Clearcoat confusion

Hi all,

I've been reading many posts about the use of clear coats, in particular Tamiya products, and I am a little confused about the exact products being used.

I have sprayed TS paints direct from the can but not with a clearcoat as yet. As I am aiming for the type of finish, particularly over decals, that I have seen on these forums, I'd like to know if I have the right end of the stick when it comes to clearcoats.

Tamiya make a clearcoat in a can (TS13) and also an acrylic clear in their little bottles (X22) Would it be possible to use the bottled clear through an airbrush and get the same results? I'm trying to avoid decanting the sprays if at all possible, so using the clear from the bottle straight over a TS colour would be great.

Also, let's say I wanted to spray a bottled colour, such as gun metal (X10). Could I lay the bottled clear over this and get a good finish?

I guess I'm just trying to gauge whether the only viable option for bodywork is the TS sprays (decanted or not) followed by the TS clear, or can most any tamiya acrylic paint be covered by either of their acrylic paints?

Also, if I was to decant and put a TS paint through my Iwata, do I need a more aggressive cleaner and is the paint generally nastier to work with than their bottled acrylics are?

Cheers
Oli

one thing i know that it is alright to use the clear over ts paints, not really sure on what the psi should be though.

TS-13 is NOT a friendly product. Improper application and usage can cause the lower paint surface to lift, decals to wrinkle, etc... It is a synthetic lacquer and a strong(hot) one. Practice and create a method/system for using it...I never bothered.

Acrylic clearcoats generally take a pretty long time to dry (Future not withstanding) and will never polish up like a lacquer or enamel due to it being a "softer" paint. When I clear-coat I use a 2-part automotive. Dries extremely quick and is rock solid.

hth,
Bill

As for me, I always apply all my paints using airbrush. The reason is when I'm using airbrush I can control the paint so that it won't bleed (I suck when using spray cans :lol: ), so, even when the clear comes in a spray can, I always transfer it into another bottle/container and use the airbrush to apply it.

As for your question on bottled clear over bottled colour, it can be applied but remember to apply a few layer of mist coats before the wet coats. FYI, I usually use automotive clear coats over Gunze colours..

Acrylic clearcoats generally take a pretty long time to dry (Future not withstanding) and will never polish up like a lacquer or enamel due to it being a "softer" paint. When I clear-coat I use a 2-part automotive. Dries extremely quick and is rock solid.

FYI, I usually use automotive clear coats over Gunze colours..

Thanks for your comments. Would I be right in taking from this that:

TS13 is a no no, because it's too aggressive to decals
X22 won't polish up to a nice auto finish, does this apply to future too?

Therefore automotive clear is the only way to go??

Some other peoples' experiences would be very helpful too.

Cheers
Oli

Look here (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=380164&highlight=935) .
This guy uses Mr. Hobby Topcoat from Gunze Sagnyo over Tamiya TS spraypaint and it just looks stunning. Tamiya clear ruins the decals - so don´t use.

Look here (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=380164&highlight=935) .
This guy uses Mr. Hobby Topcoat from Gunze Sagnyo over Tamiya TS spraypaint and it just looks stunning. Tamiya clear ruins the decals - so don´t use.

Is that both clears, the spray AND the bottled?

Oh yeah I forgot to mention that since I am in the UK, tamiya clears, future and automotive are my only options since I don't have a cheap reliable source of gunze products.

Oli

I can only add that I have tried number of automotive spray clear coats and this is the resoult.
Dupli color is good on dupli color paints but a killer for decals so no good, I have tried synthetic clear and it also doesn't like decals, tried few cheaper ones that are probably not common in UK but they are so cheap that you could buy few and test them, they are all acrylic and fast dryeing, they are kind to decals but some of them tend to yellow with time (over white) and some doesn't have the right shine.
Hese is the one I am most setisfied with.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y27/sjelic/2004_0907Toyota0013.jpg

And producer

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y27/sjelic/2004_0907Toyota0015.jpg

and resoult

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y27/sjelic/2005_0118Lukas0001.jpg

Thanks Sasa,

It looks like I'm just going to have to sacrifice some kit bodies and decals to see what works. I'll get some automotive clears to try too. It does seem strange that Tamiya's products don't work well together, I'd have thought that their TS clear would be designed for use over their decals.

I was hoping that I'd be able to just spray the X22 clear through my airbrush over decals to get a showroom shine but things are never as simple as they should be I guess.

Perhaps future will do the trick and give me a shine that I want.

Oli

I've also found that the Tamiya clear spray can thin the paint over some sharp edges. The clear from the bottles works well, but as mentioned earlier, it is soft and takes time to cure. I'm not always looking for super high gloss, so the effect works fine for me. But I need to experiment with 2-part automotive clears. A lot of builders I know really seem to like them.

This is sort of off topic... But not. I don't use acrylic. I can't get the shine out of it. This wouldn't normaly come up, and especially not with acrylic, but I ran across this in modifying a MB Mustang Concept into a 2005 Mustang. Usually glass work is no issue. But the way the MBC is constructed the roof and tinted glazing are one in the same. The stuff they use to make it is soft and suseptible to anything. Even rubber cement. I use that for masking a lot of things. Had to repolish the glass after using rubber cement to mask it. Then I sprayed Krylon Triple Coat Glaze over the whole car after painting it. Anywhere the plastic wasn't protected by paint, it krazed. In desperation I cut two pieces of clear shipping tape to rough size and placed it over the krazing. It sealed the krazing to where you can see through the glass! Just a word of warning on "Clearcoat" and a, how to undo.

You most certainly can use X22 out of the bottle over Tamiya acrylics (or over ANYTHING else), and polish it out to a good shine.

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/502/67954109_0961.JPG

http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/503/67954109_0962.JPG

This finish is entirely Tamiya acrylics- a mix of blue, purple, and gun metal, overcoated with acrylic X22 and polished. I found that the X22 dried plenty quickly, I only waited 48 hours after applying the last coat before polishing. It does take a bit of work and patience, but every body you paint and polish out will, and I found using the X22 to be easier to work with than hotter clearcoats, and a whole lot safer. I did the polishing with a Squadron polishing stick, and rubbed it out with Tamiya compound. This was the easiest body I've ever painted.

I've tried using Future in this way also, but it's definately inferior. I will both haze and crack if applied too thick.

Give it a try!

This has been a useful thread. I have problems using TS-13 clear, but looking at what MPWR managed to do with X22, I will be giving this a go next time. Thanks all..

This has been a useful thread. I have problems using TS-13 clear, but looking at what MPWR managed to do with X22, I will be giving this a go next time. Thanks all..

Yes completely agree, thanks MPWR for proving that it can be done. If I can get that sort of finish reliably I'll be very happy since it's both easy to obtain and put through an airbrush.

Cheers
Oli

Which x22 are we talking about here as Tamiya does x22 as a enamel as well as Acrylic and I have used that (the Enamel one) over their spray paints with no probs but I prefer to use Testors Modelmasters Hi Gloss Clear.

X22 acrylic. Tamiya enamel is unavailible in most of the explored regions of the galaxy. :headshake

I tend to think an enamel clearcoat would take forever (months) to cure for polishing.

X22 acrylic. Tamiya enamel is unavailible in most of the explored regions of the galaxy. :headshake

I tend to think an enamel clearcoat would take forever (months) to cure for polishing.

Well, I have just done the rounds of the main Hobby Shops within 30 mins drive of me (6 of) today and not one of them had X22 acrylic clear in stock. Plenty of the other Tamiya Acrylic colours. All had X22 Enamel Clear in stock. When questioned they all said the same that it (the Acrylic clear)has been unavailable from the Tamiya Distributor here in Australia since Xmas.
I was also advised by 2 of their "Experts"(military) that I would be better off with either the Gunze Clear or Enamel clearas it is better to polish out on car models - Quote "the Acrylic always attracts dust which sticks to it".
I thought the Gunze was acrylic?
I always airbrush enamel clear and it is rock hard in a week. Admittedly I am in a climate where it is rare for the temp to drop below 20 deg celsius so that would help.

Slightly off topic but it was interesting to note that all shops had cut their car range dramatically with only 2 shops having more than 1 bay of car kits. They all used to have at least 2 or 3 bays minimum.
The military range has taken up the space the cars had before. When quizzed same answers alround, kits either not bought in by importers, always backordered or not enough interest in cars to justify the space. And they wonder why we go offshore and order!
Cheers
Tony

TS-13 is great stuff, but not for the inexperienced!

Has anyone had any experience using auto clear over a TS color?

I must be in the minority here. I add the clearcoat over the painted body and THEN I polish out. And THEN I add the decals. I house my models in display cases so no need for clear over the decals.

I must be in the minority here. I add the clearcoat over the painted body and THEN I polish out. And THEN I add the decals. I house my models in display cases so no need for clear over the decals.
I do the same but I do clear coat over the decals as well.

Has anyone had any experience using auto clear over a TS color?

Yes. Since the TS is a synthetic lacquer (and hence the hottest) and since most auto clears are NOT lacquer, you'll have little to no problem. I usually use auto-clear over a TS basecoat and never had a problem yet. YYMV, test, test, test..etc.

hth,
Bill