GTI vs Spec-V

hey, im trying to narrow down my options for my first car, I'm pretty much down to the following:

VW GTI vr6 or 1.8T (which feels faster?)
Nissan Sentra SE-R Spec-V.

I only have about 12k to spend on the car upfront, so which do you think will end up bein a better daily driver and weekend racer?
Also, my friend just got his jetta GLI with the 1.8L turbo engine, how do these cars compare in performance??


Thanks really appreciate it

though not the biggest fan of vw, i say go for the 1.8t. easily upgradable to make faster than the other 2. the 1.8t is just very flexible. plus just feels solid and much more classier.

I, personally, would look into a used corrado VR6. i really don't like VW all that much but i do like the corrado's quite a bit, smooth, fast and handle very well. of the choices you got listed i'd go VR6 GTI, SE-R, then the 1.8T. i have a friend with a 1.8T jetta(2000 i think) and he got edged out by my buddy in a newer LS integra with just an intake.

i would go with the sentra. i don't really care to much for vw and if you haven't noticed, i am a nissan guy. plus, the spec-v is a fast car, i got beat by a non-spec-v se-r.

Cool... how are each of these on insurance? The 1.8t will probably be pretty bad because of the turbo, but are the other two classified as sporty cars?

i think they're classifieds as compact sedans. insurance shouldn't be too terrible.

BTW are you taking a poop in your avatar or something?

I don't really like VW, so I voted Spec-V. But the GTI VR6 is a solid car as well, and the GTI 1.8T is very customizable.

hmmm yeah seems like most people are voting for the GTI.... i generally like the looks of the spec-v better, and it will cost a few less g's. but on the other hand i think the spec-v has already been tuned pretty heavily by nissan, and with its torque steer issues might be something to steer clear of?

The GTI, i know has ALOT of tuning potential, does anyone have experience putting a turbo on the vr6 model?
And stock for stock, the vr6 is faster, right?


EDIT: and of yeah, in my avatar ist just a picture from a video me and my friends made last year. i have weird control in my face muscles, and we took that picture of what would happen if i pulled everything down. it looks better in high-res.

Yeah, the VR6 should be the fastest out of all those, stock for stock. You could turbo the VR6, but it would be pretty costly and you don't need that much power for your first car. If you want turbo customizability, get the 1.8T. A lot of people say the 1.8T's characteristics are better suited to the GTI anyways.

i would hardly consider the QR25DE in the SE-R to be tuned to the max from the factory. i mean sportcompact car got 30whp out of thing with bolt ons and using a balancing shaft elimation kit. they said they hardly felt the difference in vibration with the shafts elimated.

sentra spec-v, it looks way better than the vdubs. Not to mention probably a lot more reliable, and it's not turboed yet, leaves room for forced induction :naughty:

i went and looked up that article just now, and it makes alot of sense.

Still up in the air though. anyone else?

..... and it's not turboed yet, leaves room for forced induction :naughty:


you think that's good or bad??? why is being turbocharged from factory a disadvantage? a $500 chip can give the 1.8t up to 40 additional hp. other than nitrous, what will $500 get you on the nissan? dollar for dollar, not much at all. not takin away anything from the nissan, but i don't think being turbocharged from factory is a bad thing for most people.

is there a chip for the vr6 too?

I dunno about 'racing chips', but with most turbo cars you can get some hp out of a boost controller, which is a very cheap mod.

The VW's have build quality issues...so go w/the SE-R Spec V

the GTI's look like old school rollerskates.

Go to www.VWVortex.com for by far the biggest source of VW modding on the planet. A GTi 1.8t with an inexpensive Chip from APR will be faster, and probably cost less then the VR6 or the Spec-V.

With a limited budget, the 1.8t is probably the best car out of the three as far as moddifying. Theres not as much potential in the 1.8t as the VR6, but its more easily tapped.

If you have a less restrictive budget, the VR6 can be tuned to beat M3s and S4s in a drag (I've seen it done).

Guys, keep in mind that this will be his first car, so it doesn't necessarily need to be fast. What's important for a first car is safety, reliability, and drivability, and the Spec-V offers the best compromise of all of these. VW's do indeed have build quality issues, so I'd steer clear of them.

very good point kman. i have a question nissanspdr, is your z just a n/a with a kamarni (sp) wing?

Guys, keep in mind that this will be his first car, so it doesn't necessarily need to be fast. What's important for a first car is safety, reliability, and drivability, and the Spec-V offers the best compromise of all of these. VW's do indeed have build quality issues, so I'd steer clear of them.


I agree with you 100% but it would be nice to have a little fire under the hood. Also what exactly does build quality mean? Like as in the dashboard falling apart?

very good point kman. i have a question nissanspdr, is your z just a n/a with a kamarni (sp) wing?

No Kaminari wing man...that's TT Nissan OEM. I know it's not a TT but it's a fine looking spoiler

I agree with you 100% but it would be nice to have a little fire under the hood. Also what exactly does build quality mean? Like as in the dashboard falling apart?

no, actually vw has some of the nicest dashes that would put even some luxury car dashes to shame. it makes the sentra dashboard looklike card board, but they do have some issues with their electrical systems - windows stop working, headlights just busting prematurely, shit like that.

but they do have some issues with their electrical systems - windows stop working, headlights just busting prematurely, shit like that.

Yea buddy of mine had his Jetta for a month and his window stopped working...WTF is that? German perfection my arse

Don't get me wrong, any of these cars will have plenty of fire under the hood. Trust me, when you're a new driver, you won't even really care or even notice how powerful your car is; it's once you can control all of it without thinking about it, that's when you begin to notice. Luckily, all three of these cars have decent aftermarkets (the VW's have the best), so if you want to make your car fast later, you can certainly do so.

yeah since this is goin to be your first car. all of them is goin to feel pretty ballsy. even to me non of them really feels gutless. they all got decent grunt.

keeping in mind that i will be spending $12k no matter which car it is, Will I be able to get a more reliable used spec-v or a more reliable GTI for that pricepoint?
What I mean is, at $12000 i might be looking at a GTI with 60k miles, but a spec-v at the same price might have 30k. just pickin numbers out of a hat.

Also which would do better with 1 grand in aftermarket, all-motor mods??

th SE-R would be better with $1G. the GTI's only have 155 hp stock and weigh 2860 lbs. after you invest a few hundred you'll only be at the point that the SE-R is starting at, Assuming you buy a 2001, which would fall right around $12,000. if you pony up some extra dough you can get 2002 and start off at 180 hp(but weighs2900+ lbs), but i don't think you'll find one for less than $15K, on a good deal. a 2002 Spec-V falls right around $13,000-14,000 and they only weigh 2750 lbs.


you should really look into a used 4th generation maxima(95-99). the V6 puts out a good amount of power(190 hp, 205 tq) gets good gas mileage, and the car only weighs 2900-3000 lbs in 5 speed. the aftermarket for a maxima is pretty booming right now so you can mod the hell out of it with all the money you'd save. IMO the maxima looks way better too.

The GTI has the best interior for a small car. Try sitting in a fresh new GTI at a VW dealer... outstanding. The Sentra can't touch it.

BP2K2Max, i've looked at Maxima's before but that generation is just too ugly on the outside. Not to mention slow, with 16.5s in the 1/4!! :rolleyes:

Back to topic, the only thing really keeping me from buying a spec-v is that issue of torque steer that i keep hearing about. Is it really gonig to be trouble for a new driver like myself? I've been driving stick for 2 years, been on the road for 1.

BP2K2Max, i've looked at Maxima's before but that generation is just too ugly on the outside. Not to mention slow, with 16.5s in the 1/4!! :rolleyes:

That doesn't sound right. The 95-99 Maxima w/ 5-speed should run closer to low 15's.

that's way off. i'd bet all the money i have that a stock 4th gen maxima will beat a stock spec-v and GTI.
this is the motor trend review of the 95 maxima when they first tested it. maybe your numbers are from an automatic or something.

Motor Trend, Road Test, June 1994
"Our tester, a five-speed SE version of this fourth generation of Maxima, produced a blazing 6.6-second 0-60-mph time, and a 15.2-second, 92.4-mph quarter-mile run. Ask us,
and we'll tell you how the Maxima SE will whip the Integra GS-R, and Taurus SHO;
the new Maxima also shows no mercy on its Nissan stablemates: It'll stomp the normally aspirated 300ZX, and drivers of automatic-transmissioned 300ZX Turbos best not be snoozing when the light goes green.
This demure-looking family car is the quickest Japanese sedan available in the States."

16.5 is waay off even for a automatic max. my friend has a 95 GLE fully load with leather and all options and he still ran a 15.9

the 4th gen maxima's from 95-99 are the 2nd fastest maximas ever made period. they can run as low as a high 14 stock. faster then any stock GTi including the VR6. and yes i do admit that the 95-96 are kinda ugly. the 97-99 with the facelift looks alot better. those were actually the best looking maxima's ever IMO.

hmm i got the stats from www.consumerreports.com which i assumed would be accurate. whatever haha

Anyway i guess my big problem with the maxima is just that it looks dated, inside and out. Whereas a car from 2-3 years ago still looks decent, one from twice that long ago will start to look iffy. For me, looks are almost as important as muscle.

also, my neighbor just got a R32 though which is FAST but i guess thats off topic. THAT is a sexy car.

there is no doubt that hte R32 is a very sexy car with a very nice interior. however i would not get that car. for the same money i would get a EVO 8 and burn the shit out of that car. that car would need a fair amount of mods to keep up with a EVO. and mod for mod, the EVO will mop it. also the R32 runs on a haldex AWD system which is like a front wheel drive biased tq split. its a FWD until it sees traction loss. which is a bit gay. its nothing like hte audi's system which has a torsen style center diff much like hte EVO's, which is far more superior in handling and power delievery.

The R32 has that FWD/AWD crap? I thought only Volvos had that. Aww, how sad.

they have a clutch type AWD system similar to the GT-R's but the tq split is backwards.

i thought it had that 4Motion system which was basically a downplay of quattro?

thats exactly what it is. its a "downplay" of audi's quattro. the only well known vw GTi that i've seen that uses audi's torsen style center diff is that black AWD straight 5 cylinder, turbo 900hp GTi. and the engine layout is like all Audis. the engine is mounted longituditionaly ( front to back ) not sideways like most AWD VW's. including the R32.

j/w is quattro electronic or is it all dependent on the center diff?

I bought my 2002 spec-v in Feb. for $11,500 with 17,000 miles on it and nothing has gone wrong on it.

j/w is quattro electronic or is it all dependent on the center diff?

the standard quattro system is nothing but a torsen style center differential that transmits tq. this is also found in the EVO. very effective.

the audi TT and the VW R32 however is different. it runs on a active differential like a GT-R. however the power is being sent to the wrong wheels. where as the GT-R, the center diff would be near the front to send tq to the front wheels when needed. the Haldex system has the diff in the rear. its essentialy a Front wheel drive and it will send power to the rear only when needed. kinda gay if you ask me. that sorta makes it into a ultra FWD. lolz

drewluh, my friend who bought a new '03 a year or so ago tells me he has problems with the car "drifiting", like if he's on the highway driving in a straight line, it will just start to creep to the right. Do you have any of that going on? Also, I really want a straight answer on how much of a problem the torque steer is, if you can.

the car creeping to the right or left can simply mean that the car is slightly turning based on the crown of the road. i would assume that car doesnt' have that much negetive offset in the wheels. sine htey did put on larger wheels that are wider and stick out more ( less offset ) then the standard Golfs. when you mess around with the offset of a front wheel. it affects feed back and how the car wants to follow grooves in the road. and becasue of that when i got my rims i wanted to stay as close to the factory offset as possible. ( factory is 42mm, i went alittle wider and stuck the wheel out alittle more by using a 40mm offset ) i highly doubt that the AWD can be the cause. i mean it is computer controlled after all. its most likely the suspension geometry and the offset of the wheel. if you've ever driven a EVO you will know what i mean. the steering ratio is very quick, and even on stock offset the car will wander whenever it hits uneven roads. same with my friends 2nd Gen MR2 turbo. when he had 18's on the front, with less offset compared to his stock 15's. the car would hit a groove and the wheel would not return back to center lolz. its great for feedback. but alittle annoying for everyday driving.

drewluh, my friend who bought a new '03 a year or so ago tells me he has problems with the car "drifiting", like if he's on the highway driving in a straight line, it will just start to creep to the right. Do you have any of that going on? Also, I really want a straight answer on how much of a problem the torque steer is, if you can.

The torque steer is nothing to worry about. It's not going to cause you to suddenly fly off the road if thats what your wondering. As with any fwd car, keep a firm grip on the steering wheel when you pin it and you won't have any problems. Under normal driving circumstances, you won't notice it at all. Mt girlfriend drives it as much as I do and she doesn't complain.
I was also looking at buying a VW when I decided on a 2003 spec V. The VW's drive a little nicer, but for the same amount of money, I was looking at a 2001 regular Golf that was the slowest vehicle I've ever driven. To get a 2003 GTI, I was looking at about $6000 CDN more than the Spec. But the worst thing about VW has got to be the low quality of the cars. Look at any automotive rating site and you'll see a ton of problems from windows not rolling down to broken seatbelts or wipers. It's usually stuff that won't leave you stranded in the middle of nowhere, but that stuff is annoying and very expensive to fix.
So I'd get the Nissan if I was you.