I need advice - one accident - two red light violation citations
Jabby
07-15-2004, 07:27 PM
My homestate is North Carolina. My husband, my two children and me were on our way back home and came to an intersection, the stoplight in my direction was green. The light for the left turn lane had just turned red when I came close to the intersection so I knew that my light would change to yellow soon too. This intersection was on my way to work for more than a year, I'm very familiar with the way the lights work there.
I kept on driving, knowing that I could go through the intersection without problems since the yellow light there is 5 seconds long. I was driving approximately 35 mph which is the speed limit there. There was an SUV waiting stationary in the left turn lane beside me which was blocking my view right before I entered the intersection, I did not see the other involved car coming from the left before I passed the SUV. The light in my direction was still green.
The next thing I know is that my husband who was sitting next to me in the passenger seat said right after we drove into the intersection that there was someone coming pretty fast from the left running the red light, he had a much better view than me. He said "oh sh**" and the car that was coming from the left and my car collided just as my light changed from green to yellow, even though I stepped on the brake immediately after he said to me that there was a car coming from the left. I got out of the car and the lady who drove the Chevrolet Malibu got out too, she came over and said to me "I'm so sorry, I know that I ran the red light", she said that twice to me, my husband heard her saying it too. She also mentioned that she expected her light to turn green but it didn't while she was driving into the intersection which caused the collision.
A man who said that he watched the whole thing (he was the driver of the SUV who was waiting to turn left) said to me that I had a red light too which was not true at all, I replied "I didn't have a red light sir, my light was still green when I drove into the intersection and it had just turned yellow when the accident happened" but he insisted that I did have a red light and that his was green which is completely untrue because before he would get a green light the traffic going across would have a green light, then all of a sudden the lady from the car who first admitted that she ran the red light changed her story, she mentioned in the police report that her light was green.
It is completely clear that this man made a wrong statement, the light sequence is as follows: green light for left turn first, then the light for straight traffic turns green, the left turn signal turns yellow, then red (which I saw when I came close to the intersection), then the straight signal turns yellow, then red and the traffic light for the traffic going across turns green after it has been red for the whole left turn and straight traffic green/yellow phase. Is there anything I can do, I mean if the cop would use common sense he would have seen that this "witness" is totally wrong. I would take a polygraph test if it came to that, I know I'm telling the truth. Furthermore 1 other witness was questioned and he said that the other involved car clearly had a red light for an extended time when she kept on driving into the intersection which clearly means that my light was green at the time I entered the intersection.
Considering the fact that the light changes from yellow to red after 5 seconds and until everyone even realized that an accident had occurred, of course by then my light was red, but not while I was driving into the intersection. There is absolutely no possibility that at this intersection both involved parties could have had a red light at the exact same moment, it is technically impossible which I can prove with pictures. My husband was then transported to the hospital for neck and back pain, he was not even questioned about the whole accident and he saw everything that had occurred.
The lady's car was then put on a tow truck and everyone left, I was the only one waiting in my car with my children. The police officer took pictures of my damages and gave me a citation for running a red light, I told him that my light was not red when I drove into the intersection and he told me that witnesses saw that I had a red light and that he was not going to argue with me about it. The other driver who was really at fault got cited for running a red light too. Later at the hospital my husband told me that he saw that woman talking on her cell phone while she was driving through the intersection seconds before the collision and that she was looking right over to us while she was running the red light.
I feel that I have been wrongfully accused, once I am not suicidal and secondly I have enough sense not to risk anyone else's life either. I have never had an accident in almost 20 years of active driving, I consider myself a very responsible and good driver. Plus, it should be put in consideration that it is technically impossible that two people, one going from west to east and the other going from south to north, had a red light at exactly the same time which caused this accident. And why was my husband who saw the whole accident not questioned as a witness?
The insurance liability adjuster/examiner from the opposite insurance company came the next day and inspected my car, he said that it looks like both of us are responsible according to the police report and the witness statements and that she has to pay for her damages and I’d have to pay for mine which are estimated by a collision workshop at approximately $ 2.550.--. It is just completely wrong since I’m not at fault at all.
Did anyone ever hear about two people being cited for the same running a red light violation (one going from west to east and one from south to north)? And does anyone have any advice for me regarding to prove that a witness made a wrong statement because the way he said it happened is technically totally impossible? I have tried to get in contact with someone who KNOWS and can prove with me that the witness's statement was technically wrong but the city police and public works are all "not responsible" and can't give me answers, instead they give me phone numbers to other people who can't help me. I feel like I'm running against walls here.
Any input is greatly appreciated since my husband has a severe concussion and has lost wages and already mounting substantial medical costs (cat scan, medications, ER visit) because of this accident too. It would be total injustice if I was made responsible for something that I had absolutely no fault at.
I kept on driving, knowing that I could go through the intersection without problems since the yellow light there is 5 seconds long. I was driving approximately 35 mph which is the speed limit there. There was an SUV waiting stationary in the left turn lane beside me which was blocking my view right before I entered the intersection, I did not see the other involved car coming from the left before I passed the SUV. The light in my direction was still green.
The next thing I know is that my husband who was sitting next to me in the passenger seat said right after we drove into the intersection that there was someone coming pretty fast from the left running the red light, he had a much better view than me. He said "oh sh**" and the car that was coming from the left and my car collided just as my light changed from green to yellow, even though I stepped on the brake immediately after he said to me that there was a car coming from the left. I got out of the car and the lady who drove the Chevrolet Malibu got out too, she came over and said to me "I'm so sorry, I know that I ran the red light", she said that twice to me, my husband heard her saying it too. She also mentioned that she expected her light to turn green but it didn't while she was driving into the intersection which caused the collision.
A man who said that he watched the whole thing (he was the driver of the SUV who was waiting to turn left) said to me that I had a red light too which was not true at all, I replied "I didn't have a red light sir, my light was still green when I drove into the intersection and it had just turned yellow when the accident happened" but he insisted that I did have a red light and that his was green which is completely untrue because before he would get a green light the traffic going across would have a green light, then all of a sudden the lady from the car who first admitted that she ran the red light changed her story, she mentioned in the police report that her light was green.
It is completely clear that this man made a wrong statement, the light sequence is as follows: green light for left turn first, then the light for straight traffic turns green, the left turn signal turns yellow, then red (which I saw when I came close to the intersection), then the straight signal turns yellow, then red and the traffic light for the traffic going across turns green after it has been red for the whole left turn and straight traffic green/yellow phase. Is there anything I can do, I mean if the cop would use common sense he would have seen that this "witness" is totally wrong. I would take a polygraph test if it came to that, I know I'm telling the truth. Furthermore 1 other witness was questioned and he said that the other involved car clearly had a red light for an extended time when she kept on driving into the intersection which clearly means that my light was green at the time I entered the intersection.
Considering the fact that the light changes from yellow to red after 5 seconds and until everyone even realized that an accident had occurred, of course by then my light was red, but not while I was driving into the intersection. There is absolutely no possibility that at this intersection both involved parties could have had a red light at the exact same moment, it is technically impossible which I can prove with pictures. My husband was then transported to the hospital for neck and back pain, he was not even questioned about the whole accident and he saw everything that had occurred.
The lady's car was then put on a tow truck and everyone left, I was the only one waiting in my car with my children. The police officer took pictures of my damages and gave me a citation for running a red light, I told him that my light was not red when I drove into the intersection and he told me that witnesses saw that I had a red light and that he was not going to argue with me about it. The other driver who was really at fault got cited for running a red light too. Later at the hospital my husband told me that he saw that woman talking on her cell phone while she was driving through the intersection seconds before the collision and that she was looking right over to us while she was running the red light.
I feel that I have been wrongfully accused, once I am not suicidal and secondly I have enough sense not to risk anyone else's life either. I have never had an accident in almost 20 years of active driving, I consider myself a very responsible and good driver. Plus, it should be put in consideration that it is technically impossible that two people, one going from west to east and the other going from south to north, had a red light at exactly the same time which caused this accident. And why was my husband who saw the whole accident not questioned as a witness?
The insurance liability adjuster/examiner from the opposite insurance company came the next day and inspected my car, he said that it looks like both of us are responsible according to the police report and the witness statements and that she has to pay for her damages and I’d have to pay for mine which are estimated by a collision workshop at approximately $ 2.550.--. It is just completely wrong since I’m not at fault at all.
Did anyone ever hear about two people being cited for the same running a red light violation (one going from west to east and one from south to north)? And does anyone have any advice for me regarding to prove that a witness made a wrong statement because the way he said it happened is technically totally impossible? I have tried to get in contact with someone who KNOWS and can prove with me that the witness's statement was technically wrong but the city police and public works are all "not responsible" and can't give me answers, instead they give me phone numbers to other people who can't help me. I feel like I'm running against walls here.
Any input is greatly appreciated since my husband has a severe concussion and has lost wages and already mounting substantial medical costs (cat scan, medications, ER visit) because of this accident too. It would be total injustice if I was made responsible for something that I had absolutely no fault at.
Igovert500
07-16-2004, 01:39 PM
Well tha situation really sucks, and I hope your husband gets better very quickly. It's sad to hear of anything like that happening, and then the idiots responsible getting away with it.
My first thought is this: Innocent until proven guilty...the officer has to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you are guilty of running a red light to issue that ticket...I'd go to court and ask him directly if he saw you run it...obviously he wasn't witness to the accident, so his answer will be no. If the witness doesn't show up to court(unfortunantly the witness is an idiot as well) but if they don't show up to court, then that ticket should be dismissed completely.
Next, you say you know the intersection, and its patterns, I would go back to it and video tape or something, to provide evidence of the sequencing and the impossibilities you described. Most importantly, you must go to court. You cannot allow something like this to occur without fighting it. A good attorney maybe a help, but if you feel you can provide enough evidence to prove your point, then perhaps you don't need one. Don't be intimidated, judges usually aren't as stupid as traffic cops. If you present your case logically then you have a chance.
I would think that if you can disprove the witnesses story that would dismiss his testimony. The funny thing, is not only were the two of you cited for running red lights...but the SUV was waiting for a turning arrow...meaning he had a red light...so all three possible flows of traffic had red lights....I doubt it. Good luck, and let us know how it goes.
My first thought is this: Innocent until proven guilty...the officer has to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you are guilty of running a red light to issue that ticket...I'd go to court and ask him directly if he saw you run it...obviously he wasn't witness to the accident, so his answer will be no. If the witness doesn't show up to court(unfortunantly the witness is an idiot as well) but if they don't show up to court, then that ticket should be dismissed completely.
Next, you say you know the intersection, and its patterns, I would go back to it and video tape or something, to provide evidence of the sequencing and the impossibilities you described. Most importantly, you must go to court. You cannot allow something like this to occur without fighting it. A good attorney maybe a help, but if you feel you can provide enough evidence to prove your point, then perhaps you don't need one. Don't be intimidated, judges usually aren't as stupid as traffic cops. If you present your case logically then you have a chance.
I would think that if you can disprove the witnesses story that would dismiss his testimony. The funny thing, is not only were the two of you cited for running red lights...but the SUV was waiting for a turning arrow...meaning he had a red light...so all three possible flows of traffic had red lights....I doubt it. Good luck, and let us know how it goes.
MagicRat
07-17-2004, 01:48 PM
I would suggest a traffic ticket specialist, too.
Fight the ticket in court. The DA will have to produce the witness and the other driver in order to convict you. A smart lawyer may be able to get the truth out of them in court. Or the witness may not want to show (it's inconvenient) and the state has no case.
Either way, the cost of the lawyer will pay for itself in keeping your insurance down.
Fight the ticket in court. The DA will have to produce the witness and the other driver in order to convict you. A smart lawyer may be able to get the truth out of them in court. Or the witness may not want to show (it's inconvenient) and the state has no case.
Either way, the cost of the lawyer will pay for itself in keeping your insurance down.
Jabby
07-29-2004, 07:40 PM
Thank you so much for your input !! After talking to some lawyers about 1. my husband's injuries with an injury lawyer and 2. trying to get in touch with a lawyer for fighting the traffic ticket (they're all on vacation until monday) I have some mixed news. The good news are that our insurance guy said that he talked to the "witness" who supposedly saw that I had a red light and that he won't show up for court unless he gets $ 20 an hour, otherwise it would be "inconvenient" for him to go to court, his whole attitude sucks. Secondly, the driver of the other involved car will pay her ticket without fighting it, she admitted to our insurance guy that she knows that she ran the red light, in other words, she's admitting her fault and he has it on tape too. Is it true that even if I'm being found totally innocent in court that it doesn't necessarily mean that will I get the money from the other insurance to get my car fixed? That would be the only right thing for them to do, wouldn't it? I will fight this with hands, feet and teeth if I have to, I swear. I heard that the worst scenario could be that the other insurance refuses to pay for my damages. And the injury lawyer might not even take my husband's case because there won't be very much money left for the lawyer after the hospital and doctor's bills are paid which really sucks, it proves again that the rich only want to get richer and the people with no money and injuries are losing again unless there's tons of money involved in a lawsuit. I didn't get much done yet but I'll keep you posted, I'm sure that I'll be able to report something more next week.
Take care and have a great weekend !! :)
Take care and have a great weekend !! :)
fredjacksonsan
08-12-2004, 09:32 AM
Hi, I work in insurance and deal with the stuff you're talking about. First of all, ask your insurance company for a transcript of the tape where the other driver says she ran the red light. That should be enough evidence to convince the court that you didn't run the red. There's alot of people that try to make money out of being a witness. Forget them. I'd concentrate on the other witness you said there was to the accident, the one that said the other driver ran the red light.
It's possible for both drivers to run a red, but with your version of the accident and the other person stating they ran it, there is a reasonable doubt of the color of your light, which is what you're after for the judge.
As far as liability and insurance, if the other driver said on her recorded statement that she ran the red light, then that should be sufficient to get the other company to pay for your damages one way or another. If you have collision coverage and your insurance company paid for your car repairs, then your company will go after the other company to recover what they paid out as well as your deductible. If you don't have collision and are looking to pay for your damages out of pocket, then you may have to file in small claims court to recover your money.
Hope this helps, let me know if you have more Q's.
It's possible for both drivers to run a red, but with your version of the accident and the other person stating they ran it, there is a reasonable doubt of the color of your light, which is what you're after for the judge.
As far as liability and insurance, if the other driver said on her recorded statement that she ran the red light, then that should be sufficient to get the other company to pay for your damages one way or another. If you have collision coverage and your insurance company paid for your car repairs, then your company will go after the other company to recover what they paid out as well as your deductible. If you don't have collision and are looking to pay for your damages out of pocket, then you may have to file in small claims court to recover your money.
Hope this helps, let me know if you have more Q's.
Automotive Network, Inc., Copyright ©2026