fiero plans
fierangero
01-07-2005, 01:29 AM
so im trying to decide what i want to do to my 86 fiero GT. definitely an engine/tranny swap, and i need new gauges as well as a whole new wiring job. also the back quarters are cracked, so those need replacing. heres what i got so far.
ive narrowed it down to either a v6 or a v8. if i get v6 im thinking the GTP/monte carlo ss supercharged motor, but tweaked a bit to the tune of around 300hp. if i go v8, either a crate motor or a corvette engine. also, im not sure whether to get a 4 or 5 speed tranny, i've heard good things about both. also, i think i want to replace the rear quarters with the scoops. anyone know where i can get those for a decent price? i want this to be my fun car, nto necessarily a race car, but something i can take out once or twice a week and raise a little hell in.
so to boil it down, my questions are:
1) v8 or v6, and why?
2) which one is easier? which is cheaper?
3) 4 speed or 5, and why?
4) is it difficult to do an auto > manual tranny swap?
5) where can i get the quarter window scoops for a good price?
ive narrowed it down to either a v6 or a v8. if i get v6 im thinking the GTP/monte carlo ss supercharged motor, but tweaked a bit to the tune of around 300hp. if i go v8, either a crate motor or a corvette engine. also, im not sure whether to get a 4 or 5 speed tranny, i've heard good things about both. also, i think i want to replace the rear quarters with the scoops. anyone know where i can get those for a decent price? i want this to be my fun car, nto necessarily a race car, but something i can take out once or twice a week and raise a little hell in.
so to boil it down, my questions are:
1) v8 or v6, and why?
2) which one is easier? which is cheaper?
3) 4 speed or 5, and why?
4) is it difficult to do an auto > manual tranny swap?
5) where can i get the quarter window scoops for a good price?
mx6rrr
01-07-2005, 05:25 PM
1) V8...sounds bad ass
2)From what I understand they both take some work, the 8 will probley take more Im guessing you will have to do more cutom work as far as engine mounts and cuting of trunk/firewall...It seems for a really good job for a 8 cyl youd be looking around 8 grand including the ls1.
3) dono
4)kinda but if you know what youre doing shouldnt be too bad. Probley best to find a junked manual and take the parts from that.
5)Check out www.fierostore.com or ebay...
2)From what I understand they both take some work, the 8 will probley take more Im guessing you will have to do more cutom work as far as engine mounts and cuting of trunk/firewall...It seems for a really good job for a 8 cyl youd be looking around 8 grand including the ls1.
3) dono
4)kinda but if you know what youre doing shouldnt be too bad. Probley best to find a junked manual and take the parts from that.
5)Check out www.fierostore.com or ebay...
MrPbody
01-08-2005, 02:02 PM
The least expensive, and probably the best value in the long run, would be to build a 3.1 or 3.4 to replace the 2.8. It will bolt right in, and make significantly more power than the original. The 300 mark is a stretch, to say the least. But my '86 was quite nice to drive with the warmed up 3.1 in it. Good low-end torque and enough top-end to make it fun. Not something you'ld want to take out racing...
The leader of the local Fiero club had a 3800SC put in his with a 5-speed from a '91 or 2 Berretta. Now that thing flat FLIES. The swap is NOT trivial, as it cost hem well into the $7K range, between the engine, the parts and labor. The electronics issues are significant.
There's a guy out West (name escapes me, but a search should turn him up) that offers "kits" to put a small block Chevy on that TH125. I hear they run pretty good, but I'd be a bit nerveous about the trans holding that much power.
There are also a bunch of guys putting NorthStar in there. BIG money, but BIG rewards.
Finally, there's FearArrow. FearArrow is probably the most unique of the Fiero swaps. The car has a 455 Pontiac in it, attached to a TH325 (FWD unit from an '81 Riviera). I would prefer TH425, but he used what he had. The car has been in the 10s on pump gas, and handles like a Fiero. The chassis has some unique features that enable it to be changed around without significantly degrading the drivability. Apparently, it's a mid-engine thing, more than a Fiero thing.
For a drag racing car, an automatic is the transmission of choice, for a variety of reasons. Consistency and efficiency of the shift are the main ones. A torque converter is also helpful in launching and consistency.
For a road car or road racer, the manual is the only good choice. A manual will offer much more control of the car, as there's a mechanical "coupling" to the ground, not present with the auto. It also gives you the versitility of being able to shove in the clutch and pick a gear, where most autos can't do that.
No truly successful road racer or road car has had an automatic in it (one notable exception, Jimmy Hall and the Chapparel (sp?) CanAm car from the late '60s).
FWIW
The leader of the local Fiero club had a 3800SC put in his with a 5-speed from a '91 or 2 Berretta. Now that thing flat FLIES. The swap is NOT trivial, as it cost hem well into the $7K range, between the engine, the parts and labor. The electronics issues are significant.
There's a guy out West (name escapes me, but a search should turn him up) that offers "kits" to put a small block Chevy on that TH125. I hear they run pretty good, but I'd be a bit nerveous about the trans holding that much power.
There are also a bunch of guys putting NorthStar in there. BIG money, but BIG rewards.
Finally, there's FearArrow. FearArrow is probably the most unique of the Fiero swaps. The car has a 455 Pontiac in it, attached to a TH325 (FWD unit from an '81 Riviera). I would prefer TH425, but he used what he had. The car has been in the 10s on pump gas, and handles like a Fiero. The chassis has some unique features that enable it to be changed around without significantly degrading the drivability. Apparently, it's a mid-engine thing, more than a Fiero thing.
For a drag racing car, an automatic is the transmission of choice, for a variety of reasons. Consistency and efficiency of the shift are the main ones. A torque converter is also helpful in launching and consistency.
For a road car or road racer, the manual is the only good choice. A manual will offer much more control of the car, as there's a mechanical "coupling" to the ground, not present with the auto. It also gives you the versitility of being able to shove in the clutch and pick a gear, where most autos can't do that.
No truly successful road racer or road car has had an automatic in it (one notable exception, Jimmy Hall and the Chapparel (sp?) CanAm car from the late '60s).
FWIW
fierangero
01-09-2005, 11:37 AM
thanks mrpbody, i was kinda leaning towards the 3800SC, maybe take it to an engine shop and have it ported and polished, then add all the bolt-ons. im definitely going to swap to the manual, im curious as to whether to get the 4 or 5 speed, which one is cheaper/more plentiful. i've come to terms with the fact that this will cost nearly 10k, its gonna take me a long time to finish.
series8217
01-20-2005, 03:20 AM
thanks mrpbody, i was kinda leaning towards the 3800SC, maybe take it to an engine shop and have it ported and polished, then add all the bolt-ons. im definitely going to swap to the manual, im curious as to whether to get the 4 or 5 speed, which one is cheaper/more plentiful. i've come to terms with the fact that this will cost nearly 10k, its gonna take me a long time to finish.
Keep in mind that to legally drive the car in California you will need to get a recertification for an "engine change" at CARB. You will not be able to get the car smogged with a non-stock engine if you don't have an approved sticker for your swap from CARB. In order to do this you must use a transmission functionally identical to the one that the engine you are using was available with. You also have to use all the original smog equipment. Sadly this means no Series II 3800SC with a manual transmission, as they were never available with anything but autos from the factory. I'm pretty sure Series I engines were available with manual trannys, so that would be a possibility. Other swaps that would be legal with manual transmissions include the SBC V8 (sorry, the 4.9 caddy and N* only had autos :-(), 3.4 TDC/DOHC V6, 2.8/3.1/3.4 pushrod V6, and the Quad 4 (need to use donor car's tranny as it has a different bellhousing bolt pattern than your Fiero tranny).
-Steven
Keep in mind that to legally drive the car in California you will need to get a recertification for an "engine change" at CARB. You will not be able to get the car smogged with a non-stock engine if you don't have an approved sticker for your swap from CARB. In order to do this you must use a transmission functionally identical to the one that the engine you are using was available with. You also have to use all the original smog equipment. Sadly this means no Series II 3800SC with a manual transmission, as they were never available with anything but autos from the factory. I'm pretty sure Series I engines were available with manual trannys, so that would be a possibility. Other swaps that would be legal with manual transmissions include the SBC V8 (sorry, the 4.9 caddy and N* only had autos :-(), 3.4 TDC/DOHC V6, 2.8/3.1/3.4 pushrod V6, and the Quad 4 (need to use donor car's tranny as it has a different bellhousing bolt pattern than your Fiero tranny).
-Steven
fierangero
01-20-2005, 02:54 PM
yeah im gonna probably slap in the 3.1 or 3.4 (or 3.8) and get a turbo system fabbed up for it. as for smog, i will most likely register it in arizona.
series8217
01-20-2005, 07:34 PM
yeah im gonna probably slap in the 3.1 or 3.4 (or 3.8) and get a turbo system fabbed up for it. as for smog, i will most likely register it in arizona.
Sounds good. I'll have to check that out sometime when you get it finished. I'm up in the Fremont area a lot as there's often some good Fieros in the Newark Pick-n-Pull.
Are you a member of Golden Gate Fieros? They have quite a few members in that area. There's at least two 3.4 Fieros in Hayward that I know of. Might want to check out next month's meeting. They meet at Mountain Mike's pizza in Redwood City. I'll let you know what day if you're interested. I don't have it on hand right now.
-Steven
Sounds good. I'll have to check that out sometime when you get it finished. I'm up in the Fremont area a lot as there's often some good Fieros in the Newark Pick-n-Pull.
Are you a member of Golden Gate Fieros? They have quite a few members in that area. There's at least two 3.4 Fieros in Hayward that I know of. Might want to check out next month's meeting. They meet at Mountain Mike's pizza in Redwood City. I'll let you know what day if you're interested. I don't have it on hand right now.
-Steven
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