No '06 GTO

yes your T/A and your AussiChevGTO is a Chevy!
That is a Grand Am by the way. I was just asking....not asking you to insult me though.

I have said it before, and I will say it again. I understand your logic in this. I just don't agree. I am not angry, I love my cars. They both say Pontiac on them. Whether or not they are 'real' Pontiacs is up for debate. As far as I am concerned, they say Pontiac on them, can't get much more 'real' than that.

I like Pontiac now, I like Pontiac then.

i love my chevy powered pontiac. I didn't get ripped off. Then again, im not a 50 year old guy with some personal vendetta against GM and chevy. Im a 25 year old guy who wanted a fast ride, that could kick the crap out of everything else. What makes me so different then a 25 year old 30-40 years ago who bought a GTO for the SAME REASON. No one here is hiding behind a lie. No one here is in tears because thier cars have a chevy engine in them. Basicly, no one here cares that YOU and the other 1/24th of all pontiac owners has a problem with GM. We understand your points, many of which are good. Now take you beef, back to your little old school fan club so the "rest" of us pontiac guys can enjoy each others cars, aussie, canadian, mexican or american made.

You correct I was 1/3rd wrong, but the first run did not have anythng saying Pontiac on it :)

Well as far as my "rhetoric" as long at I go by the rules I can poast anything I want, I'm not butting in with name calling or being a jerk, this has been just about everyone else, I have a cool head about this and am not causeing a problem, I think you have about 3 people talking about no 06 and the last few pages have been about this FaKe GTO.

I'm just making a point, not causeing a problem, if it feels like a problem to you report me! Just because you dont like the truth you get your feelings hurt, heres a bandaid, feel better?

How am I wrong again? Nobody has come up with answers to my questions on whay this should be a Pontiac GTO, just "it's fast" and "thats what GM is calling it" !!

magnumforc nice try to display me as the "bad guy" however I have been the only one posting without attacking a "person" so ummm your wrong again?!

Answer me why a American Legend can be made in another country, and powered by a Chevy?

How could I even stop people from poasting, you and everyone else can ignore me, but your trying to get your point accross just like me, the only problem is that nobody can tell me any good reason why this car is a Pontiac GTO!

Get over yourself dude LOL!

As far as the 4th i'm have a ball, i'm not even at home posting this! I am also useing Free Speech or free typing here right now.

I also gave for this freedom, and I will use it..

I'm keeping this peaceful, and am asking good questions!

I'm 30 sport, and a chevy powerd car is a chevy!
You 100% wrong about the number of people who hate chevy powered Pontiacs, and your car is a CHEVY, your a chevy guy who drives a Chevy, you cant fly a Pontiac flag and buy Chevy parts for your engine!

Soooooo you getting all red nosed and trearie eyed is not helping things...

You drive a Chevy...

You drive a Chevy...
No.

I drive a GM product. Which includes Chevy, Pontiac, and others.

I'm 30 sport, and a chevy powerd car is a chevy!
You 100% wrong about the number of people who hate chevy powered Pontiacs, and your car is a CHEVY, your a chevy guy who drives a Chevy, you cant fly a Pontiac flag and buy Chevy parts for your engine!

You drive a Chevy...


So what you're basicly saying is guys who use other things in their cars is then considered that car? Say I got a 9'' Ford rear that its then a Ford? Or because a guy is driving a lets say 1960 Ford truck with a Chevy engine that its then a CHEVY? Because what you're saying then this is true. A car is by what the badge says, a Ford is a ford because it has a Blue oval even if the engine isnt made by Ford. A Chevy is a Chevy even if the engine is made by Cadillac.

When you were talking about the chevy and ford thing in the first place, first of all, why would anyone do that? If they did, they are complete idiots. I know its kind of off to that statement but when someone does that its all about customization, its almost what you made, just help from other peoples parts.
Also, Chevy, Pontiac, Olds., GMC, Etc... are all made from one Co. and thats GM. thats just the way it is now days. You cant get a car with a motor made by its product, its all its manufature choice...and like the northstar in the cady's only..nope, its now in the buicks. Chevy dosnt make the motor for others, GM makes the motors for everyone.

When you were talking about the chevy and ford thing in the first place, first of all, why would anyone do that? If they did, they are complete idiots. I know its kind of off to that statement but when someone does that its all about customization, its almost what you made, just help from other peoples parts.
Also, Chevy, Pontiac, Olds., GMC, Etc... are all made from one Co. and thats GM. thats just the way it is now days. You cant get a car with a motor made by its product, its all its manufature choice...and like the northstar in the cady's only..nope, its now in the buicks. Chevy dosnt make the motor for others, GM makes the motors for everyone.

True, what I was talking about is true though, guys actually put Chevy motors in their Ford cars. Now the engines are GM engines now even though they are mainly considered Chevy engines.

You correct I was 1/3rd wrong, but the first run did not have anythng saying Pontiac on it :)

Well as far as my "rhetoric" as long at I go by the rules I can poast anything I want, I'm not butting in with name calling or being a jerk, this has been just about everyone else, I have a cool head about this and am not causeing a problem, I think you have about 3 people talking about no 06 and the last few pages have been about this FaKe GTO.

I'm just making a point, not causeing a problem, if it feels like a problem to you report me! Just because you dont like the truth you get your feelings hurt, heres a bandaid, feel better?

How am I wrong again? Nobody has come up with answers to my questions on whay this should be a Pontiac GTO, just "it's fast" and "thats what GM is calling it" !!

magnumforc nice try to display me as the "bad guy" however I have been the only one posting without attacking a "person" so ummm your wrong again?!

Answer me why a American Legend can be made in another country, and powered by a Chevy?

How could I even stop people from poasting, you and everyone else can ignore me, but your trying to get your point accross just like me, the only problem is that nobody can tell me any good reason why this car is a Pontiac GTO!

Get over yourself dude LOL!

As far as the 4th i'm have a ball, i'm not even at home posting this! I am also useing Free Speech or free typing here right now.

I also gave for this freedom, and I will use it..

I'm keeping this peaceful, and am asking good questions!

You are not asking good questions anymore, you are being redundant and annoying. No one said you were wrong. The bottom line is that everyone HERE likes thier pontiac. Nothing you say is going to change that. If you don't like the GTO badge, take it off and but a monaro badge on it. Or, if you are so die hard pontiac, buy one and put an original judge motor in it. If its so cheap to build a old poncho motor, you will make a killing selling the LS2. Shit, i'll even buy it from you!

Answer me why a American Legend can be made in another country, and powered by a Chevy?

Boy are you hard headed! Pay attention now because you have been told this several thimes before in more than one thread.

Chevy does not make an engine! All GM engines are GM Corporate engines and GM only makes automatic transmissions.

The LS2 is made in Canada.
The auto trans in the GTO is made in Toledo.
The manual is made in Mexico.
The GTO is ASSEMBLED in Oz.

I also have a 2001 Buick GS, it was made in Canada. It has an L67 super charged engine in it which is also used the Park Ave, Impala, Monty Carlo, and the Grand Prix. So is my GS an American car and American powered?

I asked you in another thread what your definition of an American car is, but you never answerd me, why?

Maybe he just wants to have an arugment. Or debate if he thinks that choice of word is better.

Maybe he just wants to have an arugment. Or debate if he thinks that choice of word is better.

I think we'd be having this same issue were this a Ford board and he had an older Ford. With engines being made in various countries, entire vehicles being made in Canada and Mexico for importation into the US (Crown Vic for one, all Police vehicles come from Canada) and Ford engines being placed in all Ford "family" vehicles. The same 4.6 SOHC in the Ford is in the Mercury and the rest of the "family" of vehicles.(with the exception of the DOHC engines available in certain models, but still a Ford engine) Same with Chrysler and the Hemi. How could anyone have a Dodge with a Chrysler Hemi? For shame!

As many have pointed out, for economy, manufacturers do not necessarily make engines specifically for vehicle lines anymore. Making the same engine for different vehicles in different plants was one of the poor manufacturing procedures that got the American car maker into their problems back in the 50's-70's, not to mention their union issues and poor quality. Now, if GM made this "Chevy" engine in the old "Pontiac" plant, would it now be a "Pontiac" engine, simply because of where it was made? No, it would still be a GM engine and not a Chevy or a Pontiac because, as rzkz8k pointed out, again, all GM engines are now Corporate Engines. There are no longer specific line engines.

Bottom line is like it or leave it alone. 'Cause it ain't gonna change.

Amen, haha. Wow, thats extremely true dude. Thanks for pointing that out. As much as i tried pointing it out too.
Cody

Ok so now find me saying "They were faster" in my post???

It's everything the GTO should not be, and IT'S A SICK TRICK TO GET PEOPLE TO BUY A CAR!

You said the following in one of your posts:

"I'm talking about an American Legend built to out run everyones car."

Also, why should the GTO not be a car that handles well?

I'm 30 sport, and a chevy powerd car is a chevy!
You 100% wrong about the number of people who hate chevy powered Pontiacs, and your car is a CHEVY, your a chevy guy who drives a Chevy, you cant fly a Pontiac flag and buy Chevy parts for your engine!

Soooooo you getting all red nosed and trearie eyed is not helping things...

You drive a Chevy...

How is a Marcos TSO a Chevy?

Marcos sports car (http://www.seriouswheels.com/top-2005-Marcos-TSO-GT.htm)

http://www.marcos-eng.com/

How is a Mosler MT900S a Chevy?

http://www.moslerauto.com/

So happy to see everyone write in :)

Ok here we go..

The PMD engine is a Pontiac idea made by Pontiac, even it it was cast in Chevy plant A it's a Pontiac engine. The way you talk we might as well talk about what "was" the steel being melted from/of!

" I got a 9'' Ford rear that its then a Ford?"

As I said before, the engine is the heat and sole of the car, not the rear seat and not the 9".

"thats just the way it is now days."

So your saying that it happend, and nobody can do anything about it?! I find quitters talk like that, my words would be, "Thats F'ed up""What a lie" or "just about everything I have been posting" and not suport it in any way, like everyone should do to FAKEs and Phoneies that sell you out.

"redundant and annoying"

You sound upset, maybe you don't like hearing the truth?

"The LS2 is made in Canada.
The auto trans in the GTO is made in Toledo.
The manual is made in Mexico.
The GTO is ASSEMBLED in Oz."

Boy are YOU are hard headed! , I dont care if the Ls2 was cast on the moon, it's a Chevy engine by Chevy!!! Hello were your eyes open when you read what I wrote?

I care that the engine is a CHEVY by family and it's in a car being called a Pontiac GTO.

Since some of you are typeing out of anger and not reading what I write I will make my point clear.

I'm talking about ONE (1) car this AussiChevyGTO not any other car , OK kids?

All GTOs have allways been powered by a Pontiac engine, it's what made the car a Pontiac, the fact that it has a big fast Pontiac engine in it made it a GTO, even tho you could build a Lemans the same way. You all would love to put this car in the same area that every other car in GM is, it's not it's a car that burned Birghtly and burned out, twice as bright as any other GM car ever was, and since, it's more then any other "fast" car has ever been in GM because it was the FIRST MUSCLE CAR EVER, tho Chevy made faster cars, but they never had the "attraction" of a GTO. SS vs GTO come on guys what would you rather look at? the boxed face SS's or the 110mph sitting still looks for the endura front end of a 72 GTO?

An American car that became a Legend, now remade by the Aussis with a small block chevy???????????????


This car was GMs #3 underdog that changed everything about making a family car fast, not a fast car first, it was a family car (Tempest, Lemans) first, then it became the car we know it today a GTO.

This car did so well that Chevy sales droped , so GM responded by limiting Key HP parts so that Chevy in the end could get back it's sales. If GM is GM why would this have happened? why not Chevy engines in the GTOs in the 60's and 70's? I know all of you will back me up on this point because you know it to be true, you guys however are saying "well pontiac V8s are gone, so why not a Chevy engine?"
am I correct on this???

Because it's not what a Pontiac was or should be, Pontiac GTO ment that you had a ram air engine under the hood, it had different power making RPMs then a SBC, it's had tons of TQ off the line when chevys had to get up around 4-5Gs for the same power! Then they FOOL you by calling it a RAM AIR engine in this Bastard car, it has NOTHING TO DO WITH ANY PONTIAC ENGINE, it's a sales ploy, a BS hope you buy into it BS story!

The F'ed up part of this is real Pontiac people HATE CHEVY ENGINES, they are proud of the PMD V8 it was easyer to work on and parts were easyer to replace and at the time Pontiacs had better heads then chevys with Pontiac heads machined not "as cast" like chevy, and it was an underdog in the well funded Chevy engine world. Thats why I hate the engine!

It would be like if we ran out of soldiers and replaced them with Jar Head Marines in Army uniforms.

Some of you dont accept it because your argueing this because you have a Chevy powered Pontiac, and I dont expect you to diss your own car, so you guys with your little "team" go and hug and painting each others nails is no surprise to me, I kinda like seeing how you guys still cant answer my questions, you keep talking about other cars and they do it all the time now, "not yes this car is powered by a chevy and made outside the us on some Aussis bule print table, and sure it's a fake but it's fast , thats why we like it! I dont care about the real history of the GTO, it hasnt been made in years so it's ok it's not what it should be!"

You people know this is true, you have to, but your pride is showing, and you cant accept it!

GM took away the comp between it's own members (Chevy, Pontiac, Buick, Olds RIP) it was a crappy thing to do, they painted a very colorful picture "Chevy Orange" and ruined great auto names, what we have now at Pontiac is Chevys with Pontiac raps, not Pontiac Vs Chevy Vs Old Vs Buick, but just Chevy Vs Chevy. Thats it, it's pale and sick and without integrity!

But we are still not done with GM, it has a marketing plan to sell you "the great one" again:

GM guy: Lets use a car Idea from the Aussies and sell it over here.

GM Chevy guy: Sure thats a great car, lets put one of our SBCs in it, then it will fly!

GM guy : That sounds great, but how do we sell a import with our SBC in it? It's got to have a great gimic!

GM Chevy guy:(draws another chest full from his crack pipe) Lets call it the new GTO HAHAHAHAHA!

GM Guy: Thats a great Idea it's been so long since the cars been around people will buy it!

GM Chevy guy: I was just kidding, whos going to buy a Chevy powered imported GTO? Didnt GM get sued for useing a SBC in place of an Olds Rocket?

GM Guy: Yes we did, but who cares,times have changed, people dont care about the GTO legend, they just want a GTO, so they can say they have a GTO, people are stupid, they would buy it for the paint job!

GM Chevy guy: Ok, lets do this car...Umm man use more lube, i'm starting to hurt!

GM Guy: I'm allmost done!


Whats said hear is that everyone with a Chevy powered Pontiac is GM Chevy Guy, and your all getting it from GM Guy!

It boils down to "who cares".

I do.

I care that the name of a Pontiac GTO can be slaped on a import with a non pontiac engine in it.

Can't you see that GM used up a great name on an imported car with a chevy engine???

Just because it's fast does not make it a Pontiac GTO, GM may be calling it that, but you all should know better! So of you see my point but then turn and say "it's just the way it's done now" like thats ok,

Are you so shallow that you would by a fake legend because of speed, or name? Some of you who did must!

It's a sad day when an American can be bought on a fake GTO with fast 1/4 time.

well, since you put it that way.........i still don't care. Infact, im gonna have my 350 stroked to a 383, have pontiac engraved into the sides of the block and valve covers and buy a huge sticker to put down the entire length of the car that says "pontiac power".

Sounds like you like to bash guys that want a nice new car.
What do u REALLY expect a new GTO owner to say? Thats what i want to know. Do u REALLY think they bought thier new gto because of the name? Seriously, if the name was selling the cars thier would be a shit crock more of these babies around. People are buying this car based on price, performance and looks---not the badge. Its got the performance, but cost too much and looks too tame.

well, since you put it that way.........i still don't care. Infact, im gonna have my 350 stroked to a 383, have pontiac engraved into the sides of the block and valve covers and buy a huge sticker to put down the entire length of the car that says "pontiac power".

Sounds like you like to bash guys that want a nice new car.
What do u REALLY expect a new GTO owner to say? Thats what i want to know. Do u REALLY think they bought thier new gto because of the name? Seriously, if the name was selling the cars thier would be a shit crock more of these babies around. People are buying this car based on price, performance and looks---not the badge. Its got the performance, but cost too much and looks too tame.

If we keep this thread going it will pass the "New GTO love it or hate it" thread!

Import38, we found common ground!!
Yep I dont expect a new GTO to come out and say "well your right, it's not a GTO"
yep I think it cost too much and looks tame! Untill 1970? a GTO could be bought for a few hundred more then a LeMans, this is also what the so called GTO has a issues with, it's not really buyable to the lower middle class..Deloren wanted a fast car that could be bought by the average Joe or jane, and he made it possable for a tempast and Lemans package that could be ordered cheaper then the GTO and do just about the same 1/4 or better, I say better because in 71 and 72 the endura bumper was much heaver then the stamped steel Lemans.

I would think some people would by the car because it's "fast" but I think more people buy the name on the car, think about that, would you buy a colbolt or a GTO if they cost the same?

"Sounds like you like to bash guys that want a nice new car"
No I never said at one time that this car was "slow" or a bad performer. I said it's a lie. I also said that anybody that has a Chevy engine in a Pontiac is driveing a chevy, however I never "bashed" anybodys car, however if you think me calling your car a "chevy" is bashing, you have alot of hope left in you!

Your letting anger rule you with that BS engraved Pontiac stuff! Think about it, your half pontiac, you like the looks but you dont buy into the Pontiac engine! Pontiacs have allways looked better then chevys or just about anybodys cars.

The fact is, your cars heart and sole is a Chevy, it's a Chevy! Your car will allways be a "seen it" "done that" with a chevy engine. The engine is so over used it's sick, sure the car will be fast, but when dose just being fast make the car? If you were to put a true Pontiac engine into your car how many people do you think would be gazing under your hood and asking questions, compared to the same car you have parked next to you with a seen it 1,000,000 times 383?

Without getting snootie at me or getting pissed, answer that question . I would hope that you answer this question honestly..

And I would like to hear from all of you that have chevys in your Pontiacs, how many of you would like to have a real pontiac under the hood over your car?

Answer this honestly, you wont be giveing up anything to me by answering with "yes", and I will not toss it in your face later on, thats my word, and my word is solid!

ok, i want a pontiac. So, i shouldn't buy that pontiac because of the chevy engine? Then what do i buy? I don't like ford engines, i don't like crysler looks, and i certinaly will not buy and import, because im about tradition--and im talking american name--obviously not built in america. So what do i buy? Sure i may want to build a "real" poncho. But time limits doing that for the avaerage person who wants one "now". So my question to you is---WHAT WOULD YOU BUY? It can't be earlier then a 90's era car. U can't do an engine swap either. Your other limit is it has to be under 40 grand.

Let me know. We are all eagly waiting, ready to take notes. :rolleyes:

I'm glad you asked this,
I have allways like the looks of late 90's grand Prix, I would get a black one with the supercharged 3800 engine in it, the engine has all kinds of bolt on and aftermarkt engine parts including heads! The engine is 100% nobodys, it's not a chevy nor a pontiac, it is a true GM engine not made or stamped by anyone.

I could not argue that it is not pontiac or that it is.

The only problem I see with it, is being Fwd, however people are doing low 13's all day with the driverside headlight removed. I know they make a kit that replaces the pully on the supercharger that gives it extra boost. With aftermarket heads and hedders and a cam kit you will be eating up alot of cars that would race you just for an ego trip.

It's allso cool that you get some of your dash readouts reflected on the windshield so you dont have to look down. I would also lower it just a little and put some sloted rotors on it.

The plus side to this car is that it's not alot of doe to get one, figure going by the 40 grand you could invest in a new "built engine" as the bulk of the money and work up slowly with other mods.

A grand Am with the same engine would also work.

Another car would be the pontiac sun fire, it has a real pontiac 4 banger in it, and i'm sure with as little as 3G you could get a turbo kit along with some innercooling.

Another sleeper would be the Pontiac Montana trans port Van, gut that fat girl for weight and remove the rear seats and build a big Alum. water innercooler in the back for the engine, after you get a turbo kit.

Thats some crap getting beat by a van!

I was curzing with my buddie in his 72 Monte, it had a 355 and a "mild" cam, Edl, 650 carb and the 2.02 SBC factory heads.It was heavy but he had 4:10s and a 12 bolt with ladder bars, and his stage 2 shift kit in the Th350 made it "seem" quicker then it was. Anyhow we were out looking for a race, we ended up raceing a few cars that thought they had something and beat them easy, well this lifted JUNKie looking K5 pulled up on the passengerside (my side) and reved the piss out of the engine, and with no muffler on the end of his Y pipe it was loud. He says "i'm just have'n fun" and my buddie hammered it as the light changed.

That Blazer kicked our buts, it never spun a tire and left us, it was gone, my buddie took me home right after that. It was embarrassing, and it wasnt even my car!

I do know what your saying about your car, however you do have a chance now that your moveing on up with your plans for your car.

Sure the cast of adding a Pontiac in your car would be like building a BBC, and the chassie engine mounts would need to be changed as well as an adaptor plate to go from your trans to a Pontiac engine.

Sure it would not be cheap, and I really dont expect people to do that who dont have the time and money. I would never take up that project if that was my only car and I worked paycheck to paycheck.
However I can do it now, if I was to do it, I would get the last F body run T/A like Lotus's car and sell off the engine or make I cool urinel out of it. I would use one of my 400s nothing wild, 40 over with a roller cam WITHOUT a loped idle, I want it to be stock feeling, I would also try to use the factory air box. I would use black valve covers, and use a TPI kit for induction, I think I could use the same PCM with a chip, the only voodoo would be the pontiac fire order VS chevys.

It would grab a few heads as they walked by and expected to see the plane jane SBC and notice that my water cross over looks odd, they might even ask if I have an AIR GAP intake, and I will tell them "all Pontiac inatkes are air gap type.

I think most any pontiac looks great , even the hated Aztec. I just hate the chevy engine.

I have the movie of the T/A eating that import on avi or mpg if anybody wants it.

I'm not geoing to be around for a week, i'm sure some of you wish I was gone longer.

Drive it like you stoled it!

I disagree with you. 1- Watch the GTO commercial. the GTO goes up against a BMW at the traffic light, not a Mustang. (there's a reason GM chose to use a BMW, not a mustang.) 2- The GTO is 40K+ (luxury sport sedan pricing), not 25k (mustang pricing) 3- conservative graphics/ lines. Not aggressive like the T/A was. Again, appealing to the market of a luxury sport sedan consumer base 4- I have friends who design at GM. When they tell me GM's plan for that car (it was intended to go up against BMW), I believe them.

Now, the GTO should NOT be this. It "should" be an affordable 400hp car. (40K is not bargain pricing) It should be selling for 25K loaded. If it did I'd bet that car would sell like the dickens. It "should" have aggressive scoops, graphics, a "judge" package and killer rims. This type of thinking worked in 1964 for Pontiac. They couldn't build enough of them. If they did this today I believe it would work.

But then again in '64 America wasn't over saturated with lawyers and people looking to sue everybody for anything. Gm may not be able to afford legal defense against them being sued for making available a car with loads of power to the youth market. It woudl be deemed "socially irresponsible" and maybe this is why it's out of the price range for the average american.

look i am sorry but the GTO here is $33,000 sticker price. now 45k?? come on now look it up its on the pontiac web page!gm has to atleast have a test vehicle for altleast a year or so to get ppls opinion about the car. 2005 they did add hood scoops, bigger motor, duals in the rear, and you could get factory ground effects. so whats the big fuss over it. im a ford guy but paying 26k for a 300hp car that needs a little help on the exterior, compared to a 33k 400 hp car plus more engine upgrades and better interior, i think it is a good bargain. if you go out and look the next closest thing you can get in a 400hp car is the cobra, charger srt8, and the vette which costs way over 40k!

"gm has to atleast have a test vehicle for altleast a year or so to get ppls opinion about the car"

Well I hope the next time they do this, they try not going to the "Center for the Blind".