idle and rich with SES

i have a 95 jimmy with the CPI. I changed the CPI out with a new nut kit and when i put it back togather it wasn't leaking. i started it up and the idle was rough and the SES light was on. let it sit for 2-3 minutes and when i came back all i smelled was the gas and when i looked inside the SES light was blinking. i pulled the ECM fuses and tried again but still rough idel. looked down in the intake and it still looks dry. i did have the ignition on for about 30 mins before put back to check for leaks. reseting the computer doesn't work. what elise could it be?

You have to cycle the key on and off in 3 second intervals to check for leaks.

Also, have you checked your EGR valve?

Did you clean the EGR port passageway while the upper plenum is off?

All vacuum lines reattached and fastened?

Did you use a new plenum gasket?

new gasket,all lines were attached and did dubble check them. only turned the key on once but might pull upper intake agin to duble check. where would it leak. all went togather very well. EGR ports were clean.

There is not set places for leaking. You need to cycle the key on and off for five second intervals to check for the leaks.

Did you insert all the poppets securely into the lower plenum and gave them a faint tug to see if they were lock in place?

Is the fuel lines tightened up where they screw into the nut kit?

Check the EGR again for plugging.

Stop running the engine if you smell fuel because you have a major leak and of course you will need to check it again for leaks.

Did you attach all the vacuum line both from and back?

i never pulled it off but it is hooked up. i'm going to go pull the intake now. i don't think theres a leak but i'll pull it to check anyway. all of them made a snap when the went in except for the one under the nut kit lines but when i got it in i pulled on it and it stayed in so i know its ok. let you know what happens. it takes me about 20 mins to pull it.

Remove the EGR mod for the time being.

i thought about it and not a bad idea. not hard to put back on. i noticed that since its been on that the EGR seems to have oily film in it so i'm going to leave it off. i pulled it and it looks fine.pulled the intake and primed it 5 times and still no leaks. i did find a part i forgot but don't think it does anything. it was the rubber boot that sit on top of the CPI in between the ele plug and the unit it's self. do you think that putting it the old CPI is even worth a try?

No, I don't think so.

I would get the codes read to see what code is coming up.

Also, did you reset the computer before doing this?

How long did you let the truck idle for?

All vacuum lines completely attached?

it sat for at least 2-3 minutes. i never pulled any of except the PVC and the line that hooks up by the EGR. they are all attached. i'm going to put the intake back on and i'll try it but if it doesn't work then i'll let it sit all night to clear.

i tried it and its still messed up. when i get off of work i'm going to pull the CPI and put the old one back in and see what happens. I'm thinking that maybe it's defective and the regulator might be letting too much fuel in.

Maybe.....

A defective CPI could be the problem. If you put in the old one and it works fine, you will know you will need to get another CPI injecter under warranty from where you bought it.

i put the old one in and no diff. so i put the new one back in. i hope to get it towed tomarrow. i know the guy at the shop and he'll let me fix it and use his scanner and tools for free. i'll let you know whats found. i shut the truck of and the SES light was on but when i started it 8 hours later it was off but still ran bad.

Doesn't matter, the code will be still there unless you cleared the computer.

i hope to get it towed today. the guy at the shop said that the computer might have to be rest with a scanner and just unhooking the power might not do it. it sounds like either a plug is not firing or the timing is really off. if it doesn't get pulled then i'm going to pull the plugs to see which are firing. i know the timing order is 1-6-5-4-3-2. how are the cyinder nubers ordered. like looking at the motor. i know its somewhere on this fourm but i couldn't find it.

The firing order is fool proof on your truck with the horizontal cap.

cap

6 5
4 1
2 3

Engine

6 5
4 1
2 3

The wire going to the cap corresponds to the location of its connection to the right cylinder.

Eg Back left cap connection goes to back left cylinder etc.....

timings right. i did have it off by 2 plugs but made little to no diff. i pulled on off the plugs from each side and both were rich with gas. if it runs long enough the SES light will blink. i won't beable to get it towed untill some time next week but a friend of mine said his uncle has a scanner and might be able to get it for me by monday.

Check again, reset the computer and allow it to relearn the idle.

The polugs are wet because it wasn't firing in the right order.

i'll go try it now. i don't think it will do any thing. it still smelled very rich.

of course it did, the ignition was all screwed up.

Chances are your oil is COMPLETELY full of gass no too.

i reset it and no diff. still runs bad and set the SES light. talked to the guy and thursday is when he's going to pick it up. he said he'll help me fix it for free but the next day i have to help him and not get paid so it evens out. don't know if he's going to charge for towing.

so you know for sure the wires going from the cap are going to the exact same place it represents on the engine?

It is fool proof.

i tried following the nubers on the cap but that put it way out of time and just wouldn't start. i followed what you said about the back left cyinder on the back left plug on the cap and that seemed to fix it that it would run but still bad.

i tried following the nubers on the cap but that put it way out of time and just wouldn't start. i followed what you said about the back left cyinder on the back left plug on the cap and that seemed to fix it that it would run but still bad.

Dude, do I have to hand feed you through this.

I am not talking about one wire, I am talking about all of them.

http://www.tweaknews.net/img/firing.jpg

You see what I am talking about? Do you even have the proper firing order back I can guarantee you don't.

no thats right. you gave the example of one but they are set like that. i did set them that way after your first post on how to do it. the timing not a issue unless the computer fooling with it.

Check the fuel pressure. I had a few back in 95 that the pump return line was blocked /pinched and the pump went into a over pressure and blew right through the popit valves. If I recall the pressure was well over 80 psi when that happened.

no thats right. you gave the example of one but they are set like that. i did set them that way after your first post on how to do it. the timing not a issue unless the computer fooling with it.

Ok, I was making sure because a blinking check engine light is caused by a massive random misfire.

i'll check the fuel lines but where did it get pinched at? i know its misfiring very bad because of now power and the SES light with gas smell. i tried the old unit and no diff so i put the new one back in. how do the injectors look different when blown? or can you not tell?

To the eye you could not tell anything was wrong.Only mass miss fire and a strong smell of gas. The real bad 1 I had flooded the cylinders so bad the engine was liquid locked and would not even crank over. The owner thought it throw a crankshaft bearing and locked the engine. Any smell of gas is a clue that there is a problem because its a sealed system so there has to be a leak some where.
Did you say you had spark to all cylinders???
The cylinders that are miss fireing did you pull the plugs and where they wet /fouled with gas??
What cylinders are miss fireing???

I am wondering if this is a spark issue.

Or maybe the plenum gasket wasn't installed properly or the plenum cover bolts were not torqued down enough.

Was the old gasket removed before the new one was installed?

Was the surface cleaned?

so by looking at the fuel lines i wouldn't be able to tell? i think i should be able to see a crimped part is its affecting it. the car runs enough that i'm able to move it but i'm not even going to try to drive it like this. would the injectors be ok if the fuel is getting backed up or do i need new injectors? how much are the fuel lines and how hard are they to change out? old gasket pulled right of and no problem sticking. the gaskets on right with the red strip up. the bolts are trightened to the right amout and it wouldn't run rich like it is if they weren't. all of the plugs on the motor that i pulled were wet with gas but if i un hook them and try to run the motor it makes a diff so they must be firing some of the time.

i can't get my hand down the back of the motor and what i can tell they run along the top of the tranny. from what i could feel they felt fine. i only pulled the first 2 plugs and they were wet. might try to see if i can get a tester to test the pressure. will a tire pressure tester work?

lol, no it won't work.

Just as a recap (pun not intended) Did you check the coild and the cap and rotor for corrosion?

they worked fine before the swap. why would in 4 hours it would have gone bad. the cap seems good since every time a take a plug off it affects it a little but noit much so from what i can tell all of the plugs are fireing. how do you check the wires to see if they are good?

ok, enough with the bullshit.

Check it.

the extra amount of fuel going to the cylinders now that the injector is running properly might not be able to burn with poor spark.

Just check it would ya

how do i pull the cap on this. its the side mount post. i've never done it before. do you just pull the 2 screws in the cap?

Oh jesus, you have never replaced the cap and rotor?

Simple, remove the screws holding the cap on, then remove the cap.

Then remove the screws holding the rotor on, remove the rotor.

You really need to learn about normal maintanence bro, this is getting a little ridiculous. First you don't hook the wires up properly and then you fail to tuneup your truck?

well i asked my mechinc when i did my tune-up if i should change it and he said not to. he said to only change it if it goes bad. i'm going to go pull it now.

Don't EVER go to the mechanic again. What a moron.

Cap & Rotor should be replaced every 60k miles.

chances are yours is shot and it will be corroded badly.

the cap of the cap has white over the contacts. big problem there. how do i clean the rotor it's self. it doesn't look like steel on the end. the part that tuches the points?

You don't clean a cap and rotor , you REPLACE it.

Buy both new and install. Remember to install the rotor EXACTLY how it came off.

installed new cap and rotor. $30. no diff. still runs bad and i did reset the ECM. any other ideas?

I just know this is a simple thing causing this.

Have your friend have a look.

that won't be untill monday at the best. worst is it gets towed thursday.

I'm just pulling this out of a dog's ass but, did you get the CPI lines into the proper cylinders?

Let me through my two cents in here. This is just what I went through and cant belive no one else mentioned it. Run a compression test. Do all the cylinders and do them twice. I spent 5 days working on a 94 s10 with the same symptoms. On the second compression test we found cylinder # 6 to have no compression on one try. Pulled the valve cover and valve springs and one was broke. Two new valve springs and truck runs like a top! We could not see the broken spring with out taking it off the engine. We had taken the valve cover off once before to inspect and we did not noticce it being broken, It was broken under the "hat" so you could not see it. This takes a special tool so it is best left to a pro. Good luck.

BTW i am 95% sure it doesnt matter where you put the cpi poppets because that engine fires all injectors at the same time and the fuel stays in suspension till the cylinder needs it.

why would it have broken after installing a new CPI. it was fine before? and for the injectors, i put them in the same spots as the old one. i'll get a tester monday. the only thing i was playing around with was that if i pull the driver side front 2 plugs theres no difference in engine performance but if i pull any other it gets worse. also the manifold by the port isn't getting hot like the others= not firing or firing right.

I'm just pulling this out of a dog's ass but, did you get the CPI lines into the proper cylinders?

All the poppets are batch fired. There is no required firing or placement order.

i didn't think so. i changed the first drivers side plug since it was loose and likely got stressed. i switched the 2 front drivers side plug wires on the cap and now it runs fine. and yes i can asure you that if its wired to your drawing it seems to be out of time. maybe it has the wrong cap on it but it runs good now. will let you know of gas mileage improvment.

i didn't think so. i changed the first drivers side plug since it was loose and likely got stressed. i switched the 2 front drivers side plug wires on the cap and now it runs fine. and yes i can asure you that if its wired to your drawing it seems to be out of time. maybe it has the wrong cap on it but it runs good now. will let you know of gas mileage improvment.

Bro, just tell us you screwed up and didn't hook them up properly. You don't have to lie.

Also, go change your oil immediately seeing it will be full of gas from it running poorly.

i'm telling you the truth. i don't know why but those 2 plugs aren't like the others. all of them line up but them 2. like i said the cap might be different. all ready planning on changing the oil after the CPI was fixed.

Ok, good, just change it immediately, not a week from now.

the excess fuel is waging war on your bearings as we speak.

i'm planing on doing it tuesday. i'll have the time to do it.