new RI?????

http://forums.freshalloy.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB4&Number=67418421&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=1&vc=1

check this out....in this forum!!!! can there really be another RI that can legalize skylines!!!!!! :icon16:
can someone here prove this forum wrong or do we have another legalizer????

Read the thread there. Sean Morris has reconized the VIN number as one done by MotoRex.

It has been deleted by ebay. Maybe it IS a fraud.

Invalid item may mean that the memory of the item has run out... I had some old Ebay links from a while back, that said Invalid item.

Anyways, anyone can become an RI, $800 and some paper work. And your good to go. It's pointless unless you are going to be importing MASSIVELY.

My opinion on that...

-Wes

Here is the link to the NHTSA list of RI's.
If you would like, call each and every one up and ask if they will legalize Skylines, which models, etc.
I know of two that are in my "backyard", i.e., Florida.

http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/import/web_RI_list03012004.html

I believe WebAutoWorld's Skyline legalization efforts will be in full swing this month. I spoke to the owner a few weeks to a month ago. Currently SA will be doing our legalization work through one of the two below importers on the East Coast, or, if our customers prefer, on the West Coast through either RB or Motorex, depending on the model.
Currently I do not know of any company other than Motorex who will legalize an R34.
We will continue outsourcing legalization work until we become an RI. Although the application process SEEMS easy, it is still up to the NHTSA if we are given the certification.


Automobile Concepts
Price= $15,000 (Pre-1996)
location- North Miami, FL
Phone#- 1-305-893-1950

WebAutoWorld
Price= $15,000 (unknown models)
location-Pompano Beach, FL
Phone# 1-561-305-2500

mB

Interesting though as you mentioned, legalization is still going through MotoRex or RBMotoring. As long as it is going through them the prices will be higher than they need to be, IMO.

Holy shit. Deja Vu or what? EVERY post in here has been said before, this time it's just a different car on E-Bay.

I agree--the pricing for legalization from any outfit is too high----makes the realities involved with selling or owning a Skyline very difficult.
Skyline America does prefer to use our East Coast connections, as opposed to RB or Motorex, because of geography. I can be in Miami in less than 12 hours to oversee all aspects of import/legalization, to give our customers further assurance that everything is going according to plan.
The only problem I have with using those companies on the West Coast are there location 3000 miles away.
I also do not like Motorex's self-created monopoly myth. They contribute to that myth with various incosistancies and outright lies on their website, which goes further to both advance their myth and deter potential customers for all of us.
I wish there was some way to erase that myth in one blanket press release or something--but I see it on this site and others from people who claim that Motorex is the only place to go. Is not Sean Morris of RBM on this site? I bet he feels the same way that I do---that MX is the 800 pound gorilla in our industry.
If I had an unlimited budget I would be 100% okay with utilizing RBM for our legalization but I do not. Currently, many of our customers are in proximity to our base organization, and it is an unbelievable asset to our company to be able to take a person to our stock and let them touch and feel the vehicles we have for them to choose from. Now that we have expanded beyond just trying to sell vehicles that are overseas (although we still do that to fulfill special orders....) things have been going increasingly well for us. Our stock and legalizers are all located in Florida, so the process is almost completely seamless.
Perhaps someday I will open a base in SoCal but right now we have branding, internet presence, and overall visibility issues to concern ourselves with before we can look at expansion.
So, until the day that we are a NHTSA approved RI, we must continue to outsource Legalization, which means that we, like all individuals, are pawns in the marketplace. Perhaps once we are an RI we can increase competition and lower prices across the board, but that day is a little ways off. We are still preparing aspects of our application, then comes review, and hopefully, certification.

mB

So, until the day that we are a NHTSA approved RI, we must continue to outsource Legalization
aren't these two different things? Once you are an RI arent you still going to have to outsource legalization?

No, in fact it is one in the same.
See, I was even speaking with some of my employees today about how I thought the term "Registered Importer" was both misleading and confusing.
With the NHTSA, the term "Registered Importer" signifies a company's "certification" to street legalize vehicles that were not manufactured to DOT, NHTSA, and/or EPA standards. It does not in fact play any role at all in the ability to import/export a vehicle, etc.
If you were to question some of the companies on that list you would quickly see that many do not in fact import vehicles at all, but wait for other companies or individuals who ARE importing a vehicle to bring it to them to "legalize" it.
I was saying earlier in the day today that I wish the NHTSA title was in fact "legalization service/outfit/company" or something along those lines because it casts a disparaging shadow on a company that is in fact a very legitimate "import/export" company, but outsources legalization to a company who is a "registered importer".
Skyline America is a legitimate "import/export" company who is in the process of applying for status as a "registered importer" so that we can no longer outsource LEGALIZATION (only a small part, although important, aspect of our business) to a different company. Do you see how this is confusing----much of the confusion and misinformation in the Nissan Skyline pipeline of information, including the Motorex myth, extends from this confusion of distinction

Thank you for the amazingly simple, yet deep rooted, question that plagues many.

mB
http://www.skylineamerica.net

Well I'm am glad to see that I really am asking these questions because I am curious, not just to sling shit in anyones face. Good info though. I know there are a large amount of importers. I've seen a list and I'm sure it's quite old by now, but it had a lot of companies on there.

Are there different "levels" of RI's? e.g. does being an "RI" give you gods finger to christen all foreign vehicles "legalized". Does it go by make, or model or do you have to have paperwork to back up each make/model.... let's say I'm Mike the import company and I want to be an RI. what do I have to do to be able to import a skyline R32 GTR vs. say a Nissan Cube?

But if being a RI meant that you could also legalize them then why would any RI have to outsource to MotoRex?

No, in fact, that is why a person would have to call each of the companies on the RI list to see if they handle Skylines. A company must be certified for each individual type of vehicle, and model years depending on changes in emissions standards for those years.
Example---none of our partners in Florida do anything past 1996. For that I would have to use RB or Motorex. The reason they say is the increased emissions standards for post-96 model years. Which is why primarily I push top of the line 1995/96 GT-R R33's. I think they are the best value for the price, etc.
There are a list of things that must be included in the application to the NHTSA and this is quite intensive. Currently I am more focused on gathering these resources than the actual "method" of how legalization is to be done once we can do it. I imagine some of this is proprietary knowledge, or perhaps it is in the literally hundreds of pages of NHTSA, DOT, and EPA literature I have sitting on my desk that I am currently cramming on. Hopefully all the answers are in there, or provided once the application is accepted.
Otherwise I am rather concerned about what to do after that. In effect I am trying to say in a round about way---I don't know. I am not detered by the Motorex site that says it is all super-duper-national-security level secret. I know of five modifications in particular that must be done, and I am sure there are more, and I am counting on at least one or two that will be difficult to learn, etc. Luckily one of my best friends is a mechanical genius and I am an electrical engineer so between the two of us I know we have most of the ground covered. I actually tried to contact one of the RI's who I know personally to find out exactly what I was looking at having to worry about once I have the certification but he had an urgent call from Sweden he was on and then I got distracted with other stuff today so hopefully I will know more later.
This is kind of a conundrum, you might say. My wife says that if I DID have proprietary information I should not reveal it at all. I, on the other hand, am a fan of open-source information. I believe information hoarding should be a crime. So I don't know what to say. If there were 3 million RI's I would still want to be one so that our company would not have to outsource. Microsoft doesn't like to outsource. My father does not like to outsource in his business, and I am in that grain of individual that I prefer to do all of our work in-house. Instead of signing a publishing contract when I was 18 years old that would have netted me millions (potentially....) I ripped up the contract and founded my own publishing company. I am a do-it-yourselfer. I prefer to do all my own work on my vehicles. My wife makes fun of me for that. She prefers the "take-it-to-a-professional" type of thing(although she is also a mechanical whiz that makes me feel inadequate on an almost daily basis). She says the rest of the import community would also laugh at me, whereas I prefer the kind of guy that can fix his own car than the guy that has to take his car to a shop to "upgrade" his spark plugs, you see? Make fun of me. Who would you rather have riding with you if your car suddenly goes dead for no reason? A guy that knows stuff about his car or the guy who gets ALL of his work "professionally" done?
So, to be honest, if I knew the "secrets", I would tell them to you because I feel that if there were 3 million RI's the prices would be realistic due to market pressure. I am that manner of "capitalist". I believe in the ABSOLUTELY FREE MARKET.
Here is the stuff that I know.
1) DOT approved windshield, vehicle glass
2) five mile per hour bumpers
3) new gauge cluster
4) catalytic converter
5) VIN number
there are a couple others that aren't popping into my head in this late hour for me. I work 16-18 or 20 hour days of late. And this one is quickly running to an end. But I believe that if everyone knew the truth then the MX myth would be quickly squashed and in fact the entire community of Skyline enthusiasts would turn against MX for lying, withholding knowledge (no matter how proprietary), and using false information to try and deter competition.

gotta sleep. wife waiting and giving me that "workday ended hours ago and you are still working" look that I am becoming increasing frightened of.

mB
http://www.skylineamerica.net

I hear you. There is some bullshit somewhere, just can't seem to pinpoint it. I also believe in open source information and not just when it comes to computer software.

I really do not see why it is so hard to bring a skyline to the states.
And as far as crash safety. Think about this. Crash my skyline at 60mph onto a wall with a dummy and a seatbelt.

Now crash a motorcycle at the same speed.

Why is my skyline the problem?
It's not that it's right hand drive, I've seen right hand drive cars in the US. Do I have to get a new guage cluster? Need MPH.... uhm. okay.
The glass?

How many people have thrown a concrete brick thru the window of a skyline? (This is me jumping up and down raising my hand).
The first 5 times I threw it it bounced off the windshield.
http://blacklinux.com/pages/public/cars/skyline/2004/may/thumbnails/thumb_DSCN4314.JPG
http://blacklinux.com/pages/public/cars/skyline/2004/may/

I have also crashed a skyline at about 60mph. I've been there and seen it first hand from an inside the car perspective. It's a pretty solid fuckin car, let me tell you that.

Oh, maybe it's because I'm not aware that the objects in my mirror are closer than they appear? I can fix that. get me a stencil and some paint.

It's just hard for me to believe that motorex is and always will be the only way to legitimatly import and legalize a nissan skyline. It's not a government backed monopoly. So I guess they have some information that is copyrighted? great. what's to stop another person from doing the same shit.... need to crash some skylines, come to japan and have a ball. you can get skylines for 2 grand here. all you need now is a brick wall, some paint and a video camera. I just don't see why it hasn't been done yet.

SAPrez:

Forgive me if I sound sceptical but, others have claimed this and that. I've made it quite clear I'm not a fan of MotoRex's prices. Irreguardless what they claim is the reason for the compliance costs. To charge 15k to comply an R32 GTR is without a doubt highway robbery. You could replace every outter pannel, pane of glass, the entire wiring for less.

Now I've also made it clear I'm not here to "look after" MotoRex or RBMotoring, however again others such as Fuel Imports have claimed this and that yet they were found to be full of shit as it were.

I do WANT others to begin to comply these cars at a reasonable rate, 1st and foremost is I'm looking to move back to the states in the next couple of years and I want to take my R32 GTR with me. However paying to comply it what it cost me to buy it isn't right! Basiclly if it comes to that I'll remain in New Zealand sad as it may sound.

On a different note what you are saying about the glass is odd, since it complies with the european and asian standards. The bumper must be the rear because of the massive steel front bar on these cars can sustain substantially more than a 5mph impact. I know this for fact on a GTS-t I had which I was involved in a 40mph impact (frontal) and other than the bonnet, lights and front guards the car was fine. The car I hit however wasn't. Yes I went up someone's ass on an motorway here (interstate) , I was the 4th car in a 4 car pile up. The guage cluster makes sence because the factory one is in KPH, and the cat would be normal. None of these would be very expensive or should be. I would imagine the R32 needs side intrusion bars in the doors, and possibly some sort of rear intrusion for the gas tank. Other than that I honestly can't see where the car needs to be modified at.

1) DOT approved windshield, vehicle glass


This is a myth when it comes to the Skyline. The Skylines are equiped with DOT standard windscreens. I have a 1990 4 door skyline (never intended to see the states and can't be converted yet to US legal due to being 4 doors) and every window has the DOT stamp. If the window has that it meets US DOT standards and is street legal. It's much like tyres requiring the DOT marking (one thing several Skylines need changed to make US legal because only about half of the tyres in Japan have the DOT marking).

Thaks for the info guys----
On those things that I was pointing out specifically I picked up from boards and one of the auctions on yahoo (I know you all have seen it, that White Skyline in Hawaii that's been listed about 6 times with no takers).
From what I've heard New Zealand is awesome (all the way around, not just the car culture). I used to work with an editor that lived there. Didn't they manufacture R32's in Bathurst? What is it they call it, the Bathurst Beast? Or something along those lines....
By the way, I'm not trying to come across as if I am talking s*&^---I am trying to show you all that I am trying to be as transparent as possible. I will never claim to do something I can't. SA's business practices will always be above the level. I learned business from my father, a very renowned specialist in his field, and he would kill me if he ever found out I was doing different.

Being a Moderator I've have the responcibility of making sure our forums users are not subjected to BS, and can rely on correct information. I'm sure you and everyone can appreciate that.

I phoned up the owner of the place I purchased my cars from and had a rather interesting converstation with him. Generally when the bring in freash imports the major things that need changing are brake pads and or rotors. Sometime tyres yes but that is because they don't meet our minimum tread depth requirements. We've got very strict warrent of fitness standards here in New Zealand. Emissions are begining to come in at the end of the year, oh joy. As far as the structural integraty of the car though we are without a doubt the toughest I've seen or heard in the world. We also have a front impact standard that came into effect over two years ago which unless the car has a specific number in the maufacturers vin code ( usually post "96) it isn't allowed to be imported anymore, or unless it is over a certain age.

A quick off topic on that very subject though. We have WOF or "Warrent of Fitness" checks every six months. There is a check sheet that is used that checks 80 different things, I shit you not. Things that are checked. Shock condition (including boots, leakage, responce), all bushes on the suspension (leak, tears, cracks), steering racks, tyres, windscreen wiper condition and works, cracks in any glass, seals on windscreen and rear window, all light (condition, properly alinged{headlights}, all bulbs working, height of the cars chassis, rust on or near any structual part, noise level of the car (exhaust), they open the bonnet (hood) and inspect the engine bay looking for modifications that would increase the car's hp over factory. Now this is a judgment call. If you car produces more than 20% over factory you are required to obtain a LVMC " Low Volume Modification Cert", the same if you have adjustable suspension, changed the engine from original or any other various reasons. It is without a doubt a right royal pain in the ASS.

Back on topic.

Now something that is of interest and maybe in the past I've been a bit harsh on it is people coming in here claiming that "X company" now complies skylines. Basiclly if someone comes in here and makes this claim without proof they are banned within 24-48hrs. The reason for it is there have already been a few cases of forums users being ripped off large sums of money. Again refer to my earlier comment about looking after our users here. While I may seem to be an orgor at times I certainly hope everyone realizes it is in YOUR best interest not mine. I've heard of no other company(s) being able to comply/legalize these cars in the states other than MotoRex. RBMotoring was working on it and I've not heard from Sean that they have now begun to do the work themselves. What is begining to bother me about this thread is the fact if anyone knew what was involved to get the "OK" to do this outside MotoRex, Sean would know and RBMotoring would have been doing it ages ago.

As far as comments on websites, well honestly I have little faith and it carries like ZERO weight with me. Any fool can put what they want on a website, it doesn't mean it is fact or true. I went and visited the link you provided about the RI's and while those companies are on there, it also doesn't specify what cars they are able to bring in and legalize. It states they are able to import cars only with a number type of code, which maybe I should assume stands for the car's or models they are able to comply. The only problem with assuming is it makes an "ASS of U and ME. I've got no real way of checking these outfits out without costing me a lot of money, though I'll see about getting hold of a few contacts I've got in the states and see what it is they can dig up.

I appreciate your dilligence---I realize being in New Zealand you can't just pick up a phone and call these people so I don't hold that against you, so whatever you can learn would be of great interest to all of us since I, and I assume most other people, consider you an impartial judge.
I greatly respect your job of maintaining integrity on this site and I know we have walked the razors edge (no pun intended) of your stated rules and I do appreciate that you allowed this discussion to continue. I won't push this topic any more until your contacts can verify the information--I hope promply :).

mB

Its all good. As long as a thread stays constructive it's welcome to stay open, and of course isn't filled with loads of BS which would have no bearing or relivance of the original topic.

Ok I've had a better read of the RI list. It seems it is a business interest code. It states nothing about which vehicles they are able to comply or bring in.

I called both Automobile Concepts and Web Auto world, web auto world is still waiting for approval and cannot currently import anything, Automobile concepts cannot import anything newer than a 1995 I see you have both a 98 GT25 and a 1996 R33 advertised, I can ask sean about the rest next time I talk to him. However if these cars really are in your possesion plese take a picture of the new VIN sticker, it should look something like this:
http://www.superstreetonline.com/superstreet/eventcoverage/p173971_image_large.jpg
That is the California version anyway..
Oh yes and don't forget this:
http://www.superstreetonline.com/superstreet/eventcoverage/p173973_image_large.jpg
PRovide those two and I'll run the vin/chassis numbers and verify your stories. See anyone can post the vin of a legalized skyline, I want the pictures of the plates and the ones on your website to match. Oh yes and to make sure please take a picture of the gauge cluster so I can see that the display is indeed in MPH and that the milage is shown in miles. And please, non of this I dont have one or my digi cam is broken excuses.

Thank you for actually pointing out something that perhaps is confusing to a few people---these cars are NOT YET legalized. I include the price of legalization in the sales price because I will NOT, in any way, risk my personal assets or professional reputation by selling a vehicle to someone that does not have the means, or even the intention, to legalize the car---what will happen, we all know, is the car will be seized, the customer will be out of a vehicle, and who will be blamed? Me. Right? No matter how much I try and dissuade someone from using some end-run scheme to get around customs, the NHTSA, the DOT, or the EPA, if they turn around and do it ANYWAYS, I would still consider myself to blame, as would the customer, and anyone else that heard of the situation. You see? I do not at all encourage or condone anyone to try and attempt to do anything that, even if not exactly legal, is not completely on the level. So what I offer my customers is pricing that includes EVERYTHING that they would otherwise have to secure on their own, or lose their vehicle. You would have to completely understand that I am not solely selling these vehicles online---I meet each and every day with prominent individuals in my surrounding geographic area who are not at all informed on this process like everyone on the boards--all they know is that they would like to have a Nissan Skyline. Middle-aged successful businessmen who would otherwise go out and buy a corvette are my most viable potential client base, and I spend the vast amount of my resources and time reaching out to them. So, when I designed the website, I didn't put a page "about legalization" that I will have up tomarrow, that details how, in order of preference, I am securing legalization, through any of the 3 (soon to be 4) companies, in my order of preference that is due to geography, once again.
You are right---Automobile Concepts would not be able to legalize two of the models I have listed, and those I have slated to go to RB Motoring or Motorex, respectively. This additional cost is factored into the price. But, because of the continued misconception caused by my current design I will add that "about legalization" page so that there is no confusion.
It is Skyline America's intention to both streamline and make as transparent as possible the process involved with importing, legalizing, and ultimately, owning a Nissan Skyline. Right now there are a lot of blurry areas in the information base, and it is right for people to be both suspicious and demanding of information. I expected to be scrutinized very intensively when I entered these boards, and that was my hope---that I could both learn what I wouldn't otherwise, to be both critiqued and informed about all sorts of things that I can learn from other peoples mistakes and triumphs. I want to know all kinds of things, technical things, modification things, upgrade things, as well as learn how I can earn the trust of the community. I'm not going out and trying to solicite sales here---If people are interested and check out my site and then we can go from there. I could go and try and list my stuff on the wanted ads or something, but I am not. I do my sales work when I am out of the office---when I am here I am trying to ask questions and get to the bottom of the intense secrets involved with our community (as well as talk with the people who actually have these bad ass cars like I hope to also have soon).
Believe it or not, as I am a work-a-holic, this is actually what I consider my downtime and pleasure time activity. I really hope this has cleared up the misunderstanding.
Like I said, thanks for picking out, however inadvertantly, something that was going to continue confusing people. I had actually thought about making that extra page a couple times but skipped it due to time constraints. It is the second thing on my to-do list for tomarrow so I hope to have it up by 9 or 10 a.m. my time.
Thanks a lot!
mB

This is a myth when it comes to the Skyline. The Skylines are equiped with DOT standard windscreens. I have a 1990 4 door skyline (never intended to see the states and can't be converted yet to US legal due to being 4 doors) and every window has the DOT stamp. If the window has that it meets US DOT standards and is street legal. It's much like tyres requiring the DOT marking (one thing several Skylines need changed to make US legal because only about half of the tyres in Japan have the DOT marking).

All the glass is DOT legal.... Years ago.... Mercedes needed DOT glass... people assume its the same.

5 mph bumpers- not true...

So of 5 things you listed - 2 you dont need to do..... You are only batting 60%...

RB Motoring is an RI .

RB Motoring is not complying Skylines.

There is one place that complies Skylines - Motorex.

In the last 5 years - no one else has done it.

Rather than TALK about what you are " GONNA" do.

Do it...

Working on it....

so SAPREZ
good luck bro,
hopefully we can all see you on the RI's top list,
i thought rb motors was LEGALIZING skylines?

Something else you might want to tell your customers....


There is an indeterminant hold on ALL GTR's at the moment as the new members of the staff that are in charge of approving the GTR packages are verifying some things. The paperwork for my completed car has been at the DOT since Dec 23rd. Every package is being looked at with a fine-tooth comb. I've been in contact with the DOT on a number of occassions and it still doesn't appear the car will be released any time soon.

Keep in mind....this was a car that was brought into compliance by Motorex and their subcontractors....so even for those truly approved RI's...it isn't an easy task right now.

Working on it....

I will pass this information on to our people and have it looked into. What is this staff? Or, to put it differently, what department at what agency (I am assuming NHTSA, right?). What have you been able to learn in your inquiries?

mB

Thanks Mr. Morris,

I had actually recieved two corrospondences yesterday that mentioned G&K as the people who did the petition for MotoRex, when it was actually JK Technologies. I was wondering who these mysterious G&K people were.
I just put in a submittal for price quote with them to see how much they are running if they do Skylines at all.....
Do you know anything about this "hold" on GTR's, etc?

mB

G & K does all the emissions work for Motorex. Or - they did - if what people are saying is right.

It seems like Motorex is just giving up on legalizing vehicles.

JK are the ones that filed the inital petition. JK and G&K , and Motorex all worked together on the legalization of the Skylines.

I'm talking about the final approval authority at the Department of Transportation, Office of Vehicle Safety and Compliance. Specifically, Mr. Lindsay/ Mr. Stevens.

The R32's are being held until it can be verified the supplemental restrainst system meets required guidelines. I'm not sure about the R33's...I haven't called to get an update in a couple weeks...and I don't really care about the 33's anyway-not my car.


I will pass this information on to our people and have it looked into. What is this staff? Or, to put it differently, what department at what agency (I am assuming NHTSA, right?). What have you been able to learn in your inquiries?

mB

Thank you GTR2.7L.
And thank you also Tyndango for clarifying that for me. As I said some people had been morphing the two into one, I would assume, or something along those lines.
What do you mean, MotoRex is giving up? Is this in response to your own company, or what? Any details that you can give us, privately or otherwise?

mB