Need help! Couple questions

Okay... I was pretty happy with how my car was running... until I raced my friend's '02(?) Trans Am today lol. I drive an '86 Fiero GT... he smoked my ass, WITH a 2 second head start! This is unacceptable ...

K, a couple of questions... I know people pump TONS of horsepower out of smaller engines (like 4 cylinders on Honda's, mine is a V6), my first question is what can I do to my Fiero to see performance increase? I was thinking about getting some Flowmasters on it first... my dad got some of those on his Mustang and they sound really nice, but I think they're the crappy ones because his only costed like ~$200. My friend with the Trans Am said his costed around like $1000... big diff there.

My other question is, would it be a good idea to swap a V8 into my car? I mean... I don't know much about how cars work, but wouldn't I have to get a new drivetrain and tranny? Or would that not be necessary... I've been told so many different things I've become a bit confused.

And also, how much would all of this cost? I mean... I don't want to put in TOO much money into my Fiero if it would be better to get say a later model Mustang or Trans Am, something like that. So would it be better to just get a new car? Buddy in the Trans Am says he's pumping 500 HP out of his... I have no clue how much I got but I KNOW it's not near that.

A V8 always seems to be the first thing people think of when considering a bigger engine swap, not that there is anything wrong with a V8 but it isn't the only better engine swap out there to consider.
You might also look into getting a 3800 supercharged V6 engine. It even bolts right up to the existing trannie requiring very little modification, though you might also want to consider a stronger clutch just like if you did a V8.
The nice thing about a 3800SC is the fact that it's usually a much cheaper swap to do than a V8. It doesn't require a lot of modification like in the cradle area or special conversion plates and so on. Plus getting a low mileage 3800SC at a junk yard is usually easier and less expensive to get than getting a SB V8.
There are guys out there that have done a 3800SC swap in their Fiero and are doing 11's at the track.
Doubt mister Trans Am that claims he has 500HP could even come close to that. Not too shabby for a high powered V6. It's what Pontiac should have put in the Fiero to begin with. Oh well.
The guy saying he is pumping out 500HP has to be pulling your leg if it's mostly stock. Unless that engine is heavily modified with lots of extra go fast goodies, there is no way he is pumping out 500HP. But against a stock V6 in your Fiero his engine does have an edge, though not much but apparently enough as you have allready experienced.
I can give a Trans Am a good run for it's money in our semi modified 4 banger.
If you did at least a 3800SC transplant in your Fiero that Trans Am wouldn't have had a prayer. The power to weight ratio of the Fiero with a 3800SC compared to the much larger and heavier Trans Am would have been lights out for him :D

Oh he wasn't BS'ing me... he has done a ton of stuff to that car, it's insane... he wasn't even pushing the gas in all the way and he smoked me...

Couple more questions, like... how much HP does the stock V6 have, and how much would I get out of a 3800 SC? Also how much would it cost? I am currently really poor... but getting a job soon (I hope)

ALSO, my car is automatic :banghead: , really wish it was stick but my dad is the one who bought it... so no real choice there. Does that make much a diff? Doesn't seem to shift really that fast...

Well, lets look at a few different engines and HP for comparison:

Stock 4 Cyl 98 HP
With turbo (150 to 200 HP) varies with turbo
with NOS (a lot more)

Stock Fiero V6 140 HP
With turbo (250 or so) varies with turbo

3800SC (SuperCharged) 400 HP
(upgrade cam): 500 HP (at the crank)

Honda S2000 2.2L(DOHC) 240 HP

2005 Vette (pushrod) 6.0L 400 hp.

2004 Viper (pushrod) 8.3L 500 hp.

Ferrari Enzo (DOHC) 6.0L 660 HP

Ferrari 360 Challenge Stradle (DOHC) 3.6L 425 HP

2004 Pagani Zonda 7.3L (pushrod) 555HP.

Chevy pushrod V8's make about 300 HP at 350 ft lbs of torque on average vs a 3.4L DOHC putting out 215 HP at 220 ft lbs of torque. Just a difference in rpms.
Pushrod engines typically have more low end torgue where as a DOHC requires higher RPM's for power.
The DOHC engines have some advantages with the angles of the ports and valves giving better flow and combustion ability. Your basic pushrod engines though are limited by the heavier valvetrain buit are of course more compact.
I believe the DOHC engines lack some torque as they are cammed for top end power but they are probably so close it doesn't really matter.

This Mustang that he claims has 500 HP would mean that his engine is equivelent to a Vipers engine?
Maybe as reaching 500HP isn't that difficult as mentioned by the add cam for the 3800SC.

As for your Fiero being an automatic, yeah that can kill some power and speed, especially off the line as you have no rev or shift control.
My 5 speed 4 cyl can usually at least match an auto V6 for a while until top end kicks in at around 65 MPH. Quarter mile I can hold my own pretty well :iceslolan

Steve

With a quick look around my suspicions were confirmed, with minor modifications the '02 Trans AM runs 325-350hp... it wouldn't take alot to bump that up. Even my stock '83 5.0L Trans would have cooked my stock 85 2.8L Fiero (SE). Both being Auto.
My personal opinion is if your going to race get a stick. I have seen some auto's roast manuals, but for the effort your putting into it on a low budget, I'd be talking dad into letting me get a stick.
As far as your engine goes if your interested in keeping it, from stock you have so many optins... it all depends on what you want to get out of it. Obviously getting headers & an exaust system will help a bit.
As fir another car, like I've always said. Find what you like and go with it. I've got friends sporting everythig from Mazda - Mustang - Maxima (and of course honda) It all depends on what you want ot do with your car, and the kind of ride you like.

Here's a site with a few common options http://www.sunpoint.net/~pontiac/power.htm ... I wasn't really impresed, but it lets you know the general options for improving the 2.8L
If your a :newbie: to performance it'll give you some Ideas.
Check this out for some swap options http://www.westcoastfiero.com/engine_conversion/engines.html
http://www.westcoastfiero.com/engine_conversion/

Cubic inches is usually = cubic dollars, but if you want to improve performance without spending alot, some things you could do:

Shift by hand: (Cost = free) If you're letting the tranny do the shifting, consider starting in 1st and controlling the shifts yourself. Just don't overdo it in the lower gears or you'll cause nasty damge to the engine and/or transmission.:nono:

Performance intake/air cleaner: (cost = $25-$100+) Your Fiero will improve somewhat if it can breathe easier.

Performance Mufflers: ($20-$100+) Same concept as the intake. Better flow = more power. Just remember, the police dislike loud exhaust.

Mod Chips: (varies) Performance programed chips for the ECU can add a few horses under the hood (or decklid, as the case may be :lol:) I see them all the time on ebay, and they are readily available from many mail order catalogs.

Ignition Upgrades: ($5.00x6-?) Performance plugs and wires do help improve power. I am new to the fiero thing, so I'm not sure if your v6 has a distributor or coil packs, but either can be upgraded as well.

:2cents: - Should you have a few grand to spend one day, you might look at turbo or nitrous kits. Keep in mind that tired 2.8L wasn't meant to handle that kind of boost when it was new, let alone after 100k miles. If you bolt those kind of kits on a well warn stock engine, you'll probably blow it up in a short amount of time.

Thanks guys, I found everything you said to be quite valuable... I think what I'm going to do is get a lot of what Ragtop mentioned for the meantime, while saving up for a new car that is naturally higher HP (maybe a Trans Am or Mustang). Either that, or I'll get an Integra for cheap and rice it out lol, I hear those can be modded to be way fast.

Okay. P-bodies do not lend themselves well to drag racing without significant modifications to the suspensions. V6 cars will blow 4-cyl cars in the weeds. Fieros are all at least 16 years old. Comparing a worn out old car to a modern car with many less miles is apples-to-donuts. Comparing V8 cars to ANYTHING else is dragons-to-mice (regardless of what you saw in the movies). 3800-3s with the blower are rated at 260 NET horsepower. I have no idea where this guy gets the 400 o 500 figure. It isn't accurate. If you think it's expensive to build a GM engine of any description, wait 'til you see the bill on one of those Honda/Acura POSs.
The stock exhaust system in the V6 P-Body is pretty well done. I know of no Flow Master or other "buzzword" muffler that might fit without major changes. They already have headers, though they be "shorties". Maybe some of you youngr guys should do a bit of research before advising others about how and what to do. Repeating information heard or read about other cars rarely fits the Fiero.
V8 kits are available for P-Bodies in California. They use the TH125 transmission already in your car, and mount the engine sideways. While a decent enough job, the little TH has trouble with any serious power. The most effective V8 Fiero I've ever seen is the Ferncliff Flash's "Fear Arrow". He has a 455 Pontiac (not a Chevy, not an Olds or Buick, but a REAL Pontiac) coupled to a TH325 (FWD unit from a Riviera). He made his own cradle, but it was an easy job. Headers was the biggest part of the mods. The car has run 6.40s in the 1/8 and 10.50s in the 1/4, with 87 octane fuel and street tires.
The smart play would be to rebuild the little P-Body with a mild upgrade to enhance the low-end so the car FEELS spunkier. Then, take the money you might have wasted modifying the P-Body, buy an old (pre-81) F-body (prefer Pontiacs, but some still like the Chevy), and build a serious 400 or 455 for that. Then, you can have both worlds. A nice, comfortable Pontiac, and a bad-ass Pontiac.

Hmm, Don't recall anyone saying any of the suggestions made in this thread would BEAT the buddy's Firebird, just make the car a little less embarassing for him. Plus, while Fiero is unique in being the only GM mid-engine car, (unless you count the Corvair, which was more of a rear-engine) it still uses the same basic 2.8L V6 found in the FWD lineup.

Regardless,
*there is no such thing as a Chevrolet 455
Proof we all make mistakes sometimes.