Do i have a CHANCE? Civic Vs. Mustang GT

Okay... i am just wondering what ur guys's opinions are on this... here is the backround...

About 3 months ago one of my "friends" bought a 2000 Mustang GT. pretty much brand new. Now, ever since then he's been doing everything like hes the hot shit, and well.. its starting to get on some peoples nerves. My good friend kraig bought a 00' Gs-r to try and accomplish the feat of beating the (mustang man) but before they could race he rear ended a mini van... anyways.. this guy claims his car runs 13's and its stock except for some performance tires... he also might have an lsd but i am not sure. Now, it has become my dream, along with others in my small town... to shut this kid down... with a good old honda 4-banger. and i just recently purchased a car for the job... only question.. is it READY? because i dont want to race him untill i am sure i can beat him, or at least not get left in the dust.. anyways here is the "Chosen One"

Its a 1992 Honda Civic Hatchback.

Mods:
Integra Type R (USDM) motor completely stock inside
AEM cold air intake
Civic SI Tranny
JDM final drive
ITR LSD
Skunkworks short shifter
front and rear strut tower bars
Eibach race springs
Suspension techniques sway bars
koni red shocks

Now... do you Think i can pull on him or what? and if not? any suggestions would be great...

If you can drive I think you have a good chance.

If he cant drive then you can beat him.

i would consider myself a good driver, not great, but good... hes good at launching but for god knows why shifts like a 85 year old grandma i would say my skill level is a bit higher than his.

Odds are on your side.

Unless they're drag radials and he's a really good driver he's not running 13s. And even if they're drag radials and he's a really good driver he's probably only running high 13s if 13s at all. Depends on how long the race goes on for..I'm pretty sure he should trap higher MPH than you...


Edit: I reread that he's really good at launching...if he takes a huge lead from the launch than I don't think you'll have a chance of catching up.

any suggestions would be great...

I suggest NOS!

Sounds like a drivers race - my 2nd gen CRX was capable of high 13's with a b16 swap and a few other mods. Get NOS for added insurance. :thumbsup:

Is his stick or auto? I aint got no real advise, just curious. you prolly could take him on the take off.

94civicdxtuner...how is he going to take a RWD 300tq car on drag radials off the line with a FWD street tire car with no torque? Also..he says the guy has skill at launching. So yeah...explain this one to me. I'd love to hear it.

You can kill him if you can drive OK. You can quote me on that.

i Dont really have the money for anymore parts as of now... i need to get some new rear brake rotors and pads, besides, im not a big fan of nos, i dont hate people who use it. im just scared of ruining my engine. also i have a stock exhaust... and some people have been saying that is choking the b18c5 but im not sure if a cat would make that much of a difference, besides, i love how LEGAL my car is its awesome. BTW i do currently have some aftermarket low profile tires, not sure of the brand, they came with the car.. so just letting you guys know. and please if anyone has any advice on how to get a good launch im open to suggestions. thanks for all the input guys! -kc

Deff. look into getting an exhaust it really is holding you back.

But you should take him if you dont mess up driving.

if you dont beat him you SUCK at driving. i have a b16 hatch and have killed countless mustangs. the other day me and my big friend (me and him weigh 470 combined) fucking walked ALL OVER this mustang gt.

May I ask arn't you the same person as this?
your other post (http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=356021)

so first of all i'd like to hear what this is and 2nd Its a drivers race but he'll get you outta the hole if this is even a vaild question.

Yes, that was my post. at that time i was just about to buy a stock ek instead. but overnight somone bought it out from under me. so instead i ended up buying my friends eg which is this car right here, so basically forget about that other post.. i was trying to learn some more on the car i thought i was getting but it never came through. Thanks for all the input though, u guys are great.

P.S. I will MOST LIkely Race the (mustang Man) today if i can find him where he usually is... I will keep you guys informed on the results.

While im at it... my friend has a 00' gs-r bone stock except a racing clutch n flywheel. what kind of race would it be if all three of us ran? (he cant race for a while though, his cars in the shop till friday after next) Personally i have been in both cars while racing and it feels like the mustang would beat the gr-s hands down, but i have been told repeatedly that the gs-r has a good chance. Whats ur guy's thinking.

Ill keep everyone posted on the results.

THANKS!!!

94civicdxtuner...how is he going to take a RWD 300tq car on drag radials off the line with a FWD street tire car with no torque? Also..he says the guy has skill at launching. So yeah...explain this one to me. I'd love to hear it.

Well Mr/Miss (who cares) dampachi, he could get a get jump off, seeing that his car is a stick. Who's to say the other guy wont f*ck up and stall? The little things count too.

The mustang will beat the GS-R almost effortlessly. I got beat by a Type-R because at first I thought it was a GS-R and I didn't go full throttle because I've beat GS-Rs pretty bad before. Then we raced again and we ran pretty head to head..but I started pulling away by 90mph. B18C5 is the Type-R motor right? And it also has a pretty high compression ratio? Yeah...I don't think I'd want to be putting NOS on that..that's built to be N/A.

um...then whats to say this guy wont fuck up and stall? Damn you're throwing alot of shit into the equasion. So, let's assume for a minute that they both launch perfectly rather than assuming he'll launch good (keep in minds he's asking advice on launching..so apparently he's not too skilled) and the mustang will launch bad (the guy already said the mustang driver is skilled at launching). So! They both launch perfectly. The mustang will definitely take a huge lead. And isn't the mustang a stick too? You can't stall an automatic..so yeah..that 'advantage' is no longer valid. Oh yeah..and it's Mr.

You also must throw in power to weight. he has a civic with a b18c5 which is lighter than the integra's either way I think if the mustang was near stock and this guy had a catback atleast he would wax the stang with little to no problem.

If the mustang spins his tires the least amount..then it's a drivers race...if the mustang shifts 2nd slow..then he should beat the mustang. Race him several times and I bet you'll get totally different outcomes eachtime.

You can kill him if you can drive OK. You can quote me on that.
agreed. i use to beat them left and right w/ my eg hatch/b18c1 w/ just intake&hondata

Civic will win 3 outta 5 races

um...then whats to say this guy wont fuck up and stall? Damn you're throwing alot of shit into the equasion. So, let's assume for a minute that they both launch perfectly rather than assuming he'll launch good (keep in minds he's asking advice on launching..so apparently he's not too skilled) and the mustang will launch bad (the guy already said the mustang driver is skilled at launching). So! They both launch perfectly. The mustang will definitely take a huge lead. And isn't the mustang a stick too? You can't stall an automatic..so yeah..that 'advantage' is no longer valid. Oh yeah..and it's Mr.

Ok, i agree, but theres always the little things (tire pressure, driving skill, reflexes, correct shifting, etc) that play a huge factor in the race, and that was the point that i was trying to make. Its not always "who has the bigger engine". Get where I'm comin from?

Damn..you're already making excuses for a race that hasn't even taken place. Do you have any pictures of your car? I think I hear something boiling..

Hey guys... thanks again for all the input... i just got a digital camera (a small shitty one) but it works and i wanna post up some pics. will somone please tell me how? also how you pic pictures so that it shows everytime you post. thanks

P.S. didnt get to race him yet.. maybe tomorrow. did smoke my friends 93 integra with a b16a no competition and a firebird from a 50 mph roll.. (my civic si gearing has its ups and downs ;D)

One of the mustang moderators, GTStang made these very easy to follow directions on how to post pictures..and it can be found here: http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=343284

Damn..you're already making excuses for a race that hasn't even taken place. Do you have any pictures of your car? I think I hear something boiling..

I just bought it, so check with me in 5 months. Unlike you, my mommy doesnt give me money to fix up my car. I work for my shit.

Ok guys this is headed in the wrong direction, instead of talking about the topic you are shifting towards flaming each other.
Let's calm it down a little.

The EG with an ITR will win hands down, every race. GT Mustangs run low 14's and very rarely get into the 13's. B18C5 eg's run mid to low 13's all day long and my friend's eg with an ITR with i/h/e ran a 12.98. The GSR will lose though.

To run a 12.9 with just a B18C5 and i/h/e, he must have his car fully gutted and run drag radials. And 94civicdxtuner..that was the most gradeschool remark you possibly could have made. Since when is having pictures of your car considered 'fixing it up'? And you're not the only person in the world who has to work a job for what they want so stop pretending like you are.

Naturally he's gutted the interior. All my friends and I don't have interior except one who's into the JDM crap. And he ran the 12.98 on Falken Azenis tires. He has Skunk2 coilovers with the stock struts, 15" by 6.5" wheels, and a carbonfiber hood. With all that he ran a 12.98. He has run it three times but he can't seem to get a better time. Most of his times are around 13.1-13.2. Even with that though, he would woop on any GT Mustang.

There is no way a pretty much stock civic would ever beat a mustang gt, it would not even be close at all, all the stang would have to do is hold the gas and that's it

My friend has a totally gutted hatch with a B16A and just I/H/E..If I have 2 passengers he can beat me.

2000 Mustang GTs run 14.5 - 14.9 ( Mid to high fourteens)

An ITR runs high 14s. Now put the engine on a lighter car, with some mods and...you see how the story ends.

Smokey818, reread the whole thread, this isn't a stock Civic. It has a motor swap, and GT Mustangs are not very fast. I seriously hope you aren't losing to them in your car.

I ran a 14.2@101mph in my totally stock 2002 GT mustang 5 speed.

Oh don't worry, I know GT's will run that. Most GT's I see run usually get in the low 14's.

To run a 12.9 with just a B18C5 and i/h/e, he must have his car fully gutted and run drag radials. And 94civicdxtuner..that was the most gradeschool remark you possibly could have made. Since when is having pictures of your car considered 'fixing it up'? And you're not the only person in the world who has to work a job for what they want so stop pretending like you are.

omfg..........are you still whining?

Ok lets get this straight.... IM the one going to post pics of MY car... Not 94CIVICDXTuner and I am the one who started the thread.... i think some of you are getting us confused. P.S. i raced the mustang on the freeway today from a 40 mph roll.... haha was funny stuff... specially because he was talking mad shit about imports like 3 minutes before. Have it on video :) ... its SO hilarious.. my friends in the car WITH HIM and im alone. and he says just before we start how bad hes gonna smoke me and how shitty imports and hondas are then mid-sentence....ZOoooom Lol he got lost so fast. then he drove home. talkign about "yeah...wellll....when i have exhaust your toast..." lol cant wait to beat him from a stop. thanks guys!

post the vid ASAP lol i think that would be funny to see :cwm27:

how on earth do you post video's? its kinda long like 10 minutes, has some other cars i recently raced as well. and a "best motoring" kind of introdution with both my car and the mustang (going over the cars performance) had to do my car seperately though... was funny cause he didnt know what i had done to it.. he must have had a hint though with my type r seats ;)

you have to have a site to host it on then post the link to it.

well.. dont got one a those. could maybe send u one thru aim but it'd take days

I'm finding this thread pretty interesting and (before posting) was wondering if someone could set me straight on these Honda motors I always hear...

Like, what excatly is a B16, B18(aka GS-R?) - how many litres, hp are we talking about for each. Am I correct in thinking that the thread starter has an Integra motor in his smaller Civic?

B16A is the Si (SiR for the Canadians) motor. Has 160hp and an overwhelming 111 ft/lb torque. The B18C1 is the GSR motor. Has 175hp and 127 ft/lb torque.

The motor that the thread starter has is the B18C5, the best B-series motor out there. Has 195hp and 130 ft/lb torque.

Has 160hp and an overwhelming 111 ft/lb torque.

Is underwhelming a word? It should be :iceslolan

b16=1.6 litres
b18=1.8 litres

2000 Mustang GTs run 14.5 - 14.9 ( Mid to high fourteens)

An ITR runs high 14s. Now put the engine on a lighter car, with some mods and...you see how the story ends.


I've never seen a GT run slower than a 14.3 at the track. most run about a 14.1.

I've never seen a GT run slower than a 14.3 at the track. most run about a 14.1.

Everybody has to take into consideration that where you live has an effect on 1/4 mile times too. So there can be variances in times from location to location.

I have a slip somewhere here where I raced a 02 GT that ran a 14.6.

Everybody has to take into consideration that where you live has an effect on 1/4 mile times too. So there can be variances in times from location to location.

I have a slip somewhere here where I raced a 02 GT that ran a 14.6.


I agree entirely. elevation plays a huge role in performance on N/A motors. and also different tracks take care of and prep their raceways differently, also different tracks are sometimes made of different materials and different quality materials. All these variables play a huge role in what a car will run..... but my point was that he was saying that a GT was a mid to high 14 second car where really it is a very low 14 second car, so if thats the case then the ITR which should run a high 14 would be running a mid to high 15.


the only thing at the track that will affect only one car is the driver, all other variables usually affect both vehicles.

The B18C5 is the best honda motor if you're staying N/A...but I'd go B18C1 for boost. Not to mention for the cost of a B18C5 you could have a turbo'd B18C1. Or atleast that was true when I was looking into building a turbo'd B18C1 93 hatchback.

how much does a civic hatch wiegh? as far as the starter of this thread, how much does his car wiegh?

You don't save that much money. And really the best NA motor would be the B20/Vtec. But then we could start talking about race motors. This guy I know has a b16 that makes over 300whp NA. Of course the displacement is 2.4 liters and it's an all motor drag CRX. So in stock Honda b-series form the B18C5 would be the best NA and the B18C1 would be the best turbo. It all changes when you start doing other mods though.

There were 4 different trims in the hatchback models of that year.
CX = 2094 lbs
DX = 2178 lbs
Si = 2326 lbs
VX = 2178 lbs
Keep in mind these are bone stock, off the showroom weight.

The b-series motor is about 80 lbs heavier than the d-series. That's an estimate though, don't quote me on that.

My friends hatch, gutted, with him in it, and a full tank of gas weighs around 1800 pounds.

which hatch is this? 1800 is a bit low unless theres ALOT of weight reduction going on, more than just interior.

He had at the time just one racing seat..but I think he got another one because his girlfriend. And it's like...everything. Radio/AC/ALL the interior and he has lightweight parts. He has about 150hp in that..that's good for low 14s, right?

okay just to fill you all in the model is a cx with not really any more weight added. just changed to type r seats but that shouldnt make much of a difference

the B18C1 would be the best turbo.
That's really speculative though IMO. I'd much rather have a B18B boosted than a C1. Just for the pure fact that you would have gobs and gobs of torque with a boosted B18B motor. It's entirely preference. IMO torque makes a car more fun that HP so I would hands down go with a B18B.

I used to think that the C1 would be the best motor to boost. But that was when i had my 4th gen EX. Now that I've had a taste of some torque (an entire 175 ft/lb with my Sentra lol) I so much more want a torquey car than a more of a top end car. Considered going domestic a few times, but I can't picture a little Korean dude driving a Camaro or Mustang :icon16:

Anyone can drive a domestic!

Anyone can drive a domestic!
I don't think that made very much sense