Turbo or Naturally Aspirated?

Hi Folks,
I was wondering what people's views are on forced induction vs. naturally aspirated. I am currently building the 351 Cleveland 4V motor for my '78 Ford Fairmont (fox chassis machine) and am trying to decide what setup to use.

Here is option #1:
Run naturally aspirated motor which has projected output of ~450 hp and maybe a 150 hp shot of nitrous (strong bottom end), with a nice lumpy idle and long headers. Note: this projection for power output is not unreasonable, as the STOCK 351 cleveland 4V in the Boss 351 mustang made 330 hp (conservative) from factory, so with a hot roller cam, single plane intake, bigger carb, porting, and headers, it isn't unreasonable at all.

Here is option #2:
Run boosted version (10 psi) of above motor with lower compression pistons, milder cam more suitable for boost, and blow through carb or EFI system, most likely with a power output of ~550-600 hp.

Curious to hear everyone's input, as either way this light machine will be fast but hardly anyone really turboes v-8's, especially rather rare muscle car ones like the 351 cleveland
Thanks

A sidenote,
I am hoping this car will go into the low 10's or high 9's if I run turboes, check this website http://www.musclemustangfastfords.com/features/0401mm_fair/
I have a similar setup, the '78 is a very small 2-dr machine around 2700 lbs with V-8.
Maybe 10's will be achievable all motor, sacrificing some streetability?
Later

read the third post in this link:

http://www.automotiveforums.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=201348

its an article about a turbo V8


Anyway forget all the all scholl guys and their NA dreams, your goal is maximum power and turbos are the way.





BTW I bet the next post will be by redneck383 arguing that going turbo is cheating....Bring it on Matty :biggrin:

BTW I bet the next post will be by redneck383 arguing that going turbo is cheating....Bring it on Matty :biggrin:


Turbo's are cheating? Nah, just another way to make more power.


Remember, I want a particular turbo motor for my Z. :p







Pfft... Owned. :loser:





:grinno:

Turbo's are cheating? Nah, just another way to make more power.


Remember, I want a particular turbo motor for my Z. :p







Pfft... Owned. :loser:





:grinno:


We are talking about turbo V8's here punk, not turbo 4 bangers. :disappoin




:biggrin:

We are talking about turbo V8's here punk, not turbo 4 bangers. :disappoin




:biggrin:



Pfffft... I PWN3D J00!


Please see Fig.1....




http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/500/33812Moderator_Ownage_Fig1.jpg






:lol:

Pfffft... I PWN3D J00!


Please see Fig.1....




http://files.automotiveforums.com/gallery/watermark.php?file=/503/13360watermark_php_jpeg_copy.jpg






:lol:



Mmmkay........ :uhoh:

Mmmkay........ :uhoh:




hahhahahahaha..... asshole....



Nice one. :thumbsup:

hahhahahahaha..... asshole....



Nice one. :thumbsup:



:lol:


BTW don't you just hate it when people - other than us - hijack threads :biggrin:

:lol:


BTW don't you just hate it when people - other than us - hijack threads :biggrin:



Yeah... I hatttee people who do that... such buttheads. :biggrin:

Well I assume that you want to make this a full race-only car, so the obvious choice would be the setup that has the most power. If you intend on driving this car on the street however, than you might want to go with the most reliable set-up, naturally aspirated.

Well I assume that you want to make this a full race-only car, so the obvious choice would be the setup that has the most power. If you intend on driving this car on the street however, than you might want to go with the most reliable set-up, naturally aspirated.


given equal displacement a turbo car will be more reliable and stretable than an NA car when you reach very high power levels for that given engine


just as an example a stock turbo srt4 engine: getting 350Hp will be easy to make, will still run on pump gas and be reliable, on the other hand take the same engine and with whatever modifications you want make it have 350hp NA....it will be very expesive, very high strung, will run only on race fuel since you'll need at lest 13:1 compression

I choose comedy option #5

For a muscle car theirs nothing like allmotor rawness......................but adding on a little turbo system just ups the odds :naughty:

i got this from the STi forums.

"having n/a is like having endless lag"

which is true even though we're talkin about small block v8's here. i mean sure you can get the small block to make 500-600hp n/a but what would happen if you add boost? so its like in other words

"having n/a is like having endless lag"

now how true is that? i 100% agree.

well if you want to be fastest of course you go turbo, but if you want to be fast in a different way, you go allmotor. i prefer allmotor, just that loud ass raw sound, bahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

i got this from the STi forums.

"having n/a is like having endless lag"

which is true even though we're talkin about small block v8's here. i mean sure you can get the small block to make 500-600hp n/a but what would happen if you add boost? so its like in other words

"having n/a is like having endless lag"

now how true is that? i 100% agree.



I don't see how having a N/A motor is like having endless lag... if the motor is setup properly it won't have any dead spots in its powerband. You just hit the pedal and go...

Just like a properly tuned turbocharged car...

Only thing I can think of being considered 'lag' is if we're talking about somebody who's running a big lumpy camshaft in like a V8. You know, choppy idle... sounds like it's going to die at any moment. A Cam like that means, the power band is fairly high. Having a cam like that means off idle they are a bit sluggish... 'lag'. But that's why you launch them (with auto) with a high stall converter. Also having too high of a stall on a car that doesn't have the high rpm power band, will feel sluggish.

Other than that... I can't think of a 'lag' for a N/A car.

I don't see how having a N/A motor is like having endless lag... if the motor is setup properly it won't have any dead spots in its powerband. You just hit the pedal and go...

Just like a properly tuned turbocharged car...

Only thing I can think of being considered 'lag' is if we're talking about somebody who's running a big lumpy camshaft in like a V8. You know, choppy idle... sounds like it's going to die at any moment. A Cam like that means, the power band is fairly high. Having a cam like that means off idle they are a bit sluggish... 'lag'. But that's why you launch them (with auto) with a high stall converter. Also having too high of a stall on a car that doesn't have the high rpm power band, will feel sluggish.

Other than that... I can't think of a 'lag' for a N/A car.


What I belive TATII was refering to the difference in power between an engine in NA form Turbo. Basically what you call a turbo lag is the NA power of that engine before boost. This is particularly evident in turbo 4 bangers. Take an evo for example off boost its just another econocar I4 engine hit boost and it becomes a V8.

Same for putting a turbo on an ls1 for example, off boost will still be about as powerful as it used to be as NA wich is stil impresive but hit boost and that ls1 will become insane and compared to that its NA power will seem like crap.

What I belive TATII was refering to the difference in power between an engine in NA form Turbo. Basically what you call a turbo lag is the NA power of that engine before boost. This is particularly evident in turbo 4 bangers. Take an evo for example off boost its just another econocar I4 engine hit boost and it becomes a V8.

Same for putting a turbo on an ls1 for example, off boost will still be about as powerful as it used to be as NA wich is stil impresive but hit boost and that ls1 will become insane and compared to that its NA power will seem like crap.


that is exactly what i mean. kudos to you. :thumbsup:

If adding more air to your cylinders is considered cheating then slap my silly and call my Susie!! :iceslolan