How many of you build for the...

enjoyment of the hobby? If not, why? Why do so many people nitpick about the unimportant details of others' models yet some of their own models are moderately lacking in larger areas? I'm just wondering because there have been several awesome builds presented here at AF and without acknowledging the time and efforts people put into these things, others are so quick to tear them down to shreds. I don't have any specific people in mind but it happens on a far too regular basis. If a piece was put on a kit a certain way, perhaps the builder wanted it that way. this doesn't apply to all criticisms, as some are helpful and necessary but sometimes we can go overboard with the trivial things. I thought the hobby was mostly for fun. Just my :2cents: . Reply as you see fit. :)

just my :2cents: but unless your working for a auto maker
what diffrence will it make if you put toyota rims on a ford
truck as long as you like the way it look's

i might be new here but after taking the day off from
my job and messing with a few model's and reading some
of the post's here. toino you are totaly right in what your
saying. i mean if i had a digi cam and posted a pic of my
white raybrig nsx what would some of you say

criticisms weather you mean it in a jokeing way or not
can hurt people's feeling's. my idea's might not sound cool
to some but other's might like them a lot.

just think before you type is all

Wow i just build for myself. I don't care if people don't like what i build. I do.

Because its easier to criticize other people than yourself. Remember, I am better than you, mine is better than yours, I am perfect and your not, etc. I think it's in our nature to compete and critizing ourself will only hinder our ability to fully carry out our best. It's human nature.

Wow i just build for myself. I don't care if people don't like what i build. I do.

i agree, you shouldnt build to satisfy people, but to satisfy your self. i used to really be hard on my self when poeple didnt like my idea or inovation, i have learned who cares ignore those poeple, dont build for them. i like ot build for the fun, every car is diffrent and never know things that will happen

enjoyment of the hobby? If not, why? Why do so many people nitpick about the unimportant details of others' models yet some of their own models are moderately lacking in larger areas? I'm just wondering because there have been several awesome builds presented here at AF and without acknowledging the time and efforts people put into these things, others are so quick to tear them down to shreds. I don't have any specific people in mind but it happens on a far too regular basis. If a piece was put on a kit a certain way, perhaps the builder wanted it that way. this doesn't apply to all criticisms, as some are helpful and necessary but sometimes we can go overboard with the trivial things. I thought the hobby was mostly for fun. Just my :2cents: . Reply as you see fit. :)


^word thats all i get on my f250 is criticizm i'd appretiate it if some people (wont say who) would stop that

im totly with you tonio you said it best i build for me,not for everybody in the world if you like it cool if you dont thats cool too everybody is untiled to an opinion.

I am sorry I put the badges at a slightly different angles :( I appologize.. My Enzo is shamed :(


hehe

I am sorry I put the badges at a slightly different angles :( I appologize.. My Enzo is shamed :(


hehe

LOL, you need to hold your head down in shame and think about what you did. Next time you will think twice before posting that half-assed crap on here......j/k. Those badges could have been upsidedown and I still would love that build.:rofl:

I personally have made a very concious effort to be more positive when commenting on someone's models. I look at everyone's model as I do mine, it's my art, my hobby and i'm proud no matter how bad i f'd up the paint or whatever. I try not to post in a thread if i don't have anything nice to post, but If i like the model i will give my opinion on what I would personally change or fix if it's not too late.
One of the main problems I see around AF is that when people post their criticism about someone else's models they come across as If they think they know it all about this hobby and that they are the best. This is just a hobby, some people like my self build to pass the time. Or in my case, to keep myself out of trouble:nono:. I don't mind the criticism, I realize that people are entitled to their opinions and can say what they want as long as it dosen't violate the rules. I definately don't let the way people respond to my builds bother me, other wise I would probally cry myself to sleep at night b/c of the few posts mine get. :mad:

On a diffrent note, one thing that I can't seem to keep myself from doing is pointing out how pointless a thread is, or someone's response to a question asked. It seems like some people will post a response to a question that they know nothing about. when someone asks how to do someting that you have never done and you respond with a vague answer that the person probally knew anyway, then you have no need to post. People ask specific questions hoping for educated responses from someone who has been there and done that.
For instance (this is just an example off the top of my head), If someone who is new here asks how to fit a roll cage into a specific car to convert it to a rally car, they want an answer from someone who has previously done that or at least attempted and can advise of things to watch out for. Simply replying, use styreen rod, cut to shape and glue together does not do anyone any good. It makes me seem that post was ment to just ad 1 post to your count, and that you really don't know what your talking about. The # of posts you have dosen't mean you deserve to be listened too, people remember you especally if you never have anything helpful to say but seem to always say something. Just because someone starts a thread don't mean you have to post in it.

Sorry to go on so long, but you did say, "Reply as you see fit." :)
This is just my :2cents: .

I like building and painting, but i guess my real reason is for the photography.

:)

There are several sides of the coin here. Personally I feel that if you share your model with somebody you ask them to review it, point out some mistakes that you've made and perhaps give you advice on how to avoid these mistakes and make your next model a level better. I would value advice from people who have been in the hobby for decades, I know they started off somewhere and if they managed to get to the level I want to be close to, they must know something I need to know and if they decide to share that knowledge I'm right here waiting with my eyes and ears open accepting every bit of it.

If anything, I feel that perhaps we here are going overboard with "good job" comments, nothing wrong with positive encouragement, but at the same time if the modeller is told that perhaps a model that is not perfect in all respects actually is, what are the chances that he will not make the same mistakes on his/her next build and that the next model will be better than the previous one?

enjoyment of the hobby? If not, why? Why do so many people nitpick about the unimportant details of others' models yet some of their own models are moderately lacking in larger areas? I'm just wondering because there have been several awesome builds presented here at AF and without acknowledging the time and efforts people put into these things, others are so quick to tear them down to shreds. I don't have any specific people in mind but it happens on a far too regular basis. If a piece was put on a kit a certain way, perhaps the builder wanted it that way. this doesn't apply to all criticisms, as some are helpful and necessary but sometimes we can go overboard with the trivial things. I thought the hobby was mostly for fun. Just my :2cents: . Reply as you see fit. :)

perhaps you are talking about me pointing out (or in your view nitpicking") something about the SLK320's enzo.

again.. it is an awesome build and i acknowledge the time and effort he put in.

There are several sides of the coin here. Personally I feel that if you share your model with somebody you ask them to review it, point out some mistakes that you've made and perhaps give you advice on how to avoid these mistakes and make your next model a level better. I would value advice from people who have been in the hobby for decades, I know they started off somewhere and if they managed to get to the level I want to be close to, they must know something I need to know and if they decide to share that knowledge I'm right here waiting with my eyes and ears open accepting every bit of it.

If anything, I feel that perhaps we here are going overboard with "good job" comments, nothing wrong with positive encouragement, but at the same time if the modeller is told that perhaps a model that is not perfect in all respects actually is, what are the chances that he will not make the same mistakes on his/her next build and that the next model will be better than the previous one?

Very true, but the fact is that when you get a little too nitpicky, it can be annoying to the person who "left out a bolt on the chassis" or whatever. Sure, criticism is nice if someone gets an obvious thing wrong that they maybe didn't mean to, but that doesn't mean that everything that *looks* wrong IS wrong. It really depends on how you look at it. I whole-heartedly agree with Tonioseven on his stand point, and really see yours Ales. Interesting topic Tonio.

There are several sides of the coin here. Personally I feel that if you share your model with somebody you ask them to review it, point out some mistakes that you've made and perhaps give you advice on how to avoid these mistakes and make your next model a level better. I would value advice from people who have been in the hobby for decades, I know they started off somewhere and if they managed to get to the level I want to be close to, they must know something I need to know and if they decide to share that knowledge I'm right here waiting with my eyes and ears open accepting every bit of it.

If anything, I feel that perhaps we here are going overboard with "good job" comments, nothing wrong with positive encouragement, but at the same time if the modeller is told that perhaps a model that is not perfect in all respects actually is, what are the chances that he will not make the same mistakes on his/her next build and that the next model will be better than the previous one?

i totally agree. when i start my enzo and lotus (again) this summer, i really hope i dont get any of those 'man, thats cool' or 'nice and clean' comments if i do get something very wrong. Of course i dont mind getting those comments if i do actually do a good job :iceslolan . to be honest, im a perfectionist, so i would like anything pointed out that i've done wrong so i can avoid it next time.

i also agree, there are way too many over the top positive comments for cars that are not as good as they could be.

I build for the enjoyment of the hobby. It can be very relaxing and other times it can be very overwhelming. I see my skills getting better with ever different build and every new tip or trick that I try. I might not win any contests but if you look at it are you building for yourself? Are you having fun. Having fun is what it is about.

Charlie

Sometimes criticism (constructive) helps, hard to take in the first place but makes you create better work, Nitpicking is not criticism IMO.
Years ago I wrote a website about the band The Smashing Pumpkins, I spent weeks on it, then It got reviewed and was slagged off bad, I was so pissed off, so I sat down and re wrote it, the finished page won 2nd place in the UK Yell We Awards in 1997 only beat by a Spice Girls website. So that made me a better designer.
What I trying to say is don't take it too hard, use it to make you stronger and produce better work, but make sure you do as Antonio says "Build for yourself"

Ooooh, this is a sticky one! I agree that one should build for ones self and it is not nice to be overly critical. However, Alex makes some very good points. Are we not all striving to learn and improve as modellers? Is criticism not a tool to enable us to do so? I guess the key here is to offer criticism in a constructive manner.

To clarify I'm talking about criticism based on observable facts, not opinions. The former is valid, the latter personal and not necessarily transferable to anybody else. Posting “that sucks”, “retarded” (both seen on this forum in the last couple of days) or similar taunts are of no use whatsoever. Those who make such comments lack creativity and intelligence and are therefore unlikely to be able to build descent models themselves. Treat them with the scorn they deserve!

I always try to keep the level of the modeller in mind when making comments, nobody is going to turn out a perfect model first time every time. And no matter how shit hot a person thinks they are, remember there is always somebody out there who is better! There is no point hammering home some obscure detail if the guy is just happy to complete the basic fit and finish to personal best levels.

Those of us who build models of real cars have a completely different take on the hobby than the tuner/custom people. An error is usually due to something that was missed or new references that clarify a guess on some detail. Such things cannot be disputed and should be welcomed. Provided the critic isn’t a complete asshole about it. It is also hilarious to see comments like “don’t like the wheels” from people who don’t realise that the wheels aren’t an option because they are the type the real car wore!

In ywwong’s case he had a valid point to make, but probably could have presented the facts in a more sensitive manner. Difficult to do on an international forum such as this with so many different languages and customs represented. In fact slk320 was receptive to the criticism and explained his reasons. It was more a case of third parties who took umbrage.

So I consider constructive criticism to be a good thing, I've certainly benefited from it. So long as it is presented tactfully and with facts to back it up. If you can’t do that - why post?

Personnaly i post here not to show what i can make (not only :lol2: ), but more to share and learn techs from other modelers. I think everyone can learn something from everyone here. I spend more time reading and watching pictures than commenting just to know "how did he/she made that, how can i make it too ?".
But at the final result, we most build alone (apart those who are in a club), and the model will be displayed on our shelves, no?

Again, to clarify this matter, I welcome critisism, and several times through the build people pointed something out, I looked it up and posted pics of the real car and we discussed it. So I appreciate the guidence and critique, ESPECIALLY from people that have been doing this a lot longer then myslef and are on a much higher level of modeling.

So thank you!

I don't build for contests and outside of this forum I doubt very much that anyone will ever see it again, but I buil models for the challenge and to help me unwind a little.

...
What I trying to say is don't take it too hard, use it to make you stronger and produce better work, ...

Words of wisdom! I like it.

I would like to thank you all for the replies! I just wanted to get a perspective on how others view things sometimes. I may have taken approach to ywwong and I apologize for the way I said what I said but again I would like to thank you all for the well thought-out replies.:sunglasse Keep them coming!!!:)

There are several sides of the coin here. Personally I feel that if you share your model with somebody you ask them to review it, point out some mistakes that you've made and perhaps give you advice on how to avoid these mistakes and make your next model a level better. I would value advice from people who have been in the hobby for decades, I know they started off somewhere and if they managed to get to the level I want to be close to, they must know something I need to know and if they decide to share that knowledge I'm right here waiting with my eyes and ears open accepting every bit of it.

If anything, I feel that perhaps we here are going overboard with "good job" comments, nothing wrong with positive encouragement, but at the same time if the modeller is told that perhaps a model that is not perfect in all respects actually is, what are the chances that he will not make the same mistakes on his/her next build and that the next model will be better than the previous one?

I agree in that at times a few too many "good jobs" are given and praise is lavished a little too thickly, but you want to encourage fellow modelers and while sometimes its hard to find the correct line on the praise, its always hard to give constructive criticism to someone you only know as Ales (and not hurt their feelings)...;-)>

As to why I build models the answer is easy, I can't afford any of the real racecars in anything other than plastic or resin!

Bill

Everything that needs to be said has been said already, for the most part. I agree with RallyRaider and Ales the most, as I persoanally feel that critiques of buildups are necessary, and all too often a build that could be better gets "Great job!" stuck on the tail end of it. However, the key is to tell those who don't necessarily want to improve their skills and those who know how to do things but need practice apart from the folks that need guidance. There are also a lot of people that specifically ask for criticisms during and after their build, and these are my favorite threads because the builder is usually receptive, willing to try something new, and with the ability to take the criticism comes the ability to ignore the things you don't agree with. I certainly welcome any sort of criticism into my builds, For all I know I could be going about a step all wrong and no one ever told me... Or I could be making a car look ridiculous but be blinded by my own sometimes bad taste. So I need you guys to clue me in.

It seems to just boil down to, in my opinion, that some people want criticsim, some people do not. It's taken my all my time at AF to tell these people apart.

I dunno. no way to make a small post about this...

I build to quench an automotive craving I cannot satisfy in a garage. because I dont have a garage!! or money to do this in 1:1.

I come to this site to learn from the pro's and stay up to date on the area's of modeling I enjoy. like fr instance new stuff coming from the likes of Tamiya and fujimi, SAS.. I like learning tips and tricks from you guys... love the reviews of kits new and old. I like to make a contribution to the site also, once and a while I come up with something to offer.

I hear you tonio. I think that the major issue is positivity. when someone posts pics of a there model and its obvious there skills aren't especially great, no need to be negative. any helpful hint about a particular area is good, like "hey, try tamiya paints next time.. you should have even better results then you did with the testors sprays"

I think its nice to say, good job or compliment a build. if there is a particular area you like on a model you don't like. focus on the positive.

but for the most part, giving someone else a bit of confidence in what I would honestly consider a pretty difficult and sometimes tedious hobby is a good thing. the kind words some of you have said to me have helped me through bits of frusteration and modelers block. nothing is better then hearing someone who's modeling skills you look up to, tell you they think you did a good job and are liking your model.

I say it's a matter of do unto others as you'd expect done to you.

I admit, I'm no Augie Hiscano or Doug Whyte. I make mistakes, I don't lay down a picture perfect paint job every time, my bare metal foil tears occasionally or wrinkles, excrement occurs.

However, I also know that in order to continue improving as a builder, I have to correct these things. When I build, my interests lean towards building accurate or realistic representations of some of my favorite cars. If an engine is incorrect, I replace it. If a body is poorly shaped, I'll correct it (or simply avoid the incorrect kit). I've gone through three kits trying to find an accurate Studebaker V8 for my Avanti project. So now I'm going Pro Touring with the damn thing because I'm out of options.

Now, how's this all relate to what I say to other builders? Simple, I hope that when I've made a bad move in a build people will tell me. Personal opinion stuff like "I don't like the wheels" and "That color doesn't look right" don't matter to me because those were my choices. But things like "You wired that engine wrong" or "The roof doesn't line up right" are things I want to know. And I feel that when other people have problems like that, it's not only okay to inform them, but it's something we're supposed to do to help our fellow modelers.

But, then again, I'm a rivet counter. I bitched about the interior in Tamiya's S13 kit.

But, then again, I'm a rivet counter. I bitched about the interior in Tamiya's S13 kit

true.. quit your bitchin! ;) :D :p

i am a very depressed person and sometimes i find myself building a model just to here nice comments here on af to cheer me up, and its hard for me to take criticism sometimes, i read somthing bad about my model and go into a very deep depressed state of mind, and i know that this is a public forum and im not supposed to come here and expect to hear people tell me how perfect my model is but sometimes comments here can be very harsh. all i want to say is if your going to nitpick then please do it in a nice way. thank you for taking the time to read my post.



Robert.

Very interesting thread here mate.

I try and build what i want and not what others want or expect.

I haven't bothered to post here for months or show any more of my builds etc due to the comments i received via PM's and emails which really just pissed me off about the whole modelling hobby and the way some people act around here. All they want to do is pick holes in other peoples models because they cant build a good kit for themselfs.

Very interesting thread here mate.

I try and build what i want and not what others want or expect.

I haven't bothered to post here for months or show any more of my builds etc due to the comments i received via PM's and emails which really just pissed me off about the whole modelling hobby and the way some people act around here. All they want to do is pick holes in other peoples models because they cant build a good kit for themselfs.

A few of us were wondering what happened to you. Are you coming back now? Its good to see your still alive and well.

A few of us were wondering what happened to you. Are you coming back now? Its good to see your still alive and well.

No.
I just log in as a guest and read the modelling forum to see what's been going on and keep an eye on all the neat builds that people are doing.

No.
I just log in as a guest and read the modelling forum to see what's been going on and keep an eye on all the neat builds that people are doing.

Dammit that sucks. It hasnt been the same with out you man. I remember when I first came to this site with you here, it was a very enjoyable beginning.

Well its your decision anyway, glad to see you here sometimes.

I'm never posting a comment if I don't like the model. (It's not becose I don't post on your that it's not great, I miss so many great built here)

But, I try to be constructive with some ppl. Getting the good part and part that can improove.. Not many ppl do that ! I started to improove once few ppl gave me critical comment and suggestion, now I try to do so.

When I see kit that are a bit rushed and see 20 comment that say AWERSOME, Kick A$$ and Impressive, how can someone improve if he don't know how to do it. anyway just my :2cents:

I built for fun and for you guy !

I'm never posting a comment if I don't like the model. (It's not becose I don't post on your that it's not great, I miss so many great built here)

But, I try to be constructive with some ppl. Getting the good part and part that can improove.. Not many ppl do that ! I started to improove once few ppl gave me critical comment and suggestion, now I try to do so.

When I see kit that are a bit rushed and see 20 comment that say AWERSOME, Kick A$$ and Impressive, how can someone improve if he don't know how to do it. anyway just my :2cents:

I built for fun and for you guy !

:iagree: So many people freak out when you critique there model, they think its the best thing since crushed ice, when really it looks like crap.

If we cant tear each others builds apart, what are we going to post about?

No, seriously, I appreciate sincere criticism and/or tips on how to improve my work. This type of criticism motivates me to do better. Its the only reason I participate in this forum and go to contests. I dont even enter most of them, I just go to display my stuff and look at other people's stuff. If I see a model that has something done exceptionally well, I find the builder and ask him how he did it. I have been improving my building skills over the last ten years by doing this (also hanging with Veyron and Zoom Zoom MX-5). One thing I find annoying is false or petty compliments. I'd rather get a good criticism than this type of compliment.

The bottom line is build for you and try to make every model better than the last. If you feel compelled to comment on someone's model, just remember, criticism to put someone down is not what this forum is for. I'll get off my soapbox now.

i build for enjoyment =) and i build what i like not what others like.

and u will probably know by now that im into jap cars, and most likely only build jap cars =)

Very interesting thread here mate.

I try and build what i want and not what others want or expect.

I haven't bothered to post here for months or show any more of my builds etc due to the comments i received via PM's and emails which really just pissed me off about the whole modelling hobby and the way some people act around here. All they want to do is pick holes in other peoples models because they cant build a good kit for themselfs.

thats the reason i left the hobby for 12 months, i remember one person crapping on all these kits but has never put their own pic for everyone to see.when i build a kit it is for me.
i find the forum a great place to get new idea's and insperation to build
and mainly to help each other.

Truth and fact is, I build to past time and to manage my depression. Period.

Each of the positive comments I received is a great motivator to me. Egocentric as you may want to call, but it made me feel good and motivated. As building and painting a typical model kit is never too easy a task, especially when you messed up something.

When I got to know AF I went ahead to build my first model car kit which I also almost gave up halfway due to some terrible mistakes. It is the positive comments from the folks here that helped me to "get going" to complete it.

I also welcome constructive criticisms, as I appreciate the efforts of someone trying to share his/her experience or knowledge to better my build. One AF member even PM me in detail on how to do figure painting right when I bitched about how difficult and unenjoyable I felt about painting figures.

Negative criticisms does nothing except being negative. It may even be destructive and discouraging to some of us beginners.

I don't think it is an overboard of positive comments to project threads. If you think it is overboard that's good because it means you could do much better. You know you are "there", at a certain relative skill level. So just hang in "there" and keep quiet if you don't have anything positive to say while "looking" at those at "lower levels". Be aware that some of those who gave these "overboard" comments are also excellent builders of their own and they know they are giving out words of encouragements for the purpose of motivation.

One of the great thing about AF since I joined last year is the positive encouragements and constructive comments we give to each other no matter how badly someone does his/her build. I hope this shall remain as one of the hallmarks of the AF Car Modelling community, comprising of people of all skin, and across the globe.

Bottomline is, this is just a hobby for most of us. We display our projects to share, to exchange ideas and to learn, to improve, not here to be condemned, or to form elitist "expert" groups. Each one of us begins this hobby as a beginner at one time. Remember?

I am discouraged when I learn PMan is scarcely appearing nowadays due to some of the messages/comments he received, even though I don't know what happened exactly. If he is busy with his life or work thats perfectly fine, but when this is probably due to some unjust remarks he received around here then it really is a sad thing.

I was glad to see this topic pop up. There have been some interesting opinions expressed.

I think that if you post something on a public forum, be prepared for the worst, but hope for a good reception.

Personally, I welcome critiques from someone that can help me fix what isn't quite right. Complaining about a problem without offering a solution, is just creating more of a problem.
A "your CF looks awful" comment does no one any good. But a "try taking a hairdryer to your CF to get it to shrink into the recess's and conform to the part better" critique I welcome.

The simple "good job" or "clean build" comments are nice. But when I see a build I like, I usually try to address something specific about what I liked about it. Let someone know what caught your eye. Maybe others didn't see it right off.

Now I have just a little bit of nitpicking of my own to do.

I find it hard to accept or read a critique, and posts, from someone who can not use proper grammer/writing skills. I miss The Syndicate most for keeping those persons, who refuse to use proper grammer, in line. It's not hard to make capital letters, and use periods, is it? <-- Or even question marks. :)

If you want someone to listen to you, and actually take you seriously. Present your case in a legible fashion. I'm not saying you have to run your posts by a english professor before posting. But it is easier to read this forum if you do.

P-man - It's good to hear you keeping an eye on us here. You're an inspirational modeler to many of us, and your absense has been missed.

I applaude you all, every one of the posts in this thread has something usefull to contibute and I hope I don't drop the ball in that department, with mine. May I first ask the question, has anyone else noticed the people many of you have refered to have not posted, i wonder why? maybe the comments 'stuck a nerve' and they are all sulking. I build purely for fun and if I produce a good model at the end of it then great, if not it stays on my shelf as a reminder. I have welcomed all comments good and bad, its the way we grow in the hobby (35 years modeling and still picking up pointers) and it applies to everything in life we do even though we may not always realise. I thank Tonio for starting this thread but does he realise its used up 20 mins modeling time :lol2:

Only joking and thank you again for a little adult reading.

Neil

PS CADguy will my english do :naughty:

Quote:
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Originally Posted by primera man
Very interesting thread here mate.

I try and build what i want and not what others want or expect.

I haven't bothered to post here for months or show any more of my builds etc due to the comments i received via PM's and emails which really just pissed me off about the whole modelling hobby and the way some people act around here. All they want to do is pick holes in other peoples models because they cant build a good kit for themselfs.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by Phase 5
thats the reason i left the hobby for 12 months, i remember one person crapping on all these kits but has never put their own pic for everyone to see.when i build a kit it is for me.
i find the forum a great place to get new idea's and insperation to build
and mainly to help each other.

I miss seeing both theses guys work especially P-mans builds. I too usually just browse and rarely post now due to the criticism on here at times. Not of my own models but in general. I came back to the hobby after 25 yrs and have stepped back again from most Forums because of it. I just don't want any part of it.
There seems to have been a growing incidence of personal attacks for which there is no reason.

There seems to have been a growing incidence of personal attacks for which there is no reason.

maybe we need another moderator or two? :dunno:

its up to everyone to make this a good forum, just walking away isn't the answer. sooner or later, you'll be back. You all know this is the end all be all for modelers like ourselves. ol' school modeling forums are a dime a dozen, this forum is special, it caters to the newer generation of modelers. Yes, the door is going to be constantly in motion from members coming and going. Some of the newcomers are sure to piss someone off here and there, but those of you that stay and offer some quality to the forum are irreplaceable! when some of you guys say you backed away from the forum, I think you somewhat are taking for granted what we have here. p-man included.. maybe you just aren't into posting and browsing the forums recently? maybe your in a modeling rut? pppfffsshh. who hasn't been!! I can't even finish my freekin S14 thats almost done.. I won't touch it. but that will change and so will this forum, that you can count on. but its up to us to keep change on our side!

nice... a Diablo just drove by my window at work. Rich bastard. :evillol:

Im kinda new here, I have to agree joining this forum has made me enjoy the hobby even more, ideas, hints and improvements are expressed. I dont build too quick, but try to improve from model to model..

Critism is great, but only if it can be of helpful substance, slagging ppl off is a big no no, it can hurt so much.. Then again, if it is good critism it can make u stronger, with a bit of direction and motivation we can all learn from each other. From just being here for a month or so, I have learnt so much, from this forum, i have plucked up the courage to go a bit further on my projects..

I post rarely, because I dont really progress quick enough, but do manage to get chance to read up on the threads once in a while. Building for enjoyment of the hobby I sure do..

:iagree: So many people freak out when you critique there model, they think its the best thing since crushed ice, when really it looks like crap.

Well if you use words like "looks like crap" then people have the right to freak out back at you! I'm not suggeting that you use phrases like that Mike. But if people in general are getting a negative reply to such a blunt critiqe then they need to be more subtle and tactful. Suggest a way to improve rather than that make an unhelpful statement. For instance, how about saying "you can smooth the paint down with a polishing kit, they are available from www.xxx" rather than saying "paintwork is crap - massive orange peel".

EDIT: Just read CADguy's post - disregard most of the above, substitute "I agree with CADguy!"

OK.....I've had plenty of PM's etc asking my reasons why I'm pissed off and who posted me the crap.
I'm not going to start naming people as that is not my style of doing things on here. As far as i'm concerned its water under the bridge with those people.

I will say the 2 things that really pissed me off was....

1). Being called a cheat, and saying i rigged the results of the AFMOTY contest.
This was done by myself with the help of others here that gave up there time and also gave prizes. I had nothing to gain or loose from the contest. Being PM'd from people saying they didnt get enough votes blah blah blah is not my bloody fault if people didn't want to vote for your model. For me it was a real kick in the guts for something that 99% of people injoyed.
2). My "HOW TO ON PAINTING BODIES"....This is what works for me and was posted to try and help people out. Sending me a PM blaming me for following each step but stuffing up your paint job isn't my fault. It wasn't the BIBLE on model painting for gods shake !! :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

maybe we need another moderator or two? :dunno:


A good point. There are quite a few moderators about here at the moment. PMan, Jay, Toni and FOTW are the ones listed at the bottom. In addition we have Freakray Ales, Hiroboy, myself and now GTMike400 regularly patrolling the Car Modelling forums. We don't have time to check every single post (or at least I don't) so if you have a problem PM one of us. Worst case scenario use the "Report Post" option, but I'm happy to say we don't need that too much in here (or am I missing something?)

If somebody is causing grief, hopefully it is just a misunderstanding and their behaviour can be corrected with a heads up via PM. Or if it is a case of people being discouraged from using the forum by inappropriate behaviour, then more drastic measures can be taken.

On the other side of the coin remember that when you post here you are exposing yourself to the whims of the online world. You might need a tough skin from time to time!

Cheating on the AFMOTY? What delusional mind could suggest such a thing? :screwy:

Why is there always a tiny percentage of the population who are never prepared to accept responsibility for anything? Didn't get enough votes - somebody must have rigged it. Paintwork wasn't glass smooth - the guy who gave advice must be trying to fool me.

Don't let that tiny percentage get you down Warren! Good to see you around here again.

That's a real shame P-man. That's honestly taking stuff around here too seriously. Wasn't this who hobby about fun? Who really cares who wins the AFMOTY (ok, so we all care but as long as we enjoyed scoping all the models and whatnot... well ya'll know what I mean). And fussing you over paint... well, that's rediculous. Just like any tutorial here, your instruction was just a jumping off point, I'm sure everyone here has a different wat of painting and getting a fine finish... Feh, well I guess I am preaching to the choir, but I didn't realize such silliness was going on here and frankly, I'm rather ashamed of it. Please don't let stuff like that ruin this place for you... even if you don't get much from here anymore, we all get a lot out of your builds!

Well all I have to say is read my sig!!!! The reason I build is for myself and no one else. Yeah I have posted a few cars here, but I do not build what everybody else builds. Try a little variety in your life. I know you do not eat cheesburgers or pizza every day, so build something different. Build it just for the fact of building. We could all be out doing alot worse stuff than building. That I know.

[QUOTE=ol' dude] I know you do not eat cheesburgers or pizza every dayQUOTE]

I eat the same thing day in and day out. But there are different things I eat with it.

Anyway, I build for myself, but to me if nobody likes it there no point in it. Thats why when people post in my threads about how it looks good, or just a comment, it motivates me. It shows that people are intrested with what I am doing. Its sort of double sided.:rolleyes:

i build for the love of the hobby i could care less if it came out like crap and someone lets me know it. honestly i wouldve given a rats before but now i just shake it off. not everyone here builds the same exact car with the same exact idea in mind and even if they do they end up as 2 completely different builds. i take ideas from here and put them to my cars im sure people do the same.


as for riggin of the AFMOTY :screwy: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Very interesting topic.
I build models for myself. I like building car models because i like cars and it allows me to be creative so i can paint/build/modify/ruin it in whatever way i want :) I like to take pics and post on this forum as well becuase photography is my another hobby and i WANT criticism from the pros here and hopefully the criticism + experience will help me improve my next project. Of course comments like "nice paint job" or "very clean!!" are good too but only if my paint job is really nice or it is clean. If i did something wrong/bad, i would rather hear something tell me that "the paintjob seems a bit rough around the left door" or even better "try warm up your spray can using warm water and it may give you better result".
Sometimes i see some really below average models and still see like 20+ "awesome!", "nice and clean" comments and i personally don't think it's very good. It's good to be nice to everyone here but at the same time i think we should not be "too" nice and point out the area that is below average. Of course we need to be a bit flexible and don't expect a new guy to have a shinny paint job like PMan or build a skyline that is as good as NISMO400R. But my main point is... Post the comments from your heart, in a constructive way.
And when i post a comment about what i don't like or some +ve criticism, i usually will tell the builder what i like about his/her model as well. In this way, the modeler will feel a bit better and understand i'm not just trying to pick on him. Afterall, i believe there must be something good on each model!!!

Richard

And what am I, Rallyraider, chopped liver? :p

I think part of the big problem is that we've got some rose-colored glasses on around here. Guys like SLK320, Ratdat, Kunta, Kurtl, bigfrit, and Hiroboy all post some truly mind-blowing stuff. Seriously. I've taken home 1st and 2nd place contest trophies and I don't think I could do something as wild as Kurtl's Capri.

But, sometimes it seems we judge against these masterworks as status quo. Not all of us can scratchbuild an accurate Vertex Soarer's bodykit or correct the front suspension of a Revell 510 chassis so that it fits a wholly different Nissan.

You've got to judge a model against its peers and on its individual merits. Honestly, I nitpick more with the master guys than I do with the less seasoned builders. I expect more from them.

And, yes, there's good and bad. We've all got room for improvement. But we're all at least doing something right (I think). So let's build on that.

And what am I, Rallyraider, chopped liver? :p


How could I have forgotten the notorious Octagon...:lol:
Who else is about?

So what ever happened to Ratdat? No offense to any other folks, but I miss his builds. They were my favorites, I think. Did we run him off on account of the things we are discussing in this thread?

So what ever happened to Ratdat? No offense to any other folks, but I miss his builds.
I was thinking this a few weeks ago. Interesting thread this. I notice not many of the younger member have taken to posting in this thread :disappoin

There's not much I can add that hasn't already been covered quite well by others.

It's a damned shame that a few fucknuts ruin the experience for others. :nono: :mad: :banghead:

Maybe there should be a "Fucknut of the Year" award that we all get to vote on. :evillol:

I build for myself first. I get tons of inspiration from others. I love showing off my models and getting positive response, but at the end of the day I'm happy if my model satisfies nobody but myself. I've done really well sometimes on some pretty tame stuff, and done really poorly on something that should have turned out awesome. Win some, lose some. A lot of it boils down to personal taste.

Perhaps there needs to be a "sticky" with someone offering "how-to's" on how to critique models effectively.

For those who don't bother with good spelling and grammar, and have an attitude about it...sorry, I cannot and will not take them seriously.

For those who don't bother with good spelling and grammar, and have an attitude about it...sorry, I cannot and will not take them seriously.

:iagree:

i'm kinda new, both to this forum and to model making.....

just too busy trying to figure out a sensible answer to this.
just so you have some background on me.
i spent a year in art college where every other week we had to pin-up for what is affectionately and forever known as a crit.

the purpose of this was that so we can be assessed by our peers and also so that we, as a group (of 113 people...) can see what each other is doing.
the second purpose of this is, as the name of the session implies, to be critically analysed by peers AND superiors.
if there are good things to say, they will be brief and to the point (after all, no need to inflate your ego)
if there are bad things to say then the response will be longer because you need to understand what they don't like about it; they want you to understand what is 'wrong' so to speak.

following that, i spent three years doing an architecture degree part of which was, once again, regular crits.
these were more harsh.
the tutors hardly ever lavished praise (because well, telling them it's good doesn't make them work harder).
instead, they picked at the weakest parts of what they saw.
their job was to critically analyse what we were doing in order for us to be able to see more clearly where our weaknesses lie and they did this with ruthless efficiency but it served a purpose.

not sure where i'm going with this but i'll try to sum up the essence.


if you've posted pics of something that you have done, then you are in effect, presenting your work for us to judge.
i doing so, you should be ready for comments both good and bad.
some people will say 'excellent, well done' and not mean it.
some people will say 'not bad, good do with a better paint scheme'
some people will say 'what a big pile of walrus snot'
what ever they chose to say, and it is their right to speak freely, you should be ready to accept it.

on the side of the proverbial coin,
saying something is shit doesn't help if you don't explain why.
even if it's about something personal regarding aesthetics, then say so.
a clear explanation of why you don't like something is worth more than a thousand empty praises.

i don't post the (very few) pics of what i've done for praises.i post so that my peers can judge what i do and tell me where i go wrong.
if something is good, tell me and i'll aim to maintain that standard.
if something is bad, tell me and i'll try to fix it next time (it would also be nice if you can give a pointer or two....)

i guess the pure essence is that comments, be it good or bad are only really worth something, if they are useful.

Cheating on the AFMOTY? What delusional mind could suggest such a thing? :screwy:

I find this really disturbing. We have generous people like Warren and others who donated their time, money, and efforts to make this place more enjoyable, and someone accuses him of cheating? Speaking personally, that person should be banned. We don't need that kind of individual ruining this forum.

The kit I built for the contest was a gift for my father-in-law. When I gave it to him, he absolutely loved it. That made me happy = why I build. Not winning the AFOMTY or getting any votes is meaningless. It's not why I build. Tonio's sig says it all, "Build for yourself. Nobody else matters". That should be a sticky thread. Maybe along with "This is your hobby. Hobbies are supposed to be fun."

I enjoy posting my pics on the forum (the few that actually get finished), and I enjoy seeing other people's finished kits even though I rarely post a message. We are a community, and it's good for everyone to share, to help each other out with useful comments and praise. I mean that's what we are all here for, to be around those who share our similar interests and passions. To enjoy, to grow, to be inspired, etc.

And is it just me, or does a thread like this about thoughtless comments or petty bickering or general negative comments spring up every couple of months around here? I've only been a member for a year or so, but I've seen this come and go quite a few times.

Stuff like this does show up every so often, but this is the most comprehensive one yet. And drunken monkey rocks, he has a good point of view. That's why I post my models, anyway, "putting them up for crit." Brilliant!