Kerry honored by communist in Vietnam!

:lol::lol: Go figure. We've already had one democratic candidate take communist money, its just funny that they publicly endorsed him this time.

Communist Kerry? Somehow I don't think so. He likes spending everyone elses money. Telling other people what they can and cannot do.....

Wait a minute!!



:grinno:













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In the Vietnamese Communist War Remnants Museum (formerly known as the "War Crimes Museum") in Ho Chi Minh City (Saigon), a photograph of John Kerry hangs in a room dedicated to the anti-war activists who helped the Vietnamese Communists win the Vietnam War.
Problem number one, the south was already losing, problem number two, Nixon (not Kerry, you'll note) had decided on "vietnamization" - that is handing the war that we should never have gotten involved in back over to the South Vietnamese, who should have been fighting it by themselves in the first place - which was widespread opinion in the United States, don't blame him for doing what people wanted.
Most importantly, supporting the end of of involvement in a war doesn't necessarily mean you want one side or another to win. While the communists might place value on the actions of war protesters for helping them win the south - I think we all know about communists and the effects their public relations teams have on reality and history.

They (Bush campaign) must be getting desperate.

Either that, or there is some very concerned citizens, who are scared to back up their words.

Here's the registration info on the two domains you have linked to in the past week:

www.scaryjohnkerrry.com (http://www.scaryjohnkerrry.com/)

Registrant:
Domains by Proxy, Inc.

15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: SCARYJOHNKERRY.COM
Created on: 26-Mar-04
Expires on: 26-Mar-05
Last Updated on: 25-May-04

Administrative Contact:
Private, Registration SCARYJOHNKERRY.COM@domainsbyproxy.com
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599
Technical Contact:
Private, Registration SCARYJOHNKERRY.COM@domainsbyproxy.com
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599

Domain servers in listed order:
NS3.POWWEB.COM
NS2.POWWEB.COM


And the other: www.wintersoldier.com (http://www.wintersoldier.com/)

Registrant:
Domains by Proxy, Inc.

15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: WINTERSOLDIER.COM
Created on: 12-Feb-04
Expires on: 12-Feb-06
Last Updated on: 12-Feb-04

Administrative Contact:
Private, Registration WINTERSOLDIER.COM@domainsbyproxy.com
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599
Technical Contact:
Private, Registration WINTERSOLDIER.COM@domainsbyproxy.com
Domains by Proxy, Inc.
15111 N Hayden Rd., Suite 160
PMB353
Scottsdale, Arizona 85260
United States
(480) 624-2599

Domain servers in listed order:
PARK15.SECURESERVER.NET
PARK16.SECURESERVER.NET

Here's some info on the DomainsbyProxy.com:
http://domainsbyproxy.com/getDBP.aspx?

- Your domain is registered in the name of Domains By Proxy -- so our contact information is made public -- not yours.

- You retain the FULL BENEFITS of domain registration. You can: cancel, sell, renew or transfer your domain; set-up the name servers for, and resolve disputes involving, your domain.

- We create a private email address for your domain.You tell us to forward, not forward, or filter messages for spam before forwarding.

- We protect your identity and only reveal it in special situations.

Tell you what, THIS is a real, concerned citizen, not a campaign-backed slander site:
http://www.impeach-bush-now.org/

Here's their registration info:

Registrant:
Steven Hawley
PO Box 1991
Issaquah, Washington 98027
United States

Registered through: GoDaddy.com (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: IMPEACH-BUSH-NOW.COM
Created on: 18-Mar-03
Expires on: 18-Mar-05
Last Updated on: 22-Apr-04

Administrative Contact:
Hawley, Steven info@tvstrategies.com
PO Box 1991
Issaquah, Washington 98027
United States
(425) 391-2723 Fax -- (208) 248-4026
Technical Contact:
Hawley, Steven info@tvstrategies.com
PO Box 1991
Issaquah, Washington 98027
United States
(425) 391-2723 Fax -- (208) 248-4026

Domain servers in listed order:
WSC1.JOMAX.NET
WSC2.JOMAX.NET


How do I know all this? Well, for one, my brother-in-law works for the Republican Campaign fundraising effort here in AZ (told you my family is conservative). Their single office alone accumulates about 80,000-dollars on the average daily.

Oh wait, that was the registration info for impeach-bush-now.com I gave.

Here's the info on the .org site:

Domain ID: D91395896-LROR
Domain Name:IMPEACH-BUSH-NOW.ORG
Created On:21-Oct-2002 02:02:56 UTC
Last Updated On:14-Dec-2003 13:08:51 UTC
Expiration Date:21-Oct-2004 02:02:56 UTC
Sponsoring Registrar:R34-LROR
Status:OK
Registrant ID: DOTR-00569528
Registrant Name:Zachary Cravens
Registrant Organization:National Campaign to Impeach Bush et al.
Registrant Street1:506 South Fourth Street
Registrant Street2:Apt. #101
Registrant City:Champaign
Registrant State/Province:IL
Registrant Postal Code:61820
Registrant Country:US
Registrant Phone:+1.2173441020
Registrant Email:zcravens@uiuc.edu
Admin ID: DOTC-02022630
Admin Name:Elisabeth Rickman
Admin Organization:National Campaign to Impeach Bush et al.
Admin Street1:3015 Grove Street
Admin Street2:Apt. #2
Admin City: Denver
Admin State/Province:CO
Admin Postal Code:80211
Admin Country:US
Admin Phone:+1.3034551757
Admin Email:ehrickman@yahoo.com
Tech ID: DOTC-02022631
Tech Name:Elisabeth Rickman
Tech Organization:National Campaign to Impeach Bush et al.
Tech Street1:3015 Grove Street
Tech Street2:Apt. #2
Tech City: Denver
Tech State/Province:CO
Tech Postal Code:80211
Tech Country:US
Tech Phone:+1.3034551757
Tech Email:ehrickman@yahoo.com
Name Server:NS1.DNSWIZARDS.COM
Name Server:NS2.DNSWIZARDS.COM

Do you have any more credible links to this,or are we just expected to believe some wacko with a website?Any damn fool can post claims on the net,show us some credible sources and I'll take it seriously.

so what if the communists endorse him. whuptie shit.

all i have to say is when Kerry said "there are several world leaders who want me to win" all the conservatives said "who cares what te rest of the world thinks, this is an american election"

so really, who cares what the rest of the world thinks...this is an american election

not to mention, american has to get over this irrational fear of communism anyway

In an exclusive interview yesterday with NBC's Tim Russert, Saddam Hussein claimed that he would have "no problem" with a Democratic ticket that included John Kerry as president and Ted Kennedy as vice president. The reason, he said, is that "they're anti-war, pro-economic growth, pro-choice-and they've both killed people and left them for , which in my opinion is the best gauge of leadership skills."

Saddam Hussein explained in the interview that "although Kerry is stale and hackneyed, he has the best chance of beating Bush, given the leftward slant of the other contenders and the current American mood. Also, I have to assume that, as a Vietnam vet, he killed a bunch of and left at least a few of them for . Those aint Saddam Hussein numbers, but it's a start."

As for the surprising choice of Ted Kennedy as a VP, Saddam became even more animated. "Well, lets face it, the Kennedys are American royalty," he said, "not only would Kennedy secure the liberal base and bring out the blue-blood vote, his name evokes great American memories, and he may also help to increase African American participation in the election."

This lead to an interesting exchange between Russert and Hussein.

Russert: But what about Chappaquiddick?

Hussein: You're acting like that's a negative. Not only did Ted kill some chick during a drunken bender, he left her for , never apologized, and used his connections to get out of trouble. Even as a ruthless dictator, even I have to say that's some bad-ass ****. And then there's the women, and the drinking, and the . . .

Russert: Wait. Are you saying that having killed people is a good quality for a president?

Hussein: Yes, of course. I mean, what else is there really?

Russert: So Kerry's probably a shoe in, right? But I'm curious about . .

Hussein: Well not exactly, I mean Kerry probably killed people, but it was a war so the cold-blooded-ness is at a different level. I mean lets face it: there's a difference between leaving some chick for after DUI accident, and mowing down Charlie while he's shooting at you. But even given that, I have to assume that . . .

Russert: . . . but what about Sharpton? What about Sharpton? Do you want him to be president? He had a least one person killed, a Hasidic Jew no less-and haven't you heard of Freddy's Fashion Mart? His actions lead to the of seven people there. Certainly that must resonate with you . . . [cross talk]

Hussein: . . . aha! Here's where you think "ruthless" dictator means "idiotic" dictator! Sharpton is completely unelectable. He hasn't even allied with the wider left-even Jesse Jackson did that in '84. But that notwithstanding, I have to admire the way he whips up a mob, has people killed, and is still treated as a viable Democratic candidate by the media . . .

Russert: Not only that, he fraudulently destroyed the lives of at least two other people---policemen no less. That must count for something in the dictator's political handbook, right? You're being hypocritical . . .

[cross talk]

Hussein: Ok, I see your point. The dictator in me says that Sharpton is the man, but the politician in me knows that he stands no chance of being elected. America is a racist: it would never elect a black er over a white one. So no, I cannot endorse Sharpton for President, although I definitely give him "props."

Russert: What about recent drop-out Clark? He is a four-star general who fought in Vietnam.

Hussein: Yeah, I know, but he's really weird.

Russert: Indeed.

Although Saddam admitted that either Dean or Kucinich presidency would be "personally advantageous" for him, he said that he "just couldn't bring himself to endorse them," adding that "they're probably even vegetarians."

Pollster John Zogby believes that there is actually a good chance that Kerry might select Kennedy as his running mate. "According to our numbers, Kerry is not polling well with bubble-headed lushes, ugly womanizers, or fatuous windbags; the selection of Kennedy might turn those numbers around."

John Kerry's office did not return phone calls when asked for comment.

Do you have any more credible links to this,or are we just expected to believe some wacko with a website?Any damn fool can post claims on the net,show us some credible sources and I'll take it seriously.

The same type of sites are often cited to critisize Bush, so they are all taken for what they are - comedic value.













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I think that the biggest issue here is not what Communism really is or what the technicalities are, but the effect that this will have on a vast majority of 'dumb americans'. The biggest problem here will be, that (insert large number here)% of americans will see "Kerry honored by Communist" and will immediatly jump to, Therefore, Kerry = bad. Im not saying anything one way or another on the issue here (I'm quite the republican), but Im just saying that it doesnt matter so much what the technicalities are, I'm just suprised that Kerry and Communism in the same sentence was made so public

The same type of sites are often cited to critisize Bush, so they are all taken for what they are - comedic value.

This is why I was pointing out the glaring differences between the anti-Kerry/anti-Bush sites above. The two anti-Kerry sites (and more, in fact, I've discovered), are all anonymous, unbacked sites, while the anti-Bush site has the actual contact number of the private individual who started it.

Now which one lends more credibility to itself?

Speaking of which, it's interesting that the proxy that was used to create all the Kerry-slander sites is domainsbyproxy.com here, in AZ - home of one of the Bush campaign's biggest fundraising companies - to the tune of 80K a day.

Oh, did I mention that all the slander sites were created within this past year - with www.scaryjohnkerry.com (http://www.scaryjohnkerry.com) being the latest, at March 26th? How far past the election do you think the website gets updates?

Although the www.impeach-bush-now.com (http://www.impeach-bush-now.com) entity is admittedly new, www.impeach-bush-now.org (http://www.impeach-bush-now.org) has been around since 2002.

You're just splitting hairs. The fact is the anti-whoever people are of the same mold.

Of course the anti-Kerry sites are new. He's jumped to the national scene just recently. How many anti-Bush sites were there prior to 2000? Few and far between.

None of the sites have any credibility. The only reason people give them any is because the sites are saying what the reader wants to hear. :disappoin













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And what's credible to you? Whitehouse.org? :disappoin

And what's credible to you? Whitehouse.org? :disappoin

Yeah - thats what I think :rolleyes: Good grief, its become more clear that you are so blinded by your hatred for Bush, that you are losing all semblance of your claimed impartiality.













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It's all just "spin". :)

Wednesday, June 2, 2004 4:03 p.m. EDT
Sampley: Kerry 'Bird' Shot May Have Been Captured on Film

Former Green Beret Ted Sampley, who confronted Sen. John Kerry at Washington, D.C.'s Vietnam Veterans Memorial Wall on Monday, said today that photographers were in the vicinity and may have captured Kerry "flipping the bird" to him.

"There were some cameras," Sampley told WTN-Nashville radio host Steve Gill. "A reporter came up to me and asked me my name."

"I assume it was a reporter. It may have been somebody from the Kerry campaign," added Sampley, who heads up the group Vietnam Veterans Against John Kerry.

As reported Monday by NewsMax.com's John LeBoutillier, the veterans advocate approached the top Democrat that morning and told him, "I am here to escort you away from the Wall because you do not belong here."

When Kerry turned away and began to talk to a group of schoolchildren, Sampley opened his jacket to uncover a T-shirt reading "Hanoi John."

"Kerry does not belong at the Wall because he betrayed the brave soldiers who fought in Vietnam," Sampley told the children.

At that point the presidential candidate allegedly flashed "the bird" at the ex-Green Beret.

Though Kerry's visit to the Wall was widely covered, Sampley said that he didn't think the insulting hand gesture was captured by any of the TV news crews on hand. "I did not see any big television cameras," he told Gill.

NewsMax.com has been unable to determine whether the still photographers nearby were press, private citizens or part of the top Democrat's publicity team. So far, no photograph of the incident has surfaced.

Sampley said the confrontation was inadvertent, explaining that he was there with the veterans motorcycle group, Rolling Thunder, when "someone called to me and told me, 'Kerry's over at the Wall.'"

"Our organization [VVAK], we're advocating that any veteran who encounters Kerry anywhere should challenge him," he told Gill. "Since I'm leading the organization, I had to lead by example."

Sampley said that Kerry initially managed to keep his cool during the confrontation, but blew a gasket after a crowd started to gather.

"He looked around and some more vets were starting to show up," Sampley told Gill. "They heard the commotion. A few more started to heckle him a bit."

As Kerry turned to leave, said Sampley, "he walked by me - he was about 40-50 feet from the kids and maybe 15-20 feet from me - he turned around and after all that coolness and calmness, I guess he just couldn't hold it in anymore."

After flipping the bird Kerry ended the confrontation with a terse "See ya, Ted" - to which Sampley replied, "See ya, John."

Kerry is a dingbat. As president he would rank just below Carter. People will go bankrupt. Homelessness will skyrocket. The UN will be encouraged to continue to pass resolutions and debate while hudreds of thousands die. But at least the international conservatives out there (thge see nothing and do nothing people) will be happy. And thats whats important. Keep the whiners happy.













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Kerry is a dingbat.
Compared to whom? Bush? http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/images/smilies/screwy.gif

Compared to whom? Bush? http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/images/smilies/screwy.gif

By any definition of the word :rolleyes:

You seem to have Bush on the brain. :screwy:













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you are losing all semblance of your claimed impartiality.

LOL

When did I ever say I was impartial?

I'm ALWAYS partial, never to the politicians, but always for my country. Not that it gives me any more rights than the average citizen, but I was willing to die in uniform for this country a few years ago, and I'll die for her now, as a civilian.

You guys bitch and moan about the fact that Kerry left Vietnam early, or that he spoke up against the war, when he did leave. Well, tell you what, in that context, I'll have more respect ANYDAY, for the man who was actually in harm's way, regardless of his motivations (political), than for a man who was in unit that was nicknamed the "Champagne Squadron", regardless of whether he went AWOL or not.

You can just imagine how I feel for Senator John McCain, who was an actual POW.

Bush's campaign decided to smear the living piss out of this man in the 2000 Republican Nomination campaigns.

You can imagine how I felt then, and how I feel now, when I see Bush's campaign using the same tactics, and even the same man (Ted Sampley), to smear Kerry, regardless of how I feel about his politics.

If you support McCain endlessly like you do, you sir, are no conservative.

By any definition of the word :rolleyes:

EXACTLY!! Kerry is more crooked, devious and deceptive than even the slime that preceded GWB. The only thing that he is cleaner than Clinton on is that he doesn't have the womanizing stigma attached to his name......yet.
As president he would rank just below Carter.
THAT is pretty low! As a president the only good thing about Carter was that he was an honorable kind and truly nice man. He was a man of integrity....but an idiot that was not too savy on things outside peanut and worm farms.

In the Vietnamese Communist War Remnants Museum (formerly known as the "War Crimes Museum") in Ho Chi Minh City (Saigon), a photograph of John Kerry hangs in a room dedicated to the anti-war activists who helped the Vietnamese Communists win the Vietnam War. The photograph shows Senator Kerry being greeted by the General Secretary of the Communist Party of Vietnam, Comrade Do Muoi.
We could be really proud to have this man in the Whitehouse.

BTW
Kerry was running this pic in his ads and got caught--The faces and bodies were of course in there when he ran it and stated that all these vets supported him. I guess he thought no one would notice it in Iowa or North dakota but they did


-----------------------------------------
The Associated Press reports that Sen. John Kerry has recruited a large numbers of service men that want him to be their Commander-in-Chief.

"You'd be amazed at the number of active duty personnel who are coming up at events around the country, greeting me in rope-lines or coming to rallies and telling me how important it is for us to stand up and fight for those who are not able to speak out for themselves right now for obvious reasons," John Kerry said.

It seems that part of the myth of Kerry’s veteran support stems from his service in Vietnam on a swift boat. He frequently has one or two of his service buddies or the person he pulled from the river to exemplify his heroic Vietnam service.

Unfortunately for Kerry, most of the individuals he shows in his band of brothers picture from his swift boat days say that "Kerry is unfit to be commander-in-Chief.” In fact, only two of the 19 pictured with Kerry say that they want Kerry elected President. On the other hand, 11 say that Kerry is unfit and they are now suing Kerry to make him stop using the photo fraudulently indicating they support him.


Pitiful!
http://www.pondmountain.com/k_boat.jpg

You claim to be republican, yet you take what COMMUNISTS say as gospel, and even promote it yourself? I for one would not be surprised if you had a red flag in your basement. :)

You claim to be republican, yet you take what COMMUNISTS say as gospel, and even promote it yourself? I for one would not be surprised if you had a red flag in your basement. :)
What the hell are you talking about?? Since when is the Associated Press Communist?

That picture is not sourced from the Associated Press, and I suspect that the article isn't either.

the picture is lifted from a tiny little message board, http://www.pondmountain.com

Currently Active Users: 2
There are currently 1 members and 1 guests on the boards. | Most users ever online was 38 on 02-18-2004 at 08:20 PM Wednesday.

Reading the story carefully, there is a section attributed to AP...

The Associated Press reports that Sen. John Kerry has recruited a large numbers of service men that want him to be their Commander-in-Chief.

"You'd be amazed at the number of active duty personnel who are coming up at events around the country, greeting me in rope-lines or coming to rallies and telling me how important it is for us to stand up and fight for those who are not able to speak out for themselves right now for obvious reasons," John Kerry said.

The rest of the article is not.

Do you have an Associated Press link for us,GH,or is this just a crappy smear tactic from some anonymous little Republican hatemonger?

While I could not find the specific article from the AP, I DID find a miriad of great links to similar articles equally flattering to the scumbag.

I don't really have time to research more now. I actually have a life outside this forum.

....but here is some good reading for you.
http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewSpecialReports.asp?Page=\SpecialReports\archiv e\200405\SPE20040504b.html
http://www.disinfopedia.org/wiki.phtml?title=Swift_Boat_Veterans_for_Truth
http://frontierwebdesign.com/stopjohn/archives/000208.htm
http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2004/5/17/135458.shtml
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/belliveau200401220912.asp
Vietnam vets slam Kerry

By RICHARD TOMKINS, UPI White House Correspondent

WASHINGTON, May 4 (UPI) -- Sen. John Kerry's accounts of his service in Vietnam and his statements that he witnessed atrocities were attacked as fabrications and political opportunism Tuesday by a group of Vietnam veterans who served with him personally or in the units affiliated with him during his short tour of duty in Southeast Asia.

The veterans, including some of Kerry's former commanders and shipmates, have formed an organization called "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth" and called on the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee to authorize release of all his service records, including medical records.

"We feel it is very, very import that the American people get the actual truth about that three or four months Kerry served in Vietnam since he has made it a center piece of his biography," said John O'Neill, who took charge of Kerry's boat and crew after Kerry left Vietnam. "Second, we resent very deeply the false war crimes charges he made coming back from Vietnam. ... We think that those have cast aspersion on those living and dead.

"We think he knew he was lying when he made them. We think they are unsupportable. We intend to bring the truth about that to the American people. Third, we believe that based on our experience with him, he is totally unfit to be commander in chief."

Kerry, who commanded a river patrol boat, served about 4 months of a one-year tour of duty in Vietnam and won the Silver Star and Bronze Star. He requested and received reassignment to the United States after receiving three Purple Hearts for combat wounds, allowed under Navy regulations. The circumstances and merit of one of those awards has come into question in the campaign against President George W. Bush, leading to acrimonious mudslinging and a resurrection of the turmoil the conflict inflicted on American society.

Following his return and then discharge from the Navy, Kerry became a prominent anti-war activist and testified before Congress that he had witnessed U.S. forces committing atrocities and war crimes.

"I do not believe John Kerry is fit to be commander in chief of the U.S. armed forces," said retired Rear Adm. Roy Hoffmann, chairman of the organization. "This is not a political issue. It is a matter of honesty."

Hoffman said Kerry had recently telephoned him and spent 45 minutes attempting to convince Hoffman of not proceeding with the formation of the organization, which Democrats Tuesday attacked as a shill for Bush.

Hoffmann, who debated Kerry on television in 1971 over Vietnam allegations, denied any ties to Bush or the Republican Party. The Swift boat veterans held differing political and social views, he said. "There is only one issue we all agree on, and that is the issue of John Kerry."

In a letter to Kerry signed by more than 200 Swift boats veterans, they wrote, "It is our collective judgment that, upon your return from Vietnam, you grossly and knowingly distorted the conduct of the American soldiers, Marines, sailors and airmen of that war (including a betrayal of many of us, without regard for the danger your actions caused us).

"Further, we believe that you have withheld and/or distorted material facts as to your own conduct in this war.

"We believe you continue this conduct today, albeit by changing from an anti-war to a 'war hero' status," the letter said.

The veterans Tuesday were vociferous in denying they had seen or had participated in wartime atrocities and questioned that if Kerry had indeed observed any, why he didn't report it as he was required to do.

One veteran, noting the allegations were again made in a book on Kerry's war experiences, choked back tears as he related how his wife and daughter had read about the alleged war crimes Kerry spoke about in Douglas Brinkley's "Tour of Duty: John Kerry and the Vietnam War" and asked him if he had committed them.

Spokesmen for the Kerry campaign were not immediately available for comment Tuesday, but the Democratic National Committee put out a statement attacking the public relations company used by the group as having Republic Party connections. The veterans made no comment on the allegations.

Kerry has admitted a poor choice of words in his testimony before Congress in 1971 but says he served with honor in the war.

--

(Please send comments to nationaldesk@upi.com.)

Copyright 2004 by United Press International.
All rights reserved.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/04/22/politics/main613190.shtml
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=38948
http://www.mediainfo.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000526984
http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewSpecialReports.asp?Page=%5CSpecialReports%5Car chive%5C200406%5CSPE20040604a.html

http://www.military.com/NewContent/0,13190,Sandusky_Interview,00.html

http://www.thesunlink.com/shns/story.cfm?pk=CAMPAIGN-VETS-05-31-04&cat=PP

Bush and Kerry fight for support from veterans

By JAMES O'TOOLE
Pittsburgh Post-Gazette
May 31, 2004

- For a campaign manager, it was like winning the lottery.
In late January, Jim Rassman, a Republican and a retired police officer, called the office of Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry to see if there was anything he could do to help. Thirty-five years earlier, Kerry had won a Bronze Star for helping to pluck a wounded Rassman from the Bay Hap River while under Viet Cong fire.

Rassman and the Massachusetts senator met at an emotional reunion in Des Moines on the final weekend before the Iowa caucuses. The dramatic moment added to the last-minute momentum that brought Kerry a come-from-behind victory in Iowa and set him on the path toward his party's nomination for president.

The Rassman-Kerry reunion also signaled the determination of both Kerry and President Bush to compete for the votes of veterans, a constituency traditionally considered more Republican than Democratic.
The battle for veterans' hearts and minds is likely to be crucial given this year's closely divided electorate. But it also serves as a metaphor for the larger national security issues paramount in the minds of all voters in a time of war and terrorism.

Both campaigns have organized extensive grass-roots networks aimed at veterans.

Bush, whose role as commander-in-chief was on display last week as he spoke about Iraq at the U.S. Army War College in Carlisle, will continue to talk about the contributions of veterans as he travels to Europe this week to commemorate the 60th anniversary of D-Day.

Kerry chose the period between Memorial Day and D-Day for a series of speeches and events focusing on national security issues.

Veterans make up nearly 13 percent of the voting age population, and scholars who have studied their voting behavior say that while they often favor Republicans, they are anything but monolithic when it comes to politics.

Professor LarrySabato, director of the Center for Politics at the University of Virginia, has written on veterans preferences in presidential elections. The sometimes "squishy" data available, he said, suggest that majorities of veterans voted for Republican candidates in most of the presidential elections of the last few decades, including President Bush in 2000. He noted exceptions, however, such as in 1964 when veterans acted much as the rest of the electorate in providing a Democratic landslide for Lyndon Johnson.

"I think it is fair to suggest that veterans tend to be a bit more Republican," Sabato said, "but contrary to popular belief, they are not overwhelmingly Republican."

A recent Gallup poll supports that observation.
The national survey, conducted May 7-9, found that veterans were more inclined than all registered voters to support Bush, but only by a narrow margin. Kerry led Bush 50 percent to 46 percent among all registered voters, while a sub-sample of veterans favored the president 51 percent to 46 percent.

The margin of error of plus or minus 4 percentage points for subgroups is substantially larger than the poll's overall margin , so the survey suggests the preferences of veterans differ little, if at all, from those of voters at large.

"I would argue that veterans are more generational than partisan," Sabato said in an e-mail exchange.

While veterans account for 12.7 percent of the voting age population, they make up slightly larger shares of potential voters in several key battleground states, including Pennsylvania, Ohio, West Virginia, Florida, Missouri and Wisconsin. Three of the 10 cities with the largest proportions of veterans are in Florida, which is both a retiree haven and an address of convenience for many members of the armed forces because it has no income tax.

For veterans, as for the general population, the chief national-security argument made by Bush and Kerry for their candidacies is that they would be the better commander-in-chief at a time of international peril.
"These are the band of brothers I relied on 35 years ago," Kerry told students at the University of South Carolina in the days before that state's primary. "We are a little older, a little grayer, but we still know how to fight for our country."

Appearing with Kerry, as on many subsequent stops, was former Georgia Sen. Max Cleland, who contrasted Kerry's Vietnam service with Bush's stateside tour in the National Guard. As in past elections, Bush has had to fend off questions about whether he performed all of his required service during his Guard years.

Bush allies have sought to put Kerry on the defensive on Vietnam-era issues, as well. While fellow swift boat veterans have spoken of Kerry's valor, other swift boat vets have organized to protest his subsequent anti-war activities.

Earlier this month, a group of Vietnam veterans held a news conference to assail Kerry's fitness to be commander-in-chief. Kerry aides dismissed the group as a concoction of the Bush campaign, a charge that its members denied, insisting that their actions were totally independent.

James O'Toole can be reached at jotoole(at)post-gazette.com

Out of all these "mates" only 2 are willing to support Kerry.
http://ice.he.net/~freepnet/kerry/graphics/20_Vets.jpg

Out of all these "mates" only 2 are willing to support Kerry.
http://ice.he.net/~freepnet/kerry/graphics/20_Vets.jpg
While that may be true, get this in your head: They are ALL (with the exception of Kerry, of course) pawns of a political game. As am I, being a veteran myself.

As of now, the bigger, and hence more devious, player has been Bush and his Campaign, with these renewed smear tactics I despise. Deny it all you want, but that last statement, though you might want to think is mere opinion, is fact - and YOU sir, are helping that machine right along, and is therefore, ALSO subject to my own personal despise.

Bush isn't smearing ANYONE!! It is HE who is generally the target of smears. I am merely pointing out items of note to the ignoarnt and ill informed here in this forum. ...and YOU sir, are one of those ignorant and illinformed, and are therefore, ALSO subject to my own personal despise.

While I could not find the specific article from the AP,

That'ds as close as we are ever going to get to an apology for misrepresentation,I think.

And I'm flattered that you choose to quote me inyour sig,Gladhatter,but I'd appreciate it far more if you actually read and absorbed the post that you have quoted. :smile:

Bush isn't smearing ANYONE!! [/


He doesn't need to.He has a few loyal supporters to do it for him.Normally,his supporters would 'talk up' the President's great achievements in his first term,but clearly,they can't think of any,and would rather talk down the record of a man who served his country honorably instead of going AWOL.

Please,Mr Bush...Go AWOL again any time you like just now,the world would not miss you. :disappoin

And I'm flattered that you choose to quote me inyour sig,Gladhatter,but I'd appreciate it far more if you actually read and absorbed the post that you have quoted. :smile:
I wasn't aiming to flatter...just hoping you would read and understand what YOU have written.

....,and would rather talk down the record of a man who served his country honorably instead of going AWOL.
Kerry DID NOT serve his country honorably. Believe what you want...(you aren't American anyway I don't even know why you care or post in this forum anyway for that matter) The man has clearly been shown to be a communist simpathizer who aided the enemy and has no business even running for president much less even thinking for a minute he has a chance.

Kyou aren't American anyway I don't even know why you care or post in this forum anyway for that matter)

If you choose to install a complete asshole with the IQ of a hamster for a president,by using a court order to rip off the legal vote in Florida,that's your business.But if that asshole then turns round and tries to start the third world war in the middle east based on lies about WMD's,and utter bullshit about 'war on terrorism',and tries to threaten and bribe the trest of the world into joining in his shoddy little land grab,it becomes of interest to the rest of us.If Bush were just bad for America,I'd say fine...let the fools who put him in suffer the consequences. However Bush is just about as bad for world peace as a man could get without wearing a swastika.And like it or not,if your clown wants to divert attention away from his piss poor performance by shooting up other peoples' countries,bombing children and civilians,and installing puppet governments for financial gain,then the rest of the world will tell you just what an atrocious little shit the sonofabitch is.

But if that asshole then turns round and tries to start the third world war in the middle east based on lies about WMD's,and utter bullshit about 'war on terrorism',and tries to threaten and bribe the trest of the world into joining in his shoddy little land grab,it becomes of interest to the rest of us.
I think you are safe. He is only a threat to countries that are a threat to the United States and the security of our lands. He doesn't plan on attacking anything in Italy.

Italy? Where is the relevance of Italy.

And yet more Republican nonsense.Iraq is not and never has been a threat to the United States.Bush just had a score to settle for his Dad,and a shitload of oil to grab.

Italy? Where is the relevance of Italy..
Shoot I don't know I thought you were located in Italy somewhere...my mistake.

And yet more Republican nonsense.Iraq is not and never has been a threat to the United States.Bush just had a score to settle for his Dad,and a shitload of oil to grab.
The liberals have been climbing all over Bush for not taking any pre-emptive actions against AlQuaida. Wh would have thought for a moment that Afghanistan would ever be a threat to the US? Iraq has NEVER complied with the UN's resolutions regarding WMD. Theyhad them in 1991 and everyone knew it. They NEVER showed any evidense that they had destroyed them. The continually thumbed their noses at the world and you and those who are thinking along the same lines as you would be perfectly content to sit back and allow THEM to pull off actions comparable to 9/11 and then you'ld be all over Bush again for not taking actions PRIOR to them.

If you choose to install a complete asshole with the IQ of a hamster for a president,by using a court order to rip off the legal vote in Florida,that's your business.

:rolleyes: After four years, you'd think there would be one recount that actually gave Gore more votes, but nobody has found one. Yet this crap still comes around. As for choosing an asshole "blah blah blah", I'm sure someone will vote for Kerry.

But if that asshole then turns round and tries to start the third world war in the middle east based on lies about WMD's,and utter bullshit about 'war on terrorism',and tries to threaten and bribe the trest of the world into joining in his shoddy little land grab,it becomes of interest to the rest of us.

Interesting take - totally wrong, but interesting. I remember when you predicted the end of the world after our last presidential election. The cry of the chicken littles has worn thin over the years.

If Bush were just bad for America,I'd say fine...let the fools who put him in suffer the consequences. However Bush is just about as bad for world peace as a man could get without wearing a swastika.

I enjoy the consequences of having Bush in office. My portfolio has done nicely. Job prospects have been fantastic. My friends and family are doing quite well. As with most politicians, they just need to let the communities and businesses do what they do best and, for the most part, everyone is better off for it.

Bad for world peace? How many wars were being faught in the world before he took office and now? My bet is that you have no idea. Iraq is the only thing on the brain of some people. Indonesia, Ivory Coast, Chechnya, Israel, India, Nepal, Philippines, Columbia, Algeria, Burundi, Uganda, Sudan - perhaps those are slipping some peoples minds? Or are they of no consequence because they don't involve US troops directly?


And like it or not,if your clown wants to divert attention away from his piss poor performance by shooting up other peoples' countries,bombing children and civilians,and installing puppet governments for financial gain,then the rest of the world will tell you just what an atrocious little shit the sonofabitch is.

:rolleyes: This is fun.

Bush has been a great president. The creative use of synonyms by people who cannot see past their own narrow views and bigoted opinions does nothing to change that fact. The rest of the world typically depends on the UN to install puppet governments and cannot fathom that anyone else would actually let the people hold an election.



Its actually quite entertaining to listen/read people get more and more torqued out of shape with every success and advancement Bush has. Because they cannot stomach good news, they get louder and more childlike with their attacts. If we followed the advice of some we would either be surrenduring to the first person who comes along or stick our head in the sand. Fortunately, most of the people crying the loudest have zero say in US policies. Sure we have our own dingbats voting for socialism and cradle to the grave idiocy but the international ones are the most entertaining to play with.













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Italy? Where is the relevance of Italy.

And yet more Republican nonsense.Iraq is not and never has been a threat to the United States.Bush just had a score to settle for his Dad,and a shitload of oil to grab.
HAHA!! You are so damn blinded by your hate for W. you can't even see through anything you say. ITs just as easy to call you conspiracy-theory bullshit as it is to call Bush's accusations. I believe your theories are bullshit. No proof of him lying, one dictator out of office, and a check-mark for the "infidel" in the war on terror: I'll take it.

No proof of him lying, one dictator out of office, and a check-mark for the "infidel" in the war on terror: I'll take it.

If we're taking 'no proof' as an acceptable standard, theres 'no proof' on the WMD,so they never existed,right?

one dictator out of office........and replaced with anarchy,factional fighting and terror attacks against those who would aid the occupying forces...........

A check-mark for the 'infidel'? More like,thousands of distressed and angry families,waiting for the opportunity to get revenge on the country that executed so many of its young men without any trials or reasoning.

You can take it,if you see it as a victory Pick.I 'd think more of you if you saw it for what it is,a crime against Iraq,and still took responsibility for it.

What the hell are you talking about?? Since when is the Associated Press Communist?

Uh, I believe that it was Vietnamese Communists, not the Associated Press who were claiming Mr. Kerry helped them during the Vietnam war. And I believe it was you who was believing this communist bunk. :loser:

i still dont see why his support of communism is a bad thing. or what he did a generation ago has to do with what he'll do now. look at his records as a senator recently. thats a more accurate portrayal of how he'll act as president (should he win), not what he did as a pissed off vet a long time ago.

just like i dont bag on bush's past (even though its easy) i prefer to concentrate on what he's done while in office as governer of texas and as president. which is pretty bad.

and yes, bush lied, and he had his administration lie. colin powell admitted as much. do you not keep up with the news?

and yes, saddam may not have provided evidence of his destruction of WMD, but the UN inspectors (that werent US spies) did...who are you going to believe anyway, a tyrant, or independant UN inspectors?

and no, the votes in florida did not win Bush the election. it was the 200,000 or so registered democrats that voted republican that won him the election.

i still dont see why his support of communism is a bad thing. or what he did a generation ago has to do with what he'll do now. look at his records as a senator recently. thats a more accurate portrayal of how he'll act as president (should he win), not what he did as a pissed off vet a long time ago.
#1 It has to do with integrity. Kerry is a PROVEN liar and THIS is just ONE of the lies he has been caught up in.
#2 Bush is NOT a liar. He is a man of integrity that has been besmerched beyond belief by the leftist sheep.
#3 Bush BEAT Algore and it is high time you got over that fact and moved on.

#2 Bush is NOT a liar. He is a man of integrity that has been besmerched beyond belief by the leftist sheep

Four words: Weapons Of Mass Destruction.

You're funny. :iceslolan

No,there's nothing funny about a blind man constantly tripping over his own tongue.

Again...Just because they have not yet been found doesn't mean they aren't/weren't there. Iraq is a pretty big place to be sniffing around for things like that. They aint gonna be found over night. They may NEVER be found. Still don't prove they weren't ever there. I think they are there....AND.... I think they smuggled a bunch out that we may yet experience. We should have gone in there years ago instead of pussy-footing around with the bastard so long.

GH...your President asserted that those weapons could be made ready for firing at less than an hour.Over a year has passed since Bush mistakenly claimed that the bulk of the fighting was over, and still no credible evidence of these stocks of weapons exist.So...365 days at 24 hour equals 8760 lost opportunities for any of the many freedom fighters fighting to disrupt the immoral occupation of their country to arm and fire these dreaded weapons....and still,nothing.The WMD have disappeared without a trace...it's like they were never there....

Could it perhaps be because they never were,or will you still be chanting your mantra in ten,twenty,thirty years?? The time for America to uncover and display these weapons with any credibility has passed.Even if they claim to have 'found' them some time in the future,the length of time that has elapsed since the war has tainted any credibility to the claim.It's time for the Bush camp to admit that in their haste to find an excuse to seize Iraq, they got it badly wrong.

They aint gonna be found over night. They may NEVER be found. Still don't prove they weren't ever there. I think they are there....AND.... I think they smuggled a bunch out that we may yet experience. We should have gone in there years ago instead of pussy-footing around with the bastard so long.
...

will you still be chanting your mantra in ten,twenty,thirty years?? :rolleyes:

I won't NEED to.

#1 It has to do with integrity. Kerry is a PROVEN liar and THIS is just ONE of the lies he has been caught up in.
#2 Bush is NOT a liar. He is a man of integrity that has been besmerched beyond belief by the leftist sheep.
#3 Bush BEAT Algore and it is high time you got over that fact and moved on.

wow, did we go off the deep end? i was merely attempting to point out how dredging up what happened a generation ago is usless in determining how someone will act in office. look to both mens service records as representatives to see their character, not what they did in an emotionally trying time 30 years ago.

and yes, bush beat al gore. 200,000 registered democrats voted republican in that election. why did you bring that up? i would have hated to see al gore win, almost as much as i hated seeing bush win (but then, being a texan, i knew exactly how bad he would fuck up). im not a gore supporter by any stretch of the imagination.

i could go on, as you are obviously oblivious to where i stand on this issue. but really, you will miss the point, as you happen to be so blinded by your undying support for the bush's that you will discount everything i say before you even consider it. its people like you that make me wish that we could sometimes suspend the right to vote.

i could go on, as you are obviously oblivious to where i stand on this issue. but really, you will miss the point, as you happen to be so blinded by your undying support for the bush's that you will discount everything i say before you even consider it. its people like you that make me wish that we could sometimes suspend the right to vote.
Hey!! Those are MY words!!! 'Cept take out "Bush" ...insert "Kerry.

but i wont be voting for kerry, i hardly think he will make a decent president....like i said, you have no idea where i stand on this issue.

its people like you that make me wish that we could sometimes suspend the right to vote.

So are you saying people who disagree with you shouldn't be allowed to vote? I think you reside in the wrong country!

So are you saying people who disagree with you shouldn't be allowed to vote? I think you reside in the wrong country!
GREAT POINT!!!! Are you related to Yogs?

So are you saying people who disagree with you shouldn't be allowed to vote? I think you reside in the wrong country!

no, im not. im saying people who refuse to educate themselves on things, who accept party lines on every topic, who are blindly loyal to one party to the point of utter stupidity so much to believe that the man in office has done nothing short of perfect. people who shamelessly cannonize a politician, even in the face of outstanding evidence that they are liars and crooks, who write off any evidence of their faults as the oppositions plot to brainwash america, and who cant be open minded enough to at least develope their convictions for themselves that shouldnt be allowed to vote.

im proud to know people like yourself and yogs are voting. educated people at the polls is what this country needs, but not political zealots willing to believe anything and everything their told, and worship their party at the alter of ubsurdity