Engine Dies After 15 minute and Won't Start

My 92 Buick Park Ave. 3.8 L has another problem. Previous to the water pump and gasket covers being replaced it did not have a stalling problem. Now whenever the car runs for about 15 minutes from a cool engine it will stall and won't start until the engine cools from 30 min. to one hour. Then it has no problem starting. Once the car runs it may take about 5 to 10 minutes to stall again and requires another cooling period before it starts. The alternator charges the battery and can get over 13 volts when running. The fan also kicks in when the engine is hot. The coolant level is normal. I have washed the engine with Engine Brite and the outer engine looks relatively clean. Maybe the coil gets hot? Where is the coil located? Any other thing I should check. Thanks for all your help.

had similier problem, it was my fuel pump , it would overheat and stop working till it cooled down. next time your car won"t start, release fuel pressure from fuel line , and turn key on to see if it pressurizes fuel line

I drove my car around to get it heated then turned the engine off. I test the starting. When it does not start, I test the ignition with this gadget like a pen. You stick it close to the wires close to the spark plug. If there is ignition the neon light flickers. I did not get ignition. I guess that rules out the fuel pump? So what are the causes for ignition to be absent when starting and what causes it to stop while driving.

You may want to check your module. They are notorious for being heat sensitive when bad. Good Luck.

Thanks public, My mechanic brother in law also recommended changing the coil packs and ignition module. Standby, it was mailed from California yesterday. Each coil pack is $35 and there are 3 of them. The ignition module is $ 170.

The coil pack and ignition module were replaced yesterday. Test drive for 20 minutes was okay. However after the engine was turned off and restarted it would not start until a cooling period. No ignition while the engine is hot. Now what? Also while test driving, the lamp monitors were blinking. Now this may be insignificant but like others have experienced the low coolant level warning is on even though there is enough coolant in the radiator and overflow container. But the low coolant warning has existed before the stalling and no start problem has occured.

After reading a similar problem at the Le Sabre forum, in which the problem was solved, I am going to change the crank sensor. Does anyone know where is the crankshaft sensor in a 1992 3.8 Liter Park Avenue?

The crank sensor is located near the front of the engine off to the side of the harmonic balancer. I had mine replaced by a repair shop a couple of months ago. Cost me $150. I think I got reamed.

From the AutoZone web site


WELLS CRANKSHAFT POSITION SENSOR for a 1992 BUICK PARK AVENUE

Unit Price: $29.99
Core Value*: $0.00
Part No.: SU132
Weight: 0.2 lbs.
Warranty: 3 MO
Availability: Online: Ships within 2 business days
Store: Normally Stocked

DioGreer I guess most of it was labor charges?

Good Luck

http://www.asashop.org/autoinc/feb2000/techtips.htm
During my research into the function of a crankshaft sensor, I discovered the above website for those who have osciloscopes for troubleshooting crankshafts problems or connections between sensor and ignition module, on 1991-1993 Park Avenue 3.8 Liter.

jimmybvilla, sounds like you might have read my thread in the LeSabre forum. Your problem sounds very similar to mine. I sure wouldn't replace coil packs yet. I suppose it could be the ICM, but my shop was wrong on when they replaced mine early on in my 11-week ordeal.

Are you getting any codes? (I got a *cam* sensor code P0341, but not a *crank* sensor code--that's what really hacked me off.)

I can't wait to hear how it turns out for you. Hopefully you'll get to the answer quicker and more cheaply than I did!!

DioGreer: don't feel too bad; the $150 amount is exactly what I paid for the crank sensor installation on my '95 LeSabre. (By that time, I was *glad* to pay it, too.) I've replaced one on an '89 LeSabre--it took me about four hours; I had trouble getting the pulley off to access the sensor. So a guy who knows what he's doing can probably do it in 1.5 to 2 hours, and with labor rates what they are these days and the 60% mark-up on parts, I'd say the $150 is about right.

tim, thats good to know. I remember asking the guys at the repair shop about it and I think you might have to take off the harmonic balance to replace the sensor. I remember looking up the tool to do that, and it was a J 38197 crankshaft pulley puller for the 3800 engine ;). Along with messing with that, the sensor and magnet have to be aligned and calibrated.

so public, it was mostly labor charges :)

Thanks tim and diogreer for your post. After reading them I lost heart about changing the crankshaft myself. It looked like you pop out the old and pop in the new at first. Then I saw in the web tools for removing crankshaft sensors and Diogreer confirmed it by giving a tool number. At this point I don't mind spending $150.00. As previously noted in this thread, I have already changed the coil pack and ignition module at the suggestion of my mechanic brother in law. but that did not do the job. Hopefully, the crankshaft will do it. I have been following Tim Rice at the Le Sabre forum and I know many people will benefit from that experience. Stand by for further developement.

I had the same problem wtih my '92 buick 3.8l. I replaced about every sensor, coil pack, ignition module known to mankind - to no avail (luckily i had a very good donor junkyard car and nothing cost that much). Finally after finding some good info on the web regarding this problem - i changed out the crankshaft sensor - which really isnt that hard to do - though not a novice job, the main thing is you have to mark and line up the little finned thing thats on the sensor itself (good terminology yes?). You have to remove the inside wheel flap protector (which is like 2-3 bolts) and take off maybe one or two things (its been awhile since i did this) - and then the key thing is just Mark (scrape etc) how the cover of the crankshaft sensor is positioned - and take it out and put new one in (new at Autozone for $25). THIS solved my problem - no more cutting out while i was driving - and waiting 1/2 hour to 'cool' down. I too was receiving a Camshaft error message - which threw me off base - replacing the camshaft sensor didnt do anything except maybe smoothed the idle abit. Ok - anyhow - there are the posts describing my experiences with this a couple monthes back on this list. Mike

Based on what you said, mounddog, it's pretty likely that you and I are probably not the only ones who've been "fooled" by GM's lying camshaft sensor codes when the real problem was the crank sensor.

Given that professional mechanics have been taken in by it too, we probably won't be the last, either.

I already bought the crankshaft sensor through someone who works in a parts distributor store.$ 21.00 with his discount. A bracket goes with it and you insert the sensor into the bracket. Two bolts hold the bracket into the engine. I am not sure I got the right one but a friend who is a mechanic will help me install it. Here are the instructions:

1.Disconnect battery and sensor wiring.
2. Rotate harmonic balancer until interrupter ring slot on rear of balancer aligns with sensor. On combined sensor the balancer must be rotated until both inner and outer interrupter ring slots are alinged with the sensor.
3. Remove sensor mounting bolts and slide sensor assembly back and out. It may be necessary to loosen or remove the harmonic balancer to obrtain sufficient clearance.
4. Examine sensor for evidence of physical damage. If damage is noted the dynamic balance interrupterring should be inspected.
5. Install the sensor reversing the removal procedure. Note: The enclosed crankshaft sensor is a second generation consolidated design using the same mpounting bracket as the dual crankshaft sensors. In single crankshaft sensor applications the outer interrupter pathway does not contain a sensor assembly. the sensor assembly is installed using the inner interrupter ring pathway.
6. With sensor installed use a brass feeler gauge and adjust for a 0.02 clearance bertween the outer surface of the interrupter ring and the sensor. Recheck at three different locations 120 degrees apart around the interupter ring. torue sensor retaining bolt to 3.4 N. M. ( 30 lbs ) while maintaining light pressure on the sensor against the gauge and interupter ring. If interupter ring contacts sensor at any point during rotation, the interupter ring may need to be replace.
7. Reattach sensor wiring and battery cables.

Those of you who have replace the sensor on P/A 92 3.8L does it sound familiar to you?

He all....I just finished this very job as Timrice knows. So far so good still. I have a 92 Lesabre so my code was a 17. Research lead me to the crankshaft pos sensor. Yes I replaced plugs, wires, coil packs, fuel filter and tested fuel rail pressure before I went to the internet. I'm sure they needed changing anyway but who knows.

My advise is to use a very big breaker bar on the the Harmonic Balancer bolt.

I just marked the old sensor before I took it off and ligned up the new one to my marks.

The special tool to remove the pulley is nothing more than the one Autozone sells for $15 or loans out for free. You just have to get 3 .25 in bolts and some washers. The official part comes with tappered bolts down to .25in from .375 in.

Reinstall the balancer by tightening the bolt. Don't bang it on. There's a key on the balancer so you can't install incorrectly.

Have fun..you may end up spending the same amount of money but you get to keep the tools....

Thanks for the tip 3echo9. I will copy your post and give it to my friend. How long did it take to do the job? Is the Le Sabre crankshaft sensor the same as the Park Avenue? The picture you posted did not look like the one I bought. Mine has a bracket. This will be a interesting and educational project.

Glad to hear it, 3echo9. Let's hope that's the end of your problems.

As far as the variation in crank sensors goes, My '89 and '90 LeSabres had the plastic sensor-in-metal bracket type. My '95 LeSabre has the single-piece, all-plastic type which I have to believe is probably a more failure-prone design due to the thermal cycling stresses on the plastic body.

Hey...I wonder if plastic would make a good intake manifold? (That's really not funny, I realize.)

Jimmy...it took me a few days due to my lack of experience. Knowing what I do now and having all the right tools I would say it's about a 2 hour job. I had to put the car back together a couple of times as time ran out to get tools and advise on how to do the job.