stalling and starting issues with 89 Cherokee

I have another question. again my son has a 1989 Jeep Cherokee Laredo 4WD and the problem we are experiencing is that the car will on occasion just die when he is driving or wont start after being turned off.

the problem will come and go and not appear for a week or two and then come back.

The crank sensor has been replaced some time ago and that is not it.

can i assume its the fuel pump? i changed the fuel filter but that didnt help.

Or could it be the cadalitic converter? i dont know

any suggestions?

does any one have any advice for this issue??

first thing to do is to determin if there is spark when the jeep won't start. Pull off a plug wire or coil wire and hold it about a quarter inch away from a good ground while somebody trys to start it. There should be a good spark.

well i took off the coil wire from the distributor side and held it to a metal line and against a metal plate and i could not see any spark. its possible i didnt see it or i didnt have it against a ground but what does it mean if there is no spark. and why would it only be an issue after the car has been running for awhile or sometimes when the car is running?

I just want to confirm that you held it about 1/4" away from a ground and not touching a ground. We have to decide if it is a fuel problem or an electrical problem.

well the wire has a boot on it and the wire is not very long.

to give more detail.

The car will always start if it has set for a few hours.

but when it has been running for a bit and you turn it off , it may not start again for a few hours. on rare occasions the car has died while going down the road.

it would be easier to check the spark at night i imagine but would metal lines be a ground?

ok does it happen after the car's temperature has risen above normal temperature ? i had a similar problem to have it start i either let it cool for a day or unplug a sensor and plug it back. It's that sensor on the firewall. when your standing infront of the car and looking straight in fornt of you you should see it. It has a conector and a tube that goe s to it. i usualy unplug both and plug them back and the car starts.

ok i will try that tomorrow but the car is not excessively hot as far as i know but it could be related.

the metal lines you are talking about could be fuel lines which have rubber hoses on them, not a good ground, use the engine block for a ground.

the lines i saw were AC lines i believe and they didnt have rubber around them but i will try the engine block.

but what do you think would be the problem if i didnt have spark?

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any suggestions?[/QUOTE]
If your Jeep has no spark it will not run. Check the connections on the 1) coil (there are three of them - 2 in and 1 out); 2) the fuses (any one of them can be the problem); and 3) the connections under the distributer cap.

Make sure you also check the BIG resister that is in the engine compartment (it is about 3" x 1/2" and white).

I dought its the cataletic converter, as that is after the spark.

Y ou should check your exhaust intake manifold gasket when mine started to go it was sucking air and would not want to start or would stall in travel. when they go completly you will lose brake pressure due to lack of vaccum.

Well oddly enough we have not been able to check for spark because the car has not acted up since i have been trying to test for spark.

The problem is odd because the car only doesnt want to start after its been driven for about 20 minutes or more and it doesnt want to crank for about 1 0r 2 hours then it starts.

But as soon as it wont start ill check for spark and let you fine people know what we find.

Thanks

Well folks I took the car to the local jeep dealer since there was no spark when the car had starting problems. i thought they could diagnose the problem with 1/2 hour of labor and they did.

Here is the issue. My sons car has 3 leaking fuel injectors that drip fuel out. according to the service rep this is causing the engine to flood and that is why it sometimes stops when running or wont start after being shut off.

They said the injectors are $113 each and labor is $240

any one have any solutions for this? are there any stop leak products for injectors? can they be repaired with new gaskets or something?

i dont know a thing about injectors so any advice will be helpful

Thanks

I have heard of injecters leaking on the engine, then you would buy new o - rings from the dealer for a few bucks and replace them , but injecters leaking into the cylinders and causing the engine to flood , I haven't come across that. The fact that it has no spark is something that has nothing to do with the fuel injecters, how do you know it has no spark when it acts up?

That is a good point. i was told the problem was the injectors.

the person that told me there was no spark was a sales person at the jeep dealer because the service department was closed. i was out of town when it happened. Injectors have nothing to do with the spark.

Ill keep you guys informed on the issue

Well the injectors can leak, but most of the jeeps I have seen leak externally. It is possible for injectors to leak and flood the engine but you would have notice that when it did start that it was flooded. And when you have a flooded engine ,if you hold the pedal all the way to floor it will turn injectors off. This is done for the times that the engine could have gotten flooded. And you say in your last thread that there was no spark. Injectors is not going to cause that. I know you said that the crank sensor was replaced but you describe and crank sensor getting hot and stop working and when cools off works again. I have a 89 Jeep commache and it has done that before and found bad connection at coil. I would also guestion ignition wires too esp the coil wire.

Thanks for the info. i was thinking the coil or the distributor may have issues but im not sure its the ignition wires since the car will stall sometimes when running. and oddly enough the car can go several days without a problem at all. so its a bit of a mystery.

but here is something that really pisses me off...

Prices for parts (Both places give a 1 Yr warranty)

Injector: $113 at Jeep, $41 at Auto Zone

Coil: $104 at Jeep $42 at Auto Zone

Distributor: $109 at Jeep $59 at Auto Zone

I only assume the Crank Sensor has been replaced because a mechanic looked at it and gave it a tune up told me that the sensor looked recently replaced but he may have been mistaken.

Can a Coil, Crank Sensor or Distributor be tested?

Distributor most likely will not be problem. It isnot a dist as you are use too. In this model it is the cam sensor and delivers the fire only. The cam sensor will not stop from running. The coil can be tested with omh meter. The crank sensor can be check with lab scope. But then may not show problem unless the problem is present. The reason for the prices is because of being in business. I own a shop and can not make living and paid bills and warranty work with markup on parts. As the how much well that varys. And remember sometimes yoy get what you pay for. There is good qualilty parts out there and bad. Believe me I pick and chose. I don't want my customers coming back for the same thing. Only for more good service.

i understand the business reason but my son does not have a lot of money to spend on his car so we will but an "o" ring packet for the fuel injectors. wouldnt it make more sense that little drip from the injector would be caused by an old O ring? so before i buy new injectors i will go that route.

So since the car runs fine for several days at a time. then for what seems no reason the car may not start. if it does this it will always start after and hour or so and be good for a day or so. in the last 10 months its only quit while the car is on the road but when it does that the car will start in another hour or so.

So can i assume the crank sensor or the cam sensor.

here is my ignorance. What is a cam sensor and where is it?

Thanks

The cam sensor is in the dist. The crank is in back, working off of ringgear on convertor. The cam will most likely not be your problem. I have never yet had to replace one. If your injector are bad, you should be able to see gas leaking at the seam on the inmjector. I say this because it is what I have seen the most of. The only other time I have replace the injector is when it failed tp work. Most of the time the computor will code a failed injector in this case. The cam sensor sync the timing of injectors. You may find this interresting. http://www.asashop.org/autoinc/feb99/techtotech.htm

I had the same 'gremlin' rear it's ugly head once in a while. Won't start....no spark. Just a quick clean of the CPS connector and it's been problem free since.

do you mean the crank position sensor?

isnt that inside the bellhousing?

how do you get to it to clean it?

The cranks sensor is on the top of trans on drivers side. It is held there by 2 bolts. When you remove the bolts it will lift up and out. I doubt that cleaning will do any good. There not of anything that will get on it. It can be a little tough to get to the bolts. The wire is at the top of intake manifold at the rear. Follow the wire down and you will find it.

ok thanks but if cleaning it wont do any good then what do you guys suggest?

I don't think the part cost that much. I would just replace it and get it out of the way. Without special tools like a lab scope you just have to play it by ear. In this case it won't be that bad. You will not be spending that much. I would not mind using the part from Advance Auto or maybe Auto Zone. I do pick and chose but this part should be fine from theses places. You should be able to replace it yourself.

I didn't mean cleaning the CPS itself, but undo the the plastic connector where it comes up at the back of the rocker cover and then joins the rest of the harness. Just a shot of electrical/contact cleaner, reconnect, and away you go (hopefully :smile: ).

I thought you could also test the CPS with a multimeter, just get someone to crank the engine whilst you read the voltage at said connection. Can't remember the specs though.

I know I dug up an old thread, but I don't get access to computers too often anymore.

Well in your last note there you said when you got to the dealer there was no spark. If that was the case the injectors had nothing to do with that. The biggest thing I have found with the injectors is that when they start to leak they leak externally. That would not cause a flooded condition. And 2 if that were the case you have notice that when it did start back up it would have acted like a flooded engine. I replaced my crank sensor one time and made a mistake with the wiring laying to close to the exhaust manifold. And it would short out. It got worst as time went on as then found the mistake i had made. Just because it has been replaced doesn't mean it isn't bad again. But now this is just a idea if there is no spark when it doesn't start.

injectors on e-bay for arond $150 a SET. easy install.