What takes so long with the subbing.

This is killing me >.< this is probably the longest it has taken them to sub initial d. If anyone watches the anime naruto...that one takes one day...an initial d takes this long..how come?:screwy::eek7:

Okay, when fans get together and create fansubs of a series, all they have to do is insert English text at the bottom of the screen of their computer video file. That's it. They do this with no sanction from the series' creators, and usually with a cursory knowledge of the Japanese language.


Now, when a licensing studio (like Tokyopop) subtitles a series, they use up to ten to fifteen translators with multiple years of experience just to come up with an intelligible interpretation of the dialog (remember, Japanese has an entirely different grammatical scheme than English). They also have to research differences in syntax, dialect, period grammar, slang, and find English equivalents (for which, sometimes, there are none).

And, after all of this is done AND a subtitle script is devised, the script has to be approved (and occasionally altered) by the Japanese creators. The script is sent to Japan, reviewed, altered, and sent back, where the English team reviews it again and has to edit it in order (again) to make it intelligible for an English speaking audience. For a topline title, this can occur dozens of time until an agreeable compromise is reached between the Japanese creators and the English translators.

If you want a good comparison as to "What takes so long", try something other than amateur fansubs of Naruto. After all, Shopro (the same people responsible for Inu Yasha) have licensed Naruto and will be producing DVD's (and getting the show a Cartoon Network run) within the year.

while japanese is a difficult language to learn, im quite certain that anyone with a remedial understanding of the language could come up with a readable english version. Where the problem lies is the coding. No, they dont just put words at the bottom of the media file. Code for a 20 minute audio codec on a video file can take weeks for manipulate, all the while any mistakes in coding will cause the file to be corrupted.
Add to that that fansubs are just that, subbed by fans. people just like you and me that have lives, maybe a job or school...go figure.

but it suprises me that there is no ameture subbers for initial d...thats weird. and about naruto ... i hate them for licensing it it will be english dubbed...prolly no blood or anything perverted(jiraiya). I would rather these companies not bring things like intial d and naruto to the states and just stick with the fansubs. The translators take a while but they often ruin it by changing the words to "urban" language. like i remember in the 1st initial d dvd tokyopop released... iggy says man this sucks were the only ones without cars...then the english dubbing makes him say man this blows we aint got cars...or something stupid like that....i never watched the english versions again after that.

The reason there are no fansubs of Initial D is because when you fansub and distribute a licensed series you are facilitating piracy of a copyrighted product. Fansubs of licensed products are ILLEGAL.

Yes, in the English dub Itsuki says "Man, this blows." However, that's not the translation given in the SUBTITLED version that's also on the DVD. The beauty of modern anime DVD's is that except in the case of kiddy shows licensed by 4Kids (like Pokemon, One Piece, or Yu-Gi-Oh) just about ALL anime receive uncut bi-lingual DVD releases.

Shopro is a subsidiary of Viz Entertainment, the same company that handles Inu Yasha. As with Inu Yasha, there will be a moderately edited television run and totally uncut bi-lingual DVD's.

And, by the way, buying legitimate domestic releases guarantees that more anime will be produced and more anime will be released. Do you realize that it was AMERICAN money that got Big O continued? That it was enthusiasm from AMERICAN fans and money from Urban Vision (the American licensing company) that got Ninja Scroll turned into a TV series?

How about the list of anime that were flops in Japan that have become fan favorites in America? Cowboy Bebop (originally heavily edited in its Japanese Pay Per View airing), Outlaw Star, Berserk, and the list goes on.

And how about the obscure titles that get released because of the money that big name licensing and high ratings TV broadcasts bring? Do you realize that Funimation milking the Dragonball Z franchise for every penny brought Fruits Basket to the states? Or that to please the fans who've supported the anime industry, Funimation paid 4kids for the rights to release UNCUT SUBTITLED Yu-Gi-Oh DVD's?

The bold faced truth is that responsible fansubbers respect the industry and only do the service of helping publicize new series. The responsible ones pull fansubs once a series is licensed so that pirates don't have the oppurtunity to acquire the property illegally.

ok I see what u mean. I haven't really thought of it that way :sly:.

fourth stage isnt licensed yet....so its not illegal.....yet.

exactly.

besides fansubs are a little more complicated than how layla puts it, but even then its not more than what toypop has to do.

Why can't you just wait for the licensed release? Most fansubs I've seen are of terrible quality, anyways.

It's like getting files online/filesharing: you're stealing them. It doesn't matter if it's licensed or not, you're still a parasite by committing this act. People spent a lot of money developing this series, and you're gonna just take it for free?

That's my 2 cents. Out.

i wonder how its stealing if you can't buy it in the first place.

btw the current initial d subs are great quality. if you are reffereing to the ones for first or second stage, then yeah the quality sucked.

i love the assumption that any file swaping is seen as parasitic. how is someone watching a fansub any different than someone seeing a movie they didnt pay for at a friends house? not every piece of digital media needs a price tag. you want to buy fantastic quality licensed dvds of initial d? great for you...im sure you feel satisfaction from having them. me, id rather see them in original form with or without subs. i just want to see it. thats all. i dont want a collection of cool dvds. i feel that no money is being lost by my participation in watching a fansub. i wouldnt buy the dvd....ever.

everyone has their opinion. but remember...we're all friends here.

yeah the fansubs for fourth stage are good quality i think... but I think it's okay to download things if they're not licenced or we can't buy them. We download the fansubs only because we don't live in Japan or maybe we don't understand Japanese it's pretty much like watching it on tv...but the tv is ur computer. So what you're saying is lets say your favorite show is Pimp my ride or something like that, and the night it's on you have work and you couldn't see it, so you go and download it. Would that be wrong? because its almost the same thing.. Also I downloaded ALL of initial d online...yeah it was illegal...but I did end up buying a couple dvd's because of it. If it wasn't for these illegal fansubs...alot of people would have probably not heard about it .. which means they wouldn't have bought the dvd's.

Equivalent exchange, buddy. That's all I'm going to say.

I admit, the first time I saw Initial D it was via a fansub.

However, those were VHS fansubs released by Anime Vision (a group that contributed their fansubs to Tokyopop to form the basis of the subtitle script) way back in 1998. At that point in time, the idea that Initial D was a licensable property was pretty laughable.

The series I do watch via fansub are those in the same boat. My fansub collection (primarily VHS) is comprised of older shows (such as the original Galaxy Express 999 TV series or Violinist Hamelyn) that stand little to no chance of being licensed and thus I have little to no chance of seeing them legitimately.

Right now, licensing is pretty much guaranteed for big name, big budget anime that fall into traditional big selling categories. For instance, Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex was in licensing talks before the first episode aired in Japan. The only real hold-up in the US was a minor feud between Bandai Entertainment (who had the capitol to license SAC) and Manga Entertainment (who still held a license on the original Mamoru Oshii directed film). As such, Manga and Bandai agreed to co-license Stand-Alone Complex.

It's become like this for many series. CLAMP, Rumiko Takahashi, Sunrise, BONES, Gonzo, Production I.G., Madhouse, Gainax, AIC, and Studio Pierrot have all proven to be "money in the bank" with their releases. If Akira Toriyama decided to do another TV series, it'd be licensed within a month of airing because it's proven his stuff is marketable. When Shinichi Watanabe or Satoshi Kon or Yoshitoshi Abe announce new creations, instantly the American distributors start talking about licensing.

However, there are still the small scale productions, the sleepers, and the overlooked classics. These I try to find fansubbed and continue to lobby hard for releases. I'd still like to see the original Captain Harlock TV series released over here (preferably by Pioneer or Media Blasters, U.S. Manga Corps is too sketchy).

i to have fansubs, but mainly of older anime.For instance the original Macross series before they defiled it by making robotech"shudders" but the 4th stage isn't bought just yet, so i don't have a problem with watching the fansubs.

ALthough if you think about it, this series isn't released on cable television, in japan it is air on pay-per-view.So yes these amatuer fansubbers are performing illegal acts by copying it and releasing it worldwide while others had to pay to view it.

*just finished watching episode 11 of fourth stage............i love this anime.........*

Equivalent exchange, buddy. That's all I'm going to say.

this is inital d not fma.

I know, but I love FullMetal Alchemist so much I just had to plug it. :)

Back to the topic at hand. What I'm saying is exactly what was said before. Initial D Fourth Stage is shown on Pay-Per-View, therefore it is illegal to copy it and offer it for free download.

My views on fansubs are the same no matter what the series, save for the few that have no chance of ever coming here or have been butchered with no chance of an uncut version becoming available. Those are the only exceptions.

Thumbs up for FUNimation bringing out unedited 4Kids stuff. Let's hope they give us the first part of Dragonball Z unedited sometime in the future...

Done with this thread.

they have DBZ unedited.

Like the episodes before Captain Ginyu? I can't find them anywhere.

Im with who ever said that if it wasn't for fansubs alot of people would not know what most of these anime titles are. I will admit I have watched every episode of Initial D, minus Act 11 of the 4th stage, via fansubs. But I also buy the DVDs to help support it. But its so addicting that I can't wait a year for them to come out with the DVD of the 4th Stage so I can be caught up. Currently I only have the first 3 U.S. DVDs of Initial D because I'm broke. I do plan on buying all of the DVDs though.

Most animes I will download a couple fansubs to see what they are like that way I know I'm not wasting money. The same thing I do for music. I download it to see if I like it or not, if I do I will go out and buy the CD. I have no problem supporting the media, but I do have a problem with wasting money, it doesn't come easy.

here here

I dont know about you guys but to me. I think the industry relies on the subbing of there stuff. If youre going to nitpic about whether some guy pays to see Initial d then copies it and sends it to be seen or even gets paid a nominal fee to do so. Which could only happen once and probably not that much , then I dont want to see anyone in this forum speeding, or hurring up to run through a yellow light. Is it wrong. YES. Is speeding really wrong. YES. but we do it every day. However if we are going to do it just as laylas keeper said before we may as well be responsible for it and just take it off when it gets licenced. Here is a perfect example. When i love something like an anime. I want it. I want to be entertained. Since family guy went off the air i have been relativly bored. However, my friend is a total pirate, he is cool though. he burned me a copy of rurouni kenshin. After i saw the first episode. I WAS TOTALLY HOOKED. just like when he introduced me to initial d. here is the problem. Its all about supply and demand. I wanted to watch more kenshin and initial d. they didnt have the supply.
so i burned and downloaded all the episodes i could to satisfy my lust for action and quality cartoons. Now i like these series so much, that i want to watch them anytime and i want good quality. so the first chance i got i bought the entire collection of Initial d and i have all 3 collectors boxes for Kenshin. I couldnt be happier. yeah some people are just gonna watch then not watch again. and some are going to watch and keep a burnt copy. those will eventually not work in a couple of years. My quallity dvds will. And there are people out there just like me that we just dont want to wait untill they decide to put out the next three friggin episodes and charge you 20 dollars for the dvd. when i can wait and get my moneys worth and just buy a box set. the set is more economical. I dont have the money to blow on a series(kenshin for example) at 20 a dvd for 95 episodes. even if i give them some leeway its 95eps/4eps per dvd=23.75 which we round up to 24dvds now 24dvds*20per dvd=$480 now ive seen the dvds for sale here and they only have 3 per dvd that i saw so for initial d. I like anime but not that much id rather spend it on my car. So if you ask me they are lucky that there are some subfans out there to push there product. Only a total moron would buy one dvd at a time. or has more money then they know what to do. thats why people buy movies anyway to watch them when ever they want and it not be a sucky copy. in the long run a dvd is better because if you keep a copy on your hard drive then unless you go to great measures it will eventually crash or become corrupt, viruses or just need the space. If you keep it on a burnt CD. Its not going to last forever. My piont is does piracy steel money. yeah but so does AOL.
they have been overcharging me forever untill i dumped them. companies do it. ive been apart of it. they get greedy and pump the price up and then bitch when because the price is so high that we are priating and they are losing money. (Now japanese executive man with tiny pe%is cannot afford new sports car and go visit Me so horny, i love you long time. Instead he must buy sports car from last year and visit Me so horny, Ive loved you and alot of others long time.)all because they want to be greedy about it. i had a friend that was in japan for a year and doing that kind of stuff over there is dirt cheap. He bought 100s of manga for really cheap and new. he could easily turn around and sell them there and litterally get a 200% profit. we did the math. you get my piont so its all good. it works out the system isnt perfect but then again in the world of anime look who would run the system. I love and will buy there cars, but there just going to have to take a little loss on the anime with me.

I have no issue with fansubs AS LONG AS THEY ARE OF UNLICENSED PRODUCT.

Also, I believe it is important to point out that now there is a precedent for Japanese companies to request that American/English language fansubs be pulled from the net. Not too long ago, Media Factory (producers of such anime as Area 88, Gatekeepers, Rahxephon, and Vandread) asked several large fansub groups to stop fansubs of their properties.

As it is undoubtedly known, most bootleg copies of all media are produced in the Pacific Rim (mostly Hong Kong and Taiwan). What has become a problem is that fansub groups provide a perfect place for these pirates to get their hands on source material for producing their DVD's (as well as opening up a whole secondary market in the States). These bootleg Region 0 DVD's (check through eBay, you'll find a ton of them) are destroying the Japanese DVD market. As such, Japanese production companies are becoming very upset with American fansubbers.

With Media Factory setting the precedent, already rumblings are coming from Production I.G., Madhouse, Gainax, Sunrise (which is wholly owned by Bandai) and many others about how detrimental fansubs are to the industry as a whole.

yea i see this. but again, these fansubs also help them gain money, probably more then they lose. without the fansubs we would still be at the beginning of stage two. It would take soooo long to catch up to fourth stage, and i bet alot of people would become less interested because of the very long wait time. Even if these English fansubbers give them material that they can make dvd's on, if they stopped do you really thing the bootlegging will stop? it won't there will always be someone releasing it to them to make money or just for whatever reasons. It might hurt the Japanese dvd industry, but it's not like that stuff wouldnt happen without these english fansubbings. I have bought 2 dvd's because the fansubs were good enough, but nothing beats dvd quality. I will end up buying a box set later. because like he said, we all dont have that kind of money to go an buy all these dvd's for $20 a dvd. I have spread this to at least 5 of my friends an a couple have bought dvd's also. I think for now, even if it's licensed, the fansubs help the industry more then hurt it. Saying that they are ruining all these things is just because they need something to blame. no matter what there will always be people bootlegging things, it cannot be stopped.