Reliability of KA24DE-T vs. SR20DET?

Well, if things don't go my way, I won't be getting my beloved FC3S RX-7 Turbo II. My next favored choices (in order) are the S14 240SX, BMW 3 Series, and Audi A4. I figure that for the price of an S14 SR20DET (plus the price of the install), I could get a turbo kit for the KA24. I realize that the KA24DE-T is more suited for drag racing, but I also like road racing (which the SR20DET would be the better engine). Needless to say, i'd be happy with either option. My question to you is, which of the two are more reliable? I have a feeling the answer will be the SR20, simply because it would be at factory specs (for now), but maybe i'm wrong. Any info and opinions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

BTW: Just for the sake of information, my budget for my new car is $7500.

sr20det is more reliable

If you are going to go turbo ka, which i recommend anyway, get the engine rebuild with stronger pistons and connecting rods, and get the greddy turbo kit. That is probaly the best kit i have ever seen, they also have an intercooler kit. MAKE SURE YOUR ENGINE IS UP TO THE TASK. Get it checked out or you WILL most likely be sorry. A rebuild would probaly be a good idea anywere near 100k miles which most 240sx' are getting near at this point. Thicker Head gasket, no more using shitty gas either. If the engine does go, they arent that expensive.

You wont be dissapointed with the results

Ok, so the Greddy/Trust kit, plus rebuild with quality parts...how much do you estimate that to cost?

the greddy kit the best youve ever seen ???hahahah try FMAX,Nsport,or realnissan kit

If you are going to go turbo ka, which i recommend anyway, get the engine rebuild with stronger pistons and connecting rods, and get the greddy turbo kit. That is probaly the best kit i have ever seen, they also have an intercooler kit. MAKE SURE YOUR ENGINE IS UP TO THE TASK. Get it checked out or you WILL most likely be sorry. A rebuild would probaly be a good idea anywere near 100k miles which most 240sx' are getting near at this point. Thicker Head gasket, no more using shitty gas either. If the engine does go, they arent that expensive.

You wont be dissapointed with the results

yea I'd like to rebuild my KA then turbo it (faster than sr20det) but it's goin to cost a shitload. How much will all this cost do you know?? Probably be a better thing just to buy a new SR20DET (found one at $1,800 @ 30k miles) and just use the rest of the money it would cost to rebuild a KA + greddy turbo to sup it up a lil bit.

I'm not meaning to hi-jack the thread or get flamed, but I do have a question on something that I keep seeing that I don't understand.

People say the KA is more suited for drag because of the torque. This good for the launch and a good pull throughout the run. Now, they also say when comparing the KA with the SR that the SR is better for road and obviously drift racing because it rev higher. That is what I don't understand. Does the SR have a longer power band? I assume it has a higher redline as well. What is the overall benefit of having this "higher revving" engine?

Again, I'm not trying to get flamed. Thanks.

Shohn

people are stupid and say KA is better for drag or whatever

learn ur shits, and every motor is suited for all types of racing

I'm trying to learn my shit. I've been reading the boards. I see something that I don't understand what am I supposed do?

Obviously every motor is suited for all types of racing when built properly, but there will still be some better then others for what ever reason.

slohan dont pay attention to that last post people around this board arent that helpfull, but to answer your question the Ka is better for drag because it has a longer stroke and is a bigger engine then the Sr20, when you drag race you dont stay in the High redline rpms that long so all that matters is raw power. The Ka is a 2.4 liter engine while the Sr20 is a 2.0 liter engine. The Red line in the Sr20 is 7 grand as for the KA 6 grand, the Sr20 can stay in the higher rpm band longer then the KA and substains less strain in doing so. also the torque comes in at a lower Rpm in the Ka compared to the Sr20 so it will have more pull but will let off around 5000 rpm. People love sr20's for drifting and auto racing mainly because you dont have to shift as much and like I mentioned before it can stay in that high red line longer. So think about it for a sec.... if the ka lets off at around 5rpm? how can you maintain a drift? easy answer is you cant thats why its not very efficient. For a normal persons needs the Ka is a very good engine and pulls like an American made car.

Thanks Zanark! You answered my question completely and then some. I appreciate your help and I agree with you about the less helpful crowd here. I have read a multiple post asking serious question and then see replies of people laughing the person off the board. Thanks again.

^ yea it is kind of sad how some people behave here. Not everyone has the time or knowledge to know everything about 240sx's, no point in belittling them or putting them down.

yeah your right

KA or SR is going to be a tossup.

Most SR's are more reliable *because* they were factory built. The KAT's with problems are usually bad builds or old engines with some idiot trying 15lbs of boost and poor tuning.

Either engine *built right* is equal, neither has enough torque advantage or weight savings to be more than splitting hairs. If everything is equal the KA should be a little more powerful due to .4 more liters (which is equal to about 17%).

For most people with newer engines KAT is cheaper (bolt on and go) for most people that will require a rebuilt first, buying an SR20DET is cheaper.

Of course the KAT will be *legal* in all but a few states, the SR not in any.

Å

Hey Alk just thought ide tell you the Sr20 is legal in all states depending on if the car passed emissions or not.

the SR20det swap isnt legal any any states as far as i know

Hey Alk just thought ide tell you the Sr20 is legal in all states depending on if the car passed emissions or not.
sorry that we poeople on this board are not that helpful

but it makes much sense for the muthafucka to go get his engine swap then have to put his KA back in just cuz ur ass lied/////

"but Zanark said it was legal!!...."

:D

"but Zanark said it was legal!!...."



I would laugh if I heard someone say something like that!

Then I was mistaken and I apologize for false information, its just seeing so many people around in my area have done these swaps and are also insured i asumed it would be legal if it passed emissions. But there was no need for the comments. Thanks.

Then I was mistaken and I apologize for false information, its just seeing so many people around in my area have done these swaps and are also insured i asumed it would be legal if it passed emissions. But there was no need for the comments. Thanks.
no need to apologize to me man, ....

but yes, there was need for a comment....and no thanks...

:) :D

the KA24 is far more reliable. When something breaks on it you can go get the parts at most parts stores for it. When something breaks on your RB or SR your car sits there waiting days/weeks for parts from Japan.

^ nope, SR parts are easily found here. The non-turboed version is used in the sentra. the Sentra uses the sr20de just not turboed. the RB you will have to wait for awhile. That was the main reason my friend chose the SR swap instead of the RB swap

Then I was mistaken and I apologize for false information, its just seeing so many people around in my area have done these swaps and are also insured i asumed it would be legal if it passed emissions. But there was no need for the comments. Thanks.

Yeah man, comments are necessary. Don't go talking about stuff you don't understand fully because "you saw it" especially when you are changing directions on another's statement.

I hate to break it to your friends, but if they get into a large enough accident were financial damages are high the insurance company on their side will rule 'illegal equipment' and not have to provide coverage (I can guarantee you they will comb through the car to figure out anything to not have to pay out a large claim). The insurance one the 'victims' side will rule 'illegal equipment' and use that to imply racing.

Chances are a fender bender will never have the 'powertrain' checked, but it's an illegal swap just as everyone speeds too, but only a few get caught.

Å

^ nope, SR parts are easily found here. The non-turboed version is used in the sentra. the Sentra uses the sr20de just not turboed. the RB you will have to wait for awhile. That was the main reason my friend chose the SR swap instead of the RB swap


this is not true, name 5 parts on them that are interchangeable...

block is different
pistons are different
pulleys are different
manifolds are different
IGNITION is DIFFERENT(thats an important one)
Cooling is different
Computer/Electrical is different
Headgasket is different.

you shouldn't even really put it in the same class as a SR20det. Yes they are both SR20's but thats it. What the similarities are and why its still called a SR is the Displacement and bore/stroke on both engines is the same. They are constructed SIMILAR to each other. this does not mean that every nut and bolt is interchangeable, they are not twins.

One of the main differences is the Ignition system, and that one engine is for FWD and one is for RWD. This design change makes the construction a bit different on the two engines, ex. manifold is different, the coolant passages/hoses/headgasket/outlets on block are all different. The belt system is different as well, Power Steering, A/C compressor.......this is all the normal type of shit things go wrong on with cars that is important to be able to get the parts exactly when you ask for them.

A lot of people are blind to maintenance, they think the only thing that will go wrong with their car is if they overboost it and blow up the engine. The thing is not a brick its a machine. It depends on different systems to all be operating properly to ensure the operation of the engine.

So say you need to do simple maintenance things on your SR20det, most of them you cannot get from the Sentra. Wires, Ignition System, Gaskets(thats an important one there), oil filters, radiator hoses, belts, serpentine belt system, power steering, air conditioner, and electrical things.

man! good shit sr20det power good shit!!!!!!

i can't add anything to what u said! i agree with u, but i fined it hard to disagree when most of what u said is facts!

i have a bltp sr20 and i waited 2 weeks for a turbo gasket!!! the whole time i ran 0 boost!!!!

i think sr are more better but it all has to do with how often the car been taken care of!

This could go on for ever :rolleyes:

Just get a 3 series, and call it good, autocross your ass off.

:evillol:

What the FUCK does parts availability have to do with the reliability of the engine??? If your engine keeps crapping out, then should that engine be thought of as reliable just because parts are easy to find??? It may be practical, yes (for a USDM engine), but reliable, not necessarily.

In general, Nissans have great reliability and can withstand a good amount of abuse (if cared for properly). SR motors are usually in bad shape since they've probably been beaten the shit out of. In terms of reliability on a fair and even level (new vs. new or rebuilt vs. rebuilt) the engines should be about the same, ESPECIALLY since more people are going KAT and most of the tuning and bugs are being worked out as we speak.

A lot of people are blind to maintenance, they think the only thing that will go wrong with their car is if they overboost it and blow up the engine. The thing is not a brick its a machine. It depends on different systems to all be operating properly to ensure the operation of the engine.


I dunno man, a car made entirely out of bricks wouldn't go very fast or last very long. You would automaticly win any car accident though...

Hey they call it a red top because the head is made out of a brick right? k cause thats what my friend told me. =(

this is not true, name 5 parts on them that are interchangeable...

block is different
pistons are different
pulleys are different
manifolds are different
IGNITION is DIFFERENT(thats an important one)
Cooling is different
Computer/Electrical is different
Headgasket is different.

you shouldn't even really put it in the same class as a SR20det. Yes they are both SR20's but thats it. What the similarities are and why its still called a SR is the Displacement and bore/stroke on both engines is the same. They are constructed SIMILAR to each other. this does not mean that every nut and bolt is interchangeable, they are not twins.

One of the main differences is the Ignition system, and that one engine is for FWD and one is for RWD. This design change makes the construction a bit different on the two engines, ex. manifold is different, the coolant passages/hoses/headgasket/outlets on block are all different. The belt system is different as well, Power Steering, A/C compressor.......this is all the normal type of shit things go wrong on with cars that is important to be able to get the parts exactly when you ask for them.

A lot of people are blind to maintenance, they think the only thing that will go wrong with their car is if they overboost it and blow up the engine. The thing is not a brick its a machine. It depends on different systems to all be operating properly to ensure the operation of the engine.

So say you need to do simple maintenance things on your SR20det, most of them you cannot get from the Sentra. Wires, Ignition System, Gaskets(thats an important one there), oil filters, radiator hoses, belts, serpentine belt system, power steering, air conditioner, and electrical things.

alright I shall not question your knowledge of sr20's anymore, you obviously know a lot more than me. It's just that I heard that a major advantage that the sr20 has over the rb25 is that the parts are easily found in america do to the sentras using the same engine. My friend who knows a lot about 240s and just got a red-top sr20 said that also

What the FUCK does parts availability have to do with the reliability of the engine??? If your engine keeps crapping out, then should that engine be thought of as reliable just because parts are easy to find??? It may be practical, yes (for a USDM engine), but reliable, not necessarily.

In general, Nissans have great reliability and can withstand a good amount of abuse (if cared for properly). SR motors are usually in bad shape since they've probably been beaten the shit out of. In terms of reliability on a fair and even level (new vs. new or rebuilt vs. rebuilt) the engines should be about the same, ESPECIALLY since more people are going KAT and most of the tuning and bugs are being worked out as we speak.

call me retarded but if I lose a part on the road and cannot get a replacement within a day (hell even under a week) I would say that is unreliable.

I don't know where you get that SR motors are terribly abused. It would be like the average 30-40k mile pull here. Not all of japan in 240SX's (silvia/180sx) are insane like us.

Å

do you guys want alot of cross over parts???

CA18DET!!!

is the CA18DET the NA model, and the SR20DET the Turbo? or what? I read Initial D, and watch the Anime, the S13 in the series has a CA18 and the Sileighty in the series has a SR20... if the 180sx and silvia are pretty much the same car what is with the engine differences?

is the CA18DET the NA model, and the SR20DET the Turbo? or what? I read Initial D, and watch the Anime, the S13 in the series has a CA18 and the Sileighty in the series has a SR20... if the 180sx and silvia are pretty much the same car what is with the engine differences?
yes you are right, the CA18DET is the NA model of the S chassis cars, and the SR20DET is the turbo model...180sx never came turboed, they all had the NA sr20's which were also known as the CA18DET's

i have just learned what initial D is last week when i went to the arcade and saw the game so i dont really know much about that.(im serious)_

hey, I have a 92 ka turbo charged with stock internals 300whp with the jim wolf tech ecu ect. It's still running.

hey, I have a 92 ka turbo charged with stock internals 300whp with the jim wolf tech ecu ect. It's still running.

running is only a small part of the picture. Mileage since adding the turbo is the real one.

Congrats on the build up, don't like anyone tell you 300HP is crap. Most that will say that are :screwy:

see I don't really believe all the high mileage shit either. If you take care of a car and have everything working like it should theres really no reason why it shouldn't be able to make 200-300rwhp everyday for a long time. I think the KA is stronger then the SR now. The construction is heavier duty and the block is made of iron. As long as fuel/spark/computer/appropriate boost level is all in check it should run perfectly fine.


Stealthj....

you need to find a company that wants to sell some CA18's and ask them to be the head salesman hehe....

Stealth you should add some stuff on this thread about the CA and its reliability, parts interchangeability etc. it would be good info for this thread.

see I don't really believe all the high mileage shit either. If you take care of a car and have everything working like it should theres really no reason why it shouldn't be able to make 200-300rwhp everyday for a long time. I think the KA is stronger then the SR now. The construction is heavier duty and the block is made of iron. As long as fuel/spark/computer/appropriate boost level is all in check it should run perfectly fine.


Well that was my point....I have heard of probably 100+ people making 'turbo' engines between the different car boards. I have found 2 years with a 'turbo' is 1.9 years of it sitting in a garage somewhere and two runs around the block.

If you build up a 200-300hp KA and tune it properly you should get to see 85-90% of the normal longevity out of it. Going higher causes a faster decrease on longevity though.

The thing most that are successful in their turbo builds come to boards only for the advice and never return other that for post build problems. However there are many that should never have attempted a build up and they are the ones that make it sound big of problems and unreliable.

So:

saying I have a KAT running just fine tells me nothing.

saying I have a KAT at 10psi making 200-300HP tells me more

saying I have a KAT at 10psi making 200-300HP that I have put 20,000 miles on and over 50 1/4 mile runs only having to change the oil and play with the fuel maps a couple times tells me a lot.

I am also not saying that a KAT cannot be every bit as reliable or more than a stock SR20DET....I am also not saying that a stock SR20DET can't be improved. I will say with either you are bound to be able to find a power level you can be happy with.

Å

CA18det not turbo?? huh??
The way I read Nissan motors is this way

CA18det

The CA stands for the motor mane the number that follows it (18) is the engine displacement (1800 cc), the (d) stands for dual overhead cam, (e) for electronic fuel injection and finally the (t) for turbo????

KA24e (not d, this is the single cam version on the KA)

KA name
24 (2400cc)
e electronic injection


VQ30DE, RB26det…..etc

Correct me if wrong, but that’s how I was informed at the Nissan dealership?

he was just joking with the nooB about him saying he learned about engines from IntialD lmao

he was just joking with the nooB about him saying he learned about engines from IntialD lmao
The joke isn't so obvious...I was wondering how a 1000+ poster could think the 180sx never had turbo ;).

For the record the CA18DET is a turboed 1.8 liter. I think all 180sx always had either the CA18DET or SR20DET, yet silvias could be had with CA18DE and SR20DE.

I am still learning though....

Å

The joke isn't so obvious...I was wondering how a 1000+ poster could think the 180sx never had turbo ;).

For the record the CA18DET is a turboed 1.8 liter. I think all 180sx always had either the CA18DET or SR20DET, yet silvias could be had with CA18DE and SR20DE.

I am still learning though....

Å
actually 180sx's also came with the SR20DE's, i believe its the type S?im not so sure on that

and yes:), i shall be head salesman!!

and if you guys really want i can get a list of crossover parts

Just to clear the engines up, 89 (88 for silvia) to mid 91 was ca18det (also ca18de for silvia). 91 to 97? was sr20det (also sr20de for silvia to 94 and post 96 180sx type s).

I can't comment on the KA-T reliability, we never got them thank god. The sr20det is a very reliable engine and can withstand a lot of punishment. I rarely hear of anyone having anything go wrong even on fairly worked engines. One mate has a sr20det silvia making 290odd rwkw (400rwhp) @20psi on completely stock internals (including stock headgasket, pistons, cams) and pump fuel. A mob in South Australia pulled just over 500rwhp on completely stock internals a couple of weeks ago, though that was with some toluene (and lots of boost).

the ka motors i dont think ever came factory turbo. so you wouldve never gotten them anyway, no one did. you have to add the turbo yourself. i dont know much about this topic, but what ive gotten so far is that if you want a turbo, beef up the ka. if you want a known reliable engine with a turbo already, go with the sr. the ka should be reliable if you make it reliable, do regular maintenence, make sure to build up the internals, etc.

just thought id summarize it

sr, is great but, it going to cause money to get it too run 300-400hp without upgrades $1500. You will be paying the same amout building up a kaT.

I think the KA is constructed better then the SR. Also when you are going for extreme power levels the KA will prevail with its iron block. Iron is stronger then aluminum, this is a known fact.

its different for someone in Australia or Japan to comment on the SR20det reliability because those engines were sold there. You cannot say nothing goes wrong with them because I have heard of MANY sr's blowing out the block. When you fuck up the block its time for a completely new engine. No parts dealers in america stock sr20det parts, most have never even heard of it...it was never ever sold here in one single car. There are more parts in America for a pinto then a sr20det.

I have also heard horror stories about SR swaps in America. Normal car systems do not work as well or at all, such as power steering, air conditioner(thats a biggie when u live in south florida), wiring rats nest of amatuer done harness jobs.... It is not really a bolt in process, yes the engine came in that car but the sr20 equipped S chassis do have differences, one being the systems of the car are built, designed, and laid out for a RHD car.

The KA comes with a forged crank and forged rods. The only thing that really needs to be replaced is the pistons. And if what some people say on here is true, then the pistons are fine. The only problem I see is that most KA engines have a lot of miles on them. Besides that, why pay for less displacement when you can rebuild and turbo for the same price and no wiring? If you are going to do a swap, just go for the RB. I saw a guy at the track last night with an RB that he did himself.

The KA comes with a forged crank and forged rods. The only thing that really needs to be replaced is the pistons. And if what some people say on here is true, then the pistons are fine. The only problem I see is that most KA engines have a lot of miles on them. Besides that, why pay for less displacement when you can rebuild and turbo for the same price and no wiring? If you are going to do a swap, just go for the RB. I saw a guy at the track last night with an RB that he did himself.
once my CA18 blows or whatever the hell happens im going for a fully built for turbo KA !! :)

all i want is a stock 270r...

some teins, kaaz 2-way and a nice clutch would be great too...

after that, id drive with a smile so big you'd think i was in a ferrari

I'm going to replaced the piston with JE once I blow them out; Until then thier doing just fine. But I am putting 103 oct. gas once and awhile when racing.

how old are you gc8936?

any engine is pretty reliable as long as you take care of it. in other words, resist the urge to race every single civic on the road.

View Profile Welcome, stealthj. You last visited: 04-15-2004 at 07:21 PM



gc8936
(AF Newbie)

Birthday: April 25th, 1977
Last Activity: 04-15-2004 10:06 PM



all u gotta do is click on the persons name and the profile comes up with their bday most of the time its optional for peeps to enter it

forgot to do that, my bad stealth. gc8936, you're 1977? awesome, i hope you got a lotta advice on regular car repairs instead of just performance replacement parts. at least that's the general impression i get from older people. if you're a mechanic, mind if i pm you from time to time?

Do not pay any attention to my profile it's all wrong, buddies messing around. Age 27 with a 92' kat, But can give advise to any questions you have.

but u really are 27....

ok so if the sr is "more reliable", would that still be the case if he went out and got the sr stroker kit to make it a 2.2?

My thought is go with the KA, if anything, the parts are available in large quantities (pull-a-part in GA, KA is only $90, for the whole engine), larger displacement, and for the price of getting an SR and then Installation, and not to mention parts that will have to be ordered from cali, emission worries, you can use that money to beef up the KA, put new and stronger components, machine the internals for higher RPM eg balancing the rreciprocating mass, including crank etc. Might come up to a little more than you would spend on the SR but you will be in a whole new level above the SR and ready for serious boost. The benefit of low end torque, you'll be able to smoke most SRs' if you boost the KA. But the SR looks more pretty, but good looks don't get you past the finish line. Once you get the SR and want to go to the next level, you will have spent alot more. But both motors are good options, depend on what you are going to use them for.
Drag & take off KA, drifting and road races SR20, but like I said you can always invest some into the KA and have it built for higher revs and keep you .4L displacement over the SR giving you the better option. Its all about the money. Speed costs, how fast can you afford to go. was given that card four years ago when I was 18 by a shop owner. found out the hard way.

yea the hard way sux.....i prefer ka just because its already in there and the nissan dealership has the parts available. Thats just me though, i need quick easy access being its my daily driver and all, maybe when im older and am suited financially ill bust out a rb25 or something. But for now i think a ka-t would be more than enough to make me smile.

If you go with a stroker 2.2 $3500+ labor, you are going to pay out more. If you build up your KA, you have 2.4L plus alot of upgrades and still have money left. MY 92' KA-T 300fwhp with stock internals with fuel mag. upgrades still running. spend $2800 total

my KA has too many miles on it. getting new internals would cost too much money. would rather go SR20 with low miles route, cheaper and more reliable

Like I said 137, choice is yours, both are fine motors with benefits in there own ways, but rebuilding a KA and reinforcing it would be less than buying an SR and installing it. Rebuilding costs around $700, and the aftermarket parts maybe another $1500 (rods and pistons, think the crank is already forged), some good head work extra $300, all for a total of $2500.00, which is still cheaper than the cost of buying an SR and installing it.
SR $1500-$3000, w/wiring and ECU, installation cheapest I ever saw in ATL was $1300 all for a grand total of $3000-$4500. Your choice, still think the SR is Pretier than the KA, but would rather have the KA.