granny shifting and double clutching........

not that i dont know how to double clutch or any thing but i have a probly a really stupid question,

what the heck is granny shifting??????


is it shifting like my father probly would shift like as in (1st -2nd-3rd-4th-5th)


or as i would shift during a race (1st-2nd-3rd-2nd-3rd-4th-3rd-4th-5th)


am i on the right track here ? ? ? ? ? ?



let me know .

granny shifting is feathering the clutch, much like you'd do when you're just driving normaly. But the 1st-2nd-3rd-2nd-3rd-etc thing is a nice way to over rev your motor unless you're hitting corners doing autocross (SCCA type thing). In a straight line you never want to downshift when accelerating or your rpms will be far too high in the lower gear. Check out some of the videos online of kids doing that, there's one specifically where the kid downshifts and blows a hole in his tranny as soon as he lets out the clutch.
Now tell the truth...did you just get done watching the Fast and the Furious?

i'm from oklahoma and we granny shifted our trucks all the time in high school,some new trucks still do it,mosty all older trucks also,here it simply means you go from 1st to 2nd and/or 3rd to 4th without pressing clutch,some trannys will allow the shift to be made with no clutch at all,simply shift.some people round here also call it a granny gear when there is an extremly low first gear,cause you waller round in first to take off then slam down to second,no clutch,and take off.then again,this is just hillbilly's down here,so it might not be the same,never heard of it in cars,just our old pickups,though my 99 s-10 can shift 3 to 4 no clutch.

I think you're talking about power shifting, playtoy. I don't know I've heard so many different names for different things. I've been told powershifting by one person and double clutching from a different person and thye were both talking about the same thing.

actualy its been on my mind ever since vin diesel said it in F&F to paul walker.

just wondering. . . .

why would you have to double clutch your honda?

power shifting and double clutching are the same thing, and granny shifting IS whene you feather clutch

And feathering is where you give it gas while you let out the clutch while shifting? It slips a little, right?

power shifting and double clutching are the same thing, and granny shifting IS whene you feather clutch

If i remember right.. (If im wrong ignore me.. im tired) Double clutching and powershifting are opposites. Powershifting is when u simply slam your shifter through the gears without using you clutch and double clutching originated back when trannys didnt have syncro's. Its when you push the clutch in, pull it into neutral, let of the clutch, pushed it in again then pulled it into gear. I know it sounds like quite the prosess but it was supposed to help line the gears up before u shifted so u wouldnt grind. But that was back when tranny's had no syncros so none of us should be worrying about it.

If i remember right.. (If im wrong ignore me.. im tired) Double clutching and powershifting are opposites. Powershifting is when u simply slam your shifter through the gears without using you clutch and double clutching originated back when trannys didnt have syncro's. Its when you push the clutch in, pull it into neutral, let of the clutch, pushed it in again then pulled it into gear. I know it sounds like quite the prosess but it was supposed to help line the gears up before u shifted so u wouldnt grind. But that was back when tranny's had no syncros so none of us should be worrying about it.

correct.

Its when you push the clutch in, pull it into neutral, let of the clutch, pushed it in again then pulled it into gear.

You forgot the important part, after you have it in neutral, you tap the gas to rev-match your rpms, then you push the clutch in again and shift to the lower gear.

And yes, as of now, it isn't required on most cars...but that doesn't mean it isn't a good idea. Some cars have problematic synchros, 3000gts for example, and to lengthen their lifespan, double-clutching is a great idea. Many people still do it in modern manuals, myself included.
Just my .02

hold up, i thought powershifting was shifting normally with the clutch in but not letting off the gas.

See what that lame ass movie has done :disappoin

All the shit stated here is wrong. Damn!

Grannyshifting = shifting at low rpms, not close to where your engine is making the MOST power. If your engine makes 127 hp at 6700 and you are shifting at 4500 rpms, you are granny shifting. Shifting too early.

Powershifting = Upshifting (1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd...) without letting off the gas. So you press the clutch while you are pressing the gas at the same time and shift. If you shift like this at redline you will be mostly hitting the rev limiter for the split second, this is not recommended but it sometimes generates better times at a track.

Doubleclutching = Serves no purpose. If you double clutch while you upshift you are an idiot. Period. If you double clutch while downshifting it helps a little. The transition from one gears rpms to the lower gears is not as rough. If your on 3rd at 5000 rpms and you just press the clutch put it into second and release the clutch, the engine will jump suddenly from 5000 rpms to 7000 lets say, a bit rough...by rev matching your engine: that is setting the rpms in neutral to the equivalent of the lower gear, the transition will be smoother.

Now. Get IT?

MexSiR

well said

Doubleclutching is indeed revving the engine in neutral to sychronize the speeds of the engine and drivetrain portions of the transmission, and isn't necessary in cars with synchros. anyone who has driven a tractor or old truck on the road will be familiar with this process, though ;)

i'm not sure if it's powershifting, or whatever you call it, but Playtoy is correct when he talks about shifting without using the clutch. A lot of semi drivers will do this (drive something for 250k miles, and you get used to shift points) which saves on effort and clutch pads. Basically, you shift at points where you align the engine and drivetrain speeds, and the transmission will slip easily into gear. With practice, you can do it both upshifting and downshifting. Obviously, having a tachometer makes it easy, although you don't need one. You can't do it during hard driving, just easy acceleration or deceleration. I do it a lot on the 3-4 shift, and sometimes if I'm lazy i'll go 2-3-4-5 without clutching.

I always thought granny shifting was when you take your sweet time shifting gears o.O

what gives with all this 1st-2nd-3rd-2nd-3rd-4th-3rd-4th-5th shifting crap? this is the second time i have seen someone say that this week it makes NO sense at all!


edit: i just realized it is the same person both times. seriously man, where did you get the idea to shift like that and how have you not broken something yet?

what gives with all this 1st-2nd-3rd-2nd-3rd-4th-3rd-4th-5th shifting crap? this is the second time i have seen someone say that this week it makes NO sense at all!


edit: i just realized it is the same person both times. seriously man, where did you get the idea to shift like that and how have you not broken something yet?

yay for ECU redline?

This is a funny post. I agree with MexSiR on everything except double clutching. I believe double clutching is what you do right after you shift. For instance, you shift into 2nd (any gear) after redline; now, your RPMs are down and you are in a lower hp range of your engine. So, you depress and engage the clutch while holding full throttle, this is an instantaneous action. The rotational inertial your engine built up for that instance helps by lunging your car and creates a momentary void of resistance where your engine doesn’t need to work so hard to bring up the RPMs (closer to peek hp) i.e. for that instance of the lunge . This is a common trick in motocross especially when you find yourself approaching a jump or a hill in the wrong gear. Just adding my 2¢.


http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/628654

This is a funny post. I agree with MexSiR on everything except double clutching. I believe double clutching is what you do right after you shift. For instance, you shift into 2nd (any gear) after redline; now, your RPMs are down and you are in a lower hp range of your engine. So, you depress and engage the clutch while holding full throttle, this is an instantaneous action. The rotational inertial your engine built up for that instance helps by lunging your car and creates a momentary void of resistance where your engine doesn’t need to work so hard to bring up the RPMs (closer to peek hp) i.e. for that instance of the lunge . This is a common trick in motocross especially when you find yourself approaching a jump or a hill in the wrong gear. Just adding my 2¢.


http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/628654

Ok that has absolutely NOTHING to do with double clutching :screwy::disappoin.

This is double clutching - http://www.felixwong.com/openroad/double_clutch.html & the correct way was posted 5 times already in this thread.

This is a funny post. I agree with MexSiR on everything except double clutching. I believe double clutching is what you do right after you shift. For instance, you shift into 2nd (any gear) after redline; now, your RPMs are down and you are in a lower hp range of your engine. So, you depress and engage the clutch while holding full throttle, this is an instantaneous action. The rotational inertial your engine built up for that instance helps by lunging your car and creates a momentary void of resistance where your engine doesn’t need to work so hard to bring up the RPMs (closer to peek hp) i.e. for that instance of the lunge . This is a common trick in motocross especially when you find yourself approaching a jump or a hill in the wrong gear. Just adding my 2¢.


http://www.cardomain.com/memberpage/628654


sounds like a good way to burn up a clutch and not accelerate as fast if you ask me....

1st-2nd-3rd-2nd-3rd-4th-3rd-4th-5th

thats so retarded, I went to traffic school and when we were trelling our stories this kid sitting next to me was talking about a race he was in and he said he was in 2nd gear and he shifted to 3rd for a couple seconds, slammed it back to 2nd and the put it in 3rd again real quick for a boost. it was so hard not to just laugh in his face right in the middle of traffic school, but every cop in the room knows me and doesnt like me so I just sat there quietly.

So, you depress and engage the clutch while holding full throttle, this is an instantaneous action. The rotational inertial your engine built up for that instance helps by lunging your car and creates a momentary void of resistance where your engine doesn’t need to work so hard to bring up the RPMs (closer to peek hp) i.e. for that instance of the lunge

Whole lotta words...nothin bein said... :screwy: ...Oh yeah and Im sure "inertial" isn't used properly up there...

All the shit stated here is wrong. Damn!

Grannyshifting = shifting at low rpms, not close to where your engine is making the MOST power. If your engine makes 127 hp at 6700 and you are shifting at 4500 rpms, you are granny shifting. Shifting too early.

Powershifting = Upshifting (1st to 2nd or 2nd to 3rd...) without letting off the gas. So you press the clutch while you are pressing the gas at the same time and shift. If you shift like this at redline you will be mostly hitting the rev limiter for the split second, this is not recommended but it sometimes generates better times at a track.

Doubleclutching = Serves no purpose. If you double clutch while you upshift you are an idiot. Period. If you double clutch while downshifting it helps a little. The transition from one gears rpms to the lower gears is not as rough. If your on 3rd at 5000 rpms and you just press the clutch put it into second and release the clutch, the engine will jump suddenly from 5000 rpms to 7000 lets say, a bit rough...by rev matching your engine: that is setting the rpms in neutral to the equivalent of the lower gear, the transition will be smoother.

Now. Get IT?

MexSiR


Jeez man i thought no one was gonna get it right!

Well said, MexSiR.

In racing double clutching is used when downshifting to make the shift smoother. This is really critical when coming into a turn really heavy. If you don't double-clutch it takes a lot of torque to get the engine to speed up to the next gear when you let out the clutch. This torque translates to added braking on the drive wheels. So if your really racing hard, and you are already near the limits of traction, those drive wheels may begin to slip, or equally nasty, they don't slip and the weight of the vehicle is thrown forward putting extra traction on the front wheels and too little on the rear causing oversteer.

A "missed shift" is what happens when you fail to make the downshift correctly. When that happens you can't get on the throttle through the turn which implies that you can't get the weight back on the rear wheels making the back end really loose.

So bottom line is if you're racing on a course you need to learn to double clutch to be as competitive as possible. But, in normal driving its unnecessary unless you have lame syncros (or no syncros like old trucks).

Good link posted by Jackassi. It brought up the point I glossed over that while double clutching in racing, we are braking at the same time. A lot of modern cars suck for this because they mouth the gas pedal lower than the brake pedal. You can get modified pedals for a lot of cars to enable better "heel-toe'ing".

True I've tried heel-toeing in my civic and I can't seem to be able to touch both at the same time. The gas pedal is too low.

shit, i hit both by ACCIDENT sometimes >_<

having big feet sucks, but it's easy to heel-toe shift.

True I've tried heel-toeing in my civic and I can't seem to be able to touch both at the same time. The gas pedal is too low. That's because 90% of the cars out there are not designed for "heel-toe" shifting especially an economy car like a civic. In order to heel-toe correctly the pedals must be modified and I don't mean some stupid ass pedal covers.

As long as your controlling the brake & gas with one foot it's considered heel-toe but in reality it's impossible to do in most cars. Bascially you use your big toe on the brake and the right side of your foot to control the gas. The pedals are purposely posistioned that way for a safety feature so people don't slam on the gas instead of the brake or visa versa.

Now if your real good you left foot brake. That means left foot brake & right foot gas. But you may ask what about the clutch, that's the whole point your not using the clutch what so ever.

Heel-toe and left foot braking are racing techniques, if you do it on the street don't wonder why stuff breaks.

yeah i always thought that granny shifting was shifting like you would driving normally, not speed shifting at redline like you would if your racing. and double clutching is when you synchronize the engine and transmission when you upshift or downshift. and to the guy who said he can shift his old pickup truck without using the clutch, im pretty sure you can so that in any car; ive made complete trips not touching the clutch pedal once, except to engage first gear. i simply put the car in neutral, let the engine slow down 200-600 rpms and it goes right in 95% of the time.

Any manual transmission can be shifted up or down without the clutch so loang as it has synchro's 1960+ & newer. If it's hard to without the clutch your doing it wrong while tearing up your trans, it should take very little effort. NEVER downshift to 1st gear while moving(unless under 5mph)

This is how I control the gas/brake
http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=3052/35564brake_gas.JPG

Who cares about double clutching or granny shifting. To win a race you redline every gear in this order and youre guaranteed to win the race (1-2-3-4-1). You can take as much time shifting as you want youre guaranteed the win. I do it everytime.

Who cares about double clutching or granny shifting. To win a race you redline every gear in this order and youre guaranteed to win the race (1-2-3-4-1). You can take as much time shifting as you want youre guaranteed the win. I do it everytime.

hmm... i think the important part of your post was here...

" dino_racer []
AF Newbie
Joined: Dec 2004 "

I'm assuming you are talking about drag racing, whereas yes, it's (mostly) all about acceleration, and the best pattern is right up the scales. However, you are still incorrect about shift times, considering that every second you are on the clutch, you are not accelerating, you are either remaining at a constant speed or slowing down (this is BAD). I don't know if your... 1987 Honda Civic... has VTEC, a turbo, Chevy 454, or a Maclaren F1 engine in it, but you obviously haven't been racing anyone with a car of nearly the same powers if you don't know this. Grandma in her stock Chevette doesn't count.

Of course, the rules change COMPLETELY in any sort of rallying, circle racing, or anything other then a straight-line drag race. Then, things like heel-toe shifting, double clutching, shift points, and other aspects of "knowing how the hell to drive" come into play. I would suggest inquiring with a truck driver, police officer, or one of the more experianced people on here or locally if you want to learn how to drive.

Running your car into the redline purposely is just plain stupidity at work. The ECU or manual govorner is set to that spot to keep you from destroying your engine, and banging that spot over and over will eventually fulfill that. You want to shift just BEFORE redline, or wherever you stop making the most power before redline. Doesn't matter if you shift by a light, a tach, the sound of the engine, or the spedometer, the idea is the same.

Okay, one more thing- why the hell did you drag up an old thread to put one of your first posts in? Grow some balls and post where people are still talking!

:disappoin

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U granny shift if ur a douche....if uve ever been called a douche then u granny shift u dont even need to assume ur doin anything other than granny shifting. Double clutching is more for auto-x or road race whil eur going thorugh a corner. Double clutching in a drag race wastes time and Vin diesel can suck my balls, if u watch that part he doesnt double clutch neway. Just know that all u need to do is hit redline then shift in numerical order. 1-2-3-4-5- and 6 if u have it, thats why einstein invented numbers

speaking of numbers... you should look at the numbers that say when the last post was... 5 MONTHS AGO, why bring it back only to call someone a "douche" and make a point that was already said...:headshake

speaking of numbers... you should look at the numbers that say when the last post was... 5 MONTHS AGO, why bring it back only to call someone a "douche" and make a point that was already said...:headshake
:owned:

U granny shift if ur a douche....if uve ever been called a douche then u granny shift u dont even need to assume ur doin anything other than granny shifting. Double clutching is more for auto-x or road race whil eur going thorugh a corner. Double clutching in a drag race wastes time and Vin diesel can suck my balls, if u watch that part he doesnt double clutch neway. Just know that all u need to do is hit redline then shift in numerical order. 1-2-3-4-5- and 6 if u have it, thats why einstein invented numbers


Ladies and Gentlemen, we have a first. This person has :owned: themself!


(PS: hey stratpunkr, you're why darwin 'invented' evolution. have fun at the shallow end!)

Ok Powershifting Is Shifting Up Without Letting Off The Gas This Keeps The Rpms Us Thus The Use For A Dual Friction Clutch Or A Six-puc Clutch. He Is Right About The Granny Shifting, Shifting Too Early And Double Clutching Is Pointless Unless You Have 18 Wheels!

Ok Powershifting Is Shifting Up Without Letting Off The Gas This Keeps The Rpms Us Thus The Use For A Dual Friction Clutch Or A Six-puc Clutch. He Is Right About The Granny Shifting, Shifting Too Early And Double Clutching Is Pointless Unless You Have 18 Wheels!
So you brought back an old thread just to agree? Please look at the post dates before posting, especially if someone already got ripped on for doing the same thing.

Double Clutching can also be used to slow your car by friction when your brake master cylinder goes out in the middle of rush hour traffic.

Edit: My bad. I am also guilty of not reading dates and I posted this before finishing the 1st page. I am not really a DA, just misguided.

And actually just ignore this altogether because it really doesn't make that much sense now that I reread it. But it is hell when the BMC goes out. LOL

actualy its been on my mind ever since vin diesel said it in F&F to paul walker.

just wondering. . . .


dont forget "you could have blown the welds on the intake!" hahaha

For God's sake let this thread die!!!! This thread is going to haunt Automotive Forums forever!!!!!

F&F killed the Honda Driver

Look a fire, here's some fuel.

I have never seen such a cluster fuck of don't know what the fuck in a long time, and am glad that I was not oin during the hayday of this thread. going to unsubscribe before first email notification hit my inbox, thanks Jackasssi :)

i think this is the official "i'm a n00b so i'm going to post in an old thread, saying something redundant" thread.

can we shoot this thread, and put it out of our misery?