1998 transmission problems

The automatic transmission on my 2 wheel drive F-150 will shift down hard from out of overdrive to the next gear down when I give it a little bit of gas doing about 45mph. It's as if it misses for a split second before it engages. It has 93k on it. Any thoughts on what might be the problem?

Well it looks like it will be an $1,800 tranny rebuild for me according to the shop. To bad Ford can't make a decent transmission.

Its not that bad! Its probably you 3-4 shift solenoid wich isnt that big of a deal.

FORD makes an awsome tranny the C-6 bullet proof in my experance

Did they give you a specific reason for the needed rebuild?

Lots of metal shavings in the pan. Besides the shifting problems I felt myself.

From my quick conversation I had with the transmission shop sounded like the bands were pretty shot. Not sure what else exactly there was wrong with it. But they felt a rebuild was going to be neccessary.

Lots of metal shavings in the pan. Besides the shifting problems I felt myself.

From my quick conversation I had with the transmission shop sounded like the bands were pretty shot. Not sure what else exactly there was wrong with it. But they felt a rebuild was going to be neccessary.

Get a second opinion my tranny crapped out with 63K miles and it was the 3-4 shift mechanism plus that gear was a bit shredded

Um you have only one "band", and its is the OD band.

I suggest you get a second opinion. The 4R70W is a very durable AT, and when properly maintained not known for premature failures. The SINGLE most common cause for a "rebuild" is NOT MECHANICAL at all, but a failure in the EASILY REPLACEABLE solenoid pack that bolts to the bottom of the valve body.

Have you gotten your problem fixed, what was wrong?

Tom
HardCore Ford

It would think it would be alittle hard to get a second opinion on a transmission problem. By the time each individual takes the pan off and looks at it. Not unless you can have another mechanic go to someone elses shop and look at it? Not sure if most shops would like that.

Well here is what they replaced from their invoice.

New kit that includes; clutches, gaskets, bushings, seals, o’rings. $331.27
Torque converter $272.50
Filter $20.60
Friction Bands for OD $28.37
Diode Mechanical $78.69
Low Roller $23.46
Solenoid SHT $84.57
Solenoid TCC $76.56
Solenoid EPC $86.88
AODE output speed sensor $28.08
Shift Correction PKG $57.82
Transmission Fluid $58.38
Flush transmission $65.77
Remove/Replace Transmission $302.54 (4.6 hours)
Rebuild Transmission $542.60 (8.25 hours)

Grand Total of $1,876.92

Plus 12 months / 12,000 mile warranty.

It would think it would be alittle hard to get a second opinion on a transmission problem. By the time each individual takes the pan off and looks at it. Not unless you can have another mechanic go to someone elses shop and look at it? Not sure if most shops would like that.

Well here is what they replaced from their invoice.

New kit that includes; clutches, gaskets, bushings, seals, o’rings. $331.27
Torque converter $272.50
Filter $20.60
Friction Bands for OD $28.37
Diode Mechanical $78.69
Low Roller $23.46
Solenoid SHT $84.57
Solenoid TCC $76.56
Solenoid EPC $86.88
AODE output speed sensor $28.08
Shift Correction PKG $57.82
Transmission Fluid $58.38
Flush transmission $65.77
Remove/Replace Transmission $302.54 (4.6 hours)
Rebuild Transmission $542.60 (8.25 hours)

Grand Total of $1,876.92

Plus 12 months / 12,000 mile warranty.

I need to request a copy of that bill from my warranty company, but it was a torque convertor, gasket kit, and something about the third gear. I'll let you know when I get a copy, the claim was for about $1300.

DEMAND they REMOVE that "shift correction kit" because I can almost gaurantee you that it is a "TransGo shift kit", and IF it is, it WILL destroy your rebuilt trans.

Why do you say it will distroy the transmission? I would hope they wouldn't put something in that would distroy the transmission plus give me a 12mo/12k mile warranty?

I will ask that question when I go back for my 2 week check up on about Jan 10th.

If they installed a shift kit, particularly if it were a "transgo" brand, the "kit" has the installer do things (leave out parts, alter others, and change line pressure settings) that WILL eventually destroy the trans.

This information I got DIRECTLY from a Ford trans. engineer.

Steve I talked to my mechanic it wasn't a major rebuild, just a SOFT rebuild with the third gear bushings and new packings hope this makes sense, sorry if I wasn't any help

Just wanted to say that Transgo is very reputable when it comes to aftermarket parts and reprogramming of transmissions. I use these on a daily basis with a 5yr or 50K warrenty. These kits supply special hardend and quality valves that don't wear out in 60,000 miles(i.e. boost valves) So you have unstable line pressure. Ask the "engineer" if the client should just carry spare boost valves and EPC solenoids with them. And throw one in every 60K. Because it IS worn out!

Factory would rather have everyone replace a whole valve body then repair it. Unfortunatly, thats not cost effective in the aftermarket as it is at a dealership.

Just a couple of pennies for you...

Bullshit. The engineer LEFT FMC partially because of issues like you mention.

Transgo knows very little about how to make a Ford electronic trans work PROPERLY.

If you feel differently, that is fine with me, but I can refute nearly EVERY claim transgo makes and show you why they are wrong.

You cannot refute the fact that these kits (Transgo, Sonnax and Superior) work very well for me and for people that don't treat transmission rebuilding as an assembly line job. That is, each transmission is custom and has a personal touch. The people that care for their customer and make a good living working on transmissions will use these kits. These are not just shift kits like you would put into a TH350 or C6 or something for drag racing. They fix the little, as I would say "engineering oversights" Or, maybe they just know how to market well.

Now take the 5R55E and newer of that family transmission. All we can do is purchase a new valve body during rebuild from fomoco. Because the VB is such a POS no one will even attempt to alter or repair it. See Ford can just put one of these on every rebuild cause its a hundred bucks for them. I buy it, $500, then I have to warrenty that POS so I charge $800-$900. This is also the reason for valve body kits. To not just replace the part with same ole thing that will wear out before "expected" service life ends.

I'm not trying to prove you wrong on anything Mod...:) Everyone has different repair procedures and whats good for the goose isn't always good for the duck and vice versa...

Have a day

I am just trying to make sure no one gets incorrect info, and the "shift kit" manufacturers want only one thing, TO SELL PRODUCT.

What does transgo know? Let's see.

They claim (think) the AODE and 4R70W/4R75W are not the same trans. They are. Do you know the only significant difference between the AODE and 4R70W? The gear ratio in 1st, and the output bushing diameter. Yup, that's it. Both the AODE and 4R70W (MY dependant) use the EXACT same controls, the VB, solenoids, TCC sol, everyting.

Transgo claims their shift kits "improve efficiency" How? They claim by modifying the VB etc. Hmm, NOTHING in the VB has anyting to do with efficiency.

Transgo's instructions have the installer adjust the EPC solenoid to increase line pressure. You should NEVER EVER touch that solenoid and adjust it. You WILL fail the seals and clutch drums with the pressures attained if you follow their instructions.

They have you enlarge some VB seperator plate holes. Ok, the engineers do to. The problem is, they list their kits for both the AODE and 4R70W in the same kit. Well DUH, the later ('98) up plates ALREADY have enlarged holes, so their "kit" is utterly useless. They don't tell you that.

Transgo has you leave out some check balls. BAD BAD idea. It allows fluid to "reverse flow" under some (not good) conditions, and dumps flow when it should not, causing the pump to work harder than normal to supply the necessary fluid volume.

Transgo has you modify the VB to provide a "vent" to prevent what they call "a dangerous overpressure condition" for the EPC solenoid. Guess what, it has NEVER happened on a factory trans, they are designed to prevent it. It could happen if you follow their instructions and modify the EPC settings.

They have you jack the line pressure to "improve grip". Great. You run jacked line pressure 100% of the time. This does three things, none are ANY good. It increases the load on the engine (lots), creates excessive heat (function of additional work done by the pump), and REDUCES COOLER FLOW. So, they are so smart, they increase line pressure which distorts the pistons (BAD), adds lots of heat (BAD), and reduces the cooler flow (BAD). Great, you just destroyed your trans. Maybe no today, but it WILL happen. I have personally seen what happens (at the track) with a "properly installed" transgo "kit". The owner did everything accordingto the instructions. '97 Mustang 4.6L 4R70W. It made it to about 1/2 track when it lost the trans. He had only 1st and 2nd, 3rd and OD were gone, and what he has was just enough to drive it, barely. Failed seals, blown right off the piston. Do you know how much the cooler flow is reduced? LOTS! The specific numbers depend on the before/after line pressure, but suffice it to say that a doubling of the line pressure will cut the cooler flow to 1/4 of it's previous flow, which I think everyone will agree is VERY BAD.

The '98 up factory VBs are GREAT. Most of the issues in the AODE/4R70W are of control, shallow pan, and weak OWCs. Does transgo attempt to "fix" any of these? Nope. No money in it. The deeper pans are readily available for $35 from Ford, they have no clue how to alter the EEC to control the trans better (provide full lock-up of the T/C) to reduce heat and shudder (the control problem), and to fix the OWC problem, you need to tear into the guts, and FMC eiinated the OWC in favor of a better design which is BACKWARDS compatable with the AODEs in '98, and it solved the OWC failure problem.

The rebulders don't even know which are the "good" parts, and which should be tossed for updated ones. They continue to install the OWCs in older transmissions when they should ALL be upgraded. They use the WRONG friction elements and that causes increased friction in the trans and extra heat, a transmissions biggest enemy. They use the seals in the "overhaul kit" that come in it, instead of the proper teflon updated seals (that FMC factory rebuilds use).

You seem to know the basic theory of transmission operation. I can easily contradict a few statements but man I've got to move on. Neither of us will change our point of view. O'well,
Keep up the good work man.

Um you have only one "band", and its is the OD band.

I suggest you get a second opinion. The 4R70W is a very durable AT, and when properly maintained not known for premature failures. The SINGLE most common cause for a "rebuild" is NOT MECHANICAL at all, but a failure in the EASILY REPLACEABLE solenoid pack that bolts to the bottom of the valve body.

ModMech,
I would like to know more about this solenoid pack.
It is internal to the tranny?
If it is, can you access it by removing the pan alone (after draining the trans of course).

Mine is a 4wd unit.

I've got a 97 F150 with the 4R70W. I followed your earlier advice and chanhed the filter/fluid according to the do-it-yourselfers website link posted by you.
A very cool way to flush and fill, by the way. I still get some hesitation when coming out of overdrive, like on a slight upgrade. Feels a little like a miss in the engine but never till the engine is warm enough to go into o/d. servicing the trans definitely improved the performance.

The solenoid pack is bolted to the botton of the Valve Body, and is serviceable with only the pan off and fluid drained.

My 89' chevy did the same thing, and turned out to be just a vacume leak. It wasn't getting enough pressure to the tranny