit someone in the nose wrong and you can break off their nose bone into their brain, killing them instantly. If you seriously think a full forced hit to the head by a man to a woman cannot kill her...you seriously need a reality check.
you might want to listen to some of your own advice.
PALM STRIKING SOMEONE'S NOSE INTO BRAIN IS 100% FALSE.
let me tell you a little about martial arts and how 'restraining locks' work.
most of these restraining locks are milder versions of things that are by their nature designed to break the joints. they are used as restraint because it is assumed that the agressor will usually yield to the pain. however, if they don't and you do the necessary to make the restraint stronger, you are actually pushing it closer to breaking the joint.
on the other hand a simple 'stop hit' (note, a stop hit is something you throw out, not intended to do damage but to disrupt the aggressors attack) will do a better job of stopping the aggressor.
this hit, whilst not a 'take your head off' strike does require force behind it to work.
would you rather me do a stop hit in an attempt to stall/stop the situation or allow the aggressor to attack and then I use restaints and locks where real physical damage of joints and ligaments can occur?
you might want to listen to some of your own advice.
PALM STRIKING SOMEONE'S NOSE INTO BRAIN IS 100% FALSE.
let me tell you a little about martial arts and how 'restraining locks' work.
most of these restraining locks are milder versions of things that are by their nature designed to break the joints. they are used as restraint because it is assumed that the agressor will usually yield to the pain. however, if they don't and you do the necessary to make the restraint stronger, you are actually pushing it closer to breaking the joint.
on the other hand a simple 'stop hit' (note, a stop hit is something you throw out, not intended to do damage but to disrupt the aggressors attack) will do a better job of stopping the aggressor.
this hit, whilst not a 'take your head off' strike does require force behind it to work.
would you rather me do a stop hit in an attempt to stall/stop the situation or allow the aggressor to attack and then I use restaints and locks where real physical damage of joints and ligaments can occur?
lazysmurff
07-15-2005, 05:28 PM
Having said that, if it was the only solution...I can't say. I have no idea what I would do until that critical moment to act. I simply don't know.
truest shit said yet. i tink this goes for all of us. we can talk a big game, but when it comes down to it, we dont know till we're there.
truest shit said yet. i tink this goes for all of us. we can talk a big game, but when it comes down to it, we dont know till we're there.
Knifeblade
07-15-2005, 07:27 PM
Like drunken says, it would take the PERFECT set of conditions to do a nose-kill!!!!!!!!! And that rarely happens, so right to lifer- know what works or doesn't, plz.
Besides, good forward punch just under the sternum, will at minimum cause the aggressor to pause for their cause, sheesh.
And as lazy states, until you are in it yourself, you do not/ nor cannot predict your personal actions to the immediacy of the situation. So I feel you are merely pontificating your ethical standards [which I applaud and understand] to the detriment of reality of the immediacy of the mileu that you would react within.
Besides, good forward punch just under the sternum, will at minimum cause the aggressor to pause for their cause, sheesh.
And as lazy states, until you are in it yourself, you do not/ nor cannot predict your personal actions to the immediacy of the situation. So I feel you are merely pontificating your ethical standards [which I applaud and understand] to the detriment of reality of the immediacy of the mileu that you would react within.
Jetts
07-15-2005, 07:30 PM
i would of socked her or pimp slapped her down
drunken monkey
07-15-2005, 08:20 PM
nononono, the bone into brain doesn't work.
at all.
there is a quite a big cavity right behind the nose.
if you punch and break someone's nose, all it does is at most compact into the cavity.
even if you get a perfect break in exactly the way you want to create a v shape sharp point, in the direction that the myth is based around, the broken bone fragments will just come into contact with another chunk of bone. not to mention that the myth is based on an upright type palm strike hit that almost no one outside of a martial arts school even does.
there's also the fact that the actual target is very small with very hard points above it (the forehead) and below it (your teeth).
miss this very small target and you've probably busted your hand pretty good.
there is no way you can in any circumstance, sledgehammer not included, can you break someone's nose and send the bone fragments into the brain cavity.
have you ever noticed boxers get their nosed flattened on a regular basis AND in a lot of cases repeatedly take shots on a freshly broken nose.
same for the mma/nhb fights.
don't see many brain injuries there, do we?
i wouldn't aim for the SP as a stop hit.
personally, i have more success using the shoulder as a target to disrupt and it allows me to maintain cover on both sides against wild swinging. if the initial stop hit fails or misses, i am still in the centre and not commited to anything (but i guess this is probably due to what i train in). it also causes next to no injury which brings up another point; hitting someone is often the safest and least damaging thing to do. heck, i'd rather be knocked down by a good hit than be forced to tap out to a 'restraining' lock.
anyway.
that's enough tangential ranting from me.
at all.
there is a quite a big cavity right behind the nose.
if you punch and break someone's nose, all it does is at most compact into the cavity.
even if you get a perfect break in exactly the way you want to create a v shape sharp point, in the direction that the myth is based around, the broken bone fragments will just come into contact with another chunk of bone. not to mention that the myth is based on an upright type palm strike hit that almost no one outside of a martial arts school even does.
there's also the fact that the actual target is very small with very hard points above it (the forehead) and below it (your teeth).
miss this very small target and you've probably busted your hand pretty good.
there is no way you can in any circumstance, sledgehammer not included, can you break someone's nose and send the bone fragments into the brain cavity.
have you ever noticed boxers get their nosed flattened on a regular basis AND in a lot of cases repeatedly take shots on a freshly broken nose.
same for the mma/nhb fights.
don't see many brain injuries there, do we?
i wouldn't aim for the SP as a stop hit.
personally, i have more success using the shoulder as a target to disrupt and it allows me to maintain cover on both sides against wild swinging. if the initial stop hit fails or misses, i am still in the centre and not commited to anything (but i guess this is probably due to what i train in). it also causes next to no injury which brings up another point; hitting someone is often the safest and least damaging thing to do. heck, i'd rather be knocked down by a good hit than be forced to tap out to a 'restraining' lock.
anyway.
that's enough tangential ranting from me.
Muscletang
07-15-2005, 08:50 PM
Hey DM not to be an ass or anything but I have to disagree with what you said. I've heard from several reliable sources that the nose hit will work.
drunken monkey
07-15-2005, 09:25 PM
dont worry about it.
questioning is good.
anyway.
check out a diagram of the skull.
right behind the bone part (nasal bone) of the nose there is your nasal cavity. there is a very thin part that separates this and your brain, this is the target that you have to get to with that broken bone fragment.
if you look at the top part of the skull where the frontal sinus is, some people say you can break/fracture this part and send it into the brain.
unfortunatle, this section of the brain is part of a bigger multi-part curved structure that is stronger than the diagrams suggest (and people have a habit of showing a direct side section to show 'weak' parts).
in short, the parts of the nose that can break just have no way of reaching the fragile parts of the skull to project into the brain and that's ignoring the fact that this part is not that big.
we're talking displacement of more than an inch before getting near the brain.
the only way to send the broken nose into the brain is to crush the front of the skull (maxilla and frontal bone structure) specifically the brow and bone surrounding the nose. yes you can break the nose but you'd have to get your fist pretty far back into the guys face before you will get the broken nose anywhere near the brain; hence sledgehammer.
in short, and i'm wondering why i didn't just type this, the nasal bone isn't big enough to get to, or penetrate into the brain.
incidentally, there's another mythical one hit kill spot on the skull.
if you go back to a diagram of the skull, you'll see that near the temple, there is a point where four bones of the skull meet. this point is also, coincidentally, near what the chinese call the 'sun' pressure point and it is said that a strike here can possible kill although it's never been determined how hard the strike has to be.....
questioning is good.
anyway.
check out a diagram of the skull.
right behind the bone part (nasal bone) of the nose there is your nasal cavity. there is a very thin part that separates this and your brain, this is the target that you have to get to with that broken bone fragment.
if you look at the top part of the skull where the frontal sinus is, some people say you can break/fracture this part and send it into the brain.
unfortunatle, this section of the brain is part of a bigger multi-part curved structure that is stronger than the diagrams suggest (and people have a habit of showing a direct side section to show 'weak' parts).
in short, the parts of the nose that can break just have no way of reaching the fragile parts of the skull to project into the brain and that's ignoring the fact that this part is not that big.
we're talking displacement of more than an inch before getting near the brain.
the only way to send the broken nose into the brain is to crush the front of the skull (maxilla and frontal bone structure) specifically the brow and bone surrounding the nose. yes you can break the nose but you'd have to get your fist pretty far back into the guys face before you will get the broken nose anywhere near the brain; hence sledgehammer.
in short, and i'm wondering why i didn't just type this, the nasal bone isn't big enough to get to, or penetrate into the brain.
incidentally, there's another mythical one hit kill spot on the skull.
if you go back to a diagram of the skull, you'll see that near the temple, there is a point where four bones of the skull meet. this point is also, coincidentally, near what the chinese call the 'sun' pressure point and it is said that a strike here can possible kill although it's never been determined how hard the strike has to be.....
ghetto7o2azn
07-16-2005, 01:58 AM
Having said that, if it was the only solution...I can't say. I have no idea what I would do until that critical moment to act. I simply don't know.
i do... id him him/her...think about it... if hitting really was the ONLY solution then why would that be such a big mystery??
thats like seeing an addition problem, knowing what the + sign means, but you try subtracting and dividing first even though you know they wont work :screwy:
personally, i would try to take the person to the floor with something like a double leg... (say you do punch the person, he/she loses balance and falls over and hits his/her head... you might not have punched the person in the head, but the contact of the floor and her head can do the same damage... in fact, people that faint are usually mostly injured from hitting their head...) from the ground i think that choke holds work the best because they cut the circulation of blood from the brain to pass them out, but only for a short period of time letting you get things situated... thats just imo
i do... id him him/her...think about it... if hitting really was the ONLY solution then why would that be such a big mystery??
thats like seeing an addition problem, knowing what the + sign means, but you try subtracting and dividing first even though you know they wont work :screwy:
personally, i would try to take the person to the floor with something like a double leg... (say you do punch the person, he/she loses balance and falls over and hits his/her head... you might not have punched the person in the head, but the contact of the floor and her head can do the same damage... in fact, people that faint are usually mostly injured from hitting their head...) from the ground i think that choke holds work the best because they cut the circulation of blood from the brain to pass them out, but only for a short period of time letting you get things situated... thats just imo
Right_LiRrr
07-16-2005, 03:17 AM
I just think living without principles is pointless. So no, it's not really just that simple.
ghetto7o2azn
07-17-2005, 07:24 PM
whats that supposed to mean?
the choke hold and double leg would only be used after trying to avoid the situation in the first place in every way possible.. maybe i should have clarified that it would be a last resort but it was my mistake for that to be implied.. i also explained why i would resort to this as it is less likely for there to be seriously injury, your resort that i read above (choke hold submition) can, like someone already said, easily end up in a broken bone... i also said that when a person passes out, their head hitting the ground can cause more damage than a punch, which is why if u were to choke someone while standing, u might just be doing more damage...
if youre talking about my reply to your comment, maybe u should look at what u said again.. you said ONLY solution as in ONE solution... if there is one solution, then it would be obviouse to use the method to reach the solution for without a solution nothing is solved
the choke hold and double leg would only be used after trying to avoid the situation in the first place in every way possible.. maybe i should have clarified that it would be a last resort but it was my mistake for that to be implied.. i also explained why i would resort to this as it is less likely for there to be seriously injury, your resort that i read above (choke hold submition) can, like someone already said, easily end up in a broken bone... i also said that when a person passes out, their head hitting the ground can cause more damage than a punch, which is why if u were to choke someone while standing, u might just be doing more damage...
if youre talking about my reply to your comment, maybe u should look at what u said again.. you said ONLY solution as in ONE solution... if there is one solution, then it would be obviouse to use the method to reach the solution for without a solution nothing is solved
drunken monkey
07-17-2005, 07:44 PM
a double leg wouldn't be the easiest thing to argue for in a court as it is, from an observer's point of view, 100% aggressive. add a choke to the end of that and you have no case for self defence.
Right_LiRrr
07-17-2005, 09:57 PM
whats that supposed to mean?
It's not supposed to mean anything except what's written at face value.
Why must their be implications to everything I write? Can I not simply make a statement and that be it? I don't write underhanded comments, if I think something of you, I'll call you out.
It's not supposed to mean anything except what's written at face value.
Why must their be implications to everything I write? Can I not simply make a statement and that be it? I don't write underhanded comments, if I think something of you, I'll call you out.
naruto
07-20-2005, 12:08 AM
no and yes!!! my answer to the thread...for all the peple said i would give it right back to them or she hits me its on does that mean you would start hitting back as if she was a man if so thats just low. i doubt that a women knows what it fells like to get a full force punch from a man to the face and if that happend yeah sure it was her fault but i beleive theres a boundary on how hard a man can hit a women. ive never been in a position like that but if i was id probablay give them a slap to the face or a jab to the gut just to say snap out of it i wouldnt give them i masive right hook to the jaw instantly breaking it. i only say yes to hitting women as to only waking them up not to knock them out them out or break her nose over anger or revenge.
lazysmurff
07-20-2005, 06:28 PM
i doubt that a women knows what it fells like to get a full force punch from a man to the face and if that happend yeah sure it was her fault but i beleive theres a boundary on how hard a man can hit a women.
at the risk of getting into this again....
there quite a few men out there that are unaware of how it feels to be punched full force in the face by another guy. not everyone gets into fights all the time. add that to the fact that every guy hits differently, and this reasoning for not hitting a woman back is ridiculous. this would mean you wouldnt hit any guy who you hadnt hit before as well. and that has nothing to do with gender.
at the risk of getting into this again....
there quite a few men out there that are unaware of how it feels to be punched full force in the face by another guy. not everyone gets into fights all the time. add that to the fact that every guy hits differently, and this reasoning for not hitting a woman back is ridiculous. this would mean you wouldnt hit any guy who you hadnt hit before as well. and that has nothing to do with gender.
escort357
07-21-2005, 02:08 AM
All this talk of violence... Personally, if it came down to it, I'd use my favorite style of martial arts: Nike Juijitsu. Just run away. Well, I wouldn't run away from a chick, but if it looked like she was ready to kick my ass, I'd walk away swiftly while muttering obsecenities.
Knifeblade
07-21-2005, 02:19 AM
I'd order another beer.
escort357
07-21-2005, 02:22 AM
I'd order another beer.
Yeah. That's probably the best suggestion on this thread.
Yeah. That's probably the best suggestion on this thread.
Shpyder
08-26-2005, 06:46 PM
Kinda old thread but:
I would immediately call up my sister, and have her and her friends come over, and beat the living snot out of that bitch. What happened to you in the bar is just out of this universe, like...WTF??
I would immediately call up my sister, and have her and her friends come over, and beat the living snot out of that bitch. What happened to you in the bar is just out of this universe, like...WTF??
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