Need a dodge ram drivetrain expert

customer truck....97 2500 4x4

dana 44 or 60 front axle (have not seen truck yet, its coming in sat)

needs axle outboard ujoints bad.....Ive done fords that are like this, since the dodge is full time hubs, I need to know, can I press out the u joints once I remove the spindle? do I HAVE to pull the axle shafts out? I dont have the special dodge tools to take apart the 4x4 lock machanism to take out the long side.

I have a giant c-clamp that presses out ball joints and u joints and can do em on vehicle a lot....the design of fords that use the same axle you cannot, I wonder if the dodge can?

...And you're a mechanic? At a shop? Are you serious?

yes, now do you have an answer or not?

I shouldn't have asked, now I'm in trouble.

My apologies. No, I don't have an answer for you.

you have to pull the axle shafts out.
Careful here; 44 and 60 are somewhat different.
You dont have the Dana hub tool?
Buy one.

If you run into trouble, post here and I'll try to help you.

Another place for an answer is www.ramchargercentral.com
Lotsa smarty pants guys there..!


and to Bleed,
Nice save...:)

Thats what I was afraid of, I know on the fords the design of the knuckle and spindle do not let you remove the knuckle with the shafts in place - short side shaft on a D44/D60 is never retained, if comes out once the spindle is removed. Its the long side that worries me.

The solid tube axles dodge uses are slightly different than the IFS axles ford uses (or solids in the jeep for that matter), its no longer a question of removing a keystone clamp and then the long side shaft slides off splines from a stub shaft ujointed to the intermediate, but you have to disassemble the sliding collet mechanism for the intermediate shaft (ford/jeep dana applications use the locking hubs to tie the front wheels together, the G2 dodge uses something similar to what is in chevys transaxle to tie the intermediate shaft to the long side shaft) - from the manual there appears to be at least 3-4 special dodge tools - of which Im pretty sure I wont have.

the hub tool is no brainer, I have about 6 of them covering D20-70 for like 40 years of applications.

My hope was that where was room to get the knuckles off without first pulling the shafts so I could use the tool on the stub shaft u joints right there, saving the customer a lot of time (hence $$)

Quaddriver,
Dodge had to be "Different"... but I've done it without the "special" tools, except the damn hub socket, but I can tell you I really wouldn't want to do it again without the special tools! (You know that feeling you get after it's too far apart to put back together without fixing? Yeah, that's where I was, one mostly disassembled axle, wrong tools on a sunday, afternoon .
And the guy HAD to get the truck home.
What a pisser!

Slantsixness

This may be too late. The axles do need to come out. No special tools needed. I've done many with a press and/or hammer. Tip, loosen the shift collar mounting bolts before pulling the right axle shaft. Otherwise diff fluid will run into the right axle tube and the owner will be back claiming it leaks.

I think he doesn't have the clip tool, or a press.

Cool tip on the right axle, I remember what a mess one of the one's I did was... Hind sight's 20/20, right?!

truck came in today. it *looks* like a D44 carrier-wise, but damn the u joints look like D60 and there is of course no tag - no prob, the stub shaft u joints are like 1.188 if 44, 1.375 if 60.

It appears I read the manual wrong, once I take off the hub then spindle I only have to disc. the shift mechanism and yank the intermediate shaft out - I dont care about the inner shaft on the left (facing axle) side and all those evil tools, so it is still as easy as a ford. Unclear if the knuckle has to come off yet....any pointers appreciated.

My questions are thus: I keep reading over here about the 1-7/16" axle nut socket. Is that a fancy way of you guys saying 36mm socket? (danas use 30, 32, 34 and 36mm w/o locking hubs)

nextly, does anyone have a part number for the intermediate shaft support bearing? and the seal is still a 5131 no?

Last insidious question: if the manual is right, the outer locknut is only set to 50ftlbs? I know the inner is set lightly on most danas, then the locating/thrust washer is slid on and you clamp against that, but the book procedure here seems to differ from other danas I have done.

Remove the front wheels, and calipers. Remove the vacuum actuator plate- 4 bolts. Remove the axle shaft nut and washer, 36mm sounds too small. Remove the disc/bearing/hub bolts-12 point 5/8" socket needed. Now the fun begins, remove the bearing/hub assembly. The hub is usually rusted in the knuckle assembly. Lots of penetrating oil and pry bar between the discs and knuckle. Once the hub/disc is out the axles slide right out. I always banged the nut back on with my impact, 50 ftlbs seems to light.

The spec is right, but I just tighten the nut with an impact that's probably at 90Lbs... never had a problem.

I have the SAE socket... so I'm not sure if it's 36mm either, thought it might be more like 40...

I thought you had to do the left shaft too.?

There you go again getting lucky!

Good luck,

Slantsixness

Oops, not 5/8" but 9/16" 12 point socket needed

was easier than I thought.

procedure for dana60:

loosen hub nut, remove wheel, caliper, then rest of hub nut. use puller to pull rotor off the inner hub bearing (outer hub bearing and sleeve comes with.

undo the 4 hub bolts. you have 2 choices - either undo the bolts half way and using a 1/2" extension use the power steering to push the hub loose, or there are 8 'slits' in the hub where you can use a chisel (I use railroad spikes courtesy of the norfolk southern - they flow without shattering) and pop her out.

then the intermediate shaft just pulls out.

hardest part was pressing out the u joints....they were screwed beyond belief

the inner hub bearing was also a little loose from the stub shaft flopping about - thats another day. then you set the spacer, dust shield and inner portion of the hub back in, and in a crosswise patter use the bolts to suage it in, then set the rotor+outer hub on, using a lucite hammer u can get it 75% of the way on, then use the hub nut to bring it all together.

warning: dont even attempt to set the hub+rotor back in as 1 unit on a 4x4 - you will never get it to line up and there is no room to rotate the inner hub to line the holes up. therefore since you have to split it, CLEAN WORK AREA is key....lots of crud in there.

assessment of dodges 'new' front end:

the use of dana axles is certainly bulletproof - ford used em for decades, but without the use of even the split axle like the D44 or 50IFS, the front end suspension is like a 1930s truck. the rules have certainly changed.

the use of a sliding collet in the axle like chevy in the transaxle is certainly convenient in that you dont have to get out and change hubs or dont have air/vacuum hubs that fail, BUT, I fix countless electric/vacuum shifters on the chevys, the fords never fail unless u bust a hub basket in extreme cases. take your pick.

using the integrated hub - not a good idea in this case. with the chevy transaxle design, you have light cv joints going into this. since this is on the outboard ends of the axle, there is 1 u joint - plays hell on the ujoints like the ford does, only when the ford goes, the stub shaft support bearing goes ($9) and with the dodge - $100 - take yer pick.

the winner? chevy with its tru IFS setup and negligible usprung weight. (about tied with the new ford - but wins with the unclutteredness of the torture bar vs coils)

I have to place the older ford over the new dodge simply because the split axle allows only one wheel to go off camber on a rough surface whereas the dodge forces both to go off camber....hard to control a vehicle with both front tires tipped on edge.

and for future reference, the hub nut will fit a 1-11/16ths, or 43mm socket, and NAPA, federated, car quest, advance, autozone and pepboys do not know about this - nor stock the part, nor can order it (tho napa does sell a generic 1-11/16ths socket)

the torque rating is 150-175lbs. 3/4" tools should handle it. This torque rating is IMPORTANT, like the chevy, it holds the shoulder on the stub shaft and the outer hub/rotor assembly together -keeps the bearing assembly from splitting. so I would assume the same caveat as with chevy applies: NEVER remove the hub nut with vehicle weight on.

notes: the D44 is different, the rotor literally falls off from the hub, allowing you to pull the hub as 1 piece.