Engine Stopped On Highway
tjtriple3
04-28-2005, 01:44 PM
Hey guys. Just bought a used 95 Sunfire (2.2L Auto) last week. Driving it home seemed fine... accelerated normally, pretty quiet. Drove it next day, seemed a little noisy in the engine and rattled a bit... acceleration definitely slowed down a lot. Had to get to work so I figured I'd get it looked at by the end of the week. On the highway home, engine just stopped. The Oil light came on at the same time... Now I had JUST changed the oil, oil filter, plugs and wires the day I got it. Everything was gapped properly, wasn't misfiring... just a little noisy. So I tried to start it again and the engine turns over, and fuel is there, but the car wont start. The oil light stays on... do you think my oil pump went? Car has 150K on it (engine only has 75K)... My real question is this: is there a safety switch on the engine that won't allow the car to start/continue running with low-no oil pressure? I'm in desperate need to fix this car. PLEASE HELP!! It's been towed to my house, so I need to fix it ASAP!!! Thank you!!
hondamechanic
04-29-2005, 10:08 AM
Hey guys. Just bought a used 95 Sunfire (2.2L Auto) last week. Driving it home seemed fine... accelerated normally, pretty quiet. Drove it next day, seemed a little noisy in the engine and rattled a bit... acceleration definitely slowed down a lot. Had to get to work so I figured I'd get it looked at by the end of the week. On the highway home, engine just stopped. The Oil light came on at the same time... Now I had JUST changed the oil, oil filter, plugs and wires the day I got it. Everything was gapped properly, wasn't misfiring... just a little noisy. So I tried to start it again and the engine turns over, and fuel is there, but the car wont start. The oil light stays on... do you think my oil pump went? Car has 150K on it (engine only has 75K)... My real question is this: is there a safety switch on the engine that won't allow the car to start/continue running with low-no oil pressure? I'm in desperate need to fix this car. PLEASE HELP!! It's been towed to my house, so I need to fix it ASAP!!! Thank you!!
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Greetings, TJ
Can't help you with regard to there being a safety shut-off control switch tied to the oil pressure. If there IS a safety switch, then a chunked oil pump would have caused a drop in pressure, tripping the switch and cutting power to the ignition system (as you are guessing). If there is NOT a safety shut-off, then you might check things out as per the following to narrow down possibilities.
Your problem as I see it:
Possibly a bad oil pump with a fail-safe shutoff switch tied to the oiling system. Possibly a "stopped" camshaft, which could mean a snapped or broken camshaft, busted timing belt, stretched timing chain, or stripped/broken timing gear. Possibly a power problem, though I doubt it. Wish I could hear how the engine sounds when you are cranking it.
The following is assuming that you have a fair grasp on mechanical stuff and that you have at least $50.00 invested in a red tool box and some bent wrenches (as opposed to just knowing where the gas goes).
Easy and cheap tests:
The first thing I'd do is get a hold of a Haynes or Chilton manual for the car and see if there is an oil pressure kill switch, either as part of the oil pressure system or incorporated in the computer. If you already have such a manual and have come up dry, you can always enlist the help of the parts monkeys at a parts store (think dealership, too). Go to one or give 'em a call and ask if they have an oil pressure kill switch listed for your vehicle. When they give you the "duh, what?" look, explain your theory and get them to give you possible part names or options. If they are decently oriented, they should be able to help you out.
On that note, see if you can get a hold of an OBD2 computer tester. They are fairly cheap now-a-days (relatively), and you might be able to borrow one from you friendly neighborhood Autobone, Choker, or Schlep Boys if you know someone. If you can, read the computer's fault codes for clues as to where to look and how to think about the problem.
Under the hood:
Pull the oil cap off and see if you can see the valve train through it. If you can see the valves or any of the internal workings of the head, have someone crank the engine while you are looking in there. If you can see stuff moving and turning, rest assured that the timing belt/chain is not the problem. If stuff isn't moving, then you probably have a broken timing belt/chain. The timing set drives the oil pump on many engines, and this would explain both problems. If you cannot see anything moving, but the engine seems to crank really fast (as though it is hooked up to 3 batteries instead of 1), that is a symptom of a broken timing set, too.
Assuming the car is not distributorless, take the distributor cap off and crank the engine, looking for the rotor to spin. Again, this is a similar test, but it will tell you if something is broken or not. On most vehicles, the oil pump is driven either by the timing set, or by a gear on the distributor shaft. Most distributors run off the camshaft, so if it is not spinning, you can figure that the oil pump is not functioning because the cam isn't spinning (again, timing set... or possibly a snapped camshaft).
Look at the belts, too, to ensure they are spinning when the engine cranks. I have seen a dead engine due to a snapped crank (oil starvation over a period of time caused heat stress).
A pressure test is a good thing to do, assuming you cannot draw any conclusions just by looking at the other items. While I do not think that a cylinder failure caused the problem, performing a compression test will give you an idea if one of the cylinders is problematic. You could also perform a leak-down test to see where a drop in compression is going.
"So what the heck is this test supposed to tell me?!"
Well, you said that there was a louder than normal noise that developed before the engine quit. Above everything else, this is a simple test that can can tell you the extent of any engine problems that you may have. For example, if the leak down test reveals moderate or worse leakage past the rings, or through the head, then you will have to decide if the engine is worth rebuilding... regardless of the oiling problem. In short, it will tell you where you money might wind up going before the car gets going.
Remember that the problem could also be electrical in nature. If you have a problem with the computer or with the ignition system, the engine will quit... so the oil pump will quit. The result will be a dead engine that will crank but not fire. As I said before, I doubt this scenario, but it is one worth keeping in mind.
I wish I could check your car out. If you find this helpful, feel free to send me an e-mail at [email protected]. I'd be ahppy to help further if I can.
Steve
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Greetings, TJ
Can't help you with regard to there being a safety shut-off control switch tied to the oil pressure. If there IS a safety switch, then a chunked oil pump would have caused a drop in pressure, tripping the switch and cutting power to the ignition system (as you are guessing). If there is NOT a safety shut-off, then you might check things out as per the following to narrow down possibilities.
Your problem as I see it:
Possibly a bad oil pump with a fail-safe shutoff switch tied to the oiling system. Possibly a "stopped" camshaft, which could mean a snapped or broken camshaft, busted timing belt, stretched timing chain, or stripped/broken timing gear. Possibly a power problem, though I doubt it. Wish I could hear how the engine sounds when you are cranking it.
The following is assuming that you have a fair grasp on mechanical stuff and that you have at least $50.00 invested in a red tool box and some bent wrenches (as opposed to just knowing where the gas goes).
Easy and cheap tests:
The first thing I'd do is get a hold of a Haynes or Chilton manual for the car and see if there is an oil pressure kill switch, either as part of the oil pressure system or incorporated in the computer. If you already have such a manual and have come up dry, you can always enlist the help of the parts monkeys at a parts store (think dealership, too). Go to one or give 'em a call and ask if they have an oil pressure kill switch listed for your vehicle. When they give you the "duh, what?" look, explain your theory and get them to give you possible part names or options. If they are decently oriented, they should be able to help you out.
On that note, see if you can get a hold of an OBD2 computer tester. They are fairly cheap now-a-days (relatively), and you might be able to borrow one from you friendly neighborhood Autobone, Choker, or Schlep Boys if you know someone. If you can, read the computer's fault codes for clues as to where to look and how to think about the problem.
Under the hood:
Pull the oil cap off and see if you can see the valve train through it. If you can see the valves or any of the internal workings of the head, have someone crank the engine while you are looking in there. If you can see stuff moving and turning, rest assured that the timing belt/chain is not the problem. If stuff isn't moving, then you probably have a broken timing belt/chain. The timing set drives the oil pump on many engines, and this would explain both problems. If you cannot see anything moving, but the engine seems to crank really fast (as though it is hooked up to 3 batteries instead of 1), that is a symptom of a broken timing set, too.
Assuming the car is not distributorless, take the distributor cap off and crank the engine, looking for the rotor to spin. Again, this is a similar test, but it will tell you if something is broken or not. On most vehicles, the oil pump is driven either by the timing set, or by a gear on the distributor shaft. Most distributors run off the camshaft, so if it is not spinning, you can figure that the oil pump is not functioning because the cam isn't spinning (again, timing set... or possibly a snapped camshaft).
Look at the belts, too, to ensure they are spinning when the engine cranks. I have seen a dead engine due to a snapped crank (oil starvation over a period of time caused heat stress).
A pressure test is a good thing to do, assuming you cannot draw any conclusions just by looking at the other items. While I do not think that a cylinder failure caused the problem, performing a compression test will give you an idea if one of the cylinders is problematic. You could also perform a leak-down test to see where a drop in compression is going.
"So what the heck is this test supposed to tell me?!"
Well, you said that there was a louder than normal noise that developed before the engine quit. Above everything else, this is a simple test that can can tell you the extent of any engine problems that you may have. For example, if the leak down test reveals moderate or worse leakage past the rings, or through the head, then you will have to decide if the engine is worth rebuilding... regardless of the oiling problem. In short, it will tell you where you money might wind up going before the car gets going.
Remember that the problem could also be electrical in nature. If you have a problem with the computer or with the ignition system, the engine will quit... so the oil pump will quit. The result will be a dead engine that will crank but not fire. As I said before, I doubt this scenario, but it is one worth keeping in mind.
I wish I could check your car out. If you find this helpful, feel free to send me an e-mail at [email protected]. I'd be ahppy to help further if I can.
Steve
public
04-29-2005, 12:06 PM
I believe this car will shut off ignition if you lose oil pressure. As mentioned above the schematics in a Haynes manual should tell you. My book only goes to 94 but they DO have the oil sending unit in the ignition curcuit. Hopefully just a bad sending unit (about $4) Good Luck.
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