head issues - repair/mod advice needed

All advice welcome!

I would like to know specifically-how I should go about fixing the problem w/ the head on the engine (see below) and generally-what I should do about (taking into consideration all the problems w/ suspension, cooling, and engine) upgrades.

[note-I think this car is a ew3 1.488l engine; the block uses the same oil filter as that. It has a 12 valve head on it.]

My '85 Si has the wrong head on it, according to the shop I took it to. It also doesnt' cool in hot weather...or mild weather, I think the radiator fan might be gone. Then the ac does not work. Finally the front suspension vibrates at high speeds and the parking brake doesn't hold unless you pull it all the way up. Also there's a short somewhere and the turn signals, brake warning light, dash clock and backup lights don't work. Oh and I didn't mention that the headlights probably need replacement because adjusting them is a pain, and on both sides, the corner lamps are barely hanging on b/c the brackets on the fenders are broken. ( :angry: fiberglass fenders)


recap -
head (wrong head) / block - compression issue
misses when accelerating below 2500rpm & uses more fuel (29hwy)
oil leak
shift linkage could use new bushings
radiator fan - not cooling
ac - not cooling
rear brakes - p/b has to go all the way up
suspension (right side) vibrates 70 - 80 mph
short in system on turn signal fuse
driver window needs a regulator
headlights need work
need fenders or fender work for corner lights
(oh and a taillight is out)

-Yaw

as for the head, there are codes written on the heas specifically for the Si, CVCC and the Canadain non-CVCC. search around www.redpepperracing.com (http://www.redpepperracing.com/) for what the codes mean. the Si head uses higher comp pistons i believe but there is more volume in the combustion chamber so it's the same or similar to the CVCC motor. if someone has put a CVCC head or the canadian head onto the motor it will run at a higher comp. i suspect that somone has put a CVCC head onto your car because of the missing and poor economy below 2500 because the cvcc system has a seperate intake valve right by the spark plug, if it's blocked off by the Si manifold no air/fuel gets near the spark plug till it's at higher revs.

your suspension problem might ne a poorly balanced tire, i recently put a set of CRX Si wheels on my 83 civic and now i have the same vibration issues at similar speeds which i didn't have with the old wheels. i'm going to get a new set of rears and have the fronts balanced at the same time.

oil leak: how many miles, could be typical for it's age. where is the oil coming from?

ac - not cooling: needs a recharge?

rear brakes - p/b has to go all the way up: try adjusting it, there should be some sort of adjuster where it connects to the drums

radiator fan - not cooling: is it running at all? could be a bad rad or thermostat too.

the rest of it sounds like electrical problems. look around for bad grounds and shorts etc.

you've got a lot of problems...

The oil leaks from just beneath the distributor...the ac holds pressure (and cools if the system is 'hotwired'), but doesn't turn on if you press the 'ac' button.

I know a guy who works in a tire dept...I'll see if he can rotate and balance the tires, maybe that will fix the problem. That would be nice...

I will also look into the head today on rpr. I hopefully can get to the drums once this cold snap breaks.

-Yaw

If it's the CVCC head, there are 4 extra valves that are axilliary valves that the Si head doesn't have. Check out my website and look at my valve cover. If your valve cover is the same, then you either still have the wrong head, or there is a deeper problem. Hmm... The cam shafts aren't the same for the two, meaning that the distributor from the Si won't fit on the end of a CVCC shaft... Maybe the person had no clue? The oil leak coming from under the distributor is more than likely from the seal that may be damaged or missing. It goes between the distributor and the head as there is an oil port that allows oil to get to the end of the camshaft.

The AC thing could be your switch in the dashboard. I have to fool with my fan switch just right to get the AC to kick on. These things by now are at least a good 18-20 years old... Things tend to wear out.

The tire vibration could be that you need a good alignment or a balance of the tires. Mine has it as well. I wish we had something other than the torsion bars, personally.

As for the missing, you might want to get your timing checked. If your distributor is leaking oil, then you could have a problem with it being too advanced or retarded.

I understand your issues with the fenders... Check out my site and see what stupid people do when they don't know where to put the jack on the side of the car...

Hope this helps.

The front end vibration could also be a bad bushing. I recently found out that I have a bad bushing on my driver side front lower arm, which is causing uneven tire wear and vibration on that side at high speeds.

The E-brake just needs to be adjusted. To do this just pop the cover off of the back of the E-brake lever, jack up the rear of the car and pull the e-brake up 1 click. Then tighten the adjustment nuts on the back of the E-brake lever until the rear brakes just start to grab the rear wheels. Put the cover back on, drop the car and you're done.

As for the fenders, they're actually made of plastic. Fiberglass would be much stronger! There is someone on www.redpepperracing.com right now who is trying to get interest going in producing FG fenders. Do a search and check it out!

Have you done a compression test on the motor? The cooling issue could be that you have a head gasket that is starting to go bad, or it could be your fan relay. A compression test will tell you the condition of the head gasket (+ valves and rings depending on how you perform the test). If the fan doesn't turn on at all after the engine is warmed up, check the fan relay. Pull the wires off the relay (located on the bottom of the radiator) and put a jumper wire between them. If the fan starts when you turn the ignition on then the fan is good and you've got a bad relay. You can leave the jumper wire in untill you can replace the relay, it wont hurt anything. This just means that the fan will run constantly when the car is on, which is better than not at all.

Check the 3 fusible links located under a black plastic cover on the passenger side strut tower. If one is blown, you'll have all kinds of electrical problems. Heck, check all the fuses while you're at it!

The window regulator is pretty easy to replace. The hardest part is adjusting the window, which really isn't that hard.

Whats the deal with the shift linkage?

If it's the CVCC head, there are 4 extra valves that are axilliary valves that the Si head doesn't have. Check out my website and look at my valve cover. If your valve cover is the same, then you either still have the wrong head, or there is a deeper problem.

I wish we had something other than the torsion bars, personally.

The stamped steel and cast aluminum valve covers are interchangeable. Meaning, if someone put a CVCC head on your car they could have just put the cast aluminum SI VC on top of it. So this may not be the best way to figure out if you've got the correct head. I'd pop off the cover and count the valves, a CVCC head will actually have 16 valves (which is not as good as it sounds). Or you could take a picture of the head without the VC and post it.

Figori,
The torsion bars aren't all bad, they do reduce unsprung weight and are easy to raise and lower. Both of which are benefits on performance cars. The only real drawback to the suspension is the rear trailing beam (axle), but even that can be compensated for.

Lxndr,
I have both valve covers at my house, and I can attest that the CVCC valve cover won't work well with the Si setup, as the hose that runs from the valve cover to the IM isn't on the carburated one. I thought they were interchangeable, but the Si is slightly different than the CVCC. But it's okay. He has an Si, which the Distributor for the Si won't work with the CVCC head, and the CVCC distributor won't work with the Si ECU, being as the CVCC doesn't have the ECU. I don't think the head is wrong, it just might have a few problems.

Thanks Figori,

I agree the CVCC cover won't work well on an SI. I was assuming that if a mechanic was working on an SI and swapped on a CVCC head, that they have would have figured out right away that the SI distributor would not work with the CVCC head and would realize that they have to use the CVCC distributor. I was also assuming that the same mechanic would realize that the SI valve cover would work better because the CVCC valve cover has a huge tube coming off of it that is not needed for the SI. Granted this is alot of assuming! If this was a true scenario, a good mechanic would have realized the error of putting a CVCC head on an SI and would have picked up the correct head.

Anyway, I'm glad you guys got it figured out and I don't have to do any more assuming. As my dad always said, "You know what happens when you assume?
...You make an A$$ out of U and ME!"

EDIT:
In theory, the carbed distributor should work fine with an ECU since both the carbed and SI distributors are vacuum advance. From '85 to '87 the ECU doesn't actually control the distributor (Honda didn't start that until '88), but no, the carbed distributor will NOT fit on an SI cylinder head due to the completely different drive on the end of the cam.

Here's what I do know. As far as the head, it's got 12 valves. One intake and two exhaust per cylinder.

The mechanic said it has an intermittent loss of compression on the #1 cylinder (I believe).

And the oil filter that fits is the ph3531 (fram) and I know this fits many honda blocks, but maybe it will narrow down some what block is down there...and I don't know how many heads fit that block and have 12 valves.

There's no number stamped on the header panel (over the bumper, in front of the hood) so I've got no engine code from there, plus the engine was swapped before I bought the car. With the usual place where one would look for an engine code, I can't see anything.

If I get time today, I will post a picture with the valve cover off... --Yaw

the code is on the front of the engine at the end where the tranny mounts. as for the oil filter, my 82 EK1 accord motor uses the same one so no such luck there. as for what heads will fit that block...all of them.

Here's a link to a head that looks sort of like the one on my car (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=7946445798&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT). I can't speak for minute details, but as far as the general layout of the rocker arms and springs, and the number of valves, they're identical. I didn't have time to get the pictures yesterday...the next time I might be able to do so is on Sunday. I will check again then. Finally, about the head issue--what if the right head is on the car, but it's a carbed head? The link (above) is a carbed head also. Underneath the valve cover, it looks just like the one on my car...and I took a look at your site, Andrew; I think that I have the same head (my valve cover says honda 12 valve though) on my si as the one on your site.

Also I will eventually be pulling the head off of the car to find out what is wrong with it / if there is anything wrong with it or the block. Can someone tell me what to look for, point by point?

Finally, with the shift linkage, there is too much movement in the shifter. (according to the mechanic)

That's a CVCC head in the picture. Notice the L shaped combustion chamber and the 4 small auxilliary valves. This is not the head that should be on an SI! A CVCC head uses a pre-combustion chamber to ignite the air/fuel mixture. The 4 small valves that you see in the picture are not actually exhaust valves, they're the valves for the pre-combustion chamber. Also, notice in the picture that you can only see 2 valves in the combustion chamber. For an SI head, all of the springs will be approximately the same size and the exhaust valve will be slightly larger than the 2 intake valves. You will also be able to see all 3 valves in the combustion chamber.

Here's what I do know. As far as the head, it's got 12 valves. One intake and two exhaust per cylinder.

There's no number stamped on the header panel (over the bumper, in front of the hood) so I've got no engine code from there, plus the engine was swapped before I bought the car. With the usual place where one would look for an engine code, I can't see anything.

Unfortunately, unless you're looking at it upside down, it sounds like you've got a CVCC head on your SI.

Also, if the motor has been replaced, the blue engine ID tag located on the left side of the radiator core support, won't tell you anything except what motor you SHOULD have in the car. It sounds like someone may have swapped the wrong motor into your car. I wouldn't be surpised if it was actually a 1300cc motor, that could be why it doesn't run well with the 1500cc ECU and injectors. You NEED to find the engine ID code stamped into the engine block to know for sure.